Taxes.. How much is TOO MUCH?

Someone runs a business, what constitutes expenses and what is profit? If the business owner runs restaurant and eats meals 'off book' at said restaurant, they can deduct the cost of the food from the profits and simultaneously see a personal, invisible profit, in the form of 'free' lunch. If another businessman hosts clients to conclude deals, is that an expense? What about the auto mechanic who marks parts as lost/stolen inventory when they are actually being used, on the sly, to keep his own vehicles running.

Every time you turn around another example of ways to get around any 'income' tax will come up, available mainly to those who run their own business.

I agree that a VAT tax is terrible, but the claim that a "flat" income tax will fix everything is indefensible.


I doubt Ray Kroc became a billionaire by eating up his inventory.

If you are worried about a mechanic fixing his own car, you sorely lack perspective.

People have to sign their tax filings; cheating carries a penalty. What do you suggest we do, add 100,000 more IRS agents to snoop around donut shops to see if the fry cooks are sampling the merchandise? The type of compliance you expect would be at such a high cost to Liberty that the economy would Cease To Function.

The Real Abuse is all of the inefficiency in our economy as government rigs the system in favor of its cronies. Follow the money. The Feds spending $4T is the Big Elephant In The Room.
 
I pay roughly 10% now in federal income taxes. No dependents, no deductions or credits of any consequence. I know many many people who make just what I do, but have many deductions of various sorts, who pay far less than that.

Should they pay more?

Yes. We should all be responsible for the Same percentage regardless of our total income levels or personal circumstances.

The concept really isn't that hard to understand.

I understand the concept smartass. What you don't understand is that you have NO chance of being politically successful trying to sell a massive tax overhaul to the American people that will raise taxes on lower income Americans and cut taxes for wealthier Americans.

Why don't you understand that many, perhaps a fairly substantial majority, of Americans, probably all or most taxpayers and likely voters, are fed up with a system that is slowly but surely sinking the ship. Never mind the iceberg. They're worried about all the holes being drilled below the water line.

Some of us think or at least hope that this is slowly but perceptively changing the game.

If so, we just might finally start reversing the whole thing and return to some semblance of sanity.
 
The Real Abuse is all of the inefficiency in our economy as government rigs the system in favor of its cronies.
Let me restate - I gave examples which could be easily seen as hard to find, but the true abuse is in BIG owners who can do things like - have a fleet of company cars and retain one for their personal use. The company, which they own, pays for the car, the insurance, the maintenance, the gasoline. The company owner then has a car from tax free income because the company he owns lists all those as corporate expenses. The average working guy has to pay for all those things with taxed income.

The Feds consume ~30% of the GDP. They should not be in the double digits. Even Texas, which is a moderately conservative state, spent ~13% of our state DP in their budget. Add in local taxes and pretty quickly you pay half your income to the government one way or another. Think how much harder it would hit someone in, for example, New York City where the state and local spending is so much higher as they attempt to support failed socialist policies.

Eliminate Socialist Security and MediScam, reduce the military budget to 100 Billion, cut money from other programs across the board and then talk about reforming taxes. All the talk now is not going to go anywhere as young healthy people who are on the low income side can rightfully claim they get very little government service while still being forced to sign up for the draft and certain that Socialist Security WILL go bankrupt before they can ever hope to collect. Even a person in their 40's is apt to see SS go bankrupt before they retire, so on top of all their other expenses, they have to sock away for their own retirement, in an economy where investing in the market is extremely perilous and the returns ridiculously low (for the typical investor)
 
Let me restate - I gave examples which could be easily seen as hard to find, but the true abuse is in BIG owners who can do things like - have a fleet of company cars and retain one for their personal use. The company, which they own, pays for the car, the insurance, the maintenance, the gasoline. The company owner then has a car from tax free income because the company he owns lists all those as corporate expenses. The average working guy has to pay for all those things with taxed income.


You don't know much about how the tax system works, do you?

If you think the abuse is that some company owner uses a company paid for car for personal use, you sorely lack perspective. That is a drop in the bucket compared to how government wastes the money it collects.

Companies have to keep records of usage for company fleets - which are subject to audit. There is not upside, and a great deal of risk, for tolerating personal use of such vehicles. Does some occur? - Certainly. Government workers also abuse fleet vehicles for personal use - I know of several cops who use their squad cars as their own private limos, sailing through toll plazas without paying and driving in the HOV lanes when driving solo.

It would benefit you to up level your thinking to what the Feds controlling 30% plus of our GDP really means instead of focusing on the random individiuals who abuse minor loopholes compared to the scale of the whole.
 
Plus again, as stated before, a SIMPLER TAX SYSTEM, creates less loopholes for people to use, spreads the responsibility of the tax across the entire population, Not the top 1%-5% of taxpayers
 
I agree.

Simplicity is a great disinfectant.

The complexity of our current system enables politicians and their cronies to buy and sell favors.
 
Plus again, as stated before, a SIMPLER TAX SYSTEM, creates less loopholes for people to use, spreads the responsibility of the tax across the entire population, Not the top 1%-5% of taxpayers
I just finished my taxes, and my income does not put one in the top 10%, much less the top 1%, yet my total burden was significant - as in double digits as a percent of my income. On top of that I get the privilege of paying Socialist Security and Medifraud as well, but am not so wealth that those become a negligible sum.

We, as a nation, go to a tariff system. That would support a frugal government and is not susceptible to stealth abuse. Defining income is exceptionally hard when you consider corporate entities, and the definitions become the source of dodging. Defining a ton of bananas and placing a tariff of $5 on said ton is simple. Sure there gets to be a long list of tariffs, but it is just a list. Look up an item and find the tariff.

I don't need to hear some halfwit bring up Smoot-Hawley as an example of a failed tariff; S-H was designed to stop trade. I am discussing a tariff designed to create government revenue. Such a system would have many benefits and the sole drawback would be that the government cow would run dry if they tried to get too much milk.
 

Forum List

Back
Top