The downside of carrying a firearm...

[OODA_Loop]

I don't agree with you, but will admit that I'm pretty much set in my ways. I don't personally know any gun owners who own only one weapon, bought it for "self defense," and don't know how to handle it.

Handling and shooting your new uber-tactical pew pew you bought is not understanding civilian combative concepts.[/QUOTE]

No, it doesn't. If I don't hunt squirrels I'm still allowed to own a .22 rifle.

You're not following along very well.

 

[JimBowie1958]

I'm talking about the vast majority of CCW have a misunderstood command of the civilian defensive firearm. This is from most often no civilian combative concept training or poor training. Most gun owners cannot be told or taught anything.

That is exactly the opposite of my experiences and the facts support me. Police officers are far more likely to engage in unlawful shootings than are CCW holders.

If tell you upfront what I am going to ask if bereft of ego on my end can you respond without ego ?

What and from whom formal training have you had ?

I am not sure what you mean in the first question, but I can tell you in the second, whether you choose to believe me or not is your option.

I had 5 years as an infantryman in the US Army, from 1978 to 1983 and all the basic and AIT accompanying that, along with some informal long range target training, M911 training, etc.

Post Army I have had training in personal hand held weapons to get a CCW in Virginia and Utah and to be qualified to carry in Texas.

My most recent class was about 4 years ago that I took with my son who is also a CCW holder.

 

[OODA_Loop]

That is exactly the opposite of my experiences and the facts support me. Police officers are far more likely to engage in unlawful shootings than are CCW holders.

If tell you upfront what I am going to ask if bereft of ego on my end can you respond without ego ?

What and from whom formal training have you had ?

I am not sure what you mean in the first question, but I can tell you in the second, whether you choose to believe me or not is your option.

I had 5 years as an infantryman in the US Army, from 1978 to 1983 and all the basic and AIT accompanying that, along with some informal long range target training, M911 training, etc.

Post Army I have had training in personal hand held weapons to get a CCW in Virginia and Utah and to be qualified to carry in Texas.

My most recent class was about 4 years ago that I took with my son who is also a CCW holder.

So you have had no civilian combative concept training. Again its not my ego or sense of superiority trying to get you to see.

Rest my case.

 

[JimBowie1958]

Police: Texting argument in movie theater sparks fatal shooting - CNN.com

It is more of a mental health issue. This was a retired cop, but it could have been anyone with a carry permit. Pretty sad

Have mixed feelings about this one. On the one hand, if someone's on a mobile device in a theatre it's rude. Wanna tap away get up and go outside. And if someone asks you to put it away, do so, or go outside. Not that hard. So I wouldn't put this as some innocent guy got shot so much as someone who refused to abide by common sense and polite manners got shot. Plus, in a dark theatre, if you're a 71 year old guy facing off some younger guy and suddenly something hits you, overreacting and shooting isn't like in another situation where you can see clearly and don't feel threatened. So the news coverage painting this as some mean cop overreacting isn't giving the real picture of what happened. Seems more like they're using it as another 'let's regulate guns some more' excuse. No regulations or law would have changed this as presumedly, retired law enforcement will always have a weapon on hand if they want one. So using it as a gun control story isn't valid.

On the other hand, lethal force wasn't justifed. After the popcorn or whatever hits you, and you know you're not injured and the confrontation isn't escalating in force, escalating your defense to include lethal force isn't lawful nor is it justified. Wouldn't say 2nd degree murder though. Manslaughter more like.

Yeah, I had a thingy like that a while back, in the end the rude ass hat started to cuss me, and I walked out of the theater since management would not stop the bastards.

Welcome to Obamerica.

 

[Mudflap]

Handling and shooting your new uber-tactical pew pew you bought is not understanding civilian combative concepts.[/QUOTE]

No, it doesn't. If I don't hunt squirrels I'm still allowed to own a .22 rifle.

You're not following along very well.

I'll sit back and try to catch up.

 

[Nosmo King]

How do you know it wasn't secured properly?

Because her mentally frazzled son shot her and 26 others with it.

Knowing her son was disturbed, she should have taken greater precautions. Wouldn't that have been the responsible thing to do?

He killed his mother that is when you start failing if he had not killed his mother you could say she didn't lock them up.

Adam got her gun. He killed her. She did not secure the gun from his mentally disturbed hands. Are you trying, albeit ever so clumsily, to justify Mrs. Lanza's irresponsibility?

If citizens cannot store their weapons safely in their homes, why are we expected to believe they will handle them responsibly in public?

Carrying a Glock with the safety off is not very responsible considering the design flaw associated with Glocks. Carrying a loaded weapon just so you can save the day a la Dirty Harry is an immature outlook. Thinking that armed teachers will prevent school room shootings is also short sighted. Reagan and four others were shot while surrounded by the best armed, best trained cadre of law enforcement officers in history.

There must be something about guns that fogs the mind and suggests that the carrier of a weapon can be a super hero. Obviously the logic is distilled from watching movies or a basic feeling that life is cheap. How sad. How under educated. How tragic.

 

[Nosmo King]

How in the **** do you know she wasn't responsible? Were you in the house?

If her assault rifle had been secured properly...

They must have been he had to kill her to get them.

What did he kill her with?

 

[bigrebnc1775]

If her assault rifle had been secured properly...

They must have been he had to kill her to get them.

What did he kill her with?

She was asleep when he killed her. So does it matter? and she didn't have an assault rifle

 

[PredFan]

There is plenty of potential downside.

Many CCW'ers do not have the mindset.

How many is many?

Very few murders are committed by people who follow all the legal steps to get a carry permit.

If your mindset is to take the fight to an armed confrontation or come to the rescue.

Your mindset has fucked you before you ever clear leather.

But gun ownership is an ego game and gun owners know everything.

100% left wing alarmist bull shit.

 

[JimBowie1958]

Because her mentally frazzled son shot her and 26 others with it.

Knowing her son was disturbed, she should have taken greater precautions. Wouldn't that have been the responsible thing to do?

He killed his mother that is when you start failing if he had not killed his mother you could say she didn't lock them up.

Adam got her gun. He killed her. She did not secure the gun from his mentally disturbed hands. Are you trying, albeit ever so clumsily, to justify Mrs. Lanza's irresponsibility?

There is no way to actually 'secure' a weapon from someone who lives in your own home 100%. You are talking fantasy dude.

If citizens cannot store their weapons safely in their homes, why are we expected to believe they will handle them responsibly in public?

Its none of your business if she can or not.

Carrying a Glock with the safety off is not very responsible considering the design flaw associated with Glocks. Carrying a loaded weapon just so you can save the day a la Dirty Harry is an immature outlook. Thinking that armed teachers will prevent school room shootings is also short sighted.

It has worked in Isreal and Thailand; not a mass murder of students since.

There must be something about guns that fogs the mind and suggests that the carrier of a weapon can be a super hero. Obviously the logic is distilled from watching movies or a basic feeling that life is cheap. How sad. How under educated. How tragic.

There must be something about fascism that fogs the mind and suggests that the government can be a super hero though literally minutes away from the scene. Obviously the logic is distilled from watching movies or a basic feeling that life is cheap. How sad. How under educated. How tragic.

 

[OODA_Loop]

How many is many?

Very few murders are committed by people who follow all the legal steps to get a carry permit.

If your mindset is to take the fight to an armed confrontation or come to the rescue.

Your mindset has fucked you before you ever clear leather.

But gun ownership is an ego game and gun owners know everything.

100% left wing alarmist bull shit.

Sure thing Mr. Zimmerman.

 

[Delta4Embassy]

This particular story brought to mind old Time Life book commercials about the old west where the narrator says something about some outlaw "who once shot a man for snoring too loud." I wonder if we're gonna see this or similar stories in future Time Life books, "a man was once shot in a theatre for texting."

Moral being: leave your cellphones in the car at the theatre.

My Mom's used to be a bad-user of her cell using it driving like. At least until I threatened to chuck it out of the car if she used it again. Repeated, light-hearted mentions of Highway Patrol tests showing use of such devices was equal to being legally impaired hadn't sunk in. Having it chucked out the window however worked.

For the record, I've yet to own or use such a device. I consider them intrusive and bothersome for all but emergency workers and first-responder types. If you NEED to be reachable fine. If not, they're a fad item like pagers.

 

[PredFan]

I am not talking about CCW's committing illegal acts.

OK, but what are you talking about then?

I'm talking about the vast majority of CCW have a misunderstood command of the civilian defensive firearm. This is from most often no civilian combative concept training or poor training. Most gun owners cannot be told or taught anything.

100% garbage. You have to take a basic training class in firearms to get a CCW permit, and to use a weapon against a common thug requires very little training. Perhaps if I come into a fight with a trained killer, he just might have the advantage but its way more likely that the average CCW holder will only face the common street thug.

 

[PredFan]

I'm talking about the vast majority of CCW have a misunderstood command of the civilian defensive firearm. This is from most often no civilian combative concept training or poor training. Most gun owners cannot be told or taught anything.

I don't agree with you, but will admit that I'm pretty much set in my ways. I don't personally know any gun owners who own only one weapon, bought it for "self defense," and don't know how to handle it.

Handling and shooting your new uber-tactical pew pew you bought is not understanding civilian combative concepts.

Ignorant garbage.

 

[OODA_Loop]

OK, but what are you talking about then?

I'm talking about the vast majority of CCW have a misunderstood command of the civilian defensive firearm. This is from most often no civilian combative concept training or poor training. Most gun owners cannot be told or taught anything.

100% garbage. You have to take a basic training class in firearms to get a CCW permit, and to use a weapon against a common thug requires very little training. Perhaps if I come into a fight with a trained killer, he just might have the advantage but its way more likely that the average CCW holder will only face the common street thug.

Seems like you are one squared away steely-eyed dealer of death then.

 

[OODA_Loop]

I don't agree with you, but will admit that I'm pretty much set in my ways. I don't personally know any gun owners who own only one weapon, bought it for "self defense," and don't know how to handle it.

Handling and shooting your new uber-tactical pew pew you bought is not understanding civilian combative concepts.

Ignorant garbage.

Ego man ego.

 

[PredFan]

A defensive gun in your home and a defensive gun on your hip in public are not the same animal.

Thank you Captain Obvious. That doesn't make your argument any less ignorant or pointless.

 

[PredFan]

You're not following along very well.

I'll sit back and try to catch up.

Don't bother, his point is completely irrelevant.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

I am not talking about CCW's committing illegal acts.

OK, but what are you talking about then?

I'm talking about the vast majority of CCW have a misunderstood command of the civilian defensive firearm. This is from most often no civilian combative concept training or poor training. Most gun owners cannot be told or taught anything.

What a load of bullshit!

 

[Mudflap]

Adam got her gun. He killed her. She did not secure the gun from his mentally disturbed hands. Are you trying, albeit ever so clumsily, to justify Mrs. Lanza's irresponsibility?

If citizens cannot store their weapons safely in their homes, why are we expected to believe they will handle them responsibly in public?

Carrying a Glock with the safety off is not very responsible considering the design flaw associated with Glocks. Carrying a loaded weapon just so you can save the day a la Dirty Harry is an immature outlook. Thinking that armed teachers will prevent school room shootings is also short sighted. Reagan and four others were shot while surrounded by the best armed, best trained cadre of law enforcement officers in history.

There must be something about guns that fogs the mind and suggests that the carrier of a weapon can be a super hero. Obviously the logic is distilled from watching movies or a basic feeling that life is cheap. How sad. How under educated. How tragic.

Glocks don't have a manual safety. Is that what you mean about the design flaw?