Sen Joe McCarthy: American Patriot and Hero

[CrusaderFrank]

I never said I did not read the book. I said the footnotes do not support many of the contortions of the writer. Rochelle asked for examples. I referred him to the other reviews, and he believed that was not sufficient. Who cares what Mark thinks. He is unimportant other than as a researcher he offered some bogus conclusions. Read all of the reviews, Frank, and read Gadawag above. PC lost this OP on the first page.

Jake, you didn't read the book and you still haven't posted a single footnote.

Please post one of these "reviews" and I will gladly dissent it like it was something that got on the wrong side of Hannibal Lecter

 

[Old Rocks]

American Rhetoric: McCarthy-Welch Exchange During the Army-McCarthy Hearings

Mr. Welch: You've done enough. Have you no sense of decency, sir, at long last? Have you left no sense of decency?

 

[Gadawg73]

Had you bothered to read the book you would know that he made a speech in Wheeling WV in Feb 1950 and said that he was informed there were 57 card carrying Communists At State, none of whom he named because he wanted Congress to open an investigation into the matter and it would not be fair to the accused had he named them.

Only when Tydings began their investigation of McCarthy, and not Communist infiltration of State, did he "Name names" and all the names he named were of State Dept workers in some way shape of fashion working for or with the Communists or in association with people who were.

Stay ignorant, Jake, it's your best feature

"it would not be fair to the accused had he named them"
Come on Frank, you know that is total BS. There were no names on any list. And if there was any evidence then they would have announced it immediately for the PR he always sought.
"57 card carrying communists"
Who issued those cards Frank and did they get a decoder ring also?
Communists were in our government long before McCarthy came along and all he did was ruin many a stealth policy dating back to the teens.
Anyone with any knowledge of espionage and intelligence knows you attempt to TURN the spies first and you do that clandestinely and never hold hearings and news conferences announcing what is going on.
But that does not sell books for the naive and gullible.
No telling how many of our suits in the field were exposed by McCarthy and the fools that followed him. If you could have asked any intelligence agent of any form, shape or fashion from that era if they believe that McCarthy and his ways helped or ruined their work the answer would be in the negative. Intelligence wants NO PR, especially hearings on the Hill.

See, my main complaint about you is that you continue to read from a playbook that is 60 years old and was total fiction when it was written.

"Blacklisted" and other books have completely destroyed, with FBI files and Soviet cables, the entire notion of what we grew up learning about McCarthy.

When McCarthy made his speech in Wheeling in Feb 1950, Truman had already decided to protect Communist at State by not allowing ANY Congressional investigation and the Executive branch stopped rooting out the Comrades.

McCarthy had a list supplied to him by State with names of Card Carrying communists on it. Joe was a lawyer and knew he could not in good conscience release the names on the list that a whistleblower at State had provided him without the benefit of independent investigation.

That was all he was asking for was for Congress to be allowed to investigate the goings-on at State, that were now being protected by the Truman Administration!

That was it!

He asked for Congress to look into possible Communist infiltration at State!

You keep parroting crap back at me without any facts, just lies that you were taught

Frank, my facts come from the agents in the field.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Frank, the manner in which McCarthy made his accusations was completely unAmerican. Many innocent people were hurt (that has been proved). His own party pulled him down (none of you have addressed that). PC and her defenders here have made absolutely no case other than they are political wannabee hacks of the far right. That's fair, but it is also fair to point it out.

Had you bothered to read the book you would know that he made a speech in Wheeling WV in Feb 1950 and said that he was informed there were 57 card carrying Communists At State, none of whom he named because he wanted Congress to open an investigation into the matter and it would not be fair to the accused had he named them.

Only when Tydings began their investigation of McCarthy, and not Communist infiltration of State, did he "Name names" and all the names he named were of State Dept workers in some way shape of fashion working for or with the Communists or in association with people who were.

Stay ignorant, Jake, it's your best feature

"it would not be fair to the accused had he named them"
Come on Frank, you know that is total BS. There were no names on any list. And if there was any evidence then they would have announced it immediately for the PR he always sought.
"57 card carrying communists"
Who issued those cards Frank and did they get a decoder ring also?
Communists were in our government long before McCarthy came along and all he did was ruin many a stealth policy dating back to the teens.
Anyone with any knowledge of espionage and intelligence knows you attempt to TURN the spies first and you do that clandestinely and never hold hearings and news conferences announcing what is going on.
But that does not sell books for the naive and gullible.
No telling how many of our suits in the field were exposed by McCarthy and the fools that followed him. If you could have asked any intelligence agent of any form, shape or fashion from that era if they believe that McCarthy and his ways helped or ruined their work the answer would be in the negative. Intelligence wants NO PR, especially hearings on the Hill.

My God! You got it all wrong! I mean everything!

You ate up the Progressive storyline on McCarthy and never even cracked open any book on it to educate yourself!

What a fool!

What a tool!

I'll repeat it slowly since you missed it the first 60 times i posted it here.

Joe McCarthy made a speech in Wheeling WV in Feb 1950 and in it he said he received a list from US State Department with the name of 57 Card Carrying Communitst who were employed there. President Truman had continued FDR's "Help a Comrade" policy and had FORBADE the Senate from investigating these allegations.

All McCarthy wanted was for the Senate to open an investigation into how is was possible for the State Department to have known Card Carrying Communists working there

Don't even bother replying unless you can demonstrate that you've educated yourself on this.

EVERYTHING you were taught about McCarthy was WRONG

EVERYTHING!

Stop being Jake Starkey for Gods Sake

 

[CrusaderFrank]

American Rhetoric: McCarthy-Welch Exchange During the Army-McCarthy Hearings

Mr. Welch: You've done enough. Have you no sense of decency, sir, at long last? Have you left no sense of decency?

Yawn.

Joe McCarthy: American Patriot and Hero

 

[CrusaderFrank]

"it would not be fair to the accused had he named them"
Come on Frank, you know that is total BS. There were no names on any list. And if there was any evidence then they would have announced it immediately for the PR he always sought.
"57 card carrying communists"
Who issued those cards Frank and did they get a decoder ring also?
Communists were in our government long before McCarthy came along and all he did was ruin many a stealth policy dating back to the teens.
Anyone with any knowledge of espionage and intelligence knows you attempt to TURN the spies first and you do that clandestinely and never hold hearings and news conferences announcing what is going on.
But that does not sell books for the naive and gullible.
No telling how many of our suits in the field were exposed by McCarthy and the fools that followed him. If you could have asked any intelligence agent of any form, shape or fashion from that era if they believe that McCarthy and his ways helped or ruined their work the answer would be in the negative. Intelligence wants NO PR, especially hearings on the Hill.

See, my main complaint about you is that you continue to read from a playbook that is 60 years old and was total fiction when it was written.

"Blacklisted" and other books have completely destroyed, with FBI files and Soviet cables, the entire notion of what we grew up learning about McCarthy.

When McCarthy made his speech in Wheeling in Feb 1950, Truman had already decided to protect Communist at State by not allowing ANY Congressional investigation and the Executive branch stopped rooting out the Comrades.

McCarthy had a list supplied to him by State with names of Card Carrying communists on it. Joe was a lawyer and knew he could not in good conscience release the names on the list that a whistleblower at State had provided him without the benefit of independent investigation.

That was all he was asking for was for Congress to be allowed to investigate the goings-on at State, that were now being protected by the Truman Administration!

That was it!

He asked for Congress to look into possible Communist infiltration at State!

You keep parroting crap back at me without any facts, just lies that you were taught

Frank, my facts come from the agents in the field.

You're full of crap and ignorant to boot

 

[CrusaderFrank]

All of the copies of the newspaper from Wheeling WV from Feb 1950 to April 1950 have been removed from the National Archives along with the "Klaus Memo" which has also disappeared from the National Archives.

 

[Gadawg73]

See, my main complaint about you is that you continue to read from a playbook that is 60 years old and was total fiction when it was written.

"Blacklisted" and other books have completely destroyed, with FBI files and Soviet cables, the entire notion of what we grew up learning about McCarthy.

When McCarthy made his speech in Wheeling in Feb 1950, Truman had already decided to protect Communist at State by not allowing ANY Congressional investigation and the Executive branch stopped rooting out the Comrades.

McCarthy had a list supplied to him by State with names of Card Carrying communists on it. Joe was a lawyer and knew he could not in good conscience release the names on the list that a whistleblower at State had provided him without the benefit of independent investigation.

That was all he was asking for was for Congress to be allowed to investigate the goings-on at State, that were now being protected by the Truman Administration!

That was it!

He asked for Congress to look into possible Communist infiltration at State!

You keep parroting crap back at me without any facts, just lies that you were taught

Frank, my facts come from the agents in the field.

You're full of crap and ignorant to boot

Want to wager 10K Frank? One of my old partners in the early 80s was a former FBI agent from that era.
You read books, I am in the intelligence business for 32 years Frank. I own a fully top tier licensed detective agency for 32 years.
NO intelligence organization wants information spread around in Washington in front of cameras.
That is just common sense Frank. Do we do that now? Have hearings about the intelligence we conduct on TV?
Only a naive gullible book buying ideologue believes that.
That would be you. Here's your sign.

 

[Gadawg73]

All of the copies of the newspaper from Wheeling WV from Feb 1950 to April 1950 have been removed from the National Archives along with the "Klaus Memo" which has also disappeared from the National Archives.

Don't you know Frank?
Elvis stole them.

 

[HUGGY]

All of the copies of the newspaper from Wheeling WV from Feb 1950 to April 1950 have been removed from the National Archives along with the "Klaus Memo" which has also disappeared from the National Archives.

Man O Man I bet that person has racked up some hella late fees!!!!

 

[editec]

Tailgunner Joe was drunken, lying, fear mongering poltical scum.

Pretty simple really.

The fact that he made it so far is an indictment of the cowardess of BOTH parties.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Tailgunner Joe was drunken, lying, fear mongering poltical scum.

Pretty simple really.

The fact that he made it so far is an indictment of the cowardess of BOTH parties.

So, where would he stand relative to the mass-murder supporters that he exposed?

 

[Gadawg73]

Tailgunner Joe was drunken, lying, fear mongering poltical scum.

Pretty simple really.

The fact that he made it so far is an indictment of the cowardess of BOTH parties.

So, where would he stand relative to the mass-murder supporters that he exposed?

Chic bases her entire argument on McCarthy exposed Lenin, Marx, Mao, Stalin, and Mussolini as mass murderers.

Well done Chic. No one anywhere ever knew that any of those ever killed masses.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Tailgunner Joe was drunken, lying, fear mongering poltical scum.

Pretty simple really.

The fact that he made it so far is an indictment of the cowardess of BOTH parties.

So, where would he stand relative to the mass-murder supporters that he exposed?

Chic bases her entire argument on McCarthy exposed Lenin, Marx, Mao, Stalin, and Mussolini as mass murderers.

Well done Chic. No one anywhere ever knew that any of those ever killed masses.

I was wondering whatever because of the poster GirlForBush28 and now I see she's got a new screen name

WB GFB28!

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Frank, my facts come from the agents in the field.

You're full of crap and ignorant to boot

Want to wager 10K Frank? One of my old partners in the early 80s was a former FBI agent from that era.
You read books, I am in the intelligence business for 32 years Frank. I own a fully top tier licensed detective agency for 32 years.
NO intelligence organization wants information spread around in Washington in front of cameras.
That is just common sense Frank. Do we do that now? Have hearings about the intelligence we conduct on TV?
Only a naive gullible book buying ideologue believes that.
That would be you. Here's your sign.

I don't give a fuck about your friends or whatever "Street creds" you're holding out, the fact remains you don't have a single fucking fact correct about what actually happened with McCarthy.

The only part you got right was his name was Joe McCarthy, everything else you've been a patsy of a 65-year long Progressive disinformation campaign.

You still have no idea what McCarthy said or what he hoped to accomplish or why he made his Wheeling Speech or went before the Senate. Your ignorance is disgraceful.

Since Progressives lost their media monopoly, the facts have come out that the people McCarthy wanted the Senate to investigate have been confirmed as genuine Communist Spies by Moscow. You have no response and no answer to that other than parroting the crap and nonsense you were spoon-fed your entire life.

Once again: a patriot at State handed McCarthy a list of Genuine Card Carrying Communist at State and McCarthy made a speech that he had a list but would not mention any names!

Your ignorance is painful.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Tailgunner Joe was drunken, lying, fear mongering poltical scum.

Pretty simple really.

The fact that he made it so far is an indictment of the cowardess of BOTH parties.

So, where would he stand relative to the mass-murder supporters that he exposed?

Chic bases her entire argument on McCarthy exposed Lenin, Marx, Mao, Stalin, and Mussolini as mass murderers.

Well done Chic. No one anywhere ever knew that any of those ever killed masses.

What the fuck are you babbling about?

 

[CrusaderFrank]

All of the copies of the newspaper from Wheeling WV from Feb 1950 to April 1950 have been removed from the National Archives along with the "Klaus Memo" which has also disappeared from the National Archives.

Don't you know Frank?
Elvis stole them.

Why are they missing from the National Archives, GFB28?

Maybe you and your "Spy friends" can look into it?

 

[CrusaderFrank]

"it would not be fair to the accused had he named them"
Come on Frank, you know that is total BS. There were no names on any list. And if there was any evidence then they would have announced it immediately for the PR he always sought.
"57 card carrying communists"
Who issued those cards Frank and did they get a decoder ring also?
Communists were in our government long before McCarthy came along and all he did was ruin many a stealth policy dating back to the teens.
Anyone with any knowledge of espionage and intelligence knows you attempt to TURN the spies first and you do that clandestinely and never hold hearings and news conferences announcing what is going on.
But that does not sell books for the naive and gullible.
No telling how many of our suits in the field were exposed by McCarthy and the fools that followed him. If you could have asked any intelligence agent of any form, shape or fashion from that era if they believe that McCarthy and his ways helped or ruined their work the answer would be in the negative. Intelligence wants NO PR, especially hearings on the Hill.

See, my main complaint about you is that you continue to read from a playbook that is 60 years old and was total fiction when it was written.

"Blacklisted" and other books have completely destroyed, with FBI files and Soviet cables, the entire notion of what we grew up learning about McCarthy.

When McCarthy made his speech in Wheeling in Feb 1950, Truman had already decided to protect Communist at State by not allowing ANY Congressional investigation and the Executive branch stopped rooting out the Comrades.

McCarthy had a list supplied to him by State with names of Card Carrying communists on it. Joe was a lawyer and knew he could not in good conscience release the names on the list that a whistleblower at State had provided him without the benefit of independent investigation.

That was all he was asking for was for Congress to be allowed to investigate the goings-on at State, that were now being protected by the Truman Administration!

That was it!

He asked for Congress to look into possible Communist infiltration at State!

You keep parroting crap back at me without any facts, just lies that you were taught

Frank, my facts come from the agents in the field.

GFB28, ask your "Agents in the field" to see if they can track down who removed the Klaus Memo from the National Archives.

Oh, right, you don't even know what the Klaus memo was.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Here's what's missing

"One of the mysteriously "disappearing" documents was issued in the summer of 1946 by State Department official Samuel Klaus. He fingered Soviet agents and alleged Communist Party members — one of them Alger Hiss — in the Department. He also cited "suspects" and "sympathizers."

Blacklisted by History: The Untold Story of Senator Joe McCarthy and his Fight Against America's Enemies

Maybe some "spy friends" can see who removed it from the National Archives, because we know McCarthy allegation of Communist penetration of US State were like unfounded or dumbfounded or something like that, right GFB28?

 

[Gadawg73]

You're full of crap and ignorant to boot

Want to wager 10K Frank? One of my old partners in the early 80s was a former FBI agent from that era.
You read books, I am in the intelligence business for 32 years Frank. I own a fully top tier licensed detective agency for 32 years.
NO intelligence organization wants information spread around in Washington in front of cameras.
That is just common sense Frank. Do we do that now? Have hearings about the intelligence we conduct on TV?
Only a naive gullible book buying ideologue believes that.
That would be you. Here's your sign.

I don't give a fuck about your friends or whatever "Street creds" you're holding out, the fact remains you don't have a single fucking fact correct about what actually happened with McCarthy.

The only part you got right was his name was Joe McCarthy, everything else you've been a patsy of a 65-year long Progressive disinformation campaign.

You still have no idea what McCarthy said or what he hoped to accomplish or why he made his Wheeling Speech or went before the Senate. Your ignorance is disgraceful.

Since Progressives lost their media monopoly, the facts have come out that the people McCarthy wanted the Senate to investigate have been confirmed as genuine Communist Spies by Moscow. You have no response and no answer to that other than parroting the crap and nonsense you were spoon-fed your entire life.

Once again: a patriot at State handed McCarthy a list of Genuine Card Carrying Communist at State and McCarthy made a speech that he had a list but would not mention any names!

Your ignorance is painful.

American intelligence operations dating back to the early 1940s Frank that relied on communist spies that were gathering intelligence about the Osenberg List were still in operation into the 70s until the fall of the Berlin Wall. Your claims that the United States had no intelligence operations in eastern Europe during WWII involving gathering intelligence on Russia are unbelievable. We were heavily involved with shipping military supplies to Russia as they were an ally and after the Siege of Leningrad in 1943 we damn well knew that Germany was at a large disadvantage with the Ruskies to the east. We also knew that their scientists were being gathered AND MOST IMPORTANTLY the Soviets had operations in place to kidnap as many as possible as early as late 1941. Included in this large scale OSS intelligence operation was the cultivation of Soviet government spies working for us. Operation Paperclip paid a pant load of $$ to Soviet military officers and other Soviet intelligence operatives for double espionage operations to ensure the bulk of German scientists came our way. These initial intelligence operations carried on with many of the same operatives and operational cells until the 1990s with the JIOA.
CIOS continued other efforts concerned about middle eastern countries bidding for the services of German scientists with nuclear smarts created more intelligence operations in that arena. Stay behind operations, HUMINT and Covert Action, was formed in 1945 and was the further continuation of Soviet Bloc, now the Warsaw Pact, infiltration with agents for intelligence behind the Soviet lines.
In 1948 the OPC was formed Frank. Thiswas not CIA controlled. Hell, they did not trust anyone as they were labeled "intragency". These boys ran behind the lines counter intelligence behind the Iron Curtain. During the time that your boy McCarthy was blabbing his mouth the CIA merged the OPC and OSO labeled as The Directorate of Plans. This combined intelligence from the various behind the Iron Curtain intelligence networks we had including networks that were in Washington. You do know that at all times we had intelligence in Washington with Soviet spies in and out of government giving detailed information on the Soviet government and the passing of information both ways.
Frank, are you denying that Joe McCarthy seriously damaged these operations and that the military knew that and that is why McCarthy also accused them of having communists?
What you lack is a thorough background of the facts.
NO intelligence operation ever wants an investigation of what is going on ON NATIONAL TV.