Sanctuary States: A proposal

[TemplarKormac]

And Doc, passivity in this case is activity. In other words, sitting by and doing nothing to help ICE enforce immigration law is tantamount to willfully impeding the the government from doing its prescribed duty, to protect the citizens.

 

[Billy_Kinetta]

Oh, joy.

Another "Let's kick California out" thread.

We haven't had enough of those.

Well that's a half-assed response.

Regardless, that's the only solution is it? If you are willfully demanding that your law enforcement officials defy the government, what entitles you to be here? There's an old saying that goes something like this:

"There's the door, don't let it hit you on the ass on the way out."

Let the state secede on its own, and take back the land and property that the feds purchased while it was a member of the union.

Funny, when I was 17 and living with my dad, if I didn't obey his rules, he gave me one of two options: either I could leave on my own or be kicked out. Eventually I broke the rules one too many times and he sent me packing. He was well within his right to do so. California is well within its right to leave if it is unwilling to be cooperative with Federal immigration laws.

There are two distinct problems with your "solution".

To start off with, enforcing immigration laws isn't California's job, it's the Federal Government's job. California is under no obligation to assist ICE in doing their job, and isn't under any obligation to follow their orders.

This is a basic tenet of Federalism. State governments deal with state issues, and the Federal government deals with federal issues.

Precisely. The state cannot interfere with federal enforcement of federal law.

Sure. But that's not what's going on.

Not yet, I agree. Trump should flood sanctuary cities with ICE agents to enforce the law to the point of annoyance. Then watch what happens.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

As for our immigration laws in general, they're very, very low on my list of priorities.

Yeah, I figured as much.

I assume they're high on yours?

Why?

 

[TemplarKormac]

Curious... why have a unified system of government, then, when we have parts of that system actively impeding its function?

Because the whole point of Federalism is that different states have different interests.

Then why do we call ourselves a union if we don't strive to act in a unified manner?

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

Oh, joy.

Another "Let's kick California out" thread.

We haven't had enough of those.

You afraid of losing fed bucks?

California is a donor state. You should be worried, not Californians.

Guess again liberal stool sample!

 

[theDoctorisIn]

And Doc, passivity in this case is activity. In other words, sitting by and doing nothing to help ICE enforce immigration law is tantamount to willfully impeding the the government from doing its prescribed duty, to protect the citizens.

No, words don't reverse meanings because you want them to.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

Curious... why have a unified system of government, then, when we have parts of that system actively impeding its function?

Because the whole point of Federalism is that different states have different interests.

Then why do we call ourselves a union if we don't strive to act in a unified manner?

We're a union of states, not a unified government.

I can't even wrap my head around what you're trying to argue. Usually, you guys are all about state's rights.

 

[TemplarKormac]

As for our immigration laws in general, they're very, very low on my list of priorities.

Yeah, I figured as much.

I assume they're high on yours?

Why?

Hmm, because if a law is just it should be allowed to be enforced. For the security and safety of the citizenry. That's the basis of my argument.

 

[TemplarKormac]

And Doc, passivity in this case is activity. In other words, sitting by and doing nothing to help ICE enforce immigration law is tantamount to willfully impeding the the government from doing its prescribed duty, to protect the citizens.

No, words don't reverse meanings because you want them to.

Neither do our immigration laws.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

As for our immigration laws in general, they're very, very low on my list of priorities.

Yeah, I figured as much.

I assume they're high on yours?

Why?

Hmm, because if a law is just it should be allowed to be enforced. For the security and safety of the citizenry. That's the basis of my argument.

There are a lot of laws. Are they all equal?

Why are these laws so important to you?

Have you ever actually encountered an illegal immigrant?

 

[theDoctorisIn]

And Doc, passivity in this case is activity. In other words, sitting by and doing nothing to help ICE enforce immigration law is tantamount to willfully impeding the the government from doing its prescribed duty, to protect the citizens.

No, words don't reverse meanings because you want them to.

Neither do our immigration laws.

I don't believe that I said they did. There's no need to be petulant.

 

[TemplarKormac]

I can't even wrap my head around what you're trying to argue. Usually, you guys are all about state's rights.

I beg your pardon?

"you guys"

??

 

[Coyote]

As for our immigration laws in general, they're very, very low on my list of priorities.

Yeah, I figured as much.

I assume they're high on yours?

Why?

Hmm, because if a law is just it should be allowed to be enforced. For the security and safety of the citizenry. That's the basis of my argument.

Who determines if a law is "just"?

 

[theDoctorisIn]

I can't even wrap my head around what you're trying to argue. Usually, you guys are all about state's rights.

I beg your pardon?

"you guys"

??

Those right-of-center.

 

[TemplarKormac]

And Doc, passivity in this case is activity. In other words, sitting by and doing nothing to help ICE enforce immigration law is tantamount to willfully impeding the the government from doing its prescribed duty, to protect the citizens.

No, words don't reverse meanings because you want them to.

Neither do our immigration laws.

I don't believe that I said they did. There's no need to be petulant.

I'm not being petulant. I am simply going off of what I'm hearing (reading). Why pass laws that won't be enforced by states and municipalities?

Whether it be healthcare or immigration, if it's the law and it is a constitutional law, then you should obey that law. I am saying that while putting my personal feelings aside.

 

[Coyote]

And Doc, passivity in this case is activity. In other words, sitting by and doing nothing to help ICE enforce immigration law is tantamount to willfully impeding the the government from doing its prescribed duty, to protect the citizens.

No, words don't reverse meanings because you want them to.

Neither do our immigration laws.

I don't believe that I said they did. There's no need to be petulant.

I'm not being petulant. I am simply going off of what I'm hearing (reading). Why pass laws that won't be enforced by states and municipalities?

Whether it be healthcare or immigration, if its the law and it is a constitutional law, then you should obey that law. I am saying that while putting my personal feelings aside.

We've always had that tension between states rights and federal government....

 

[TemplarKormac]

As for our immigration laws in general, they're very, very low on my list of priorities.

Yeah, I figured as much.

I assume they're high on yours?

Why?

Hmm, because if a law is just it should be allowed to be enforced. For the security and safety of the citizenry. That's the basis of my argument.

Who determines if a law is "just"?

Who? The Supreme Court.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

And Doc, passivity in this case is activity. In other words, sitting by and doing nothing to help ICE enforce immigration law is tantamount to willfully impeding the the government from doing its prescribed duty, to protect the citizens.

No, words don't reverse meanings because you want them to.

Neither do our immigration laws.

I don't believe that I said they did. There's no need to be petulant.

I'm not being petulant. I am simply going off of what I'm hearing (reading). Why pass laws that won't be enforced by states and municipalities?

Whether it be healthcare or immigration, if its the law and it is a constitutional law, then you should obey that law. I am saying that while putting my personal feelings aside.

Do you remember all the outcry, a while ago, when Sheriff Joe got into all that trouble by trying to enforce immigration law?

It's not the job of states and municipalities to enforce federal immigration law - just like it's not the federal government's job to enforce the State of Virginia's laws against strip clubs.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

As for our immigration laws in general, they're very, very low on my list of priorities.

Yeah, I figured as much.

I assume they're high on yours?

Why?

Hmm, because if a law is just it should be allowed to be enforced. For the security and safety of the citizenry. That's the basis of my argument.

Who determines if a law is "just"?

Who? The Supreme Court.

No. The Supreme Court determines whether a law is Constitutional, not "just".

 

[TemplarKormac]

I can't even wrap my head around what you're trying to argue. Usually, you guys are all about state's rights.

I beg your pardon?

"you guys"

??

Those right-of-center.

I see.