So enough of the left and right stuff. How do the Independents and Libertarians feel

[Truthmatters]

I didn't know anyone did care what you think.

I'm at that point where I might have to move my ignor list to 2 people, Shaman and TM... But it's funny as hell watching you get your shit handed back to you while you freak out.

I'm not a birther nor is the right "run by birthers."

Like I said, why would someone put someone as shit silly dumb as you on ignore... On the other hand it's not like many people engage in any kind of real debate with you, it's more just links (to facts ha! FACTS!) proving you wrong.

Shrug, I might add you to ignore as I’m sure many others have. As we get closer to elections and you’re cock lust for Obama overwhelms any and everything you post, when the sound of you sucking off Obama with every post dominates any and all possible debate I’ll probably have no choice.

How are all four wars doing TM, I figure you might know....

please try and keep your interests in certain sexual activities out of this conversation.


See if you can actually stick to facts for a change.

Now tell me why every candidate surges when they talk birther crap to the right wing?

 

[Annie]

Porblem is that most of the Independents and libertarians lean heavially right.

They didn't in 2008, what changed?

 

[Avorysuds]

I'm not a birther nor is the right "run by birthers."

Like I said, why would someone put someone as shit silly dumb as you on ignore... On the other hand it's not like many people engage in any kind of real debate with you, it's more just links (to facts ha! FACTS!) proving you wrong.

Shrug, I might add you to ignore as I’m sure many others have. As we get closer to elections and you’re cock lust for Obama overwhelms any and everything you post, when the sound of you sucking off Obama with every post dominates any and all possible debate I’ll probably have no choice.

How are all four wars doing TM, I figure you might know....

please try and keep your interests in certain sexual activities out of this conversation.


See if you can actually stick to facts for a change.

Now tell me why every candidate surges when they talk birther crap to the right wing?

First off I'll talk about whatever I want... You support killing civilians in other countries like it's the only option so I see no reason not to bring up your ugly crsh on Obama.

Next, Ron Paul does very well for not being a birther and he just announced he is looking at running for president so he will be in the top 3 picks very soon.

 

[Avorysuds]

porblem is that most of the independents and libertarians lean heavially right.

what does left and right mean anymore? Who is left and who is right? What issues are left and what are right?

End the fed.
Obama - no
mccain - no
barr - yes
baldwin - yes
mckinney - yes

cancel nafta, etc.
Obama - no
mccain - no
barr - yes
baldwin - yes
mckinney - yes

leave the wto.
Obama - no
mccain - no
barr - yes
baldwin - yes
mckinney - yes

completely withdraw from iraq.
Obama - no
mccain - no
barr - yes
baldwin - yes
mckinney - yes

close all military bases around the world and bring all troops home.
Obama - no
mccain - no
barr - yes
baldwin - yes
mckinney - yes

stop all foreign aid.
Obama - no
mccain - no
barr - yes
baldwin - yes
mckinney - yes

end the patriot act, etc.
Obama - no
mccain - no
barr - yes
baldwin - yes
mckinney - yes

enforce posse comitatus.
Obama - no
mccain - no
barr - yes
baldwin - yes
mckinney - yes

restore habeas corpus.
Obama - no
mccain - no
barr - yes
baldwin - yes
mckinney - yes

against the bailout.
Obama - no
mccain - no
barr - yes
baldwin - yes
mckinney - yes

protect gun rights.
Obama - no
mccain - yes ?
Barr - yes
baldwin - yes
mckinney - yes

single payer universal health care.
Obama - no
mccain - no
barr - no
baldwin - no
mckinney - yes

qft

 

[Montrovant]

Unfortunately, while President gets all the attention, I think that congressional elections are much more important. Too many people seem to look to the president to solve all problems, as though he were a dictator rather than head of one branch of government.

That said, I have yet to see a candidate for president that particularly impresses me. Of course, jaded and cynical as I am, it would be hard for a politician to impress me. There's something about Ron Paul that has always struck me as off; I can't articulate it any better at the moment, and he's been in politics long enough I have no problem distrusting him without concrete reason.

Obama has earned little but scorn, there's no reason to even talk about the same re-hashed Republican candidates, Palin and Trump are jokes. Perhaps one of the less well known potential candidates might spark some of my interest, along the lines of a Gary Johnson, but there's the question of their electability and, more importantly, whether I can believe any of their supposed stances or intentions.

When it comes to presidential elections the one thing I'd most like to see is a third-party/independent candidate win. I'm not even that partial to what party or philosophy they are part of; I just want to see the political establishment shaken up and perhaps pushed into actual change, and I'd like to see that the voters aren't as strongly wedded to the Democrat/Republican dynamic as I believe they are.

Well, I suppose I should add that I'd like to see a woman and/or a non-Christian win the presidency. I don't think they'd do a better job, I'm just interested in things that break up the traditional and perhaps shock people into thinking outside the political norm.

 

[Avorysuds]

Porblem is that most of the Independents and libertarians lean heavially right.

I don't know where you get the idea that independent voters lean heavily right.

He said 'heavially' right. That must be code for 'independent'.

It's code for "It looks like we're lossing the Indy vote in 2012 so lets just say they were "righties" all along."

 

[Avorysuds]

Unfortunately, while President gets all the attention, I think that congressional elections are much more important. Too many people seem to look to the president to solve all problems, as though he were a dictator rather than head of one branch of government.

That said, I have yet to see a candidate for president that particularly impresses me. Of course, jaded and cynical as I am, it would be hard for a politician to impress me. There's something about Ron Paul that has always struck me as off; I can't articulate it any better at the moment, and he's been in politics long enough I have no problem distrusting him without concrete reason.

Obama has earned little but scorn, there's no reason to even talk about the same re-hashed Republican candidates, Palin and Trump are jokes. Perhaps one of the less well known potential candidates might spark some of my interest, along the lines of a Gary Johnson, but there's the question of their electability and, more importantly, whether I can believe any of their supposed stances or intentions.

When it comes to presidential elections the one thing I'd most like to see is a third-party/independent candidate win. I'm not even that partial to what party or philosophy they are part of; I just want to see the political establishment shaken up and perhaps pushed into actual change, and I'd like to see that the voters aren't as strongly wedded to the Democrat/Republican dynamic as I believe they are.

Well, I suppose I should add that I'd like to see a woman and/or a non-Christian win the presidency. I don't think they'd do a better job, I'm just interested in things that break up the traditional and perhaps shock people into thinking outside the political norm.

First, McCain would tell you he is a non-christian AND a female if that would win your vote.

Second, the president is super mega power and I don't understand why some people claim the President's position is weak. That 1 single position is a third of the vote made by that one single person... To me it's all imposrtant yes, but having someone that can lead and vote in a direction you agree with is more inportant than trying to get a super majority in either house and hope you gets the votes on important issues.

 

[Wiseacre]

Porblem is that most of the Independents and libertarians lean heavially right.

I think that's a good thing.
So much for the liberal view of America being a center/left nation.

Reality is the majority of American's are fiscally conservative and socially middle of road to liberal.
When the economy and the Federal defeicit as it is, it will be a while before votes for legalizing dope and gay marriage win elections.

Liberals think the USA is center/left? Still? After they got their asses kicked last November? I think you're right about most Americans being fiscally conservative, that's where the TP is coming from. I suspect on social issues though there's a lot of movement, with people changing their relative con/lib position from issue to issue.