So, whatever happened to the Greenland glaciers?

[westwall]

It seems a little odd that we havn't been barraged by Chris and company about Greenlands glaciers melting and all that and i just found out why! They aren't! An interesting little article that of course the warmists won't mention so I will!

Enjoy!

Greenland's Ice Armageddon Comes To An End | The Resilient Earth

Higher surface mass balance of the Greenland ice sheet revealed by high-resolution climate modeling

 

[code1211]

It seems a little odd that we havn't been barraged by Chris and company about Greenlands glaciers melting and all that and i just found out why! They aren't! An interesting little article that of course the warmists won't mention so I will!

Enjoy!

Greenland's Ice Armageddon Comes To An End | The Resilient Earth

Higher surface mass balance of the Greenland ice sheet revealed by high-resolution climate modeling

From your article:

<snip>

So add the disappearance of Greanland's ice cap to the list of bogus “catastrophes” predicted by the global warming pundits, along with rising sea levels, higher temperatures, mass extinctions, and increased hurricane activity. In science, theories are judged by the accuracy with which they predict the behavior of nature. The eco-alarmists have been preaching widespread disaster for more than a quarter of a century and no disaster has occured. It's time to for scientists to start speaking up, as 650 climate scientists did recently at the UN global warming conference held in Pozan, Poland.

<snip>

 

[Old Rocks]

Hmmm...... The first article, which you quote, Code, is a blog, obviously not by a scientists, totally filled with lies and half truths.

The second citation just demostrates that Walleyes is incapable of understanding anything that he reads.

Higher surface mass balance of the Greenland ice sheet revealed by high-resolution climate modeling

Higher surface mass balance of the Greenland ice sheet revealed by high-resolution climate modeling

Higher surface mass balance of the Greenland ice sheet revealed by high-resolution climate modeling
Janneke Ettema

Institute for Marine and Atmospheric Research, Utrecht University, Utrecht, Netherlands

Michiel R. van den Broeke

Institute for Marine and Atmospheric Research, Utrecht University, Utrecht, Netherlands

Erik van Meijgaard

Royal Netherlands Meteorological Institute, De Bilt, Netherlands

Willem Jan van de Berg

Institute for Marine and Atmospheric Research, Utrecht University, Utrecht, Netherlands

Jonathan L. Bamber

Bristol Glaciology Centre, School of Geographical Sciences, University of Bristol, Bristol, UK

Jason E. Box

Department of Geography, Byrd Polar Research Center, Ohio State University, Columbus, Ohio, USA

Roger C. Bales

Sierra Nevada Research Institute, University of California, Merced, California, USA

High-resolution (&#8764;11 km) regional climate modeling shows total annual precipitation on the Greenland ice sheet for 1958&#8211;2007 to be up to 24% and surface mass balance up to 63% higher than previously thought. The largest differences occur in coastal southeast Greenland, where the much higher resolution facilitates capturing snow accumulation peaks that past five-fold coarser resolution regional climate models missed. The surface mass balance trend over the full 1958&#8211;2007 period reveals the classic pattern expected in a warming climate, with increased snowfall in the interior and enhanced runoff from the marginal ablation zone. In the period 1990&#8211;2007, total runoff increased significantly, 3% per year. The absolute increase in runoff is especially pronounced in the southeast, where several outlet glaciers have recently accelerated. This detailed knowledge of Greenland's surface mass balance provides the foundation for estimating and predicting the overall mass balance and freshwater discharge of the ice sheet.

 

[Old Rocks]

Greenland rapidly rising as ice melt continues

Greenland Rapidly Rising as Ice Melt Continues
ScienceDaily (May 18, 2010) &#8212; Greenland is situated in the Atlantic Ocean to the northeast of Canada. It has stunning fjords on its rocky coast formed by moving glaciers, and a dense icecap up to 2 km thick that covers much of the island--pressing down the land beneath and lowering its elevation. Now, scientists at the University of Miami say Greenland's ice is melting so quickly that the land underneath is rising at an accelerated pace.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


According to the study, some coastal areas are going up by nearly one inch per year and if current trends continue, that number could accelerate to as much as two inches per year by 2025, explains Tim Dixon, professor of geophysics at the University of Miami Rosenstiel School of Marine and Atmospheric Science (RSMAS) and principal investigator of the study.

"It's been known for several years that climate change is contributing to the melting of Greenland's ice sheet," Dixon says. "What's surprising, and a bit worrisome, is that the ice is melting so fast that we can actually see the land uplift in response," he says. "Even more surprising, the rise seems to be accelerating, implying that melting is accelerating

 

[Old Rocks]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KRDcznl6At8]YouTube - &#x202a;Greenland Icemelt&#x202c;&lrm;[/ame]

 

[Old Rocks]

NASA Finds Warmer Ocean Speeding Greenland Glacier Melt - NASA Jet Propulsion Laboratory

February 16, 2010

Glaciers in west Greenland are melting 100 times faster at their end points beneath the ocean than they are at their surfaces, according to a new NASA/university study published online Feb. 14 in Nature Geoscience. The results suggest this undersea melting caused by warmer ocean waters is playing an important, if not dominant, role in the current evolution of Greenland's glaciers, a factor that had previously been overlooked.

Researchers Eric Rignot and Isabella Velicogna, both of NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, Calif., and the University of California, Irvine; along with colleague Michele Koppes of the University of British Columbia, Vancouver, Canada, measured the undersea melting rates of four glaciers in central west Greenland in the summer of 2008. They deployed oceanographic equipment in the glacier fjords, sampling the water at various depths to measure ocean currents, temperature and salinity, along with the depth of the fjords. The researchers found the melt rates of the glaciers studied was 100 times larger under the ocean at their terminus points than that observed at the glacial surfaces.

Rignot said the new study complements other recent research on the effects of ocean conditions in Greenland fjords. A study in the same online issue of Nature Geoscience by researcher Fiammetta Straneo of the Woods Hole Oceanographic Institution, Woods Hole, Mass., and colleagues looked at changes in oceanographic conditions in fjords that may be conducive to changes in undersea melting. Another 2008 Nature Geoscience study by researcher David Holland of New York University, New York, found that Greenland glaciers sped up as warm waters intruded into their fjords.

 

[Old Rocks]

Again, from the bogus blog, The Resilient Earth, comes this little gem. Now it sure has been a lot cooler lately, correct?

Greenland&#039;s Ice Armageddon Comes To An End | The Resilient Earth

Click on the image above for the latest close up view of the Sun. Fewer Sun spots means a cooler climate. See the SOHO site for more information

 

[westwall]

Boy! That touched a nerve didn't it! I havn't seen such a desperate attempt to baffle them with bullshit in a long time. And while it has been warm in parts of the world it has been far colder in more areas of the globe....or don't you read papers that report real news?

 

[Old Rocks]

I see. A dumbass blog against NASA and real papers from real scientists.

By the way, why lie about the warm and cold record, Walleyes? Too easy to check;

Interactive Weather Records Map, Stats, & Facts - Search for Weather Records in the US

Weather records, tied or broken, from 1/1/2010 to 7/28/2010, for ALL States
(All Records): 54341
(H) High Temperature: 6772
(HM) Highest Minimum Temperature: 10501
(L) Low Temperature: 3620
(LM) Lowest Maximum Temperature: 6479
(R) Rain/Precipitation: 20890
(S) Snow: 6079

Warm (H + HM) Records: 31.8%
Cold (L + LM) Records: 18.6%
Precip. (R + S) Records: 49.6%

Note the snow and rain events.

One of the primary predictions of global warming is wide and wild swings in weather, with an overall warming.

 

[rdean]

Hmmm...... The first article, which you quote, Code, is a blog, obviously not by a scientists, totally filled with lies and half truths.

The second citation just demostrates that Walleyes is incapable of understanding anything that he reads.

Higher surface mass balance of the Greenland ice sheet revealed by high-resolution climate modeling

Higher surface mass balance of the Greenland ice sheet revealed by high-resolution climate modeling

Higher surface mass balance of the Greenland ice sheet revealed by high-resolution climate modeling
Janneke Ettema

Institute for Marine and Atmospheric Research, Utrecht University, Utrecht, Netherlands

Michiel R. van den Broeke

Institute for Marine and Atmospheric Research, Utrecht University, Utrecht, Netherlands

Erik van Meijgaard

Royal Netherlands Meteorological Institute, De Bilt, Netherlands

Willem Jan van de Berg

Institute for Marine and Atmospheric Research, Utrecht University, Utrecht, Netherlands

Jonathan L. Bamber

Bristol Glaciology Centre, School of Geographical Sciences, University of Bristol, Bristol, UK

Jason E. Box

Department of Geography, Byrd Polar Research Center, Ohio State University, Columbus, Ohio, USA

Roger C. Bales

Sierra Nevada Research Institute, University of California, Merced, California, USA

High-resolution (&#8764;11 km) regional climate modeling shows total annual precipitation on the Greenland ice sheet for 1958–2007 to be up to 24% and surface mass balance up to 63% higher than previously thought. The largest differences occur in coastal southeast Greenland, where the much higher resolution facilitates capturing snow accumulation peaks that past five-fold coarser resolution regional climate models missed. The surface mass balance trend over the full 1958–2007 period reveals the classic pattern expected in a warming climate, with increased snowfall in the interior and enhanced runoff from the marginal ablation zone. In the period 1990–2007, total runoff increased significantly, 3% per year. The absolute increase in runoff is especially pronounced in the southeast, where several outlet glaciers have recently accelerated. This detailed knowledge of Greenland's surface mass balance provides the foundation for estimating and predicting the overall mass balance and freshwater discharge of the ice sheet.

someone posted an article as "proof", but the article in question actually proved the opposite? Funny.

 

[westwall]

Hmmm...... The first article, which you quote, Code, is a blog, obviously not by a scientists, totally filled with lies and half truths.

The second citation just demostrates that Walleyes is incapable of understanding anything that he reads.

Higher surface mass balance of the Greenland ice sheet revealed by high-resolution climate modeling

Higher surface mass balance of the Greenland ice sheet revealed by high-resolution climate modeling

Higher surface mass balance of the Greenland ice sheet revealed by high-resolution climate modeling
Janneke Ettema

Institute for Marine and Atmospheric Research, Utrecht University, Utrecht, Netherlands

Michiel R. van den Broeke

Institute for Marine and Atmospheric Research, Utrecht University, Utrecht, Netherlands

Erik van Meijgaard

Royal Netherlands Meteorological Institute, De Bilt, Netherlands

Willem Jan van de Berg

Institute for Marine and Atmospheric Research, Utrecht University, Utrecht, Netherlands

Jonathan L. Bamber

Bristol Glaciology Centre, School of Geographical Sciences, University of Bristol, Bristol, UK

Jason E. Box

Department of Geography, Byrd Polar Research Center, Ohio State University, Columbus, Ohio, USA

Roger C. Bales

Sierra Nevada Research Institute, University of California, Merced, California, USA

High-resolution (&#8764;11 km) regional climate modeling shows total annual precipitation on the Greenland ice sheet for 1958–2007 to be up to 24% and surface mass balance up to 63% higher than previously thought. The largest differences occur in coastal southeast Greenland, where the much higher resolution facilitates capturing snow accumulation peaks that past five-fold coarser resolution regional climate models missed. The surface mass balance trend over the full 1958–2007 period reveals the classic pattern expected in a warming climate, with increased snowfall in the interior and enhanced runoff from the marginal ablation zone. In the period 1990–2007, total runoff increased significantly, 3% per year. The absolute increase in runoff is especially pronounced in the southeast, where several outlet glaciers have recently accelerated. This detailed knowledge of Greenland's surface mass balance provides the foundation for estimating and predicting the overall mass balance and freshwater discharge of the ice sheet.

someone posted an article as "proof", but the article in question actually proved the opposite? Funny.

Actually the pertinent part is at the very beginning. Highlighted for the reading impaired.
What that means is all those alarmist diatribes were based on data that was so far off that their conjectures are meaningless. If you don't have a solid baseline then NONE of your research is useful. NONE OF IT!

High-resolution (&#8764;11 km) regional climate modeling shows total annual precipitation on the Greenland ice sheet for 1958–2007 to be up to 24% and surface mass balance up to 63% higher than previously thought. The largest differences occur in coastal southeast Greenland, where the much higher resolution facilitates capturing snow accumulation peaks that past five-fold coarser resolution regional climate models missed. The surface mass balance trend over the full 1958–2007 period reveals the classic pattern expected in a warming climate, with increased snowfall in the interior and enhanced runoff from the marginal ablation zone. In the period 1990–2007, total runoff increased significantly, 3% per year. The absolute increase in runoff is especially pronounced in the southeast, where several outlet glaciers have recently accelerated. This detailed knowledge of Greenland's surface mass balance provides the foundation for estimating and predicting the overall mass balance and freshwater discharge of the ice sheet.

 

[Old Rocks]

Now Walleyes, we already have the mass balance as measured by the GRACE satellites. And it is decreasing by the gigaton every year, and every year, that number gets larger.

Note that it states that they have a much more accurate measuring device now. And what they are measuring is exactly according to the predictions made by the warming models.

 

[syrenn]

It seems a little odd that we havn't been barraged by Chris and company about Greenlands glaciers melting and all that and i just found out why! They aren't! An interesting little article that of course the warmists won't mention so I will!

Enjoy!

Greenland's Ice Armageddon Comes To An End | The Resilient Earth

Higher surface mass balance of the Greenland ice sheet revealed by high-resolution climate modeling

and off topic question to ponder.

Why would they name a place "Greenland" if it it was covered with ice and snow? Could it be that it was GREEN when they found it?

 

[Old Rocks]

Not at all, Syrenn.

Outdoor Greenland | GORP.com

The name"Greenland" is one of history's great geographical scams, on par with calling the Caribbean the "West Indies." In 982, the good people of Iceland exiled Eric the Red. Eric sailed west towards some mountains visible from the top of Iceland's higher peaks. He found himself on the island now known as Greenland, and when his exile was over, he returned to Iceland to gather a group of settlers.

He knew it wouldn't be easy. The island lies at a point where the Atlantic meets the Arctic Ocean, meaning that Greenland is surrounded by cold ocean currents. Although the country is immense, encompassing 270,277 square miles (nearly twice the size of Germany), about 85% of the island's mass is covered by an ice cap. The ice cap covers extends 1,553 miles from north to south and up to 650 miles from east to west. At its center, the ice can be up to 9,800 feet thick. All in all, the ice cap contains 10 percent of the world's fresh water reserves. If all that ice were to melt, the world's oceans would rise 23 feet.

So Leif had a mighty hard sales pitch convincing would-be settlers to spend the rest of their life there. He returned to Iceland with exaggerated stories of verdant shores, abundant fish, excellent farmland and an evocative name for this wonderland: Greenland. He rallied a group of settlers, and they ventured off to found a colony that lasted for 300 years&#8212; until it was done in by the combined effects of climatic cooling and Europe's bubonic plague

Even in the best of times the colony was marginal, and they were never able to grow any amount of grain.

 

[westwall]

Now Walleyes, we already have the mass balance as measured by the GRACE satellites. And it is decreasing by the gigaton every year, and every year, that number gets larger.

Note that it states that they have a much more accurate measuring device now. And what they are measuring is exactly according to the predictions made by the warming models.

You mean these satellites that seem to have biases built into them? Seems their accuracy leaves a lot to be desired and yes this is a peer reviewed paper.

CO2 Science

 

[westwall]

Not at all, Syrenn.

Outdoor Greenland | GORP.com

The name"Greenland" is one of history's great geographical scams, on par with calling the Caribbean the "West Indies." In 982, the good people of Iceland exiled Eric the Red. Eric sailed west towards some mountains visible from the top of Iceland's higher peaks. He found himself on the island now known as Greenland, and when his exile was over, he returned to Iceland to gather a group of settlers.

He knew it wouldn't be easy. The island lies at a point where the Atlantic meets the Arctic Ocean, meaning that Greenland is surrounded by cold ocean currents. Although the country is immense, encompassing 270,277 square miles (nearly twice the size of Germany), about 85% of the island's mass is covered by an ice cap. The ice cap covers extends 1,553 miles from north to south and up to 650 miles from east to west. At its center, the ice can be up to 9,800 feet thick. All in all, the ice cap contains 10 percent of the world's fresh water reserves. If all that ice were to melt, the world's oceans would rise 23 feet.

So Leif had a mighty hard sales pitch convincing would-be settlers to spend the rest of their life there. He returned to Iceland with exaggerated stories of verdant shores, abundant fish, excellent farmland and an evocative name for this wonderland: Greenland. He rallied a group of settlers, and they ventured off to found a colony that lasted for 300 years— until it was done in by the combined effects of climatic cooling and Europe's bubonic plague

Even in the best of times the colony was marginal, and they were never able to grow any amount of grain.

Complete and utter horseshit. Low end estimates of 2500 from the 1980's studies and high end of 6000. Nowadays as the amount of research increases the estimates go ever upward. The current high estimate is 13,000 and the low estimate is 8,000. the total Viking population was around 130,000 so if it was in fact 13,000 then it was a major colony. old fraud loves to claim the colony marginal but all they lacked was possibly bread and beer so in a worst case scenario they were more healthy than their Icelandic and Norwegian brethren.

The grasses that grow there were considered exceptional and as the 450 farms that have been found were primarily concerned with the raising of cattle and sheep that would be the most important crop anyway. Also the fact that there were 12 churches, and a cathedral, and a monestary also negates old frauds contention that the colony was marginal.

Finally the colony lasted for 500 years and launched their own expeditions to North America. This would have been impossible if they were truly marginal. old frauds assertions are a blatant example of how the alarmists will distort real history to further their religios beliefs.

Marginal? Hardly! They were a robust colony until the cooling of the Little Ice Age returned and drove them away. Just like the Inuit many times before them. And that is more history the alarmists will pervert in their efforts to rewrite history to suit their needs.

Despicable.

Viking Colonization in Canada Terry Long&#8217;s Portfolio

http://www.collectionscanada.gc.ca/obj/s4/f2/dsk2/ftp04/mq22551.pdf

Rudy Brueggemann's Greenlandic Vikings image gallery

Vikings in Greenland

WBUR Dispatches : Greenland | Land of Ice and Snow

Greenland Vikings

Greenland - Facts and history - Official Greenland Travel Guide

 

[konradv]

It seems a little odd that we havn't been barraged by Chris and company about Greenlands glaciers melting and all that and i just found out why! They aren't! An interesting little article that of course the warmists won't mention so I will!

Enjoy!

Greenland's Ice Armageddon Comes To An End | The Resilient Earth

Higher surface mass balance of the Greenland ice sheet revealed by high-resolution climate modeling

Climate modeling??? I thought that was all crap! Only when they don't fit your bias, eh westy? All reports from unbiased sources reveal a continued high level of melting in Greenland. I'm afraid your agenda-driven site just doesn't pass the smell test.

 

[Old Rocks]

Now Walleyes, we already have the mass balance as measured by the GRACE satellites. And it is decreasing by the gigaton every year, and every year, that number gets larger.

Note that it states that they have a much more accurate measuring device now. And what they are measuring is exactly according to the predictions made by the warming models.

You mean these satellites that seem to have biases built into them? Seems their accuracy leaves a lot to be desired and yes this is a peer reviewed paper.

CO2 Science

Once again I have to ask if you ever really read what you post? This does not concern Greenland or any land area, but rather the oceans, as stated in the title of the article.

And I would have to question the authors interpretation of the land based sea gauges. Other articles, equally peer reviewed, have higher numbers.

CO2 Science

Ocean Mass Trends (and Sea Level Estimates) from GRACE
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Reference
Quinn, K.J. and Ponte, R.M. 2010. Uncertainty in ocean mass trends from GRACE. Geophysical Journal International 181: 762-768.
Background
The authors write that "ocean mass, together with steric sea level, are the key components of total observed sea level change," and that "monthly observations from the Gravity Recovery and Climate Experiment (GRACE) can provide estimates of the ocean mass component of the sea level budget, but full use of the data requires a detailed understanding of its errors and biases."

What was done
In an effort designed to provide some of that "detailed understanding" of GRACE's "errors and biases," Quinn and Ponte conducted what they describe as "a detailed analysis of processing and post-processing factors affecting GRACE estimates of ocean mass trends," by "comparing results from different data centers and exploring a range of post-processing filtering and modeling parameters, including the effects of geocenter motion, PGR [postglacial rebound], and atmospheric pressure

 

[westwall]

Now Walleyes, we already have the mass balance as measured by the GRACE satellites. And it is decreasing by the gigaton every year, and every year, that number gets larger.

Note that it states that they have a much more accurate measuring device now. And what they are measuring is exactly according to the predictions made by the warming models.

You mean these satellites that seem to have biases built into them? Seems their accuracy leaves a lot to be desired and yes this is a peer reviewed paper.

CO2 Science

Once again I have to ask if you ever really read what you post? This does not concern Greenland or any land area, but rather the oceans, as stated in the title of the article.

And I would have to question the authors interpretation of the land based sea gauges. Other articles, equally peer reviewed, have higher numbers.

CO2 Science

Ocean Mass Trends (and Sea Level Estimates) from GRACE
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Reference
Quinn, K.J. and Ponte, R.M. 2010. Uncertainty in ocean mass trends from GRACE. Geophysical Journal International 181: 762-768.
Background
The authors write that "ocean mass, together with steric sea level, are the key components of total observed sea level change," and that "monthly observations from the Gravity Recovery and Climate Experiment (GRACE) can provide estimates of the ocean mass component of the sea level budget, but full use of the data requires a detailed understanding of its errors and biases."

What was done
In an effort designed to provide some of that "detailed understanding" of GRACE's "errors and biases," Quinn and Ponte conducted what they describe as "a detailed analysis of processing and post-processing factors affecting GRACE estimates of ocean mass trends," by "comparing results from different data centers and exploring a range of post-processing filtering and modeling parameters, including the effects of geocenter motion, PGR [postglacial rebound], and atmospheric pressure

Gee old fraud, you forgot to put the last part of the study down, looks like you did read it and didn't want anybody else to read the conclusions, why is that?

What it means
In light of the fact that Quinn and Ponte indicate that "over the last century, the rate of sea level rise has been only 1.7 ± 0.5 mm/year, based on tide gauge reconstructions (Church and White, 2006)," it seems a bit strange that one would ever question that result on the basis of a GRACE-derived assessment, with its many and potentially very large "errors and biases." In addition, as Ramillien et al. (2006) have noted, "the GRACE data time series is still very short," and results obtained from it "must be considered as preliminary since we cannot exclude that apparent trends [derived from it] only reflect inter-annual fluctuations." And as Quinn and Ponte also add, "non-ocean signals, such as in the Indian Ocean due to the 2004 Sumatran-Andean earthquake, and near Greenland and West Antarctica due to land signal leakage, can also corrupt the ocean trend estimates."

Clearly, the GRACE approach to evaluating ocean mass and sea level trends still has a long way to go -- and must develop a long history of data acquisition -- before it can ever be considered a reliable means of providing assessments of ocean mass and sea level change that are accurate enough to detect an anthropogenic signal that could be confidently distinguished from natural variability.

 

[westwall]

It seems a little odd that we havn't been barraged by Chris and company about Greenlands glaciers melting and all that and i just found out why! They aren't! An interesting little article that of course the warmists won't mention so I will!

Enjoy!

Greenland's Ice Armageddon Comes To An End | The Resilient Earth

Higher surface mass balance of the Greenland ice sheet revealed by high-resolution climate modeling

Climate modeling??? I thought that was all crap! Only when they don't fit your bias, eh westy? All reports from unbiased sources reveal a continued high level of melting in Greenland. I'm afraid your agenda-driven site just doesn't pass the smell test.

It is crap. But at least these folks aren't trying to regulate the life of humankind based on an incomplete and inadequate system, unlike your politically motivated alarmist pseudo scientists are. Smell test? You failed that long ago bucko, long ago.