Zone1 Should I ask "Why God?" or should I ask "how did the devil become so powerful"?

[notmyfault2020]

In James 4:7, we are reminded to “submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you.” This verse sounds like a very confronting passage that we all need to understand fully in sections by taking the verse into context.

But it does not tell us HOW to resist the devil. In our own power, we cannot resist him 100% all the time

But we need to or we are doomed. Therefore, Jesus, who knew all about Satan, gave us a CHURCH, against which "the gates of Hell shall not prevail" (Sacraments.. Eucharist in particular)

 

[bigrebnc1775]

But it does not tell us HOW to resist the devil. In our own power, we cannot resist him 100% all the time

But we need to or we are doomed. Therefore, Jesus, who knew all about Satan, gave us a CHURCH, against which "the gates of Hell shall not prevail" (Sacraments.. Eucharist in particular)

Submit yourself to God. It's right their

 

[buttercup]

Gods give ultimatums

Thou shalt not...... or else

Your twisted idea of God is sad, it's no wonder you don't believe. I wouldn't believe in that strawman "god" either.

God gives us commands (which are wise and for our own benefit) but He is not the tyrannical mean-spirited slave driver that you seem to think He is, in your twisted caricature. I truly hope that one day you'll realize that.

 

[BreezeWood]

But it does not tell us HOW to resist the devil. In our own power, we cannot resist him 100% all the time

But we need to or we are doomed. Therefore, Jesus, who knew all about Satan, gave us a CHURCH, against which "the gates of Hell shall not prevail" (Sacraments.. Eucharist in particular)

evil is not a person ...

you mean evil - the mission of a&e to triumph over evil for remission to paradise, the religion of antiquity prescribed by the heavens - abandoned by the errant desert religions.

the narrow is far narrower than the desert only dreams - than to tolerate ...

 

[onefour1]

This discussion reminds me of my college days when I took a philosophy of religion course. During that course challenging questions regarding the belief in God were presented which had me questioning what the answers were. I came to understand that it requires a good understanding of God and what type of being he truly is to answer some of these questions. Also a good understand of how things are and the history God has given to us in scripture. One example I struggled with was the following question:

If God is all powerful, all knowing, and an all loving being, why didn't he simply create us to be the perfect beings he wants us to become? If God is all powerful, surely he had the power to do this. If he is all knowing, surely he had the knowledge of how to do this. And if God is an all kind and loving being, why wouldn't he do this and save us from all the pain and suffering we find in this world when he could simply have made us perfect like himself from the beginning?

It took me nearly six months after the class ended before I could truly answer this question with answers from scripture. The answer to this question is also the answer I would use to answer Blues Man's question regarding Satan. How would you answer this question from my philosophy of religion course? I will give my answer I came up with after you take a stab at the question.

 

[Blues Man]

Hmm. Kind of like, Danger! Quicksand!
Heed the sign... or else!

Instead of thinking "Ultimatum" think of advice that steps one around unstable behaviors and their consequences to self and others.

Yeah fumy how most of any god's demands are for worship

You'd think a supreme being wouldn't need its ego stoked like that

 

[Blues Man]

They are certainly not your interpretation of Biblical man's presentation of God's presence in our midst. You are speaking to people who do not share your interpretations--for good reason. They are not the intent of the original author and we are not the ones ignorant of that author's original intent.

There is no need for anyone to remain ignorant. There is plenty of scholarly study available.

I've read the bible OT and NT more than once, I've read the Koran. I've read Thomas Aquinas, and dozens of others

There are more than enough works by countless philosophers that speak on every topic in the bible. ( where do you think the people who wrote the bible got most of their ideas?)

 

[Blues Man]

Your twisted idea of God is sad, it's no wonder you don't believe. I wouldn't believe in that strawman "god" either.

God gives us commands (which are wise and for our own benefit) but He is not the tyrannical mean-spirited slave driver that you seem to think He is, in your twisted caricature. I truly hope that one day you'll realize that.

And disobeying t hose command results in what?

Eternal damnation?

Everything the bible mentions about how to live well has been plagiarized from other sources. The bible serves one purpose and that is to expand a particular religious bent

 

[Meriweather]

Yeah fumy how most of any god's demands are for worship

You'd think a supreme being wouldn't need its ego stoked like that

That is where etymology and a bit of understanding of the Hebrew language comes in handy. Meekness, humility, worship in the original context is about self-control, that we put God and His ways first in how we live our lives. It had little to do with spending our lives kneeling or bowing in prayer.

For those who hold no belief in God, it would still be about the self-control necessary to choose goodness or the ideal in our actions and choices. Think of it this way. If we worship God in all we do, that means when we get in our vehicles to drive to work, we have the self control to drive well and to be patient and loving towards other drivers.

So...worship, like the rest of God's advice, is not about Him, it is about us.

 

[Blues Man]

That is where etymology and a bit of understanding of the Hebrew language comes in handy. Meekness, humility, worship in the original context is about self-control, that we put God and His ways first in how we live our lives. It had little to do with spending our lives kneeling or bowing in prayer.

For those who hold no belief in God, it would still be about the self-control necessary to choose goodness or the ideal in our actions and choices. Think of it this way. If we worship God in all we do, that means when we get in our vehicles to drive to work, we have the self control to drive well and to be patient and loving towards other drivers.

So...worship, like the rest of God's advice, is not about Him, it is about us.

Plenty of people who don't worship gods live good lives.

 

[Meriweather]

I've read the bible OT and NT more than once

Yet you continue to use one interpretation.

 

[Meriweather]

Plenty of people who don't worship gods live good lives.

Wow! Knock me over with a feather! I must be totally blind to the lives my atheist grandfather, my husband and inlaws, my various atheist friends and co-workers are living. Thank you for opening my eyes, Captain Obvious.

 

[Blues Man]

Yet you continue to use one interpretation.

Just a different one than yours

 

[Blues Man]

Wow! Knock me over with a feather! I must be totally blind to the lives my atheist grandfather, my husband and inlaws, my various atheist friends and co-workers are living. Thank you for opening my eyes, Captain Obvious.

No Bible or gods needed

 

[Meriweather]

Just a different one than yours

And there you are wrong. The interpretation you espouse is one I have--just not the only one. It is the most! The most boring, that is. I compare it to those who thrive in close places, agoraphobics, recluses, etc. who avoid the wide open spaces.

 

[Blues Man]

And there you are wrong. The interpretation you espouse is one I have--just not the only one. It is the most! The most boring, that is. I compare it to those who thrive in close places, agoraphobics, recluses, etc. who avoid the wide open spaces.

Yes you are the most enlightened aren't you the rest of us mere mortals are nothing but cave dwellers.

Check your ego your god doesn't like pride

 

[Meriweather]

No Bible or gods needed

Again, thank you, Captain Obvious. Of course they are not needed! Do you even know an atheist, let alone live in their midst?

 

[Blues Man]

Again, thank you, Captain Obvious. Of course they are not needed! Do you even know an atheist, let alone live in their midst?

You must be the only person who knows an atheist right?

 

[Meriweather]

Yes you are the most enlightened aren't you the rest of us mere mortals are nothing but cave dwellers.

Yeah, "enlightened" like those who win at Trivial Pursuit (a game). Knowledge of the trivia of a single book is not enlightenment.

Those who pursue enlightenment are those who are able transcend beyond self. I am nowhere near that.

 

[BreezeWood]

Wow! Knock me over with a feather! I must be totally blind to the lives my atheist grandfather, my husband and inlaws, my various atheist friends and co-workers are living. Thank you for opening my eyes, Captain Obvious.

speaking of evil - that is not a person ...

not accounting for their crimes, dates back to the events and crucifixion of the 1st century where liberation theology, self determination were nailed to a cross - and those that committed that crime continue their path of desolation for their own personal gratification using religion as their most lethal weapon.