Solar Energy

Toddsterpatriot

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Would you support small amounts of solar generation in Chicago?
If individuals want to overpay to install less reliable energy, they should be allowed.

Running street lights or even parts of the railway?

No. Silly idea in Chicago.

No one really talks about small things like that even though they have a cost and can make a nice change to the budget of cities.

It would increase costs and only benefit those connected to political insiders.
Cost is a major factor in any energy generation. So what is the relative cost of generation;
View attachment 443734
When you're still paying for the nat gas plant or the nuke plant, running at lower output, how much is the real cost of the wind or solar?
 

Old Rocks

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Would you support small amounts of solar generation in Chicago?
If individuals want to overpay to install less reliable energy, they should be allowed.

Running street lights or even parts of the railway?

No. Silly idea in Chicago.

No one really talks about small things like that even though they have a cost and can make a nice change to the budget of cities.

It would increase costs and only benefit those connected to political insiders.
Cost is a major factor in any energy generation. So what is the relative cost of generation;
View attachment 443734
When you're still paying for the nat gas plant or the nuke plant, running at lower output, how much is the real cost of the wind or solar?
The findings show that retiring 74 percent of American coal power plants and replacing them with wind or solar plants would provide an immediate saving to utilities. About 44 percent of that coal power is substantially at-risk, that is it could be replaced by renewables that are at least 25 percent cheaper.Mar 25, 2019

.

And nuclear is next, then natural gas.
 

surada

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Would you support small amounts of solar generation in Chicago?
If individuals want to overpay to install less reliable energy, they should be allowed.

Running street lights or even parts of the railway?

No. Silly idea in Chicago.

No one really talks about small things like that even though they have a cost and can make a nice change to the budget of cities.

It would increase costs and only benefit those connected to political insiders.
Cost is a major factor in any energy generation. So what is the relative cost of generation;
View attachment 443734
When you're still paying for the nat gas plant or the nuke plant, running at lower output, how much is the real cost of the wind or solar?
The findings show that retiring 74 percent of American coal power plants and replacing them with wind or solar plants would provide an immediate saving to utilities. About 44 percent of that coal power is substantially at-risk, that is it could be replaced by renewables that are at least 25 percent cheaper.Mar 25, 2019

.

And nuclear is next, then natural gas.
Our coal fired power plants are all real old.. Where would you get investors to put up new coal plants? Doesn't make sense to me.
 

Toddsterpatriot

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Would you support small amounts of solar generation in Chicago?
If individuals want to overpay to install less reliable energy, they should be allowed.

Running street lights or even parts of the railway?

No. Silly idea in Chicago.

No one really talks about small things like that even though they have a cost and can make a nice change to the budget of cities.

It would increase costs and only benefit those connected to political insiders.
Cost is a major factor in any energy generation. So what is the relative cost of generation;
View attachment 443734
When you're still paying for the nat gas plant or the nuke plant, running at lower output, how much is the real cost of the wind or solar?
The findings show that retiring 74 percent of American coal power plants and replacing them with wind or solar plants would provide an immediate saving to utilities. About 44 percent of that coal power is substantially at-risk, that is it could be replaced by renewables that are at least 25 percent cheaper.Mar 25, 2019

.

And nuclear is next, then natural gas.
retiring 74 percent of American coal power plants and replacing them with wind or solar plants would provide an immediate saving to utilities.

Retiring a fully amortized plant and replacing it with an expensive new plant with intermittent output would provide "an immediate saving to utilities"?

That's funny.

Is that why power is so cheap in California? Because of all their cheap wind and solar?
 
OP
Pythagoras

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Turtlesoup

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Due to the advances in batteries/power cells/ gen. energy storage solar power has become more efficient. There is already an Island fully operating on solar power. Does Solar energy show promise in keeping cities operational? What other useful applications can solar power bring to the table? Is it cost-effective? Many companies have their own ideas like solar-powered planes and cars. Does solar transportation seem like a good idea?

LUNA RING, Solar Power Generation on the Moon | Topics | Shimizu Corporation (shimz.co.jp)

Is this idea too outrageous? Would something like this be beneficial in the long run? Would you ever support something like this? Are there any other theories you have seen or came up with that utilize solar energy?
it s become efficient BUT it still isn't efficient enough.
 

Old Rocks

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Would you support small amounts of solar generation in Chicago?
If individuals want to overpay to install less reliable energy, they should be allowed.

Running street lights or even parts of the railway?

No. Silly idea in Chicago.

No one really talks about small things like that even though they have a cost and can make a nice change to the budget of cities.

It would increase costs and only benefit those connected to political insiders.
Cost is a major factor in any energy generation. So what is the relative cost of generation;
View attachment 443734
When you're still paying for the nat gas plant or the nuke plant, running at lower output, how much is the real cost of the wind or solar?
The findings show that retiring 74 percent of American coal power plants and replacing them with wind or solar plants would provide an immediate saving to utilities. About 44 percent of that coal power is substantially at-risk, that is it could be replaced by renewables that are at least 25 percent cheaper.Mar 25, 2019

.

And nuclear is next, then natural gas.
retiring 74 percent of American coal power plants and replacing them with wind or solar plants would provide an immediate saving to utilities.

Retiring a fully amortized plant and replacing it with an expensive new plant with intermittent output would provide "an immediate saving to utilities"?

That's funny.

Is that why power is so cheap in California? Because of all their cheap wind and solar?
When you have as high a demand for energy as California does, the grid to serve that demand is rather expensive. When you are shipping wind and hydro power from two states away, you are paying for a lot of transmission loss. Even with the huge DC line going to San Diego.
 

Old Rocks

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Due to the advances in batteries/power cells/ gen. energy storage solar power has become more efficient. There is already an Island fully operating on solar power. Does Solar energy show promise in keeping cities operational? What other useful applications can solar power bring to the table? Is it cost-effective? Many companies have their own ideas like solar-powered planes and cars. Does solar transportation seem like a good idea?

LUNA RING, Solar Power Generation on the Moon | Topics | Shimizu Corporation (shimz.co.jp)

Is this idea too outrageous? Would something like this be beneficial in the long run? Would you ever support something like this? Are there any other theories you have seen or came up with that utilize solar energy?
it s become efficient BUT it still isn't efficient enough.
Compared to what? Imported diesel, oil, or coal? There are now several ways of storing electrical energy. And solar is getting less costly with every year. As is wind. In the meantime, natural gas and nuclear are ever more costly. You don't need uranium, waste storage, pipeline, nor fracking for solar and wind.
 

Toddsterpatriot

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Would you support small amounts of solar generation in Chicago?
If individuals want to overpay to install less reliable energy, they should be allowed.

Running street lights or even parts of the railway?

No. Silly idea in Chicago.

No one really talks about small things like that even though they have a cost and can make a nice change to the budget of cities.

It would increase costs and only benefit those connected to political insiders.
Cost is a major factor in any energy generation. So what is the relative cost of generation;
View attachment 443734
When you're still paying for the nat gas plant or the nuke plant, running at lower output, how much is the real cost of the wind or solar?
The findings show that retiring 74 percent of American coal power plants and replacing them with wind or solar plants would provide an immediate saving to utilities. About 44 percent of that coal power is substantially at-risk, that is it could be replaced by renewables that are at least 25 percent cheaper.Mar 25, 2019

.

And nuclear is next, then natural gas.
retiring 74 percent of American coal power plants and replacing them with wind or solar plants would provide an immediate saving to utilities.

Retiring a fully amortized plant and replacing it with an expensive new plant with intermittent output would provide "an immediate saving to utilities"?

That's funny.

Is that why power is so cheap in California? Because of all their cheap wind and solar?
When you have as high a demand for energy as California does, the grid to serve that demand is rather expensive. When you are shipping wind and hydro power from two states away, you are paying for a lot of transmission loss. Even with the huge DC line going to San Diego.
When you have as high a demand for energy as California does, the grid to serve that demand is rather expensive.

I guess, in that case, removing reliable, cheap power generation and adding unreliable, more expensive generation makes even less sense than in a lower demand state.
 

HenryBHough

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I have found solar power to be of great benefit under the right circumstances.

It works best when you have lots of sunlight. So it's a good substitute for "the grid" if you live in a trailer and migrate according to the seasons. Best if kyour trailer flies or floats as there aren't many alternatives to crossing the equator in "our" hemisphere.

It can work very well for a fixed dwelling if you have sufficient roof area and/or open land to festoon with solar cells. But also requires a lot of storage. The need for that can be reduced if you're willing to reduce your demand. Switching to LEDs for lighting can help but more effective would be turning off your TV and computer. If you're unwilling to do your part to achieve independence then you'll need a lot of storage. Batteries are good if you can build an addition big enough. Or.....

Try pumped storage. fill your attic and basement with plastic tanks. Fill the basement tank with water and use a solar powered pump to move the water up to the attic when the sun shines. When it sets let the water trickle down through a small generator. Then to to bed when the attic tank is empty and the sun's not up.

Oh, don't bother to strengthen the walls or the attic floor. Yes, it will collapse but that'll end the misery you've been living through. No worry about you're being "out" at the time of the collapse; remember, you're doing your part by cowering indoors.

Now don't you feel ever so GOOD????
 

Toddsterpatriot

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Due to the advances in batteries/power cells/ gen. energy storage solar power has become more efficient. There is already an Island fully operating on solar power. Does Solar energy show promise in keeping cities operational? What other useful applications can solar power bring to the table? Is it cost-effective? Many companies have their own ideas like solar-powered planes and cars. Does solar transportation seem like a good idea?

LUNA RING, Solar Power Generation on the Moon | Topics | Shimizu Corporation (shimz.co.jp)

Is this idea too outrageous? Would something like this be beneficial in the long run? Would you ever support something like this? Are there any other theories you have seen or came up with that utilize solar energy?
it s become efficient BUT it still isn't efficient enough.
Compared to what? Imported diesel, oil, or coal? There are now several ways of storing electrical energy. And solar is getting less costly with every year. As is wind. In the meantime, natural gas and nuclear are ever more costly. You don't need uranium, waste storage, pipeline, nor fracking for solar and wind.
In the meantime, natural gas and nuclear are ever more costly.

1610847975987.png


By "ever more costly" did you mean that natural gas is cheaper than it was in 1982?


1610848240384.png


Or that uranium is less than half the price it was 10 years ago?

 

Old Rocks

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I have found solar power to be of great benefit under the right circumstances.

It works best when you have lots of sunlight. So it's a good substitute for "the grid" if you live in a trailer and migrate according to the seasons. Best if kyour trailer flies or floats as there aren't many alternatives to crossing the equator in "our" hemisphere.

It can work very well for a fixed dwelling if you have sufficient roof area and/or open land to festoon with solar cells. But also requires a lot of storage. The need for that can be reduced if you're willing to reduce your demand. Switching to LEDs for lighting can help but more effective would be turning off your TV and computer. If you're unwilling to do your part to achieve independence then you'll need a lot of storage. Batteries are good if you can build an addition big enough. Or.....

Try pumped storage. fill your attic and basement with plastic tanks. Fill the basement tank with water and use a solar powered pump to move the water up to the attic when the sun shines. When it sets let the water trickle down through a small generator. Then to to bed when the attic tank is empty and the sun's not up.

Oh, don't bother to strengthen the walls or the attic floor. Yes, it will collapse but that'll end the misery you've been living through. No worry about you're being "out" at the time of the collapse; remember, you're doing your part by cowering indoors.

Now don't you feel ever so GOOD????
Lordy, lordy, give the man an award for stupidity. For homes, there are many manufacturers of home batteries, including Tesla. For grid level storage, Tesla and others build megawatt battery plant, pumped water storage, liquid air, and gravity.
 

Old Rocks

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Due to the advances in batteries/power cells/ gen. energy storage solar power has become more efficient. There is already an Island fully operating on solar power. Does Solar energy show promise in keeping cities operational? What other useful applications can solar power bring to the table? Is it cost-effective? Many companies have their own ideas like solar-powered planes and cars. Does solar transportation seem like a good idea?

LUNA RING, Solar Power Generation on the Moon | Topics | Shimizu Corporation (shimz.co.jp)

Is this idea too outrageous? Would something like this be beneficial in the long run? Would you ever support something like this? Are there any other theories you have seen or came up with that utilize solar energy?
it s become efficient BUT it still isn't efficient enough.
Compared to what? Imported diesel, oil, or coal? There are now several ways of storing electrical energy. And solar is getting less costly with every year. As is wind. In the meantime, natural gas and nuclear are ever more costly. You don't need uranium, waste storage, pipeline, nor fracking for solar and wind.
In the meantime, natural gas and nuclear are ever more costly.

View attachment 443917

By "ever more costly" did you mean that natural gas is cheaper than it was in 1982?


View attachment 443920

Or that uranium is less than half the price it was 10 years ago?

Kind of ignoring the costs of installing pipelines and cleaning up after pipeline explosions, aren't you? And then there is the problem of what to do with all that hot nuclear waste. And there is a reason that no insurance company will even consider insuring a nuke plant.
 

Old Rocks

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Would you support small amounts of solar generation in Chicago?
If individuals want to overpay to install less reliable energy, they should be allowed.

Running street lights or even parts of the railway?

No. Silly idea in Chicago.

No one really talks about small things like that even though they have a cost and can make a nice change to the budget of cities.

It would increase costs and only benefit those connected to political insiders.
Cost is a major factor in any energy generation. So what is the relative cost of generation;
View attachment 443734
When you're still paying for the nat gas plant or the nuke plant, running at lower output, how much is the real cost of the wind or solar?
The findings show that retiring 74 percent of American coal power plants and replacing them with wind or solar plants would provide an immediate saving to utilities. About 44 percent of that coal power is substantially at-risk, that is it could be replaced by renewables that are at least 25 percent cheaper.Mar 25, 2019

.

And nuclear is next, then natural gas.
retiring 74 percent of American coal power plants and replacing them with wind or solar plants would provide an immediate saving to utilities.

Retiring a fully amortized plant and replacing it with an expensive new plant with intermittent output would provide "an immediate saving to utilities"?

That's funny.

Is that why power is so cheap in California? Because of all their cheap wind and solar?
When you have as high a demand for energy as California does, the grid to serve that demand is rather expensive. When you are shipping wind and hydro power from two states away, you are paying for a lot of transmission loss. Even with the huge DC line going to San Diego.
When you have as high a demand for energy as California does, the grid to serve that demand is rather expensive.

I guess, in that case, removing reliable, cheap power generation and adding unreliable, more expensive generation makes even less sense than in a lower demand state.
And that is exactly why most of the new generation coming online is renewable.
 

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