Striking Union Workers Hurl Racial Epithets

[bripat9643]

SCAB WORKERS and the management that hires them deserves no sympathy.

So you also believe it's OK to assault people simply because they are willing to work?

I believe that crossing a picket line is a very bad idea.

It shouldn't be a bad idea if the police do their jobs and prevent union thugs from assaulting people who have a perfect right to cross it.

Obviously, you endorse union thuggery.

It's rather like insinuating yourself in a family squabble.

It's nothing like that.

I completely understand that you disagree, of course.

Every rational person disagrees.

We come at social science with very different POVs.

"Social science?" what you believe in definitely doesn't qualify as science.

I support unionism and the right to collective bargaining.

You don't.

Apparently you also support the right of union thugs to smash the faces of anyone who wants to work.

There's really not much else to say, is there?

No, you've admitted that you're a thug. That's the end of the discussion. I have nothing to say to thugs except to call them what they are.

We don't have enough common ground to even debate the issue.

that's true of all left-wingers. They don't debate. They simply hurl ad hominems.

 

[Jarhead]

SCAB WORKERS and the management that hires them deserves no sympathy.

So you also believe it's OK to assault people simply because they are willing to work?

I believe that crossing a picket line is a very bad idea.

it is only bad if the striker uses violence. Would you blame the scab or the striker?

It's rather like insinuating yourself in a family squabble.

I understand the analogy, but I dont agree with it. Lets put it this way....if my sister and her husband had a fight and the result was him walking 9out and leaving her with no money...I would front her money and I see nothing wrong with it

I completely understand that you disagree, of course.

Such is why we have debate

We come at social science with very different POVs.

I support unionism and the right to collective bargaining.

And that is fine.....but you do realize that the unions may be good for some, but bad for the rest of the members...and I will show you why if you would like.

You don't.

There's really not much else to say, is there?

We don't have enough common ground to even debate the issue.

If we had common ground there would be no reason to debate......

 

[thereisnospoon]

SCAB WORKERS and the management that hires them deserves no sympathy.

So you also believe it's OK to assault people simply because they are willing to work?

Your rather stupid comments are a waste of time and space. So off you go to the Ignore list with the rest of the belligerent adolescents and shit-slinging monkeys.

Ahh so that's it...Can't get anyone to agree so you insult them and place them on ignore.
Great. You just ran out of gas. Your premise that violence is ok and apparently justified as though unions and union people were above the law and get to live outside the bounds of a civilized society leaves you with ZERO credibility.
As a representative on here of unions, as your credibility is gone is that of unions.
Is it any wonder why most Americans oppose unions?
You have lost.

 

[Jarhead]

there seems to be a common theme developing.....think about this....

If you do not read or understand the fine print of a contract yet you sign it anyway, you are a victim and deserve restitution.

If you need to feed your family and you cross a picket line of people that have opted NOT to work in an effort to get what they want (not necessarily what they deserve) and you are violently attacked, it is YOUR fault and the attacker is not at fault.

Exactly when was it when our values have flip flopped?

 

[MikeK]

Mike..no matter what excuse you use for union thuggery, the bottom line is YOU ARE WRONG.
Your attitude is one of the main reasons why a vast majority of the American people are anti-union.
Digging up shit that happened long ago when the situation was much different is useless.
You are making up excuses for barbarism.
You union people claim the right to bargain. You do not bargain. You threaten and coerce. When you don't get what you want, you vandalize property and batter people. At that point you lose the label of striking worker and become a criminal.
It is time we went back to a system where union workers who do these things are prosecuted to full extent of the law.
Better still, the union is kicked out for good.
BTW, I have some great news. That NLRB suit against Boeing is a LOSER!!!!!
The NLRB an unelected accountable to no one body is going to get defanged. The NLRB should have let this one go. Now they will lose their power to regulate business.

You seem to think the American working class would be better off without unions. Why?

Tell us how you believe the elimination of unions would affect the U.S.

What is it you personally have against unions in general that prompts you to accentuate the negative and eliminate the positive aspects of unions?

What specifically has the union movement done to harm you?

How do you earn your living?


PS: You've referred in my direction as, "You union people. . ." Please be advised that I've been retired for twenty-seven years. I no longer belong to any union. And the union I belonged to is about as non-aggressive as it gets (AFSCME). My support for unions derives from my awareness of what life in America would be like for the working class without unions.

Also, I neither approve of nor do I support wildcat union action.

 

[Jarhead]

Mike..no matter what excuse you use for union thuggery, the bottom line is YOU ARE WRONG.
Your attitude is one of the main reasons why a vast majority of the American people are anti-union.
Digging up shit that happened long ago when the situation was much different is useless.
You are making up excuses for barbarism.
You union people claim the right to bargain. You do not bargain. You threaten and coerce. When you don't get what you want, you vandalize property and batter people. At that point you lose the label of striking worker and become a criminal.
It is time we went back to a system where union workers who do these things are prosecuted to full extent of the law.
Better still, the union is kicked out for good.
BTW, I have some great news. That NLRB suit against Boeing is a LOSER!!!!!
The NLRB an unelected accountable to no one body is going to get defanged. The NLRB should have let this one go. Now they will lose their power to regulate business.

You seem to think the American working class would be better off without unions. Why? Tell us how you believe the elimination of unions would affect the U.S.

What is it you personally have against unions in general that prompts you to accentuate the negative and eliminate the positive aspects of unions? What specifically has the union movement done to harm you?

How do you earn your living?

Simple..

When you speak for the masses, ones individuality no longer becomes a factor.

Now whereas that may sound like a good thing, when it comes to ones career it is not.

If you work for a unionized company and you have a differential that would warrant an advancement in your career, it becomes meaningless.

If employee A uses all of his sick days (even though he was not sick) and employee B uses none of his sick days (even though he had a sore throat a couple of times) and yet they both get the exact same raise, how many sick days do you think employee B will use next year?

Unions have created an environment where the worker strives toi work no harder than the least acceptable by contract.

It is not good for the business and it is not good for the employee with a good work ethic.

Unions were necessary to ensure safe working environments....now we have OSHA and HR laws to do that.

 

[Immanuel]

Mike..no matter what excuse you use for union thuggery, the bottom line is YOU ARE WRONG.
Your attitude is one of the main reasons why a vast majority of the American people are anti-union.
Digging up shit that happened long ago when the situation was much different is useless.
You are making up excuses for barbarism.
You union people claim the right to bargain. You do not bargain. You threaten and coerce. When you don't get what you want, you vandalize property and batter people. At that point you lose the label of striking worker and become a criminal.
It is time we went back to a system where union workers who do these things are prosecuted to full extent of the law.
Better still, the union is kicked out for good.
BTW, I have some great news. That NLRB suit against Boeing is a LOSER!!!!!
The NLRB an unelected accountable to no one body is going to get defanged. The NLRB should have let this one go. Now they will lose their power to regulate business.

You seem to think the American working class would be better off without unions. Why? Tell us how you believe the elimination of unions would affect the U.S.

What is it you personally have against unions in general that prompts you to accentuate the negative and eliminate the positive aspects of unions? What specifically has the union movement done to harm you?

How do you earn your living?

Simple..

When you speak for the masses, ones individuality no longer becomes a factor.

Now whereas that may sound like a good thing, when it comes to ones career it is not.

If you work for a unionized company and you have a differential that would warrant an advancement in your career, it becomes meaningless.

If employee A uses all of his sick days (even though he was not sick) and employee B uses none of his sick days (even though he had a sore throat a couple of times) and yet they both get the exact same raise, how many sick days do you think employee B will use next year?

Unions have created an environment where the worker strives toi work no harder than the least acceptable by contract.

It is not good for the business and it is not good for the employee with a good work ethic.

Unions were necessary to ensure safe working environments....now we have OSHA and HR laws to do that.

The one concern that I have with that last sentence is that if unions were to go away business and the government would eat away at OSHA and HR laws. OSHA the department, would of course never go away, but the protections that unions won would eventually deteriorate again.

Immie

 

[MikeK]

The one concern that I have with that last sentence is that if unions were to go away business and the government would eat away at OSHA and HR laws. OSHA the department, would of course never go away, but the protections that unions won would eventually deteriorate again.

Immie

And therein lies the tale!

Thank you for allowing your intelligence to transcend what seems to be an increasingly common quandary.

Where the issue of Labor in America is concerned, it may be said that the only thing worse than unions would be no unions.

 

[Immanuel]

The one concern that I have with that last sentence is that if unions were to go away business and the government would eat away at OSHA and HR laws. OSHA the department, would of course never go away, but the protections that unions won would eventually deteriorate again.

Immie

And therein lies the tale!

Thank you for allowing your intelligence to transcend what seems to be an increasingly common quandary.

Where the issue of Labor in America is concerned, it may be said that the only thing worse than unions would be no unions.

Don't go getting all giddy on me, that doesn't mean I support the hoods that bash heads because they don't get what they want. You can call me timid all you want. I don't support assault or murder of innocent people just because someone crossed a stupid line.

Immie

 

[MikeK]

So you also believe it's OK to assault people simply because they are willing to work?

Your rather stupid comments are a waste of time and space. So off you go to the Ignore list with the rest of the belligerent adolescents and shit-slinging monkeys.

Ahh so that's it...Can't get anyone to agree so you insult them and place them on ignore.

The fact that you along with several other opponents of mine are still here (to me) makes it clear that your perceptions are based on specious reasoning. Those whom I prefer to ignore are simply not worth the time it takes to read their stupid and/or offensive comments or the space they occupy.

 

[MikeK]

The one concern that I have with that last sentence is that if unions were to go away business and the government would eat away at OSHA and HR laws. OSHA the department, would of course never go away, but the protections that unions won would eventually deteriorate again.

Immie

And therein lies the tale!

Thank you for allowing your intelligence to transcend what seems to be an increasingly common quandary.

Where the issue of Labor in America is concerned, it may be said that the only thing worse than unions would be no unions.

Don't go getting all giddy on me, that doesn't mean I support the hoods that bash heads because they don't get what they want. You can call me timid all you want. I don't support assault or murder of innocent people just because someone crossed a stupid line.

As long as there are nations there will be wars. And as long as there is labor vs capital there will be violent conflicts. Your thoughts on the matter are noted.

 

[Jarhead]

The one concern that I have with that last sentence is that if unions were to go away business and the government would eat away at OSHA and HR laws. OSHA the department, would of course never go away, but the protections that unions won would eventually deteriorate again.

Immie

And therein lies the tale!

Thank you for allowing your intelligence to transcend what seems to be an increasingly common quandary.

Where the issue of Labor in America is concerned, it may be said that the only thing worse than unions would be no unions.

fine...based on that concern, allow unions to do what they were designed to do...ensure a safe and healthy work environment.

When they get involved in compensation, the better workers are hurt, and those with the lowest work ethic are protected.

It doesnt work.

 

[Jarhead]

Your rather stupid comments are a waste of time and space. So off you go to the Ignore list with the rest of the belligerent adolescents and shit-slinging monkeys.

Ahh so that's it...Can't get anyone to agree so you insult them and place them on ignore.

The fact that you along with several other opponents of mine are still here (to me) makes it clear that your perceptions are based on specious reasoning. Those whom I prefer to ignore are simply not worth the time it takes to read their stupid and/or offensive comments or the space they occupy.

And I assume you incluide me in that category as you never respond to me. And seeing s I do not have a reputation of slandering my opponent...I must assume you ignore me becuase you disagree with me.

That is what freedom of choice is all about.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Mike..no matter what excuse you use for union thuggery, the bottom line is YOU ARE WRONG.
Your attitude is one of the main reasons why a vast majority of the American people are anti-union.
Digging up shit that happened long ago when the situation was much different is useless.
You are making up excuses for barbarism.
You union people claim the right to bargain. You do not bargain. You threaten and coerce. When you don't get what you want, you vandalize property and batter people. At that point you lose the label of striking worker and become a criminal.
It is time we went back to a system where union workers who do these things are prosecuted to full extent of the law.
Better still, the union is kicked out for good.
BTW, I have some great news. That NLRB suit against Boeing is a LOSER!!!!!
The NLRB an unelected accountable to no one body is going to get defanged. The NLRB should have let this one go. Now they will lose their power to regulate business.

You seem to think the American working class would be better off without unions. Why?

Tell us how you believe the elimination of unions would affect the U.S.

What is it you personally have against unions in general that prompts you to accentuate the negative and eliminate the positive aspects of unions?

What specifically has the union movement done to harm you?

How do you earn your living?


PS: You've referred in my direction as, "You union people. . ." Please be advised that I've been retired for twenty-seven years. I no longer belong to any union. And the union I belonged to is about as non-aggressive as it gets (AFSCME). My support for unions derives from my awareness of what life in America would be like for the working class without unions.

Also, I neither approve of nor do I support wildcat union action.

Responding to your last comment first. You ARE union people. Period. Moving right along.
Yes middle class working people, 93% of the workforce gets by without unions.
To answer your question more directly. Unions COST jobs. Unions chase jobs first to right to work states, then out of the country. Case and point EVERY Ford Fusion an allegedly American car are built in Mexico. Why? Because Ford just like any other business is using their right under the laws of the US to build cars in locations that allow the product to be profitable.
Given the overwhelming majority of non union work in this country, it appears that unions are eliminating themselves.
There is no union "movement". In fact of there is any type of movement, it is AWAY from unions.
Examples of how unions have been harmful to me......
Ok...I was denied a job with what was then NJ Bell because the union had instituted an affirmative action program. Because I am a male of western European descent, I was discriminated against. Less qualified people were hired. AA was in the list of union demands. They wanted to eliminate the perception of a "closed shop".
My Dad was just trying to get to his job down the street from a Coca Cola plant. The Teamsters were striking the plant. They decided to block the street and all the businesses on that street had to shut down for a week. Luckily my Dad had vacation time he could take. The majority of others whop worked at the many other businesses on that road had to wait until the thugs were forced by police to clear the way. What right did those truck drivers have to do this? NONE.
It was these incidents that got my anti union ball rolling.
Other examples of union thuggery.....In the mid 80's the NYC Taxi drivers went on strike for higher rates. Well these cock suckers decided to clog all the roads leading to Kennedy Airport. They had a right to do THAT?!!
Or when the leader of the NYC Transit workers union decides to call a strike on Christmas Eve, crippling the NYC Subway system....BTW, the union thug spent three years in the crossbar Hilton for that little stunt.
So you're going to insist these things are justified? Go to hell. These examples and others, are why most Americans despise unions
How I make a living is irrelevant. Let's just say I am definitely not white collar.
For 93% of the country, life is most definitely like it is without unions.

 

[thereisnospoon]

The one concern that I have with that last sentence is that if unions were to go away business and the government would eat away at OSHA and HR laws. OSHA the department, would of course never go away, but the protections that unions won would eventually deteriorate again.

Immie

And therein lies the tale!

Thank you for allowing your intelligence to transcend what seems to be an increasingly common quandary.

Where the issue of Labor in America is concerned, it may be said that the only thing worse than unions would be no unions.

fine...based on that concern, allow unions to do what they were designed to do...ensure a safe and healthy work environment.

When they get involved in compensation, the better workers are hurt, and those with the lowest work ethic are protected.

It doesnt work.

Precisely!!!!
Unions operate on a collective mentality.
Unions abhor merit. Union members believe their loyalty lies with the union. In fact many union members believe they work for the union rather than the employer.
Unions deny the need for productivity in contract demands. Unions also believe in the false premise that employers "owe" the workers a job. When I see "job security" I want to laugh.
There are two guarantees in life, death and taxes. Unions do not see it that way.
Job security says to me "we demand you provide a position in your company for every one of our members and you must let each worker keep the job even if that worker is mediocre. We also demand that you pay our people the rate WE set without regard for that employee's value to your company"...
Anyone who denies these are the conditions under which unions operate is lying to themselves.

 

[Wicked Jester]

Mike..no matter what excuse you use for union thuggery, the bottom line is YOU ARE WRONG.
Your attitude is one of the main reasons why a vast majority of the American people are anti-union.
Digging up shit that happened long ago when the situation was much different is useless.
You are making up excuses for barbarism.
You union people claim the right to bargain. You do not bargain. You threaten and coerce. When you don't get what you want, you vandalize property and batter people. At that point you lose the label of striking worker and become a criminal.
It is time we went back to a system where union workers who do these things are prosecuted to full extent of the law.
Better still, the union is kicked out for good.
BTW, I have some great news. That NLRB suit against Boeing is a LOSER!!!!!
The NLRB an unelected accountable to no one body is going to get defanged. The NLRB should have let this one go. Now they will lose their power to regulate business.

You seem to think the American working class would be better off without unions. Why?

Tell us how you believe the elimination of unions would affect the U.S.

What is it you personally have against unions in general that prompts you to accentuate the negative and eliminate the positive aspects of unions?

What specifically has the union movement done to harm you?

How do you earn your living?


PS: You've referred in my direction as, "You union people. . ." Please be advised that I've been retired for twenty-seven years. I no longer belong to any union. And the union I belonged to is about as non-aggressive as it gets (AFSCME). My support for unions derives from my awareness of what life in America would be like for the working class without unions.

Also, I neither approve of nor do I support wildcat union action.

7% of all american workers are unionized.......Life in america is just fine without unions altogether.

Face it, unions are becoming a thing of the past. Labor laws have replaced them, and no longer will they be able to hold business hostage by threat of strike or violence.

Deal with it!

 

[FactFinder]

I grew up in the city of Boston and lived there my entire life until I moved to Charlotte four years ago. I've stated more than once on this forum, in discussions relating to racism and bigotry, that since living in the south I have never heard the word ****** used more than I did from those good ole union Democrats back in Massachusetts.

Bigotry and racism have no political boundaries, folks. The partisans here who like to consistently pin this behavior on Republicans, conservatives, and the tea party crowd ought to open their eyes and wise up.

GRAND FORKS, N.D. (AP) — Police say union supporters have directed racial slurs and racist symbols at replacement workers and security personnel outside an American Crystal Sugar plant in North Dakota.

Traill County Sheriff Mike Crocker says there have been racial statements made to security people outside of the company's Hillsboro facility. He says he recently saw a monkey-like figure hanging from a noose attached to a large inflatable rat outside the plant. He says it was removed the next day.

The Grand Forks Herald reported Tuesday (AMERICAN CRYSTAL LOCKOUT: Tensions high on the picket line | Grand Forks Herald | Grand Forks, North Dakota) that many of the replacement workers are from Southern states, and some are minorities.

Union representative Mark Froemke calls the behavior "totally unacceptable" and says the union will not tolerate racism.

About 1,300 union workers have been locked out for six weeks in a labor dispute.

Police confirm racial incidents at sugar plant - Houston Chronicle

I live in the suburbs of Boston now for about the last 25 years and I have never seen whatever the hell it is you are talking about.

 

[MikeK]

Simple..

When you speak for the masses, ones individuality no longer becomes a factor.

Now whereas that may sound like a good thing, when it comes to ones career it is not.

If you work for a unionized company and you have a differential that would warrant an advancement in your career, it becomes meaningless.

If employee A uses all of his sick days (even though he was not sick) and employee B uses none of his sick days (even though he had a sore throat a couple of times) and yet they both get the exact same raise, how many sick days do you think employee B will use next year?

Unions have created an environment where the worker strives toi work no harder than the least acceptable by contract.

It is not good for the business and it is not good for the employee with a good work ethic.

Unions were necessary to ensure safe working environments....now we have OSHA and HR laws to do that.

I believe what you're saying is working in a union shop suppresses the need for or opportunity to demonstrate individual merit.

If I'm right, that's true. And that is a difficult circumstance for those who are capable of exceptional performance but such individuals are the exception, not the rule. And having given this matter some thought I've come to this conclusion.

Suppose one works in a union shop where the hourly wage is $20 but union rules impede earning a raise for individual merit. A likely alternative circumstance is one works in a non-union shop for $5 an hour but individual merit results in a $15 an hour raise.

A second alternative is for one's exceptional abilities to propel one to a management level position where union concerns are not an impediment.

 

[FactFinder]

Simple..

When you speak for the masses, ones individuality no longer becomes a factor.

Now whereas that may sound like a good thing, when it comes to ones career it is not.

If you work for a unionized company and you have a differential that would warrant an advancement in your career, it becomes meaningless.

If employee A uses all of his sick days (even though he was not sick) and employee B uses none of his sick days (even though he had a sore throat a couple of times) and yet they both get the exact same raise, how many sick days do you think employee B will use next year?

Unions have created an environment where the worker strives toi work no harder than the least acceptable by contract.

It is not good for the business and it is not good for the employee with a good work ethic.

Unions were necessary to ensure safe working environments....now we have OSHA and HR laws to do that.

I believe what you're saying is working in a union shop suppresses the need for or opportunity to demonstrate individual merit.

If I'm right, that's true. And that is a difficult circumstance for those who are capable of exceptional performance but such individuals are the exception, not the rule. And having given this matter some thought I've come to this conclusion.

Suppose one works in a union shop where the hourly wage is $20 but union rules impede earning a raise for individual merit. A likely alternative circumstance is one works in a non-union shop for $5 an hour but individual merit results in a $15 an hour raise.

A second alternative is for one's exceptional abilities to propel one to a management level position where union concerns are not an impediment.

All those scenarios are true and fit differing individuals in differing ways.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Simple..

When you speak for the masses, ones individuality no longer becomes a factor.

Now whereas that may sound like a good thing, when it comes to ones career it is not.

If you work for a unionized company and you have a differential that would warrant an advancement in your career, it becomes meaningless.

If employee A uses all of his sick days (even though he was not sick) and employee B uses none of his sick days (even though he had a sore throat a couple of times) and yet they both get the exact same raise, how many sick days do you think employee B will use next year?

Unions have created an environment where the worker strives toi work no harder than the least acceptable by contract.

It is not good for the business and it is not good for the employee with a good work ethic.

Unions were necessary to ensure safe working environments....now we have OSHA and HR laws to do that.

I believe what you're saying is working in a union shop suppresses the need for or opportunity to demonstrate individual merit.

If I'm right, that's true. And that is a difficult circumstance for those who are capable of exceptional performance but such individuals are the exception, not the rule. And having given this matter some thought I've come to this conclusion.

Suppose one works in a union shop where the hourly wage is $20 but union rules impede earning a raise for individual merit. A likely alternative circumstance is one works in a non-union shop for $5 an hour but individual merit results in a $15 an hour raise.

A second alternative is for one's exceptional abilities to propel one to a management level position where union concerns are not an impediment.

That example does not even rise to the level of ridiculous.
First, unless one is a waitstaffer in a restaurant, $5 is illegal. So let's cut that bullshit out of the equation.
Next, you cannot claim to come to conclusion then in the very next sentence start with "suppose".
I submit you've given this no thought at all.
You simply came up with a scenario that supports your point of view. That is no one in a union shop should ever be rewarded with higher pay for exemplary work ahead of others in the group.
That very premise breeds mediocrity. It sets up a work environment where good people are bitter because the slackers get the same pay and benefits as the best workers.
It is unfortunate but true that most union workers can get much more from themselves on the job but refuse to do so because the people that have learned how to game the system and simply show up to collect their check. Quite frankly businesses do not have time for this drama. Neither do the American people.