CDZ Serious Question: What do you think it's like for DC politicians....

[Mac1958]

... when they see each other constantly lie and distort and make cartoonish mountains out of molehills for nothing more than political advantage? And knowing that they have to do it too, and do it all the time?

I wonder if, behind the scenes, they joke about it, like pro wrestlers must do in the locker room.

Do you think they ever, when feeling a little guilt or shame over their ridiculous antics, confide in each other some kind of regret for their behavior? That that they hate doing this, but have to? Or do they just maintain this facade the moment they walk out of their house?

What do you think it's like, behind the scenes?
.

 

[JoeB131]

XXXX- Mod Edit -- You are in the CDZ. Don't flame or be confrontational. JoeB131


seriously, this is nothing new. They've been doing this as long as I've been around at least.

You see, complexity of Common Core or Tax reform. That's boring.

Politician diddling an intern? That's easy.

 

[Fueri]

Likely they joke about it. Every job has it's version of "shop talk" this is no different.

And it's likely that some have some feelings of guilt, although I think in the vast majority of cases the justifications ultimately override those to the point that they start believing their own bullshit.

 

[Mac1958]

Likely they joke about it. Every job has it's version of "shop talk" this is no different. And it's likely that some have some feelings of guilt, although I think in the vast majority of cases the justifications ultimately override those to the point that they start believing their own bullshit.

Yeah, I do believe that people can literally talk themselves into dang near anything with enough repetition.
.

 

[Mikeoxenormous]

... when they see each other constantly lie and distort and make cartoonish mountains out of molehills for nothing more than political advantage? And knowing that they have to do it too, and do it all the time?

I wonder if, behind the scenes, they joke about it, like pro wrestlers must do in the locker room.

Do you think they ever, when feeling a little guilt or shame over their ridiculous antics, confide in each other some kind of regret for their behavior? That that they hate doing this, but have to? Or do they just maintain this facade the moment they walk out of their house?

What do you think it's like, behind the scenes?
.

Behind the scenes, these establishment political hacks are laughing their asses off, on how they can dupe about 47% of the voting populace into thinking they really care for them, while padding their bank accounts with millions of dollars that would have any of US put in jail for....

 

[JoeB131]

Behind the scenes, these establishment political hacks are laughing their asses off, on how they can dupe about 47% of the voting populace into thinking they really care for them, while padding their bank accounts with millions of dollars that would have any of US put in jail for....

Here's the biggest problem with politicians.

They give us exactly what we want.

We want Government to do all this stuff for us.
We don't want to pay for it.

And much like a prostitute resents her pimp or a junkie hates his pusher, we deflect blame on them for our own inability to take responsibility.



XXXX -- Mod Edit. FYI -- CDZ is not a safe place. It's a CIVIL space.

 

[Mac1958]

... when they see each other constantly lie and distort and make cartoonish mountains out of molehills for nothing more than political advantage? And knowing that they have to do it too, and do it all the time?

I wonder if, behind the scenes, they joke about it, like pro wrestlers must do in the locker room.

Do you think they ever, when feeling a little guilt or shame over their ridiculous antics, confide in each other some kind of regret for their behavior? That that they hate doing this, but have to? Or do they just maintain this facade the moment they walk out of their house?

What do you think it's like, behind the scenes?
.

Behind the scenes, these establishment political hacks are laughing their asses off, on how they can dupe about 47% of the voting populace into thinking they really care for them, while padding their bank accounts with millions of dollars that would have any of US put in jail for....

I dunno. I would guess that they may talk about this stuff now and then within their party, or with staffers, but it does look like they play this pro wrestling game otherwise.
.

 

[JoeB131]

Likely they joke about it. Every job has it's version of "shop talk" this is no different.

And it's likely that some have some feelings of guilt, although I think in the vast majority of cases the justifications ultimately override those to the point that they start believing their own bullshit.

Let's get real, here.

I think most politicians actually do believe in what they are doing, and 99% of the time, they are doing the things we elected them to do.

If you really want to blame someone, you should probably blame the media, because the boring policy stuff some people claim they want to talk about doesn't get good ratings. Just ask C-SPAN. They'd never be viable without a government subsidy.

This was predicted by the movie Network 40 years ago, what would happen when ratings and advertising became the most important consideration on News. But Howard Beale looks relatively sedate compared to Hannity or Maddow.

 

[usmbguest5318]

... when they see each other constantly lie and distort and make cartoonish mountains out of molehills for nothing more than political advantage? And knowing that they have to do it too, and do it all the time?

I wonder if, behind the scenes, they joke about it, like pro wrestlers must do in the locker room.

Do you think they ever, when feeling a little guilt or shame over their ridiculous antics, confide in each other some kind of regret for their behavior? That that they hate doing this, but have to? Or do they just maintain this facade the moment they walk out of their house?

What do you think it's like, behind the scenes?
.

I wonder if, behind the scenes, they joke about it, like pro wrestlers must do in the locker room.

Based on my encounters with politicians and high level policy makers and influencers [1], some of them actually believe the BS they spew in public and others just don't "go there" when in private settings. I haven't met any who aren't aware of and who do not despise the inane "tightrope" they are forced, by the electorate and the structure of our political/electoral process, to walk.

Some, those who are sincere about campaign and election reform and/or those who are truly of high moral/ethical character, want to revise the process so that are gone the exigencies and imperatives that reward dissemblance and disingenuousness. The thing is that they all realize that the success or failure of any such initiatives depends ultimately on the electorate.

One thing worth noting is that one need not interact with national-level politicians/policy makers and influencers to get a sense of the answer to your question. The same situational influences pervade politics at all levels and the stances individuals have about it -- begrudging indulgence, revelry, indifference, disdain, etc. or some combination thereof -- exist at all levels.


Note:

1. Full Disclosure:
   My encounters of that sort are largely social; I can count on one hand the number of times I've had a "business" purpose for having a deliberate interaction with an elected representative or highly placed appointed official. Accordingly, I can hardly say I have daily or even weekly encounters of that sort, but it happens often enough that I have some sense of it with regard to a handful of such individuals. FWIW, it's nearly always the same individuals, so there's a measure of rapport between us. Namely, they are confident I'm not going to repeat things they say (and certainly not by attributing remarks to them), and I know they aren't to go let me become aware of things they've said or done that would force me to publicly talk about it specifically in connection with them.
   
   Make of that what you want, but know that is the context in which my interactions take place, pretty much with everyone, but certainly with regard to policy makers and influencers. Have I any informal measure of influence? Well that'd be for others to say.

 

[Mac1958]

... when they see each other constantly lie and distort and make cartoonish mountains out of molehills for nothing more than political advantage? And knowing that they have to do it too, and do it all the time?

I wonder if, behind the scenes, they joke about it, like pro wrestlers must do in the locker room.

Do you think they ever, when feeling a little guilt or shame over their ridiculous antics, confide in each other some kind of regret for their behavior? That that they hate doing this, but have to? Or do they just maintain this facade the moment they walk out of their house?

What do you think it's like, behind the scenes?
.

I wonder if, behind the scenes, they joke about it, like pro wrestlers must do in the locker room.

Based on my encounters with politicians and high level policy makers and influencers [1], some of them actually believe the BS they spew in public and others just don't "go there" when in private settings. I haven't met any who aren't aware of and who do not despise the inane "tightrope" they are forced, by the electorate and the structure of our political/electoral process, to walk.

Some, those who are sincere about campaign and election reform and/or those who are truly of high moral/ethical character, want to revise the process so that are gone the exigencies and imperatives that reward dissemblance and disingenuousness. The thing is that they all realize that the success or failure of any such initiatives depends ultimately on the electorate.

One thing worth noting is that one need not interact with national-level politicians/policy makers and influencers to get a sense of the answer to your question. The same situational influences pervade politics at all levels and the stances individuals have about it -- begrudging indulgence, revelry, indifference, disdain, etc. or some combination thereof -- exist at all levels.


Note:

1. Full Disclosure:
   My encounters of that sort are largely social; I can count on one hand the number of times I've had a "business" purpose for having a deliberate interaction with an elected representative or highly placed appointed official. Accordingly, I can hardly say I have daily or even weekly encounters of that sort, but it happens often enough that I have some sense of it with regard to a handful of such individuals. FWIW, it's nearly always the same individuals, so there's a measure of rapport between us. Namely, they are confident I'm not going to repeat things they say (and certainly not by attributing remarks to them), and I know they aren't to go let me become aware of things they've said or done that would force me to publicly talk about it specifically in connection with them.
   
   Make of that what you want, but know that is the context in which my interactions take place, pretty much with everyone, but certainly with regard to policy makers and influencers. Have I any informal measure of influence? Well that'd be for others to say.

The interactions I've had with local- and state-level politicians have been similar: When political behaviors are brought up, they must kind of smile and shake their heads. Obviously I may be reading something into it, but the message I get from that is something like, "yeah, well, we all have to do it, so I'm not gonna criticize it."

But yes, there are clearly many True Believers who have created and exist within a very tight ideological vacuum, so it may very well be that, in their mind, they're being perfectly honest and forthright. Which, of course, is troubling.
.

 

[evenflow1969]

Likely they joke about it. Every job has it's version of "shop talk" this is no different.

And it's likely that some have some feelings of guilt, although I think in the vast majority of cases the justifications ultimately override those to the point that they start believing their own bullshit.

I do not know about today as I no longer have an inside track like back in the old days. In the 1980's and early 1990's we golfed together,ate together, played cards together and even worked together on some common goals. Yes, there was some tong and cheek about the goings on around the hill. Today it is not the same. My father is still an elected official and my mother came home from a dinner with the wives realy upset that some had attacked her during lunch. That shit did not happen back in the day.

 

[Mac1958]

Likely they joke about it. Every job has it's version of "shop talk" this is no different.

And it's likely that some have some feelings of guilt, although I think in the vast majority of cases the justifications ultimately override those to the point that they start believing their own bullshit.

I do not know about today as I no longer have an inside track like back in the old days. In the 1980's and early 1990's we golfed together,ate together, played cards together and even worked together on some common goals. Yes, there was some tong and cheek about the goings on around the hill. Today it is not the same. My father is still an elected official and my mother came home from a dinner with the wives realy upset that some had attacked her during lunch. That shit did not happen back in the day.

One theory I've seen that makes sense is that they all go home on weekends and very rarely interact with each other. Does that sound like it could be an element here?
.

 

[JoeB131]

... when they see each other constantly lie and distort and make cartoonish mountains out of molehills for nothing more than political advantage? And knowing that they have to do it too, and do it all the time?

I wonder if, behind the scenes, they joke about it, like pro wrestlers must do in the locker room.

Do you think they ever, when feeling a little guilt or shame over their ridiculous antics, confide in each other some kind of regret for their behavior? That that they hate doing this, but have to? Or do they just maintain this facade the moment they walk out of their house?

What do you think it's like, behind the scenes?
.

I wonder if, behind the scenes, they joke about it, like pro wrestlers must do in the locker room.

Based on my encounters with politicians and high level policy makers and influencers [1], some of them actually believe the BS they spew in public and others just don't "go there" when in private settings. I haven't met any who aren't aware of and who do not despise the inane "tightrope" they are forced, by the electorate and the structure of our political/electoral process, to walk.

Some, those who are sincere about campaign and election reform and/or those who are truly of high moral/ethical character, want to revise the process so that are gone the exigencies and imperatives that reward dissemblance and disingenuousness. The thing is that they all realize that the success or failure of any such initiatives depends ultimately on the electorate.

One thing worth noting is that one need not interact with national-level politicians/policy makers and influencers to get a sense of the answer to your question. The same situational influences pervade politics at all levels and the stances individuals have about it -- begrudging indulgence, revelry, indifference, disdain, etc. or some combination thereof -- exist at all levels.


Note:

1. Full Disclosure:
   My encounters of that sort are largely social; I can count on one hand the number of times I've had a "business" purpose for having a deliberate interaction with an elected representative or highly placed appointed official. Accordingly, I can hardly say I have daily or even weekly encounters of that sort, but it happens often enough that I have some sense of it with regard to a handful of such individuals. FWIW, it's nearly always the same individuals, so there's a measure of rapport between us. Namely, they are confident I'm not going to repeat things they say (and certainly not by attributing remarks to them), and I know they aren't to go let me become aware of things they've said or done that would force me to publicly talk about it specifically in connection with them.
   
   Make of that what you want, but know that is the context in which my interactions take place, pretty much with everyone, but certainly with regard to policy makers and influencers. Have I any informal measure of influence? Well that'd be for others to say.

Well said, but again, I ask, isn't a large part of the problem is that we eat up this tawdry scandal stuff?

You ask a person about Al Franken or Roy Moore, they can give you the blow by blow of who accused who of touching what.

But you ask them about the details of Tax Reform, and most of them will give you a blank look.

Trump is just the logical end result of this sort of "Reality TV Politics" that has been going on for at least 25 years now.

Heck, there's even a TV show about how politicians contend with scandals.

We are never going to see the Drama "Serious Policy Discussion".

 

[evenflow1969]

Behind the scenes, these establishment political hacks are laughing their asses off, on how they can dupe about 47% of the voting populace into thinking they really care for them, while padding their bank accounts with millions of dollars that would have any of US put in jail for....

Here's the biggest problem with politicians.

They give us exactly what we want.

We want Government to do all this stuff for us.
We don't want to pay for it.

And much like a prostitute resents her pimp or a junkie hates his pusher, we deflect blame on them for our own inability to take responsibility.

Sorry folks, he does that all the time. Creepy.

I thought posting in the CDZ might mitigate that.

Any adults here want to take a whack this?

Actually, I changed my post to be "nicer'.

Who was complaining about "Safe Spaces" again?

You have hit the nail on the head. We want services but do not want to pay for them. Then some politition says here is a way to have the services with out paying for them and the public is told what they want to hear and they vote for them. We should know better and theyt should hav e the balls to tell the truth about it, b ut then they would not win the election. So, ya we have done this to ourselves.

 

[Mikeoxenormous]

... when they see each other constantly lie and distort and make cartoonish mountains out of molehills for nothing more than political advantage? And knowing that they have to do it too, and do it all the time?

I wonder if, behind the scenes, they joke about it, like pro wrestlers must do in the locker room.

Do you think they ever, when feeling a little guilt or shame over their ridiculous antics, confide in each other some kind of regret for their behavior? That that they hate doing this, but have to? Or do they just maintain this facade the moment they walk out of their house?

What do you think it's like, behind the scenes?
.

I wonder if, behind the scenes, they joke about it, like pro wrestlers must do in the locker room.

Based on my encounters with politicians and high level policy makers and influencers [1], some of them actually believe the BS they spew in public and others just don't "go there" when in private settings. I haven't met any who aren't aware of and who do not despise the inane "tightrope" they are forced, by the electorate and the structure of our political/electoral process, to walk.

Some, those who are sincere about campaign and election reform and/or those who are truly of high moral/ethical character, want to revise the process so that are gone the exigencies and imperatives that reward dissemblance and disingenuousness. The thing is that they all realize that the success or failure of any such initiatives depends ultimately on the electorate.

One thing worth noting is that one need not interact with national-level politicians/policy makers and influencers to get a sense of the answer to your question. The same situational influences pervade politics at all levels and the stances individuals have about it -- begrudging indulgence, revelry, indifference, disdain, etc. or some combination thereof -- exist at all levels.


Note:

1. Full Disclosure:
   My encounters of that sort are largely social; I can count on one hand the number of times I've had a "business" purpose for having a deliberate interaction with an elected representative or highly placed appointed official. Accordingly, I can hardly say I have daily or even weekly encounters of that sort, but it happens often enough that I have some sense of it with regard to a handful of such individuals. FWIW, it's nearly always the same individuals, so there's a measure of rapport between us. Namely, they are confident I'm not going to repeat things they say (and certainly not by attributing remarks to them), and I know they aren't to go let me become aware of things they've said or done that would force me to publicly talk about it specifically in connection with them.
   
   Make of that what you want, but know that is the context in which my interactions take place, pretty much with everyone, but certainly with regard to policy makers and influencers. Have I any informal measure of influence? Well that'd be for others to say.

The interactions I've had with local- and state-level politicians have been similar: When political behaviors are brought up, they must kind of smile and shake their heads. Obviously I may be reading something into it, but the message I get from that is something like, "yeah, well, we all have to do it, so I'm not gonna criticize it."

But yes, there are clearly many True Believers who have created and exist within a very tight ideological vacuum, so it may very well be that, in their mind, they're being perfectly honest and forthright. Which, of course, is troubling.
.

I met Donna Edwards once while I lived in Maryland. As she came up and asked for my vote, I asked her if she was going to oppose any raising of taxes upon my household while she was representing us. She said she couldn't, and I told her I was in no way in hell going to vote for her...

 

[Mikeoxenormous]

Behind the scenes, these establishment political hacks are laughing their asses off, on how they can dupe about 47% of the voting populace into thinking they really care for them, while padding their bank accounts with millions of dollars that would have any of US put in jail for....

Here's the biggest problem with politicians.

They give us exactly what we want.

We want Government to do all this stuff for us.
We don't want to pay for it.

And much like a prostitute resents her pimp or a junkie hates his pusher, we deflect blame on them for our own inability to take responsibility.

Sorry folks, he does that all the time. Creepy.

I thought posting in the CDZ might mitigate that.

Any adults here want to take a whack this?

Actually, I changed my post to be "nicer'.

Who was complaining about "Safe Spaces" again?

You have hit the nail on the head. We want services but do not want to pay for them. Then some politition says here is a way to have the services with out paying for them and the public is told what they want to hear and they vote for them. We should know better and theyt should hav e the balls to tell the truth about it, b ut then they would not win the election. So, ya we have done this to ourselves.

I don't want services, as I don't want some political hack telling me what I have to do. If I want roads, then I want a contractor to come out and build me a road that I will gladly pay for. If I want a doctor I will go to him and pay him to keep me well. The problem with establishment political pukes, is that they think THEY are much smarter than me, so they go out of their way, to do things that make my life worse. Then blame someone else when they F#$% it up. 47% of the voting population are too stupid to realize this, which is why the establishment continue to be in office..

 

[usmbguest5318]

... when they see each other constantly lie and distort and make cartoonish mountains out of molehills for nothing more than political advantage? And knowing that they have to do it too, and do it all the time?

I wonder if, behind the scenes, they joke about it, like pro wrestlers must do in the locker room.

Do you think they ever, when feeling a little guilt or shame over their ridiculous antics, confide in each other some kind of regret for their behavior? That that they hate doing this, but have to? Or do they just maintain this facade the moment they walk out of their house?

What do you think it's like, behind the scenes?
.

I wonder if, behind the scenes, they joke about it, like pro wrestlers must do in the locker room.

Based on my encounters with politicians and high level policy makers and influencers [1], some of them actually believe the BS they spew in public and others just don't "go there" when in private settings. I haven't met any who aren't aware of and who do not despise the inane "tightrope" they are forced, by the electorate and the structure of our political/electoral process, to walk.

Some, those who are sincere about campaign and election reform and/or those who are truly of high moral/ethical character, want to revise the process so that are gone the exigencies and imperatives that reward dissemblance and disingenuousness. The thing is that they all realize that the success or failure of any such initiatives depends ultimately on the electorate.

One thing worth noting is that one need not interact with national-level politicians/policy makers and influencers to get a sense of the answer to your question. The same situational influences pervade politics at all levels and the stances individuals have about it -- begrudging indulgence, revelry, indifference, disdain, etc. or some combination thereof -- exist at all levels.


Note:

1. Full Disclosure:
   My encounters of that sort are largely social; I can count on one hand the number of times I've had a "business" purpose for having a deliberate interaction with an elected representative or highly placed appointed official. Accordingly, I can hardly say I have daily or even weekly encounters of that sort, but it happens often enough that I have some sense of it with regard to a handful of such individuals. FWIW, it's nearly always the same individuals, so there's a measure of rapport between us. Namely, they are confident I'm not going to repeat things they say (and certainly not by attributing remarks to them), and I know they aren't to go let me become aware of things they've said or done that would force me to publicly talk about it specifically in connection with them.
   
   Make of that what you want, but know that is the context in which my interactions take place, pretty much with everyone, but certainly with regard to policy makers and influencers. Have I any informal measure of influence? Well that'd be for others to say.

The interactions I've had with local- and state-level politicians have been similar: When political behaviors are brought up, they must kind of smile and shake their heads. Obviously I may be reading something into it, but the message I get from that is something like, "yeah, well, we all have to do it, so I'm not gonna criticize it."

But yes, there are clearly many True Believers who have created and exist within a very tight ideological vacuum, so it may very well be that, in their mind, they're being perfectly honest and forthright. Which, of course, is troubling.
.

I met Donna Edwards once while I lived in Maryland. As she came up and asked for my vote, I asked her if she was going to oppose any raising of taxes upon my household while she was representing us. She said she couldn't, and I told her I was in no way in hell going to vote for her...

I met Donna Edwards once while I lived in Maryland.

That woman is every bit as incompetent as is Trump.

I accompanied an acquaintance to a fundraising event for Edwards. Neither of us opened our checkbooks.

I was just a "plus one" and never was going to make a donation, for I don't live in MD. My lady friend was considering supporting Edwards. She decided then and that she'd have to back a different candidate.

 

[JoeB131]

I don't want services, as I don't want some political hack telling me what I have to do. If I want roads, then I want a contractor to come out and build me a road that I will gladly pay for.

Um, do you realize how much it costs to make a road?

The problem with establishment political pukes, is that they think THEY are much smarter than me, so they go out of their way, to do things that make my life worse.

How? I'm just curious how you think politicians make your life worse.

 

[flacaltenn]

... when they see each other constantly lie and distort and make cartoonish mountains out of molehills for nothing more than political advantage? And knowing that they have to do it too, and do it all the time?

I wonder if, behind the scenes, they joke about it, like pro wrestlers must do in the locker room.

Do you think they ever, when feeling a little guilt or shame over their ridiculous antics, confide in each other some kind of regret for their behavior? That that they hate doing this, but have to? Or do they just maintain this facade the moment they walk out of their house?

What do you think it's like, behind the scenes?
.

What is like behind the scenes? Don't have to speculate. Lemme tell ya a TRUE story.. 1992 Campaign. Bush 41 v Clinton. Mary Matalin is Bush's campaign mgr, James Carville for Clinton. At the time, I was hiding out in the Dem party having just worked the Tom Lantos for Congress campaign. He was "my guy". Thought like me, he was a TRUE Liberal, not a leftist. (I learned not to "love" Congress people from that experience)

Anyways --- I'm reading a Reason Mag article about the match-up and there was speculation that Matalin and Carville were shacking up the campaign trail. News breaks a month or so after the election. The 2 star-crossed Romeo/Juliette bad feuding families victims go public. Announce they are "a thing"..

They get married, buy a spacious country house on a farm, have kids. (Mutants I suspect). And I'm imagining all the laughter and chuckling that went on DURING THE FREAKIN campaign in bed, in the shower, while the nation is struggling with this "serious" decision. I become violently allergic to the 2 party system and declare myself committed to the Libertarian party that year.

Thought pattern was -- these ULTRA partisans don't take the contest seriously -- why should I ?? It's all fun and games and JOB to them... Sorry if you've heard about my moment of conversion before. But there it is. I went rogue BECAUSE it's largely a game to obtain power. And MY politics is about solutions, ideas, problem solving.

 

[longknife]

Once in office, politicians find themselves choosing which club they are going to belong to. Their goals are obviously to obtain a seat on committees that will allow them to send the most "pork" to their constituents.

Once they've joined the club, they soon realize that their future depends upon playing the game and they end up doing whatever it takes to hold on to their perks - and power.

And, if so-and-so can get away with it, so can they.

Oh yeah, and it isn't just males who play the power game for their own satisfaction.