Solar power will soon be as cheap as coal

[Old Rocks]

spectro lab a boeing company build the 3 wavelength panel 38% efficiency. may be obsolete if black light power's (sun cell )
is all its promised. a lot of money poured into blp last year by some of america's richest men.

Please link to that kind of information for the rest of us.

 

[bripat9643]

Some people just love that fossil fuel and therefore hate alternative energy, because they are simply folks that let others think for them.
They hate green, gray is their favorite color.View attachment 42774

Show us a picture of an American or European city with smog that bad.

Silly little boy, obviously you have not been alive very long. There were a bunch of American cities with extremely unhealthy air when I was a young man.


A Darkness in Donora | History | Smithsonian


"It was so bad," Jerry Campa, a Donora, Pennsylvania, restaurateur recalls, "that I'd accidentally step off the curb and turn my ankle because I couldn't see my feet." The acrid, yellowish gray blanket that began to smother the Monongahela River mill town in late October 1948 was more suffocating than anything any Donoran had ever seen—or inhaled—in the past. Before a rainstorm washed the ugly soup away five days later, 20 people had died or would soon succumb and nearly 6,000 of the 14,000 population had been sickened.


"Before Donora," declares Marcia Spink, associate director for air programs for the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency's Region III office in Philadelphia, "people thought of smog as a nuisance. It made your shirts dirty. The Donora tragedy was a wake-up call. People realized smog could kill."




Read more: History, Travel, Arts, Science, People, Places | Smithsonian
Give the gift of Smithsonian magazine for only $12! Give the gift of Smithsonian
Follow us: @SmithsonianMag on Twitter

In other words, 50 years ago we had a smog problem. Now you can't photograph detectable smog in any large city in America. Which shows your concerns about smog are entirely bogus. The pollution problem has been almost entirely solved. This country is clean enough. Further reductions in pollutants only serve to drive up the price of energy, which is the one and only reason Obama is pursuing them. Only the gullible is fooled by all his blather about pollution.

BriPat, sometimes you are totally a stupid ass. Drove by the Valmy coal fired generators in Nevada a month ago. The air was yellow with the pollution from that plant. Yes, the air was cleaned up in our cities. We move the generation plants away from the cities, we developed a program of sellable pollution credits. And we cleaned up our autos to the point that it takes over 80 of them to put out the pollution that one used to put out. All over the objections of people like you.

You're a god damned liar. I have a huge coal fired power plant not more than 5 miles from my house. The air is as clear as a spring day in the Rocky Mountains. Pollution credits may work for substances that are easy to remove. The amount of CO2, on the other hand, is inextricably related to the amount of energy produced. Reduce the CO2, and you reduce the energy produced.

On the one hand you claimed air pollution is a big problem, and on the other you claimed it has been almost entirely cleaned up.

Idiots like you, who know nothing about physics or science or economics, are destroying this country.

AGW is a huge swindle pushed by government minions to expand their power and wealth at the expense of the rest of the population.

 

[Billy_Bob]

The lies purported in this thread about wind being even close to Coal and other fossil fuels is stunning. Remove the "redistribution" of the left and you find out that coal is 1/100 the cost of all other renewables except hydroelectric power.

The size and amount of the lies are stunning and the people who refuse to look for themselves is even worse.

 

[Old Rocks]

Some people just love that fossil fuel and therefore hate alternative energy, because they are simply folks that let others think for them.
They hate green, gray is their favorite color.View attachment 42774

Show us a picture of an American or European city with smog that bad.

Silly little boy, obviously you have not been alive very long. There were a bunch of American cities with extremely unhealthy air when I was a young man.


A Darkness in Donora | History | Smithsonian


"It was so bad," Jerry Campa, a Donora, Pennsylvania, restaurateur recalls, "that I'd accidentally step off the curb and turn my ankle because I couldn't see my feet." The acrid, yellowish gray blanket that began to smother the Monongahela River mill town in late October 1948 was more suffocating than anything any Donoran had ever seen—or inhaled—in the past. Before a rainstorm washed the ugly soup away five days later, 20 people had died or would soon succumb and nearly 6,000 of the 14,000 population had been sickened.


"Before Donora," declares Marcia Spink, associate director for air programs for the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency's Region III office in Philadelphia, "people thought of smog as a nuisance. It made your shirts dirty. The Donora tragedy was a wake-up call. People realized smog could kill."




Read more: History, Travel, Arts, Science, People, Places | Smithsonian
Give the gift of Smithsonian magazine for only $12! Give the gift of Smithsonian
Follow us: @SmithsonianMag on Twitter

In other words, 50 years ago we had a smog problem. Now you can't photograph detectable smog in any large city in America. Which shows your concerns about smog are entirely bogus. The pollution problem has been almost entirely solved. This country is clean enough. Further reductions in pollutants only serve to drive up the price of energy, which is the one and only reason Obama is pursuing them. Only the gullible is fooled by all his blather about pollution.

BriPat, sometimes you are totally a stupid ass. Drove by the Valmy coal fired generators in Nevada a month ago. The air was yellow with the pollution from that plant. Yes, the air was cleaned up in our cities. We move the generation plants away from the cities, we developed a program of sellable pollution credits. And we cleaned up our autos to the point that it takes over 80 of them to put out the pollution that one used to put out. All over the objections of people like you.

You're a god damned liar. I have a huge coal fired power plant not more than 5 miles from my house. The air is as clear as a spring day in the Rocky Mountains. Pollution credits may work for substances that are easy to remove. The amount of CO2, on the other hand, is inextricably related to the amount of energy produced. Reduce the CO2, and you reduce the energy produced.

On the one hand you claimed air pollution is a big problem, and on the other you claimed it has been almost entirely cleaned up.

Idiots like you, who know nothing about physics or science or economics, are destroying this country.

AGW is a huge swindle pushed by government minions to expand their power and wealth at the expense of the rest of the population.

There are many older plants that are still very dirty. Apparently Valmy is one of them. The only coal fired plant in Oregon at Boardman is also a dirty plant. That will be shut down shortly. The plants on the Navajo Reservation are also dirty plants.

$168 Million Settlement Between Navajo Coal Plant and Environmental Protection Agency

copy68 Million Settlement Between Navajo Coal Plant and Environmental Protection Agency
Anne Minard
6/25/15
The Environmental Protection Agency has announced a copy68 million settlement to help remedy pollution from a coal-fired power plant on the Navajo Nation.

The settlement requires owners of the Four Corners Power Plant near Shiprock, New Mexico, to pay an estimated copy60 million in upgrades to the plant’s sulfur dioxide and nitrogen oxide pollution controls. The settlement also sets aside $6.7 million for health and environmental mitigation projects for tribal members and levies a copy.5 million civil penalty. The Four Corners Power Plant settlement is subject to a30-day public commentperiod and final court approval.


Read more athttp://indiancountrytodaymedianetwo...oal-plant-and-environmental-protection-agency

 

[Old Rocks]

http://environmentamericacenter.org/sites/environment/files/reports/Dirty Power Plants.pdf

The dirtiest U.S. power plants are major sources of global warming pollution on a global scale. • If the 50 most-polluting U.S. power plants were an independent nation, they would be the seventh-largest emitter of carbon dioxide in the world, behind Germany and ahead of South Korea. (See Figure ES-2.) These power plants emitted carbon dioxide pollution equivalent to more than half the emissions of all passenger vehicles in the United States in 2010.

Retiring Dirty and Costly Coal Plants

Coal-fired power plants are the biggest contributors to toxic air and water pollution and the single biggest source of greenhouse gases in the United States—they’re harming us, and our climate. When the Clean Air Act was passed decades ago, coal plants received special treatment that effectively exempted them from controlling their pollution and safely disposing of their waste, a gift that has allowed them to keep operating and profiting at the expense of Americans around the country who are getting sick and dying prematurely from exposure to coal plant pollution.

Coal-fired power plants release nearly 400,000 tons of hazardous air pollutants every year, including more than 40 percent of all man-made mercury emissions in the U.S. They also contribute more than 25% of all carbon dioxide emissions in the United States.

There are many dirty coal fired plants still operating in the US.

 

[30 year chrysler mechanic]

to ringe105 your hydropower storage system / overunity sounds like negative reservoir / cassion power tower. negative reservoir using solar or wind or wave action or ocean thermal energy to keep water pumped out of circular dam in ocean. cassion power tower places an open compressed air accumulator in base of dam . It is possible that a percentage of energy genrated by water on way down can energize the accumulator to expell the water. 2 psi or adding 100 degrees of heat to air trapped in accumulator is enough to flow water out. concidered too expensive to build . estimated 100 billion

 

[bripat9643]

Show us a picture of an American or European city with smog that bad.

Silly little boy, obviously you have not been alive very long. There were a bunch of American cities with extremely unhealthy air when I was a young man.


A Darkness in Donora | History | Smithsonian


"It was so bad," Jerry Campa, a Donora, Pennsylvania, restaurateur recalls, "that I'd accidentally step off the curb and turn my ankle because I couldn't see my feet." The acrid, yellowish gray blanket that began to smother the Monongahela River mill town in late October 1948 was more suffocating than anything any Donoran had ever seen—or inhaled—in the past. Before a rainstorm washed the ugly soup away five days later, 20 people had died or would soon succumb and nearly 6,000 of the 14,000 population had been sickened.


"Before Donora," declares Marcia Spink, associate director for air programs for the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency's Region III office in Philadelphia, "people thought of smog as a nuisance. It made your shirts dirty. The Donora tragedy was a wake-up call. People realized smog could kill."




Read more: History, Travel, Arts, Science, People, Places | Smithsonian
Give the gift of Smithsonian magazine for only $12! Give the gift of Smithsonian
Follow us: @SmithsonianMag on Twitter

In other words, 50 years ago we had a smog problem. Now you can't photograph detectable smog in any large city in America. Which shows your concerns about smog are entirely bogus. The pollution problem has been almost entirely solved. This country is clean enough. Further reductions in pollutants only serve to drive up the price of energy, which is the one and only reason Obama is pursuing them. Only the gullible is fooled by all his blather about pollution.

BriPat, sometimes you are totally a stupid ass. Drove by the Valmy coal fired generators in Nevada a month ago. The air was yellow with the pollution from that plant. Yes, the air was cleaned up in our cities. We move the generation plants away from the cities, we developed a program of sellable pollution credits. And we cleaned up our autos to the point that it takes over 80 of them to put out the pollution that one used to put out. All over the objections of people like you.

You're a god damned liar. I have a huge coal fired power plant not more than 5 miles from my house. The air is as clear as a spring day in the Rocky Mountains. Pollution credits may work for substances that are easy to remove. The amount of CO2, on the other hand, is inextricably related to the amount of energy produced. Reduce the CO2, and you reduce the energy produced.

On the one hand you claimed air pollution is a big problem, and on the other you claimed it has been almost entirely cleaned up.

Idiots like you, who know nothing about physics or science or economics, are destroying this country.

AGW is a huge swindle pushed by government minions to expand their power and wealth at the expense of the rest of the population.

There are many older plants that are still very dirty. Apparently Valmy is one of them. The only coal fired plant in Oregon at Boardman is also a dirty plant. That will be shut down shortly. The plants on the Navajo Reservation are also dirty plants.

$168 Million Settlement Between Navajo Coal Plant and Environmental Protection Agency

copy68 Million Settlement Between Navajo Coal Plant and Environmental Protection Agency
Anne Minard
6/25/15
The Environmental Protection Agency has announced a copy68 million settlement to help remedy pollution from a coal-fired power plant on the Navajo Nation.

The settlement requires owners of the Four Corners Power Plant near Shiprock, New Mexico, to pay an estimated copy60 million in upgrades to the plant’s sulfur dioxide and nitrogen oxide pollution controls. The settlement also sets aside $6.7 million for health and environmental mitigation projects for tribal members and levies a copy.5 million civil penalty. The Four Corners Power Plant settlement is subject to a30-day public commentperiod and final court approval.


Read more at$168 Million Settlement Between Navajo Coal Plant and Environmental Protection Agency

Your a buffoon.

Navajo Power Plant Proposes Closing Unit Due to EPA Edict

The owner of the plant is going to close it rather than comply with new EPA regulations designed specifically to force coal plants to shut down. Half of the coal plants in the country are going to be shut down because of these new regulations. It has nothing to do with the plant being "dirty." It has to meet EPA mandates to operate. The same goes for the plant in Oregon.

Try telling the whole truth once in a while.

 

[bripat9643]

http://environmentamericacenter.org/sites/environment/files/reports/Dirty Power Plants.pdf

The dirtiest U.S. power plants are major sources of global warming pollution on a global scale. • If the 50 most-polluting U.S. power plants were an independent nation, they would be the seventh-largest emitter of carbon dioxide in the world, behind Germany and ahead of South Korea. (See Figure ES-2.) These power plants emitted carbon dioxide pollution equivalent to more than half the emissions of all passenger vehicles in the United States in 2010.

Retiring Dirty and Costly Coal Plants

Coal-fired power plants are the biggest contributors to toxic air and water pollution and the single biggest source of greenhouse gases in the United States—they’re harming us, and our climate. When the Clean Air Act was passed decades ago, coal plants received special treatment that effectively exempted them from controlling their pollution and safely disposing of their waste, a gift that has allowed them to keep operating and profiting at the expense of Americans around the country who are getting sick and dying prematurely from exposure to coal plant pollution.

Coal-fired power plants release nearly 400,000 tons of hazardous air pollutants every year, including more than 40 percent of all man-made mercury emissions in the U.S. They also contribute more than 25% of all carbon dioxide emissions in the United States.

There are many dirty coal fired plants still operating in the US.

CO2 isn't a pollutant, numskull, and power plants emit a small fraction of the pollutants that automobiles emit. Most of what you call "hazardous waste" is no more hazardous than the stuff you breath out thousands of times a day. CO2 is "hazardous" only in the vivid imaginations of eco nutburgers and AGW con artists.

The claim that they recieved an "exemption" is also fantastic bullshit. The EPA has regulations for each kind of pollution source. Regulations for cars are not appropriate for coal fire power plants. Calling the different regulations an "exemption" is a propaganda tactic.

 

[Weatherman2020]

http://environmentamericacenter.org/sites/environment/files/reports/Dirty Power Plants.pdf

The dirtiest U.S. power plants are major sources of global warming pollution on a global scale. • If the 50 most-polluting U.S. power plants were an independent nation, they would be the seventh-largest emitter of carbon dioxide in the world, behind Germany and ahead of South Korea. (See Figure ES-2.) These power plants emitted carbon dioxide pollution equivalent to more than half the emissions of all passenger vehicles in the United States in 2010.

Retiring Dirty and Costly Coal Plants

Coal-fired power plants are the biggest contributors to toxic air and water pollution and the single biggest source of greenhouse gases in the United States—they’re harming us, and our climate. When the Clean Air Act was passed decades ago, coal plants received special treatment that effectively exempted them from controlling their pollution and safely disposing of their waste, a gift that has allowed them to keep operating and profiting at the expense of Americans around the country who are getting sick and dying prematurely from exposure to coal plant pollution.

Coal-fired power plants release nearly 400,000 tons of hazardous air pollutants every year, including more than 40 percent of all man-made mercury emissions in the U.S. They also contribute more than 25% of all carbon dioxide emissions in the United States.

There are many dirty coal fired plants still operating in the US.

Interesting your source uses South Korea and Germany to compare carbon dioxide emissions. 29% of Germany and 22% of South Korean electricity is generated by nuclear power.
So time America saved Mother Gia and followed their example and go nuclear.

 

[waltky]

Granny says, "An when it is as cheap as coal...

... Obama'll ban it."

 

[30 year chrysler mechanic]

spectro lab a boeing company build the 3 wavelength panel 38% efficiency. may be obsolete if black light power's (sun cell )
is all its promised. a lot of money poured into blp last year by some of america's richest men.

Please link to that kind of information for the rest of us.

i post names so you can look it up. if i were as skilled as you all with computers i would have my own web site. i have been kicked off sites for just listing the names of fuel efficient engines and synthetic fuels.

 

[30 year chrysler mechanic]

new technology being buried fast. graphine cable geothermal . a no moving part heat pump to pull deep geologic heat to surface where traditional steam or organic rankin turbines can produce electricity. can also be used with johnson thermoelectric convertor for a complete no moving parts power system.

 

[30 year chrysler mechanic]

spectro lab a boeing company build the 3 wavelength panel 38% efficiency. may be obsolete if black light power's (sun cell )
is all its promised. a lot of money poured into blp last year by some of america's richest men.

Please link to that kind of information for the rest of us.

i post names so you can look it up. if i were as skilled as you all with computers i would have my own web site. i have been kicked off sites for just listing the names of fuel efficient engines and synthetic fuels.

www.gizmag.com/spectrolab-cell-efficiency-world-record/29845/

 

[30 year chrysler mechanic]

spectro lab a boeing company build the 3 wavelength panel 38% efficiency. may be obsolete if black light power's (sun cell )
is all its promised. a lot of money poured into blp last year by some of america's richest men.

Please link to that kind of information for the rest of us.

i post names so you can look it up. if i were as skilled as you all with computers i would have my own web site. i have been kicked off sites for just listing the names of fuel efficient engines and synthetic fuels.

www.gizmag.com/spectrolab-cell-efficiency-world-record/29845/

solar systems austrailia deployed spectrolab solar concentrator dish systems= ceased operation in july 2015
why did it fail??? efficency 35% www.defenseindustrydaily.com/boeing-solar-subsidiary-wins-australian-contract-02544/

 

[30 year chrysler mechanic]

Solar power will soon be as cheap as coal

Inside a sprawling single-story office building in Bedford, Massachusetts, in a secret room known as the Growth Hall, the future of solar power is cooking at more than 2,500 °F. Behind closed doors and downturned blinds, custom-built ovens with ambitious names like “Fearless” and “Intrepid” are helping to perfect a new technique of making silicon wafers, the workhorse of today’s solar panels. If all goes well, the new method could cut the cost of solar power by more than 20% in the next few years.

“This humble wafer will allow solar to be as cheap as coal and will drastically change the way we consume energy,” says Frank van Mierlo, CEO of 1366 Technologies, the company behind the new method of wafer fabrication....

Read on!

Solar is about ready to destroy coal!

did you see that there are 2 full spectrum solar panels being developed. 1 is high efficiency 50% - 70% the other is lower efficiency but much cheaper to produce . gallium nitrate and tungston doping

 

[Old Rocks]

Mr. Flacaltenn, perhaps you should look a map of Oregon. Notice that river at the top of the map? And the bodies of water dammed up on that river? You see, when the wind is blowing, we do not have to run as much water through the turbines. And when it is not, we have the water saved up to do that. In that manner, the wind does help power our state, even when the wind is not blowing.

When the grid is extended into the south of our state, we will have a huge amount of wind, solar, and geothermal. And will not only have enough power for all of Oregon, but will help power California, Idaho, and Nevada.

Hmmm, no, the wind does not help to power your state when it isn't blowing. You have backup hydroelectric. If you didn't have that, you would have to burn coal or natural gas.

Your fundamental misunderstanding of how the power system works, which you have just demonstrated, shows that no one should bother paying attention to anything you have to say on the subject.

Hey bad finger little corksmoker, 195 countries just paid attention to what the scientists have been saying. And Congress passed the money that our President requested to implement our part of that Treaty. LOL, suck it up, loser!

 

[Desperado]

Solar power will soon be as cheap as coal
The Problem here is that the song remains the same.
Call me when Solar power IS AS cheap as coal

 

[Old Rocks]

Solar power will soon be as cheap as coal
The Problem here is that the song remains the same.
Call me when Solar power IS AS cheap as coal

In Texas, Austin Energy signed a deal this spring for 20 years of output from a solar farm at less than 5 cents a kilowatt-hour. In September, the Grand River Dam Authority in Oklahoma announced its approval of a new agreement to buy power from a new wind farm expected to be completed next year. Grand River estimated the deal would save its customers roughly $50 million from the project.

And, also in Oklahoma, American Electric Power ended up tripling the amount of wind power it had originally sought after seeing how low the bids came in last year.

“Wind was on sale — it was a Blue Light Special,” said Jay Godfrey, managing director of renewable energy for the company. He noted that Oklahoma, unlike many states, did not require utilities to buy power from renewable sources.

“We were doing it because it made sense for our ratepayers,” he said.

According to a study by the investment banking firm Lazard, the cost of utility-scale solar energy is as low as 5.6 cents a kilowatt-hour, and wind is as low as 1.4 cents. In comparison, natural gas comes at 6.1 cents a kilowatt-hour on the low end and coal at 6.6 cents. Without subsidies, the firm’s analysis shows, solar costs about 7.2 cents a kilowatt-hour at the low end, with wind at 3.7 cents.

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/11/24/b...-win-on-price-vs-conventional-fuels.html?_r=0

Cheapest Solar Ever: Austin Energy Gets 1.2 Gigawatts of Solar Bids for Less Than 4 Cents

Correction: Khalil Shalabi said was that 1,295 megawatts were priced below the Recurrent solar deal from last year, which was under 5 cents per kilowatt-hour not under 4 cents per kilowatt-hour.

A lot more cheap solar is coming for Austin, Texas.

The city's utility, Austin Energy, just released new data on developer bids for PV projects as part of a 600-megawatt procurement. The numbers show how far solar prices have come down over the last year -- and will continue to drop.

According to Khalil Shalabi, Austin Energy's vice president of resource planning, the utility received offers for 7,976 megawatts of projects after issuing a request for bids in April. Out of those bids, 1,295 megawatts of projects were priced below 4 cents per kilowatt-hour.

"The technology is getting better and the prices are decreasing with time," said Shalabi during a presentation in front of the Austin city council last week.

Shalabi displayed the chart below showing an "exponentially declining curve" for PV projects in Texas.

• If you continue the curve, you can see that if the cost points continue along this sort of exponentially declining curve. We expect to see prices out in the future that are possibly below $20 a megawatt-hour," he said
• 
  
• Cheapest Solar Ever: Austin Energy Gets 1.2 Gigawatts of Solar Bids for Less Than 4 Cents
  
  Looks like solar is cheaper than either coal or natural gas.

 

[bripat9643]

Solar power will soon be as cheap as coal

Inside a sprawling single-story office building in Bedford, Massachusetts, in a secret room known as the Growth Hall, the future of solar power is cooking at more than 2,500 °F. Behind closed doors and downturned blinds, custom-built ovens with ambitious names like “Fearless” and “Intrepid” are helping to perfect a new technique of making silicon wafers, the workhorse of today’s solar panels. If all goes well, the new method could cut the cost of solar power by more than 20% in the next few years.

“This humble wafer will allow solar to be as cheap as coal and will drastically change the way we consume energy,” says Frank van Mierlo, CEO of 1366 Technologies, the company behind the new method of wafer fabrication....

Read on!

Solar is about ready to destroy coal!

did you see that there are 2 full spectrum solar panels being developed. 1 is high efficiency 50% - 70% the other is lower efficiency but much cheaper to produce . gallium nitrate and tungston doping

How much power do they produce at midnight?

 

[bripat9643]

Mr. Flacaltenn, perhaps you should look a map of Oregon. Notice that river at the top of the map? And the bodies of water dammed up on that river? You see, when the wind is blowing, we do not have to run as much water through the turbines. And when it is not, we have the water saved up to do that. In that manner, the wind does help power our state, even when the wind is not blowing.

When the grid is extended into the south of our state, we will have a huge amount of wind, solar, and geothermal. And will not only have enough power for all of Oregon, but will help power California, Idaho, and Nevada.

Hmmm, no, the wind does not help to power your state when it isn't blowing. You have backup hydroelectric. If you didn't have that, you would have to burn coal or natural gas.

Your fundamental misunderstanding of how the power system works, which you have just demonstrated, shows that no one should bother paying attention to anything you have to say on the subject.

Hey bad finger little corksmoker, 195 countries just paid attention to what the scientists have been saying. And Congress passed the money that our President requested to implement our part of that Treaty. LOL, suck it up, loser!

We all lost, dumbfuck.