Terrorist Snipers Open Fire on IDF Soldiers

[Billo_Really]

p.s: sally "ain't" about propaganda !

Sally IS propaganda!


Gratuitous zone 2 compliance:
It's okay to shoot at the IDF in the OPT.

 

[Billo_Really]

Palestine was invaded and occupied by foreign powers in 1948.

That's right!

They go by the name of Zionists.

 

[P F Tinmore]

Billo_Really, Phoenall, et al,

Well, I think there is a minor (albeit important) mistake here.

Who says it isn't their land...

You don't occupy your own property, you own it.

(COMMENT)

This is only half right. Generally speaking, a nation does not "occupy" itself. Those cases are called the establishment of Martial Law; when the government extends its control by military authorities over the civilian population of a designated territory. Occupation is a lesser included form of Martial Law.

Ownership is a civil real estate issue. While there is such a thing as "Government Property" --- in general, the government exercises sovereignty and governance over territory; not ownership. There is no deed to sovereignty territory; but there is a deed for ownership. Sovereignty is a type of political authority over a geographic area or territory.


(COMMENT)

Well, again, partly right.



Not all "occupations" are hostile. That is, the situation can be either "Benevolent" (as in the post-War Occupations of Japan and Germany) or it can be "Belligerent" (as in the Middle East oPt, or Post-War Iraq).

...and who says that the arab muslims have the right to it ?

That's none of your god-damn business!

The only thing you need to know, is that it isn't Israel's.

(COMMENT)

While this exchange sounds knowledgeable, it is flawed.

The West Bank and Gaza Strip were under several different kinds of civil administration, governance, and (in one case) sovereignty since 1947. What we call the occupied Palestinian territories (oPt) today, experienced a multitude of change since the adoption of the Partition Plan, but only since 1988 has this affected self-governance.

I think it makes a great difference as to the status of the territory, as to which government claims what.

Most Respectfully,
R

You are ignoring basic facts. The Palestinians are a nation of people on territory defined be international borders. They have inalienable rights.

1) The right to self determination without external interference.
2) The right to independence and sovereignty.
3) The right to territorial integrity.​

Anything that denies them the exercise of their rights is illegal.

 

[aris2chat]

Billo_Really, Phoenall, et al,

Well, I think there is a minor (albeit important) mistake here.

You don't occupy your own property, you own it.

(COMMENT)

This is only half right. Generally speaking, a nation does not "occupy" itself. Those cases are called the establishment of Martial Law; when the government extends its control by military authorities over the civilian population of a designated territory. Occupation is a lesser included form of Martial Law.

Ownership is a civil real estate issue. While there is such a thing as "Government Property" --- in general, the government exercises sovereignty and governance over territory; not ownership. There is no deed to sovereignty territory; but there is a deed for ownership. Sovereignty is a type of political authority over a geographic area or territory.


(COMMENT)

Well, again, partly right.



Not all "occupations" are hostile. That is, the situation can be either "Benevolent" (as in the post-War Occupations of Japan and Germany) or it can be "Belligerent" (as in the Middle East oPt, or Post-War Iraq).

That's none of your god-damn business!

The only thing you need to know, is that it isn't Israel's.

(COMMENT)

While this exchange sounds knowledgeable, it is flawed.

The West Bank and Gaza Strip were under several different kinds of civil administration, governance, and (in one case) sovereignty since 1947. What we call the occupied Palestinian territories (oPt) today, experienced a multitude of change since the adoption of the Partition Plan, but only since 1988 has this affected self-governance.

I think it makes a great difference as to the status of the territory, as to which government claims what.

Most Respectfully,
R

You are ignoring basic facts. The Palestinians are a nation of people on territory defined be international borders. They have inalienable rights.

1) The right to self determination without external interference.
2) The right to independence and sovereignty.
3) The right to territorial integrity.​

Anything that denies them the exercise of their rights is illegal.

This is ridiculous.
Dementia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Do some reading and get information from other sites then speak to your GP.
Trying to explain seems useless. Sadly it is beginning to feel like speaking to my mother on a good morning.

 

[P F Tinmore]

Billo_Really, Phoenall, et al,

Well, I think there is a minor (albeit important) mistake here.


(COMMENT)

This is only half right. Generally speaking, a nation does not "occupy" itself. Those cases are called the establishment of Martial Law; when the government extends its control by military authorities over the civilian population of a designated territory. Occupation is a lesser included form of Martial Law.

Ownership is a civil real estate issue. While there is such a thing as "Government Property" --- in general, the government exercises sovereignty and governance over territory; not ownership. There is no deed to sovereignty territory; but there is a deed for ownership. Sovereignty is a type of political authority over a geographic area or territory.


(COMMENT)

Well, again, partly right.



Not all "occupations" are hostile. That is, the situation can be either "Benevolent" (as in the post-War Occupations of Japan and Germany) or it can be "Belligerent" (as in the Middle East oPt, or Post-War Iraq).


(COMMENT)

While this exchange sounds knowledgeable, it is flawed.

The West Bank and Gaza Strip were under several different kinds of civil administration, governance, and (in one case) sovereignty since 1947. What we call the occupied Palestinian territories (oPt) today, experienced a multitude of change since the adoption of the Partition Plan, but only since 1988 has this affected self-governance.

I think it makes a great difference as to the status of the territory, as to which government claims what.

Most Respectfully,
R

You are ignoring basic facts. The Palestinians are a nation of people on territory defined be international borders. They have inalienable rights.

1) The right to self determination without external interference.
2) The right to independence and sovereignty.
3) The right to territorial integrity.​

Anything that denies them the exercise of their rights is illegal.

This is ridiculous.
Dementia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Do some reading and get information from other sites then speak to your GP.
Trying to explain seems useless. Sadly it is beginning to feel like speaking to my mother on a good morning.

Is the UN a good site?

Guided by the purposes and principles of the Charter,

Recalling its relevant resolutions which affirm the right of the Palestinian people to self-determination,

1. Reaffirms the inalienable rights of the Palestinian people in Palestine, including:

(a) The right to self-determination without external interference;

(b) The right to national independence and sovereignty;

2. Reaffirms also the inalienable right of the Palestinians to return to their homes and property from which they have been displaced and uprooted, and calls for their return;

3. Emphasizes that full respect for and the realization of these inalienable rights of the Palestinian people are indispensable for the solution of the question of Palestine;

United Nations Official Document

 

[aris2chat]

You are ignoring basic facts. The Palestinians are a nation of people on territory defined be international borders. They have inalienable rights.

1) The right to self determination without external interference.
2) The right to independence and sovereignty.
3) The right to territorial integrity.​

Anything that denies them the exercise of their rights is illegal.

This is ridiculous.
Dementia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Do some reading and get information from other sites then speak to your GP.
Trying to explain seems useless. Sadly it is beginning to feel like speaking to my mother on a good morning.

Is the UN a good site?

Guided by the purposes and principles of the Charter,

Recalling its relevant resolutions which affirm the right of the Palestinian people to self-determination,

1. Reaffirms the inalienable rights of the Palestinian people in Palestine, including:

(a) The right to self-determination without external interference;

(b) The right to national independence and sovereignty;

2. Reaffirms also the inalienable right of the Palestinians to return to their homes and property from which they have been displaced and uprooted, and calls for their return;

3. Emphasizes that full respect for and the realization of these inalienable rights of the Palestinian people are indispensable for the solution of the question of Palestine;

United Nations Official Document

>>Resolution 242 implied that Israel withdraw from "some" of the occupied territories, not "all". Since Israel withdrew from 91% of the territories when it gave up the Sinai, it has already partially, if not wholly, fulfilled its obligation under 242.<<

 

[P F Tinmore]

This is ridiculous.
Dementia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Do some reading and get information from other sites then speak to your GP.
Trying to explain seems useless. Sadly it is beginning to feel like speaking to my mother on a good morning.

Is the UN a good site?

Guided by the purposes and principles of the Charter,

Recalling its relevant resolutions which affirm the right of the Palestinian people to self-determination,

1. Reaffirms the inalienable rights of the Palestinian people in Palestine, including:

(a) The right to self-determination without external interference;

(b) The right to national independence and sovereignty;

2. Reaffirms also the inalienable right of the Palestinians to return to their homes and property from which they have been displaced and uprooted, and calls for their return;

3. Emphasizes that full respect for and the realization of these inalienable rights of the Palestinian people are indispensable for the solution of the question of Palestine;

United Nations Official Document

>>Resolution 242 implied that Israel withdraw from "some" of the occupied territories, not "all". Since Israel withdrew from 91% of the territories when it gave up the Sinai, it has already partially, if not wholly, fulfilled its obligation under 242.<<

So?

 

[Billo_Really]

Billy, little fellow, it is quite obvious that you have gotten so much of what you spout off from the hate sites. It seems that little fellows like you read from the same handbook. Never in a million years would you be posting stuff as you do if you didn't read these hate sites. Please don't deny it. You are not that smart a fellow to think you can get away with it and make the readers think you did so much research on your own.

The UN and ICRC are hate sites?

Doesn't matter. Ad hominems, are not valid rebuttals.

Nice propaganda, though.

 

[RoccoR]

P F Tinmore, et al,

Begging your pardon, but --- are ignoring basic facts. The Israelis are a nation of people on territory defined be international borders. They have inalienable rights.

1) The right to self determination without external interference.
2) The right to independence and sovereignty.
3) The right to territorial integrity.​

Anything that denies them the exercise of their rights is illegal.

You are ignoring basic facts. The Palestinians are a nation of people on territory defined be international borders. They have inalienable rights.

1) The right to self determination without external interference.
2) The right to independence and sovereignty.
3) The right to territorial integrity.​

Anything that denies them the exercise of their rights is illegal.

This is ridiculous.
Dementia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Do some reading and get information from other sites then speak to your GP.
Trying to explain seems useless. Sadly it is beginning to feel like speaking to my mother on a good morning.

Is the UN a good site?

Guided by the purposes and principles of the Charter,

Recalling its relevant resolutions which affirm the right of the Palestinian people to self-determination,

1. Reaffirms the inalienable rights of the Palestinian people in Palestine, including:

(a) The right to self-determination without external interference;

(b) The right to national independence and sovereignty;

2. Reaffirms also the inalienable right of the Palestinians to return to their homes and property from which they have been displaced and uprooted, and calls for their return;

3. Emphasizes that full respect for and the realization of these inalienable rights of the Palestinian people are indispensable for the solution of the question of Palestine;

United Nations Official Document

(COMMENT)

No one has denied these basic rights to the Palestinian.

(a) The right to self-determination without external interference;

The Hostile Arab Palestinian (HoAP) exercised this right several times, and still exercises this right in the West Bank and Gaza Strip. While it is true that the HoAP enlisted the aid of "external interference" from the armies of the Arab League, --- none the less, it was at their self-determination.​

(b) The right to national independence and sovereignty;

The HoAP did exercise the right of national independence and sovereignty in November 1988. And most recently, the Palestinian leadership has expanded upon those rights, in December 2012, and again when it began signing various treaties for political emphasis.​

The Jewish State, as described in the adopted General Assembly Resolution 181(II), as recognized as legitimate by the Palestinians, was used as the foundational guidance in the methodology in establishing the State of Israel. The people of the Jewish State exercised their right under the Charter and pursuant to the "steps preparatory to independence" as adopted by the General Assembly.

As you say, "(a)nything that denies them the exercise of their rights is illegal." And would seem to oppose the General Assembly measures made in accordance with the Charter.

You seem to forget that the Charter is not written exclusively for the Palestinian, but is written by the Members of the UN for - to be interpreted and exercised - for the members of the UN. The initial invasion by the "external interference" (Armies of the Arab League) in 1948, was an attempt by the HoAP to attain by force, territorial control to that which was allocated for the Jewish State; acting in defiance of the Membership.

The HoAP is not the victim in this saga; but, the HoAP perpetrator of aggression. The HoAP have consistently thwarted every opportunity to achieve peace.

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[P F Tinmore]

P F Tinmore, et al,

Begging your pardon, but --- are ignoring basic facts. The Israelis are a nation of people on territory defined be international borders. They have inalienable rights.

1) The right to self determination without external interference.
2) The right to independence and sovereignty.
3) The right to territorial integrity.​

Anything that denies them the exercise of their rights is illegal.

This is ridiculous.
Dementia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Do some reading and get information from other sites then speak to your GP.
Trying to explain seems useless. Sadly it is beginning to feel like speaking to my mother on a good morning.

Is the UN a good site?

Guided by the purposes and principles of the Charter,

Recalling its relevant resolutions which affirm the right of the Palestinian people to self-determination,

1. Reaffirms the inalienable rights of the Palestinian people in Palestine, including:

(a) The right to self-determination without external interference;

(b) The right to national independence and sovereignty;

2. Reaffirms also the inalienable right of the Palestinians to return to their homes and property from which they have been displaced and uprooted, and calls for their return;

3. Emphasizes that full respect for and the realization of these inalienable rights of the Palestinian people are indispensable for the solution of the question of Palestine;

United Nations Official Document

(COMMENT)

No one has denied these basic rights to the Palestinian.

(a) The right to self-determination without external interference;

The Hostile Arab Palestinian (HoAP) exercised this right several times, and still exercises this right in the West Bank and Gaza Strip. While it is true that the HoAP enlisted the aid of "external interference" from the armies of the Arab League, --- none the less, it was at their self-determination.​

(b) The right to national independence and sovereignty;

The HoAP did exercise the right of national independence and sovereignty in November 1988. And most recently, the Palestinian leadership has expanded upon those rights, in December 2012, and again when it began signing various treaties for political emphasis.​

The Jewish State, as described in the adopted General Assembly Resolution 181(II), as recognized as legitimate by the Palestinians, was used as the foundational guidance in the methodology in establishing the State of Israel. The people of the Jewish State exercised their right under the Charter and pursuant to the "steps preparatory to independence" as adopted by the General Assembly.

As you say, "(a)nything that denies them the exercise of their rights is illegal." And would seem to oppose the General Assembly measures made in accordance with the Charter.

You seem to forget that the Charter is not written exclusively for the Palestinian, but is written by the Members of the UN for - to be interpreted and exercised - for the members of the UN. The initial invasion by the "external interference" (Armies of the Arab League) in 1948, was an attempt by the HoAP to attain by force, territorial control to that which was allocated for the Jewish State; acting in defiance of the Membership.

The HoAP is not the victim in this saga; but, the HoAP perpetrator of aggression. The HoAP have consistently thwarted every opportunity to achieve peace.

Most Respectfully,
R

Pfffft.

The Palestinian's rights have been denied since day one. That is the root of the problems we still have today.

Everything you mentioned are merely symptoms of that original problem.

 

[MrMax]

P F Tinmore, et al,

Begging your pardon, but --- are ignoring basic facts. The Israelis are a nation of people on territory defined be international borders. They have inalienable rights.

1) The right to self determination without external interference.
2) The right to independence and sovereignty.
3) The right to territorial integrity.​

Anything that denies them the exercise of their rights is illegal.

Is the UN a good site?

(COMMENT)

No one has denied these basic rights to the Palestinian.

(a) The right to self-determination without external interference;

The Hostile Arab Palestinian (HoAP) exercised this right several times, and still exercises this right in the West Bank and Gaza Strip. While it is true that the HoAP enlisted the aid of "external interference" from the armies of the Arab League, --- none the less, it was at their self-determination.​

(b) The right to national independence and sovereignty;

The HoAP did exercise the right of national independence and sovereignty in November 1988. And most recently, the Palestinian leadership has expanded upon those rights, in December 2012, and again when it began signing various treaties for political emphasis.​

The Jewish State, as described in the adopted General Assembly Resolution 181(II), as recognized as legitimate by the Palestinians, was used as the foundational guidance in the methodology in establishing the State of Israel. The people of the Jewish State exercised their right under the Charter and pursuant to the "steps preparatory to independence" as adopted by the General Assembly.

As you say, "(a)nything that denies them the exercise of their rights is illegal." And would seem to oppose the General Assembly measures made in accordance with the Charter.

You seem to forget that the Charter is not written exclusively for the Palestinian, but is written by the Members of the UN for - to be interpreted and exercised - for the members of the UN. The initial invasion by the "external interference" (Armies of the Arab League) in 1948, was an attempt by the HoAP to attain by force, territorial control to that which was allocated for the Jewish State; acting in defiance of the Membership.

The HoAP is not the victim in this saga; but, the HoAP perpetrator of aggression. The HoAP have consistently thwarted every opportunity to achieve peace.

Most Respectfully,
R

Pfffft.

The Palestinian's rights have been denied since day one. That is the root of the problems we still have today.

Everything you mentioned are merely symptoms of that original problem.

Normal rights are suspended during wartime. Maybe the Pals should surrender first.

 

[P F Tinmore]

P F Tinmore, et al,

Begging your pardon, but --- are ignoring basic facts. The Israelis are a nation of people on territory defined be international borders. They have inalienable rights.

1) The right to self determination without external interference.
2) The right to independence and sovereignty.
3) The right to territorial integrity.​

Anything that denies them the exercise of their rights is illegal.


(COMMENT)

No one has denied these basic rights to the Palestinian.

(a) The right to self-determination without external interference;

The Hostile Arab Palestinian (HoAP) exercised this right several times, and still exercises this right in the West Bank and Gaza Strip. While it is true that the HoAP enlisted the aid of "external interference" from the armies of the Arab League, --- none the less, it was at their self-determination.​

(b) The right to national independence and sovereignty;

The HoAP did exercise the right of national independence and sovereignty in November 1988. And most recently, the Palestinian leadership has expanded upon those rights, in December 2012, and again when it began signing various treaties for political emphasis.​

The Jewish State, as described in the adopted General Assembly Resolution 181(II), as recognized as legitimate by the Palestinians, was used as the foundational guidance in the methodology in establishing the State of Israel. The people of the Jewish State exercised their right under the Charter and pursuant to the "steps preparatory to independence" as adopted by the General Assembly.

As you say, "(a)nything that denies them the exercise of their rights is illegal." And would seem to oppose the General Assembly measures made in accordance with the Charter.

You seem to forget that the Charter is not written exclusively for the Palestinian, but is written by the Members of the UN for - to be interpreted and exercised - for the members of the UN. The initial invasion by the "external interference" (Armies of the Arab League) in 1948, was an attempt by the HoAP to attain by force, territorial control to that which was allocated for the Jewish State; acting in defiance of the Membership.

The HoAP is not the victim in this saga; but, the HoAP perpetrator of aggression. The HoAP have consistently thwarted every opportunity to achieve peace.

Most Respectfully,
R

Pfffft.

The Palestinian's rights have been denied since day one. That is the root of the problems we still have today.

Everything you mentioned are merely symptoms of that original problem.

Normal rights are suspended during wartime. Maybe the Pals should surrender first.

The Palestinian's rights were violated in peace time. War was the predictable result of those violations.

 

[Phoenall]

Billo_Really, Phoenall, et al,

Well, I think there is a minor (albeit important) mistake here.

You don't occupy your own property, you own it.

(COMMENT)

This is only half right. Generally speaking, a nation does not "occupy" itself. Those cases are called the establishment of Martial Law; when the government extends its control by military authorities over the civilian population of a designated territory. Occupation is a lesser included form of Martial Law.

Ownership is a civil real estate issue. While there is such a thing as "Government Property" --- in general, the government exercises sovereignty and governance over territory; not ownership. There is no deed to sovereignty territory; but there is a deed for ownership. Sovereignty is a type of political authority over a geographic area or territory.


(COMMENT)

Well, again, partly right.



Not all "occupations" are hostile. That is, the situation can be either "Benevolent" (as in the post-War Occupations of Japan and Germany) or it can be "Belligerent" (as in the Middle East oPt, or Post-War Iraq).

That's none of your god-damn business!

The only thing you need to know, is that it isn't Israel's.

(COMMENT)

While this exchange sounds knowledgeable, it is flawed.

The West Bank and Gaza Strip were under several different kinds of civil administration, governance, and (in one case) sovereignty since 1947. What we call the occupied Palestinian territories (oPt) today, experienced a multitude of change since the adoption of the Partition Plan, but only since 1988 has this affected self-governance.

I think it makes a great difference as to the status of the territory, as to which government claims what.

Most Respectfully,
R

You are ignoring basic facts. The Palestinians are a nation of people on territory defined be international borders. They have inalienable rights.

1) The right to self determination without external interference.
2) The right to independence and sovereignty.
3) The right to territorial integrity.​

Anything that denies them the exercise of their rights is illegal.

And you forget that there are Jews and Christians that also have those same rights that don't want to live under the yoke of islam. This makes them a separate Palestinian nation on territory defined by International Borders, and they have the same inalienable rights

1) the right to self determination without Islamic interference

2) the right to independence and sovereignty

3) the right to territorial integrity

Anything that denies them the exercise4 of their rights is illegal. That is why the land left after the muslim land grabs was divided along demographic lines and offered as two states to take into account the rights of all parties.

So why do you constantly deny the Jews their inalienable rights to a NATIONAL HOME, FREE DETERMINATION, INDEPENDENCE, SOVEREINGTY AND TERRITORIAL INTEGRITY ?

 

[Phoenall]

You are ignoring basic facts. The Palestinians are a nation of people on territory defined be international borders. They have inalienable rights.

1) The right to self determination without external interference.
2) The right to independence and sovereignty.
3) The right to territorial integrity.​

Anything that denies them the exercise of their rights is illegal.

This is ridiculous.
Dementia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Do some reading and get information from other sites then speak to your GP.
Trying to explain seems useless. Sadly it is beginning to feel like speaking to my mother on a good morning.

Is the UN a good site?

Guided by the purposes and principles of the Charter,

Recalling its relevant resolutions which affirm the right of the Palestinian people to self-determination,

1. Reaffirms the inalienable rights of the Palestinian people in Palestine, including:

(a) The right to self-determination without external interference;

(b) The right to national independence and sovereignty;

2. Reaffirms also the inalienable right of the Palestinians to return to their homes and property from which they have been displaced and uprooted, and calls for their return;

3. Emphasizes that full respect for and the realization of these inalienable rights of the Palestinian people are indispensable for the solution of the question of Palestine;

United Nations Official Document

But nowhere does it say in any LoN or UN treaty that the arab muslims are the sole landlords of the land of the M.E. In fact not one mentions the Palestinian muslims as having any rights to land in the M.E. until 1988 when they declared on UN res 181, 48 years after it ran out.

REMEMBER THAT THE JEWS HAVE THE SAME RIGHTS AND DECLARED FIRST BEFORE BING INVADED BY ARAB MUSLIM ARMIES.

 

[Phoenall]

You are ignoring basic facts. The Palestinians are a nation of people on territory defined be international borders. They have inalienable rights.

1) The right to self determination without external interference.
2) The right to independence and sovereignty.
3) The right to territorial integrity.​

Anything that denies them the exercise of their rights is illegal.

This is ridiculous.
Dementia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Do some reading and get information from other sites then speak to your GP.
Trying to explain seems useless. Sadly it is beginning to feel like speaking to my mother on a good morning.

Is the UN a good site?

Guided by the purposes and principles of the Charter,

Recalling its relevant resolutions which affirm the right of the Palestinian people to self-determination,

1. Reaffirms the inalienable rights of the Palestinian people in Palestine, including:

(a) The right to self-determination without external interference;

(b) The right to national independence and sovereignty;

2. Reaffirms also the inalienable right of the Palestinians to return to their homes and property from which they have been displaced and uprooted, and calls for their return;

3. Emphasizes that full respect for and the realization of these inalienable rights of the Palestinian people are indispensable for the solution of the question of Palestine;

United Nations Official Document

But it does not say that the progeny of those Palestinians can claim the right of return, and invade with the sole intention of destroying Israel.

 

[Phoenall]

Is the UN a good site?

>>Resolution 242 implied that Israel withdraw from "some" of the occupied territories, not "all". Since Israel withdrew from 91% of the territories when it gave up the Sinai, it has already partially, if not wholly, fulfilled its obligation under 242.<<

So?

So it shows that Israel is in compliance with UN resolutions, and that the Palestinians refuse to accept the same UN resolutions.

 

[Phoenall]

P F Tinmore, et al,

Begging your pardon, but --- are ignoring basic facts. The Israelis are a nation of people on territory defined be international borders. They have inalienable rights.

1) The right to self determination without external interference.
2) The right to independence and sovereignty.
3) The right to territorial integrity.​

Anything that denies them the exercise of their rights is illegal.

Is the UN a good site?

(COMMENT)

No one has denied these basic rights to the Palestinian.

(a) The right to self-determination without external interference;

The Hostile Arab Palestinian (HoAP) exercised this right several times, and still exercises this right in the West Bank and Gaza Strip. While it is true that the HoAP enlisted the aid of "external interference" from the armies of the Arab League, --- none the less, it was at their self-determination.​

(b) The right to national independence and sovereignty;

The HoAP did exercise the right of national independence and sovereignty in November 1988. And most recently, the Palestinian leadership has expanded upon those rights, in December 2012, and again when it began signing various treaties for political emphasis.​

The Jewish State, as described in the adopted General Assembly Resolution 181(II), as recognized as legitimate by the Palestinians, was used as the foundational guidance in the methodology in establishing the State of Israel. The people of the Jewish State exercised their right under the Charter and pursuant to the "steps preparatory to independence" as adopted by the General Assembly.

As you say, "(a)nything that denies them the exercise of their rights is illegal." And would seem to oppose the General Assembly measures made in accordance with the Charter.

You seem to forget that the Charter is not written exclusively for the Palestinian, but is written by the Members of the UN for - to be interpreted and exercised - for the members of the UN. The initial invasion by the "external interference" (Armies of the Arab League) in 1948, was an attempt by the HoAP to attain by force, territorial control to that which was allocated for the Jewish State; acting in defiance of the Membership.

The HoAP is not the victim in this saga; but, the HoAP perpetrator of aggression. The HoAP have consistently thwarted every opportunity to achieve peace.

Most Respectfully,
R

Pfffft.

The Palestinian's rights have been denied since day one. That is the root of the problems we still have today.

Everything you mentioned are merely symptoms of that original problem.

SHow how their rights have been denied, when you and the rest of the ISLAMONAZI TERRORIST SCUM are still trying to deny the Jews the same rights you claim for the arab muslims. You want to force the Jews into accepting muslim supremacy and control over their free determination, sovereignty and territorial integrity.

 

[P F Tinmore]

Billo_Really, Phoenall, et al,

Well, I think there is a minor (albeit important) mistake here.


(COMMENT)

This is only half right. Generally speaking, a nation does not "occupy" itself. Those cases are called the establishment of Martial Law; when the government extends its control by military authorities over the civilian population of a designated territory. Occupation is a lesser included form of Martial Law.

Ownership is a civil real estate issue. While there is such a thing as "Government Property" --- in general, the government exercises sovereignty and governance over territory; not ownership. There is no deed to sovereignty territory; but there is a deed for ownership. Sovereignty is a type of political authority over a geographic area or territory.


(COMMENT)

Well, again, partly right.



Not all "occupations" are hostile. That is, the situation can be either "Benevolent" (as in the post-War Occupations of Japan and Germany) or it can be "Belligerent" (as in the Middle East oPt, or Post-War Iraq).


(COMMENT)

While this exchange sounds knowledgeable, it is flawed.

The West Bank and Gaza Strip were under several different kinds of civil administration, governance, and (in one case) sovereignty since 1947. What we call the occupied Palestinian territories (oPt) today, experienced a multitude of change since the adoption of the Partition Plan, but only since 1988 has this affected self-governance.

I think it makes a great difference as to the status of the territory, as to which government claims what.

Most Respectfully,
R

You are ignoring basic facts. The Palestinians are a nation of people on territory defined be international borders. They have inalienable rights.

1) The right to self determination without external interference.
2) The right to independence and sovereignty.
3) The right to territorial integrity.​

Anything that denies them the exercise of their rights is illegal.

And you forget that there are Jews and Christians that also have those same rights that don't want to live under the yoke of islam. This makes them a separate Palestinian nation on territory defined by International Borders, and they have the same inalienable rights

1) the right to self determination without Islamic interference

2) the right to independence and sovereignty

3) the right to territorial integrity

Anything that denies them the exercise4 of their rights is illegal. That is why the land left after the muslim land grabs was divided along demographic lines and offered as two states to take into account the rights of all parties.

So why do you constantly deny the Jews their inalienable rights to a NATIONAL HOME, FREE DETERMINATION, INDEPENDENCE, SOVEREINGTY AND TERRITORIAL INTEGRITY ?

It is true that Palestinian Christians, Muslims, and Jews had the same rights and they expressed to the British many times that they wanted their state with equal rights. The PLO charter specifies that native Jews are legitimate citizens of Palestine. Today's constitution specifies that all Palestinians are equal under the law without regard to race, sex, religion.

I don't see where anybody's rights were threatened.

 

[Phoenall]

Pfffft.

The Palestinian's rights have been denied since day one. That is the root of the problems we still have today.

Everything you mentioned are merely symptoms of that original problem.

Normal rights are suspended during wartime. Maybe the Pals should surrender first.

The Palestinian's rights were violated in peace time. War was the predictable result of those violations.

The war was started on May 14 1948 by the arab muslims, of which the Palestinians were a part. The war was never declared ended and is still being fought by the arab muslim Palestinians. So when were their rights violated in peace time ?

It has always been the Jews rights to determination, sovereignty and territorial integrity that has been violated.

 

[P F Tinmore]

P F Tinmore, et al,

Begging your pardon, but --- are ignoring basic facts. The Israelis are a nation of people on territory defined be international borders. They have inalienable rights.

1) The right to self determination without external interference.
2) The right to independence and sovereignty.
3) The right to territorial integrity.​

Anything that denies them the exercise of their rights is illegal.


(COMMENT)

No one has denied these basic rights to the Palestinian.

(a) The right to self-determination without external interference;

The Hostile Arab Palestinian (HoAP) exercised this right several times, and still exercises this right in the West Bank and Gaza Strip. While it is true that the HoAP enlisted the aid of "external interference" from the armies of the Arab League, --- none the less, it was at their self-determination.​

(b) The right to national independence and sovereignty;

The HoAP did exercise the right of national independence and sovereignty in November 1988. And most recently, the Palestinian leadership has expanded upon those rights, in December 2012, and again when it began signing various treaties for political emphasis.​

The Jewish State, as described in the adopted General Assembly Resolution 181(II), as recognized as legitimate by the Palestinians, was used as the foundational guidance in the methodology in establishing the State of Israel. The people of the Jewish State exercised their right under the Charter and pursuant to the "steps preparatory to independence" as adopted by the General Assembly.

As you say, "(a)nything that denies them the exercise of their rights is illegal." And would seem to oppose the General Assembly measures made in accordance with the Charter.

You seem to forget that the Charter is not written exclusively for the Palestinian, but is written by the Members of the UN for - to be interpreted and exercised - for the members of the UN. The initial invasion by the "external interference" (Armies of the Arab League) in 1948, was an attempt by the HoAP to attain by force, territorial control to that which was allocated for the Jewish State; acting in defiance of the Membership.

The HoAP is not the victim in this saga; but, the HoAP perpetrator of aggression. The HoAP have consistently thwarted every opportunity to achieve peace.

Most Respectfully,
R

Pfffft.

The Palestinian's rights have been denied since day one. That is the root of the problems we still have today.

Everything you mentioned are merely symptoms of that original problem.

SHow how their rights have been denied, when you and the rest of the ISLAMONAZI TERRORIST SCUM are still trying to deny the Jews the same rights you claim for the arab muslims. You want to force the Jews into accepting muslim supremacy and control over their free determination, sovereignty and territorial integrity.

Not true.

I have always said that Palestinian Muslims, Christians, and Jews have equal rights.