Russia issues list of demands it says must be met to lower tensions in Europe

[Viktor]

More likely they'll all be landing here.

Uncle Jojo will find a way to screw the USA and fuck up.

 

[Siberian]

Are you saying the US has unified taxes? It does not. Each state chooses their tax rates.

Companies move to different states all the time because they get good deals from the local government.

The US is doomed to disintegrate, and has been doomed since 1776. According to you.

taxes is the least problem, in Russia local taxes also differ, but in the US it is not a problem due to :

1) federal taxes are still redistributed evey, level of life and social benefits are more or less equial, not 1/4 or 1/6 like in Bulgaria/Germany case...

2) US budget is filled now more with money emission than taxes

The US will disibtegrate due tl other reasons.

While EU model is flawed because it aims giving permanent benefits to developed Northern Europe with temporary compensation to Southern and Eastern Europe.
It could work if compensation was permanent, but it is not, and ability of subsidising deficites is coming to an end along with QE and growing inflation.

 

[ESay]

There can be two different interpretations:
1) There will be no nuclear war because nobody will provocate a nuclear state;
2) The nuclear war is unthinkable, therefore other states (nuclear and non-nuclear) may be however provocative.

I will post here some video that can help you understand this. And why Russia is desperately trying to normalize relations with the West. But try to think about it, before posting your answer.

 

[Siberian]

I will post here some video that can help you understand this. And why Russia is desperately trying to normalize relations with the West. But try to think about it, before posting your answer.

Esay, do you still have electricity in your home?
I heard that electricity cuts have started in Ukraine...

 

[frigidweirdo]

taxes is the least problem, in Russia local taxes also differ, but in the US it is not a problem due to :

1) federal taxes are still redistributed evey, level of life and social benefits are more or less equial, not 1/4 or 1/6 like in Bulgaria/Germany case...

2) US budget is filled now more with money emission than taxes

The US will disibtegrate due tl other reasons.

While EU model is flawed because it aims giving permanent benefits to developed Northern Europe with temporary compensation to Southern and Eastern Europe.
It could work if compensation was permanent, but it is not, and ability of subsidising deficites is coming to an end along with QE and growing inflation.

Well, the problem with your argument is that it hasn't failed yet, and it doesn't seem to be failing, and it might just work.

Just remember this: Russia was waiting for the Ottoman Empire to fail for hundred of years. And then Russia failed before the Ottoman Empire collapsed....

 

[Siberian]

Well, the problem with your argument is that it hasn't failed yet, and it doesn't seem to be failing, and it might just work.

Just remember this: Russia was waiting for the Ottoman Empire to fail for hundred of years. And then Russia failed before the Ottoman Empire collapsed....

Russia did not wait for the Ottoman Empire to collapse, when it was nesessary Russia fought wars with it to achieve nesessary results and not without success ...
I mean - now too Russian policy is not based on some expectation that the EU will collapse. And I justs state my vision on existing trends, they exist regardless of my wish or any Russian policy. But if natural course of History brings some extra benefits to Russia - should I ignore it in our discussion?

As for timing - empires usually collapse during severe economic crisises.
Don't you agree that human kind is now facing the biggest economic crisis of the whole History - collapse of the American empire and US-centered globalization?
So, many empires and countries will disintegrate..

 

[Ringo]

Or looks like Putin knows he got away with stealing the Crimea

No stealing here, or then we will have to reconsider all borders in the world, including the USA

 

[Ringo]

Wall Street Journal: "The West must take a tough stance in negotiations with Moscow, even if it causes a war in Ukraine with thousands of victims, because in the long run the war will weaken Russia"

Did you hear, bandera scum? Your owners-bankers ordered to die.

There are 3 mechanisms suggested for weakening the Russian Federation in the event of a conflict:
- consolidation of Euro-Atlantists on the anti-Russian wave
- "nuclear sanctions" against the Russian Federation
- guerrilla warfare

The latter is naive. There will be no occupation. Teeth will be knocked out, then an ultimatum

 

[frigidweirdo]

Russia did not wait for the Ottoman Empire to collapse, when it was nesessary Russia fought wars with it to achieve nesessary results and not without success ...
I mean - now too Russian policy is not based on some expectation that the EU will collapse. And I justs state my vision on existing trends, they exist regardless of my wish or any Russian policy. But if natural course of History brings some extra benefits to Russia - should I ignore it in our discussion?

As for timing - empires usually collapse during severe economic crisises.
Don't you agree that human kind is now facing the biggest economic crisis of the whole History - collapse of the American empire and US-centered globalization?
So, many empires and countries will disintegrate..

Well, the world is seeing a crisis and yet people aren't that badly off.

We have bigger problems coming up later.

 

[frigidweirdo]

No stealing here, or then we will have to reconsider all borders in the world, including the USA

Of course it's stealing. The way he did it. It wasn't like anyone gifted it to him.

 

[Ringo]

Of course it's stealing. The way he did it. It wasn't like anyone gifted it to him.

People in Crimea voted for it (and this is not an object for discussion), people in Kosovo did not. Return Kosovo to the Serbs.

 

[frigidweirdo]

People in Crimea voted for it (and this is not an object for discussion), people in Kosovo did not. Return Kosovo to the Serbs.

Yes, they voted for it AFTER the Russians had already taken it. That's not how things are done in a CIVILIZED world. Also we don't know who wasn't allowed to vote, who had already escaped, who had already been killed.

Why would the Kosovans need a vote? I was there one year before independence, I marched with these people, there were a lot of people in the streets of Pristina. The Serbs tried to kill these people, they put in totalitarian policies like the 50/50 Serb to Kosovan work force requirement, or education in Serbian language etc etc.

When the UN was in Pristina they didn't have a problem with 90% of the population wanting to be a part of Serbia, they had a problem with the Kosovans wanting to burn the Serbs houses down. And who wouldn't when they'd been threatened with ethnic cleaning and genocide?

 

[Ringo]

Yes, they voted for it AFTER the Russians had already taken it.

Well, why does any person in the West, even if he looks smart, instantly turns into an idiot when it comes to Russia? It's probably Russia's fault... Russian troops have ALWAYS been in Crimea, since the 1770s of the 18th century and up to the present day. Didn't you know that? . Even when the Germans occupied Crimea for two years, there were Russian partisan detachments there.
And I don't even want to talk about Serbia and its barbaric bombing. It was a crime and whole Goebbels ministries worked and are working to justify this crime.

 

[Ringo]

By the way, if the invasion is not military, but peaceful, for democracy (well, as the United States and NATO usually invade)I imagine how NATO will get confused!

"in case Russia attacks Ukraine," the United States will provide Kiev with additional barrels of chemicals and dumb reporters, who will sniff these barrels live and assure, that the smell is similar to russian-made sarin, more similar than ever

 

[Silver Cat]

I will post here some video that can help you understand this. And why Russia is desperately trying to normalize relations with the West. But try to think about it, before posting your answer.

I'm not sure that I understand it correctly, but it sounds like a schizophrenic mix of mutually incompatible political slogans copypasted from different Western political concepts.
There are both nationalistic and internationalistic, right and left ideas, simultaneous accusations of Putin both in fighting against West and cooperation with it. Russian society is simultaneously depicted as xenophobic and bloodlusting and totally pacifistic and demanding peace at any cost...
Obviously, authors of such nonsense don't understand what is their target group (and, may be, don't have a slightest idea about necessity of the targeting in political marketing).
No wonder, that their support in the Russian society is virtually zero.


But it's not the issue.
There are only two questions:
1) Is it possible, that somebody can be stupid enough to provoke a nuclear country even after a clear warning? I think - yes, human stupidity and wishful thinking have no limits. If you don't have a hammer - you don't understand when you looks like a nail.
2) Is possible, that a nuclear state, being extremely provoked, can choose to use nuclear weapon? I think - yes, human stupidity and wishful thinking have no limits. If all you have is a hammer everythong looks like a nail.

 

[ESay]

Esay, do you still have electricity in your home?
I heard that electricity cuts have started in Ukraine...

Yes, I do. Haven't heard about that, at least as mass occurrence.

 

[ESay]

I'm not sure that I understand it correctly, but it sounds like a schizophrenic mix of mutually incompatible political slogans copypasted from different Western political concepts.
There are both nationalistic and internationalistic, right and left ideas, simultaneous accusations of Putin both in fighting against West and cooperation with it. Russian society is simultaneously depicted as xenophobic and bloodlusting and totally pacifistic and demanding peace at any cost...
Obviously, authors of such nonsense don't understand what is their target group (and, may be, don't have a slightest idea about necessity of the targeting in political marketing).
No wonder, that their support in the Russian society is virtually zero.


But it's not the issue.
There are only two questions:
1) Is it possible, that somebody can be stupid enough to provoke a nuclear country even after a clear warning? I think - yes, human stupidity scraowand wishful thinking have no limits. If you don't have a hammer - you don't understand when you looks like a nail.
2) Is possible, that a nuclear state, being extremely provoked, can choose to use nuclear weapon? I think - yes, human stupidity and wishful thinking have no limits. If all you have is a hammer everythong looks like a nail.

My point was that scrape any Russian official who has hold any more or less significant post, and you will find some property abroad, or a bank account there, or their children living or studying there. And saying 'abroad' I don't mean Russian allies such as Venezuela or Belarus or even Serbia.

And don't try to persuade me that these people are going to give everything up for some political ideas or something like that.

 

[Silver Cat]

My point was that scrape any Russian official who has hold any more or less significant post, and you will find some property abroad, or a bank account there, or their children living or studying there. And saying 'abroad' I don't mean Russian allies such as Venezuela or Belarus or even Serbia.

And don't try to persuade me that these people are going to give everything up for some political ideas or something like that.

You see, all those palaces, bank accounts, cars, other property it's the dust and sand. It's just external signs of the wealth, not wealth itself, and, obviously, not the source of the wealth. The power and the place in the hierarchy is the source of any wealth (both in Russia and in the USA).

And everyone who is in power clearly understands, that nothing ventured - nothing gained.
All of them can risk with everything they have (including their own lives and millions of other lives) to gain more power, more money, more property.

And how said the greatest Russian poet Alexander Pushkin:

Napoleon's our sole inspiration;
the millions of two-legged creation
for us are instruments and tools;
feeling is quaint, and fit for fools.

 

[ESay]

You see, all those palaces, bank accounts, cars, other property it's the dust and sand. It's just external signs of the wealth, not wealth itself, and, obviously, not the source of the wealth. The power and the place in the hierarchy is the source of any wealth (both in Russia and in the USA).

And everyone who is in power clearly understands, that nothing ventured - nothing gained.
All of them can risk with everything they have (including their own lives and millions of other lives) to gain more power, more money, more property.

And how said the greatest Russian poet Alexander Pushkin:

Napoleon's our sole inspiration;
the millions of two-legged creation
for us are instruments and tools;
feeling is quaint, and fit for fools.

It is not just the sand and dust. It is the things these people live for. They are too used to luxury lifestyle and aren't going to change it for living in wasteland. No one is going to attack Russia, so their source for sweet life will remain untouched.

It is as clear as the day. And I can't imagine you guys don't get that. Whatever the reason is for your posting this nonsense.

 

[ESay]

Usually, I don't read interviews with diplomats, because they consist of many words and little meaning. The art to talk much but to say little, kinda.

But today I read an interview of the US ambassador in Russia John Sullivan. That was an interesting one. In short, the US are ready to negotiations with Russia and are ready to start it as soon as possible. No deadlines and no decisions behind the backs of NATO's members. And yes, of course, a two way road.

The interview was given to a Russian outlet Kommersant, so it was published in Russian.

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Посол США в Москве Джон Салливан о требовании Россией гарантий безопасности

www.kommersant.ru

I think the theme can be closed for now. Nothing interesting will happen in the course of at least several months.