Saudi prince: Maybe the Palestinians should’ve taken the deals they were offered

[Sixties Fan]

Wrong. The Arabs invaded the Land of Israel in the 7th Century.

That makes it now 1400 years.

Living in a place, being born there, does not make one the Indigenous people OVER the actual indigenous people who had been there for 3800 years.....namely the Jewish people, which are acknowledged as being there when, first the Kurdish Muslims invaded, and then the Aran Muslims invaded a bit later.

And it was the Arab Muslims who did, what the Christian Romans or Byzantine would not do.

They allowed the Jews to return to Jerusalem because they knew of the connection and importance of Jerusalem (closed to the Jews since 70 CE by the Romans) to the Jewish People.

Jews are from Judea

Arabs are from Arabia

It has not changed even after 1400 years.

If you've been living there for 3800 years, there's no reason to return. You're already there!

Stripping Palestinians (who have been living there for generations), of their land rights, is pure evil.

What lands rights?

To all of the land of Israel?

Only in your dreams .

The Ottoman Empire was the owner of the lands. They lost WWI, they lost the land. Simple.

People working the land owned by the Ottomans, is not the same as those people actually "owning" the land.

<<If you've been living there for 3800 years, there's no reason to return. You're already there!>>

Sovereignty was returned to the Jewish People for their land.

It was the right think to do, regardless of the fact that they have lost 80 % of it to the Muslims.

 

[Billo_Really]

When was the Hamas Charter replaced?

Replaced for what ?

Do show us where it says they do not intend to destroy Israel anymore and take over that whole land.

I just posted the link. Go read it!

 

[Billo_Really]

I have absolutely no empathy for Hamas and its intention of killing every Jew, and possibly non Jew in Israel.

I and Israel have more than empathy for those who are under Hamas and the PA.

Israel gives healthcare, jobs and education to many Palestinians.

What Military Occupation when so many Palestinians are allowed on a daily basis to enter Israel in order to work, go to school or receive health care?

What country would ever do that for the people when the leaders are very much intent in destroying that very country?

How is lying about the facts making it a better place?

 

[Billo_Really]

How you love to exaggerate.

You are full of hateful ignorance towards the Jewish People.

I would suggest stop feeding your very hungry Catholic Irish self.

That is what Catholicism has been feeding all Christians since Christianity was founded.

Hate those Jews. And you do it to perfection.

Why would I hate Jews?

And give me one country, just one, who recognizes Israel's right to that land.

 

[Billo_Really]

There is not ONE Israeli in Gaza, military or civilian to turn your fabled "Military Occupation" into reality.

By all means, do not ever question why Egypt also has its borders with Gaza closed, only allowing them into Egypt a few times per year, unlike Israel which allows people with health issues to come into Israel.

Why in the world would both Israel AND Egypt close their borders to the people of Gaza.



Israel and Egypt keep Gaza Strip borders shut

Do you know what "effective control" is? If you don't, then you are not qualified to even discuss this issue.

 

[Billo_Really]

What lands rights?

These...

 

[Sixties Fan]

The Israelis of the Settlements will always be under Israeli Law (as directed by the civil administration), until the final negotiated agreement is established.

There's not going to be any negotiation, the settlements are illegal.

You will not see a formal declaration of Martial Law, and the Arab Palestinians are not under anything like Martial Law.

Then what are the over 300 checkpoints and roadblocks in the West Bank for?

Most of the time, when the media reports a clash with the IDF, they are actually misidentifying or confusing the Israeli Border Police with the IDF.

I don't care if it is Mother Theresa, IDF snipers are shooting unarmed Palestinian's and journalists with big media badges on their chest.

That little rabble-rouser Ahed Tamimi is a puppet Palestinian activist being used to induce confrontations between Hostile Arab Palestinians and the Police of the Civil Administration for the media value.

That's a 15 year old girl (who's brother you murdered in cold blood), that you have imprisoned for slapping member of the IDF (who was wearing body armour). You go to hell!

Most Respectfully,
R

When it is not passed into the hands of the occupant, it is still an occupation.

Illegal in your mind only. Since you are not the UN or the interested sides.....your opinion does not count.

Check points are in Judea and Samaria to keep the Palestinians from killing anyone living in Israel, when they come for work, education or health reason into the country.

The journalist you are referring to was a member of Hamas.
Many of the Palestinians are armed with explosives and guns.
You are simply not paying attention to it, or not wanting to know about it.

Why are you accusing Rocco of murdering Ahed's brother?

What would be Ahed's brother's name?

Any other country would have arrested Ahed and given her more time in jail.

In the Middle East, in the Arab countries, attacking law enforcement sometimes you may be shot dead on the spot.

Compare that with spending a few months in jail for the same crime.

 

[Sixties Fan]

There is not ONE Israeli in Gaza, military or civilian to turn your fabled "Military Occupation" into reality.

By all means, do not ever question why Egypt also has its borders with Gaza closed, only allowing them into Egypt a few times per year, unlike Israel which allows people with health issues to come into Israel.

Why in the world would both Israel AND Egypt close their borders to the people of Gaza.



Israel and Egypt keep Gaza Strip borders shut

Do you know what "effective control" is? If you don't, then you are not qualified to even discuss this issue.

Hamas has effective control of Gaza. Just ask Egypt which has the same issues with Gaza that Israel has had since 2007.

 

[Sixties Fan]

What lands rights?

These...

Link to the map, please.

 

[Sixties Fan]

How you love to exaggerate.

You are full of hateful ignorance towards the Jewish People.

I would suggest stop feeding your very hungry Catholic Irish self.

That is what Catholicism has been feeding all Christians since Christianity was founded.

Hate those Jews. And you do it to perfection.

Why would I hate Jews?

And give me one country, just one, who recognizes Israel's right to that land.

The UN is full of countries which recognized Israel's right to its ancestral land.

 

[Sixties Fan]

How you love to exaggerate.

You are full of hateful ignorance towards the Jewish People.

I would suggest stop feeding your very hungry Catholic Irish self.

That is what Catholicism has been feeding all Christians since Christianity was founded.

Hate those Jews. And you do it to perfection.

Why would I hate Jews?

And give me one country, just one, who recognizes Israel's right to that land.

The international recognition of Israelrefers to the diplomatic recognition of the State of Israel, which was established by the Israeli Declaration of Independence on 14 May 1948. Israel's status is disputed due to the Israeli–Palestinian conflict. Out of the 192 other UN member states, 161 currently recognize Israel. Some states recognise Israel as a state, but have no diplomatic relations

(vide full list online)

International recognition of Israel - Wikipedia

 

[jillian]

Saudi prince: Maybe the Palestinians should've taken the deals they were offered
Ed MorrisseyPosted at 12:01 pm on April 30, 2018
Or maybe they should stop sucking up to Iran. That’s the real subtext of the surprising rhetoric coming from Mohammed bin Salman, the young crown prince of Saudi Arabia who’s rewriting the Middle East script after seizing power in a family feud last year. Barak Ravid reports for Axios that MBS, as he’s colloquially known, told representatives of Jewish groups last month that while Saudi Arabia still wants a just and lasting settlement for the Palestinians, they could have gotten that themselves.

Now, MBS says, it’s time to make a deal or “shut up and stop complaining”:


According to my sources, the Saudi Crown Prince told the Jewish leaders:

“In the last several decades the Palestinian leadership has missed one opportunity after the other and rejected all the peace proposals it was given. It is about time the Palestinians take the proposals and agree to come to the negotiations table or shut up and stop complaining.”

MBS also made two other points on the Palestinian issue during the meeting:

1. He made clear the Palestinian issue was not a top priority for the Saudi government or Saudi public opinion. MBS said Saudi Arabia “has much more urgent and important issues to deal with” like confronting Iran’s influence in the region.
2. Regardless of all his criticism of the Palestinian leadership, MBS also made clear that in order for Saudi Arabia and other Gulf states to normalize relations with Israel there will have to be significant progress on the Israeli-Palestinian peace process.

Under MBS’ leadership since taking effective power in June 2017, Saudi Arabia has aligned itself far more with the West. Decrees from the royal palace are now allowing women to drive and to dress in something other than black abayas and niqabs while in public. MBS has opened cinemas in Saudi Arabia for the first time in decades. He’s either cleaning up corruption or purging dissidents and hardliners, but either way MBS is making sure that he directs public policy for Saudi Arabia for the next several decades, and directs it to come closer to the West.

The main intention of all this appears to be an effort to isolate Iran, which has become an existential threat to Sunni power in the region. Our invasion and then abandonment of Iraq didn’t help in that effort, which is why even the previous crown prince took a distinctly cool approach to Barack Obama at the end of his presidency. MBS knows that he’ll have to modernize in order to make Western nations comfortable with any partnership for the region, and that the glut on oil markets means that the Saudis can’t simply use energy as leverage any more.

Unfortunately for the Palestinians, they’ve been playing footsie with Tehran more than Riyadh, and now they’re going to pay for it. Choosing sides has consequences, and with the stakes as high as they are now, the Saudis see the Palestinians as dispensable. They’d rather ally openly with Israel to keep Iran at bay, and the best way to do that is for the Palestinians to take a deal and get on with their lives.

Unfortunately again for the Palestinians, they still can’t decide what they want, or even how to discuss it:

A powerful but rarely convened assembly that calls itself the Palestinian “supreme authority” meets for the first time in 22 years on Monday, but boycotts and rifts suggest it will struggle to achieve its stated goal of unity against Israel and the United States.

President Mahmoud Abbas is expected to use the four-day Palestinian National Council (PNC) meeting to renew his legitimacy and to install loyalists in powerful positions to begin shaping his legacy.

Abbas has billed the meeting of the Palestinian National Council (PNC), the de facto parliament of the Palestinian Liberation Organization, as a chance to establish a united front against Israel and the United States, after President Donald Trump’s recognition of Jerusalem as Israel’s capital.

The hardline Islamists in Hamas and Islamic Jihad, both of which are aligned with Iran, have boycotted the event, ostensibly because its West Bank location puts them at risk of arrest by Israel. But Reuters notes that three factions of the PLO are also boycotting, in part because they believe Abbas hasn’t been open enough to working with IJ or Hamas. The event is seen as an anachronism by other Palestinians, a desperate attempt by Abbas to emphasize his legitimacy as the Palestinian Authority leader while being largely ignored by all sides.

The Saudis have had enough. Perhaps Abbas should take MBS’ advice and cut a deal while he still can.

the Saudi prince is right. they were offered 98% of what they wanted. but that would presume they want peace. they don't.

 

[Billo_Really]

Illegal in your mind only. Since you are not the UN or the interested sides.....your opinion does not count.

I'm quoting the UN. And the Israeli government.

Even Israel says this Jewish settlement is illegal.

Israeli high court rejects government plea, orders West Bank settlement removal

The international community considers all Israeli settlements in the occupied territory of the West Bank and Israeli-annexed east Jerusalem to be illegal ...​

Check points are in Judea and Samaria to keep the Palestinians from killing anyone living in Israel, when they come for work, education or health reason into the country.

The wall is proof of an occupation.

The journalist you are referring to was a member of Hamas.
Many of the Palestinians are armed with explosives and guns.
You are simply not paying attention to it, or not wanting to know about it.

IDF propaganda. You can't even prove it.

Why are you accusing Rocco of murdering Ahed's brother?

It was the figurative you, not the literal one.

What would be Ahed's brother's name?

You're the one who shot him, you tell me. It's the reason why the girl slapped the IDF.

Any other country would have arrested Ahed and given her more time in jail.

Any other fascist country.

In the Middle East, in the Arab countries, attacking law enforcement sometimes you may be shot dead on the spot.

And that sucks!

Compare that with spending a few months in jail for the same crime.

Compare that with a murderer not admitting he committed a crime.

 

[Billo_Really]

Hamas has effective control of Gaza. Just ask Egypt which has the same issues with Gaza that Israel has had since 2007.

Then why can't they leave? Why can't they have weapons? Why are their imports and exports restricted? Why can't they fish and farm without getting shot at?

 

[Billo_Really]

Link to the map, please.

Oh for Christs sake, it's a UN map. I'll get the link when I have a little time.

 

[Billo_Really]

The UN is full of countries which recognized Israel's right to its ancestral land.

I know. But they don't recognize the land Israel took in the '67 war.

 

[Billo_Really]

The international recognition of Israelrefers to the diplomatic recognition of the State of Israel, which was established by the Israeli Declaration of Independence on 14 May 1948. Israel's status is disputed due to the Israeli–Palestinian conflict. Out of the 192 other UN member states, 161 currently recognize Israel. Some states recognise Israel as a state, but have no diplomatic relations

(vide full list online)

International recognition of Israel - Wikipedia

At the time Zionists stood up and declared Israel a state, UN representatives had asked them to delay the announcement. And when they did announce it, they were 10% of the population, declaring ownership over 70% of the land.

 

[Sixties Fan]

Illegal in your mind only. Since you are not the UN or the interested sides.....your opinion does not count.

I'm quoting the UN. And the Israeli government.

Even Israel says this Jewish settlement is illegal.

Israeli high court rejects government plea, orders West Bank settlement removal

The international community considers all Israeli settlements in the occupied territory of the West Bank and Israeli-annexed east Jerusalem to be illegal ...​

Check points are in Judea and Samaria to keep the Palestinians from killing anyone living in Israel, when they come for work, education or health reason into the country.

The wall is proof of an occupation.

The journalist you are referring to was a member of Hamas.
Many of the Palestinians are armed with explosives and guns.
You are simply not paying attention to it, or not wanting to know about it.

IDF propaganda. You can't even prove it.

Why are you accusing Rocco of murdering Ahed's brother?

It was the figurative you, not the literal one.

What would be Ahed's brother's name?

You're the one who shot him, you tell me. It's the reason why the girl slapped the IDF.

Any other country would have arrested Ahed and given her more time in jail.

Any other fascist country.

In the Middle East, in the Arab countries, attacking law enforcement sometimes you may be shot dead on the spot.

And that sucks!

Compare that with spending a few months in jail for the same crime.

Compare that with a murderer not admitting he committed a crime.

It does not matter what the "International Community" has to say. Christian and Muslim haters of Jews have no say in what is legal or illegal when it comes to Israel and the Jewish People.

The Wall cut down 90 % of the suicide attacks against Israelis.
One can see why you and the Arabs do not like it.

Check my posts on the other thread. It is full of photos and videos of proof of what you don't like to deal with.

First you accuse Rocco, with the "figurative You", now me.
Really smart.

You know nothing about the Tamimi Clan.

By all means, equate Israel with Fascist and the Arab Muslim countries.

Your last sentence is illogical.
There is video of her aggression against law enforcement. She did it because she was raised to behave that way. It came the price for her to pay the price for attacking Law enforcement for a change. She had gotten away with similar behavior before. Not anymore.
Do not worry, she will not have learned the lesson. She has the whole Tamimi clan to make sure she, and her sister as well, will continue to be aggressive to IDF soldier anytime there is a camera nearby.

 

[Markle]

The Israeli insurgents (settlers), are not subject to martial law, only the Palestinians are.

I have not seen a formal declaration of martial law. But that is the reality Palestinians are living under.

So you claim Palestinians are living under a declaration of martial law, which does not exist imposed by their elected government, the terrorist group Hamas.

You're a hoot!

 

[Sixties Fan]

The international recognition of Israelrefers to the diplomatic recognition of the State of Israel, which was established by the Israeli Declaration of Independence on 14 May 1948. Israel's status is disputed due to the Israeli–Palestinian conflict. Out of the 192 other UN member states, 161 currently recognize Israel. Some states recognise Israel as a state, but have no diplomatic relations

(vide full list online)

International recognition of Israel - Wikipedia

At the time Zionists stood up and declared Israel a state, UN representatives had asked them to delay the announcement. And when they did announce it, they were 10% of the population, declaring ownership over 70% of the land.

You are full of it.
Israel declared Independence only over the land where they had worked infrastructure since 1920 and where the Jews were a majority.