Social Security Privatize?

[MtnBiker]

If I happened to be where you where at right now instead of 30 degree weather, I would be happy to help clean the garage and drink beer with you.

 

[Annie]

Actually the biggest event of the day is in my "clean the garage or die trying" competition.....anyone care to assist....I have beer, and some burgers. (hell I'll even order out some BBQ...we can have it catered!)

Sure, send me a ticket and I'll be there. I'm very good at throwing out stuff from garage. Helped my friend get rid of her husband's hoard. Unfortunately that included mint football cards going back to 1961-1970. Oh yeah, and his stub to a Beatle's Concert!

 

[Mr. P]

Sure, send me a ticket and I'll be there. I'm very good at throwing out stuff from garage. Helped my friend get rid of her husband's hoard. Unfortunately that included mint football cards going back to 1961-1970. Oh yeah, and his stub to a Beatle's Concert!

*Fingers crossed in the shape of an X aimed at Ms. Ks' face*
Stay outta my garage WOMAN!! I'll use all this stuff, someday! And if it's tossed away today, I'll need it tomorrow, it never fails!

 

[Fmr jarhead]

I am throwing out all the feminine stuff....arts and crap stuff (my mrs is not around...she is out on the west coast with family) YeeHaa! more room for my stuff!!!!

 

[Mr. P]

I am throwing out all the feminine stuff....arts and crap stuff (my mrs is not around...she is out on the west coast with family) YeeHaa! more room for my stuff!!!!

Perfect...now all we need to do is figure out where we will live together, after our divorces
and NOT look like we're gay.

 

[Annie]

Perfect...now all we need to do is figure out where we will live together, after our divorces
and NOT look like we're gay.

Never fear, from the sound of it, you'll be living in memorabilia and drinking beer. Never fear, no women will come round. Throw that stuff out!!!!

 

[sagegirl]

then let people manage their own savings in the form of IRAs and other retirement saving programs. Make these savings programs not tax deferred, but tax exempt up to a specified limit - say 1 million. People participating in these self-directed programs would understand that they would never be entitled to collect social security. That way the social security program could be gradually phased out or at least substantially reduced.

Im not sure what the current amount is but personal debt is very high. I know there must be alot of people that are working and spending every dime they take in and more. Credit in some ways could be considered welfare.....considering the number of personal bankruptcies is way up too.
Social security is a safety net...but it has evolved into a sort of pyramid scam....those early recipients got more out of it than they put into it, then, the ratio of investment to benefit gradually slipped, until now where there is very little return to be expected from a long term investment,
Yeah, it needs fixin....but private, personal acct's is probably not the answer.

 

[Fmr jarhead]

Never fear, from the sound of it, you'll be living in memorabilia and drinking beer. Never fear, no women will come round. Throw that stuff out!!!!

Should I venture a guess, and say, "no women, like you?"

(this message is not intended to offend or portray women in a bad light in any way shape or form. Those who are offended to go pleasure themselves, and stand in the corner, until their skin has thickened with our dearly departed AA)

Anyone need another beer? Seems the floor of the garage is about to get a coat of paint, and the mixture of alchohol and paint fumes can make for an interesting evening of football, and pretty colors.

BTW....Social Security needs to be reformed, and a choice needs to be offered for the private accounts. Opt in or opt out....look at Galveston, County who opted out of Social Security...they seem to be doing OK. AS does Chile....http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1571/is_n45_v13/ai_20035438 is a very good article outlining some of their successes.

 

[MtnBiker]

It is beyond me why any body would be suckered into a risky scheme of a 401K plan or an IRA. I mean what are people thinking?? :scratch:

 

[Annie]

Should I venture a guess, and say, "no women, like you?"

(this message is not intended to offend or portray women in a bad light in any way shape or form. Those who are offended to go pleasure themselves, and stand in the corner, until their skin has thickened with our dearly departed AA)

Anyone need another beer? Seems the floor of the garage is about to get a coat of paint, and the mixture of alchohol and paint fumes can make for an interesting evening of football, and pretty colors.

BTW....Social Security needs to be reformed, and a choice needs to be offered for the private accounts. Opt in or opt out....look at Galveston, County who opted out of Social Security...they seem to be doing OK. AS does Chile....http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1571/is_n45_v13/ai_20035438 is a very good article outlining some of their successes.

Ok. I was kidding around, you seem harsh. Fine by me.

 

[Fmr jarhead]

The old posturepedic is the best retirement plan, I have ever hear of.....that and the old burlap bag buried in the backyard...oh, crap, that reminds me, I have lived in 5 different houses in the last ten years...I got some interstate digging to go do! I wonder how much it has grown?

 

[MtnBiker]

Did you put any Miracle Grow in those burlap bags? That may have helped your investment grow.

 

[Annie]

The old posturepedic is the best retirement plan, I have ever hear of.....that and the old burlap bag buried in the backyard...oh, crap, that reminds me, I have lived in 5 different houses in the last ten years...I got some interstate digging to go do! I wonder how much it has grown?

Thanks for the rep and I know all about hitting the submit way too soon! :teeth:

 

[Fmr jarhead]

I am more of an organic guy...I thought a little manure would be best....

 

[MtnBiker]

I am more of an organic guy...I thought a little manure would be best....

Like SSI, your return would be kind of shitty.

 

[Fmr jarhead]

I'll set them up...you hit 'em out of the park!!!!!

 

[Merlin1047]

Im not sure what the current amount is but personal debt is very high. I know there must be alot of people that are working and spending every dime they take in and more. Credit in some ways could be considered welfare.....considering the number of personal bankruptcies is way up too.
Social security is a safety net...but it has evolved into a sort of pyramid scam....those early recipients got more out of it than they put into it, then, the ratio of investment to benefit gradually slipped, until now where there is very little return to be expected from a long term investment,
Yeah, it needs fixin....but private, personal acct's is probably not the answer.

Sage - some day you're going to have to explain to me why liberals have so little faith in the ability of average Americans to run their own lives.

If I were in charge of revamping social security, the system would work like this:

FICA taxes would still be deducted from every payroll, employer contributions would also continue. But instead of going to the government, that money would go into an escrow account owned by the individual. The reason for this feature is to keep politican's grubby fingers off our money. It would also prevent illegals from collecting social security.

If an individual chose to do so, he could contribute more than the minimum to the account, up to a maximum percentage to be determined (say 20% of total income). All money paid into and earned by this retirement account would be permanently tax exempt up to one million dollars.

Each individual manages his own account. Money can be moved between any of the government approved investment vehicles which would be available. The individual could choose from low risk money market accounts or bonds or choose stock market options, depending on his tolerance for risk.

Americans who are unemployed would still be covered under "my" system. If a person isn't working, or if his job pays very little. The government will contribute some amount on behalf of that person. Let's say $5,000 per year. Yes, that's a lot of money, but a greater amount would have been paid out as welfare if that person reaches retirement age and has insufficient funds to support himself.

Right now the money paid into FICA simply disappears into that black hole otherwise know as "the budget". If a system such as I suggest were adopted, that money could not be stolen by politicians. Yes, there is a risk associated with stock investment. But when averaged over any ten year time period, the stock market has out performed bank savings accounts by a substantial margin. Odds are that people who manage their own accounts will draw far more retirement income under that system than if they relied on the pittance generated by the current social security system.

 

[sagegirl]

Sage - some day you're going to have to explain to me why liberals have so little faith in the ability of average Americans to run their own lives.

If I were in charge of revamping social security, the system would work like this:

FICA taxes would still be deducted from every payroll, employer contributions would also continue. But instead of going to the government, that money would go into an escrow account owned by the individual. The reason for this feature is to keep politican's grubby fingers off our money. It would also prevent illegals from collecting social security.

If an individual chose to do so, he could contribute more than the minimum to the account, up to a maximum percentage to be determined (say 20% of total income). All money paid into and earned by this retirement account would be permanently tax exempt up to one million dollars.

Each individual manages his own account. Money can be moved between any of the government approved investment vehicles which would be available. The individual could choose from low risk money market accounts or bonds or choose stock market options, depending on his tolerance for risk.

Americans who are unemployed would still be covered under "my" system. If a person isn't working, or if his job pays very little. The government will contribute some amount on behalf of that person. Let's say $5,000 per year. Yes, that's a lot of money, but a greater amount would have been paid out as welfare if that person reaches retirement age and has insufficient funds to support himself.

Right now the money paid into FICA simply disappears into that black hole otherwise know as "the budget". If a system such as I suggest were adopted, that money could not be stolen by politicians. Yes, there is a risk associated with stock investment. But when averaged over any ten year time period, the stock market has out performed bank savings accounts by a substantial margin. Odds are that people who manage their own accounts will draw far more retirement income under that system than if they relied on the pittance generated by the current social security system.

Actually your plan doesnt sound bad to me.....I take exception to your opening statement, that liberals (me?) doubt the ability of others to run their own lives. I am not asking for any assitance or direct benefits from any government program. NOT schools, welfare, disability, tax breaks, any of it. I pay plenty in taxes and dont really expect anything back for them. I am generally not the one that needs the help, but thats because I am very conservative and live well within my means. I see what goes on objectively and try to be non judgemental about it, but I see most peoples circumstances due to their own behavior....examples....keep yourself healthy by eating pure nutritious foods and exercise, limit your spending and increase your savings, (limit consuption and live conservatively), definitely limit your reproductive urges (sex is great, be careful and responsible), be ever vigilant of fraud and foolishness. There is a lot more to living than this, but its some of the basics, as I see it too much indulgence is going on and it is too costly to measure. I do absolutely believe in self governance and self control.
I am not a supporter of social security....except that I have paid plenty into it and at my age 56 I will probably see some returns. I have otherwise saved for my old age and if the dollar maintains any of its value I will probably do okay.

 

[Merlin1047]

Actually your plan doesnt sound bad to me.....I take exception to your opening statement, that liberals (me?) doubt the ability of others to run their own lives. I am not asking for any assitance or direct benefits from any government program. NOT schools, welfare, disability, tax breaks, any of it.

I did not mean to infer that you personally were a welfare leech nor did I seek to attribute that as a lib trait. I apologize if I failed to make that clear.

What I meant by the statement was that it does appear to be a favorite liberal trait to assume that the judgement of the government is superior to the judgement of the individual. Also, it is a lib trait to seize upon the weaknesses and shortcomings of those that are incompetent, not too bright or simply lazy and rush to their defense with yet another government entitlement program. But in the process, they make rules for all of us. As a result, we lose our freedom to make our own decisions and to either reap the rewards or to suffer the consequences.

I pay plenty in taxes and dont really expect anything back for them.

Sage - it's your money. If the government comes along and takes it, you not only have an absolute right to demand an accounting, you have an obligation to do so. Sleazy politicians count on our apathy to get away with their pork barrel spending.

I got a chuckle out of a portion of the remainder of your post. It appears that we are the same age. Had I known I was going to live this long, I probably would have taken better care of myself.

I also did not intend to suggest that the SS system needed to be scrapped immediately. Obviously any changes will need to be phased in and the Bush plan does that. It's too late to change the system for folks our age. What we have to be careful of is that Democrats don't steal our anticipated social security under the guise of "means testing" or through continually bumping up the minimum age at which a person becomes eligible.

But I believe that the average person can manage his or her money far better than the government. And I believe that social security should be set up to allow for that. It should also contain sufficient safeguards to prevent the gullible from getting fleeced by fast-talking con artists.

 

[Trigg]

Yeah, it needs fixin....but private, personal acct's is probably not the answer.

I'm pretty sure the proposed plan wouldn't have people putting the money in personnal accounts.
According to what I've read people would choose between certain investments and the money would be taken out of their paychecks just like now, only instead of the money going to the gov. some would go into these previously chosen investments.