Russia Isn't Our Friend, but That Doesn't Make the Democrats' Conspiracy Theories True

[AnCap'n_Murica]

"Here are two positions an intellectually honest person can hold simultaneously:


First, Russian President Vladimir Putin is an authoritarian who, though no Josef Stalin, subverts human rights and is generally antagonistic to the idealistic aims of the United States. When Republicans cozy up to this sort of person, as President-elect Donald Trump has done, they undermine the stated beliefs and values of conservatism.


Second, though there's little doubt he wishes he could, Putin did not hack the American election. In fact, there's no evidence whatsoever that the Russians had anything to do with Trump's victory."

Russia Isn't Our Friend, but That Doesn't Make the Democrats' Conspiracy Theories True

 

[Mac1958]

I'm not aware of anyone claiming that they hacked the election.

What they may have done was hack emails from one party and release them right before an election.
.

 

[toomuchtime_]

"Here are two positions an intellectually honest person can hold simultaneously:


First, Russian President Vladimir Putin is an authoritarian who, though no Josef Stalin, subverts human rights and is generally antagonistic to the idealistic aims of the United States. When Republicans cozy up to this sort of person, as President-elect Donald Trump has done, they undermine the stated beliefs and values of conservatism.


Second, though there's little doubt he wishes he could, Putin did not hack the American election. In fact, there's no evidence whatsoever that the Russians had anything to do with Trump's victory."

Russia Isn't Our Friend, but That Doesn't Make the Democrats' Conspiracy Theories True

Whether we see Russia as a friend, an enemy or neither, it is a fact that there is no way to end the fighting in Syria or eastern Europe without reaching a mutually beneficial agreement with Russia, and seeking another Cold War with Russia, as Obama has done and is continuing to do will do no good for anyone.

 

[WaitingFor2020]

I read this on Talking Points Memo last night. VERY interesting observation/opinion. Occam's Razor right down the line.

"""Here are some facts : Decide for yourselves

1) Trump owes Blackstone/ Bayrock group $560 million dollars (one of his largest debtors and the primary reason he won't reveal his tax returns)

2) Blackstone is owned wholly by Russian billionaires, who owe their position to Putin and have made billions from their work with the Russian government.

3) Other companies that have borrowed from Blackstone have claimed that owing money to them is like owing to the Russian mob and while you owe them, they own you for many favors.

4) The Russian economy is badly faltering under the weight of its over-dependence on raw materials which as you know have plummeted in the last 2 years leaving the Russian economy scrambling to pay its debts.

5) Russia has an impetus to influence our election to ensure the per barrel oil prices are above $65 ( they are currently hovering around $50)

6) Russia can't affordably get at 80% of its oil reserves and reduce its per barrel cost to compete with America at $45 or Saudi Arabia at $39. With Iranian sanctions being lifted Russia will find another inexpensive competitor increasing production and pushing Russia further down the list of suppliers. As for Iranian sanctions, the 6 countries lifting them allowing Iran to collect on the billions it is owed for pumping oil but not being paid for it. These billions Iran can only get if the Iranian nuclear deal is signed. Trump spoke of ending the deals which would cause oil sales sanctions to be reimposed, which would make Russian oil more competitive.

7) Rex Tillerson (Trump's pick for Secretary of State) is the head of ExxonMobil, which is in possession of patented technology that could help Putin extract 45% more oil at a significant cost savings to Russia, helping Putin put money in the Russian coffers to help reconstitute its military and finally afford to mass produce the new and improved systems that it had invented before the Russian economy had slowed so much.

8) Putin cannot get access to these new cost saving technologies OR outside oil field development money, due to US sanctions on Russia, because of its involvement in Ukrainian civil war.

9) Look for Trump to end sanctions on Russia and to back out of the Iranian nuclear deal, to help Russia rebuild its economy, strengthen Putin and make Tillerson and Trump even richer, thus allowing Trump to satisfy his creditors at Blackstone.

10) With Trump's fabricated hatred of NATO and the U.N., the Russian military reconstituted, the threat to the Baltic states is real. Russia retaking their access to the Baltic Sea from Lithuania, Latvia and Estonia and threatening the shipping of millions of cubic feet of natural gas to lower Europe from Scandinavia, allowing Russia to make a good case for its oil and gas being piped into eastern Europe.

Sources: Time Magazine, NY Times, The Atlantic, The Guardian UK"""

 

[AnCap'n_Murica]

I read this on Talking Points Memo last night. VERY interesting observation/opinion. Occam's Razor right down the line.

"""Here are some facts : Decide for yourselves

1) Trump owes Blackstone/ Bayrock group $560 million dollars (one of his largest debtors and the primary reason he won't reveal his tax returns)

2) Blackstone is owned wholly by Russian billionaires, who owe their position to Putin and have made billions from their work with the Russian government.

3) Other companies that have borrowed from Blackstone have claimed that owing money to them is like owing to the Russian mob and while you owe them, they own you for many favors.

4) The Russian economy is badly faltering under the weight of its over-dependence on raw materials which as you know have plummeted in the last 2 years leaving the Russian economy scrambling to pay its debts.

5) Russia has an impetus to influence our election to ensure the per barrel oil prices are above $65 ( they are currently hovering around $50)

6) Russia can't affordably get at 80% of its oil reserves and reduce its per barrel cost to compete with America at $45 or Saudi Arabia at $39. With Iranian sanctions being lifted Russia will find another inexpensive competitor increasing production and pushing Russia further down the list of suppliers. As for Iranian sanctions, the 6 countries lifting them allowing Iran to collect on the billions it is owed for pumping oil but not being paid for it. These billions Iran can only get if the Iranian nuclear deal is signed. Trump spoke of ending the deals which would cause oil sales sanctions to be reimposed, which would make Russian oil more competitive.

7) Rex Tillerson (Trump's pick for Secretary of State) is the head of ExxonMobil, which is in possession of patented technology that could help Putin extract 45% more oil at a significant cost savings to Russia, helping Putin put money in the Russian coffers to help reconstitute its military and finally afford to mass produce the new and improved systems that it had invented before the Russian economy had slowed so much.

8) Putin cannot get access to these new cost saving technologies OR outside oil field development money, due to US sanctions on Russia, because of its involvement in Ukrainian civil war.

9) Look for Trump to end sanctions on Russia and to back out of the Iranian nuclear deal, to help Russia rebuild its economy, strengthen Putin and make Tillerson and Trump even richer, thus allowing Trump to satisfy his creditors at Blackstone.

10) With Trump's fabricated hatred of NATO and the U.N., the Russian military reconstituted, the threat to the Baltic states is real. Russia retaking their access to the Baltic Sea from Lithuania, Latvia and Estonia and threatening the shipping of millions of cubic feet of natural gas to lower Europe from Scandinavia, allowing Russia to make a good case for its oil and gas being piped into eastern Europe.

Sources: Time Magazine, NY Times, The Atlantic, The Guardian UK"""

Occam's razor talks about the most simple explanation, not a ten-point six degrees of separation conspiracy theory.

 

[AnCap'n_Murica]

I'm not aware of anyone claiming that they hacked the election.

What they may have done was hack emails from one party and release them right before an election.
.

The entire democrat bedwetting festival is based upon the tin hat conspiracy hypothesis that the election itself was tipped by the Russian hack.

 

[Toro]

"Here are two positions an intellectually honest person can hold simultaneously:


First, Russian President Vladimir Putin is an authoritarian who, though no Josef Stalin, subverts human rights and is generally antagonistic to the idealistic aims of the United States. When Republicans cozy up to this sort of person, as President-elect Donald Trump has done, they undermine the stated beliefs and values of conservatism.


Second, though there's little doubt he wishes he could, Putin did not hack the American election. In fact, there's no evidence whatsoever that the Russians had anything to do with Trump's victory."

Russia Isn't Our Friend, but That Doesn't Make the Democrats' Conspiracy Theories True

Or

It's pretty clear that Russia hacked the DNC to influence the election.

But that doesn't mean Trump won because of it.

Trump and his worshipers do more damage to Trump by attacking the credibility of American intelligence agencies than anything else.

Their behavior is bizarre.

 

[Toro]

I'm not aware of anyone claiming that they hacked the election.

What they may have done was hack emails from one party and release them right before an election.
.

The entire democrat bedwetting festival is based upon the tin hat conspiracy hypothesis that the election itself was tipped by the Russian hack.

Clinton lost because she was a bad candidate, and there is no evidence one way or the other that Russia tipped the election.

As far as I'm concerned, Trump won fair and square. Had Clinton not had a separate server and if the Clinton Foundation didn't exist, she'd probably be President today.

But that doesn't mean the Russians didn't hack the election in an attempt to influence the election.

And "influencing the election" doesn't necessarily mean "helping Trump win."

 

[AnCap'n_Murica]

Or

It's pretty clear that Russia hacked the DNC to influence the election.

But that doesn't mean Trump won because of it.

Trump and his worshipers do more damage to Trump by attacking the credibility of American intelligence agencies than anything else.

Their behavior is bizarre.

Clear to whom?

Intelligence agencies all over the world try to hack into anything they can. How do you know that the hack wasn't to gather intel on Hillary, so they could potentially blackmail her at a later date?

 

[AnCap'n_Murica]

Clinton lost because she was a bad candidate, and there is no evidence one way or the other that Russia tipped the election.

As far as I'm concerned, Trump won fair and square. Had Clinton not had a separate server and the Clinton Foundation, she'd probably be President today.

But that doesn't mean the Russians didn't hack the election in an attempt to influence the election.

And "influencing the election" doesn't necessarily mean "helping Trump win."

That's fine. I happen to agree, after a fashion.

But you're not one of the chorus of bedwetters to whom I was referring.

 

[Mac1958]

I'm not aware of anyone claiming that they hacked the election. What they may have done was hack emails from one party and release them right before an election.
.

The entire democrat bedwetting festival is based upon the tin hat conspiracy hypothesis that the election itself was tipped by the Russian hack.

Some are saying that, some are not. For example, I know that candycorn is not saying it, she just feels Hillary was a lousy candidate.

Personally, I'm far more concerned with the behavior of the Republicans who are treating the potential of adversarial influence in our elections, no matter how small, with the same seriousness as they might a SpongeBob™ episode, probably because they won and that's enough for them.
.

 

[gipper]

"Here are two positions an intellectually honest person can hold simultaneously:


First, Russian President Vladimir Putin is an authoritarian who, though no Josef Stalin, subverts human rights and is generally antagonistic to the idealistic aims of the United States. When Republicans cozy up to this sort of person, as President-elect Donald Trump has done, they undermine the stated beliefs and values of conservatism.


Second, though there's little doubt he wishes he could, Putin did not hack the American election. In fact, there's no evidence whatsoever that the Russians had anything to do with Trump's victory."

Russia Isn't Our Friend, but That Doesn't Make the Democrats' Conspiracy Theories True

Funny how the Left rightfully denigrated dipshit W for his multiple wars, but seem to want war with Russia today.

 

[toomuchtime_]

"Here are two positions an intellectually honest person can hold simultaneously:


First, Russian President Vladimir Putin is an authoritarian who, though no Josef Stalin, subverts human rights and is generally antagonistic to the idealistic aims of the United States. When Republicans cozy up to this sort of person, as President-elect Donald Trump has done, they undermine the stated beliefs and values of conservatism.


Second, though there's little doubt he wishes he could, Putin did not hack the American election. In fact, there's no evidence whatsoever that the Russians had anything to do with Trump's victory."

Russia Isn't Our Friend, but That Doesn't Make the Democrats' Conspiracy Theories True

Or

It's pretty clear that Russia hacked the DNC to influence the election.

But that doesn't mean Trump won because of it.

Trump and his worshipers do more damage to Trump by attacking the credibility of American intelligence agencies than anything else.

Their behavior is bizarre.

Since it is impossible to demonstrate that any of the Wikileaks emails did any damage to the Clinton campaign, unless you believe the Russians are just stupid, it makes no sense to think they tried to influence the election with these emails.

 

[TomParks]

Yeah we saw how calling out the CIA worked for JFK....was it Oswald and/or Alek Hidell?

 

[Toro]

I read this on Talking Points Memo last night. VERY interesting observation/opinion. Occam's Razor right down the line.

"""Here are some facts : Decide for yourselves

1) Trump owes Blackstone/ Bayrock group $560 million dollars (one of his largest debtors and the primary reason he won't reveal his tax returns)

2) Blackstone is owned wholly by Russian billionaires, who owe their position to Putin and have made billions from their work with the Russian government.

3) Other companies that have borrowed from Blackstone have claimed that owing money to them is like owing to the Russian mob and while you owe them, they own you for many favors.

4) The Russian economy is badly faltering under the weight of its over-dependence on raw materials which as you know have plummeted in the last 2 years leaving the Russian economy scrambling to pay its debts.

5) Russia has an impetus to influence our election to ensure the per barrel oil prices are above $65 ( they are currently hovering around $50)

6) Russia can't affordably get at 80% of its oil reserves and reduce its per barrel cost to compete with America at $45 or Saudi Arabia at $39. With Iranian sanctions being lifted Russia will find another inexpensive competitor increasing production and pushing Russia further down the list of suppliers. As for Iranian sanctions, the 6 countries lifting them allowing Iran to collect on the billions it is owed for pumping oil but not being paid for it. These billions Iran can only get if the Iranian nuclear deal is signed. Trump spoke of ending the deals which would cause oil sales sanctions to be reimposed, which would make Russian oil more competitive.

7) Rex Tillerson (Trump's pick for Secretary of State) is the head of ExxonMobil, which is in possession of patented technology that could help Putin extract 45% more oil at a significant cost savings to Russia, helping Putin put money in the Russian coffers to help reconstitute its military and finally afford to mass produce the new and improved systems that it had invented before the Russian economy had slowed so much.

8) Putin cannot get access to these new cost saving technologies OR outside oil field development money, due to US sanctions on Russia, because of its involvement in Ukrainian civil war.

9) Look for Trump to end sanctions on Russia and to back out of the Iranian nuclear deal, to help Russia rebuild its economy, strengthen Putin and make Tillerson and Trump even richer, thus allowing Trump to satisfy his creditors at Blackstone.

10) With Trump's fabricated hatred of NATO and the U.N., the Russian military reconstituted, the threat to the Baltic states is real. Russia retaking their access to the Baltic Sea from Lithuania, Latvia and Estonia and threatening the shipping of millions of cubic feet of natural gas to lower Europe from Scandinavia, allowing Russia to make a good case for its oil and gas being piped into eastern Europe.

Sources: Time Magazine, NY Times, The Atlantic, The Guardian UK"""

Is this post sarcasm?

I can't tell if you are serious or not.

Because it looks like something from The Onion.

Blackstone is not owned by Russia billionaires. That's retarded.

BX Major Holders | Insider Transactions | The Blackstone Group L.P. Commo Stock - Yahoo Finance

 

[TomParks]

"Here are two positions an intellectually honest person can hold simultaneously:


First, Russian President Vladimir Putin is an authoritarian who, though no Josef Stalin, subverts human rights and is generally antagonistic to the idealistic aims of the United States. When Republicans cozy up to this sort of person, as President-elect Donald Trump has done, they undermine the stated beliefs and values of conservatism.


Second, though there's little doubt he wishes he could, Putin did not hack the American election. In fact, there's no evidence whatsoever that the Russians had anything to do with Trump's victory."

Russia Isn't Our Friend, but That Doesn't Make the Democrats' Conspiracy Theories True

Funny how the Left rightfully denigrated dipshit W for his multiple wars, but seem to want war with Russia today.

Why did all the republican neocons want Hillary in office? It wasn't because they liked her.....

 

[Toro]

Since it is impossible to demonstrate that any of the Wikileaks emails did any damage to the Clinton campaign, unless you believe the Russians are just stupid, it makes no sense to think they tried to influence the election with these emails.

The Russians aren't stupid. It makes perfect sense for Putin to interfere in the US election.

And it has nothing to do with the actual outcome. It has to do with the process and perception of the US system.

Putin has come under criticism at home and abroad for his own election-rigging. Which is true. Putin has killed opponents and cracked down on an independent press, amongst other things.

The US is held up as the shining beacon of democracy. It is in Putin's interest domestically to help discredit the electoral process in the United States. It bolsters his position at home.

It doesn't matter who won the Presidency - though Trump is certainly more desirable for Putin. What matters is that Putin legitimizes his own position by discrediting and diminishing American democracy.

 

[AnCap'n_Murica]

Some are saying that, some are not. For example, I know that candycorn is not saying it, she just feels Hillary was a lousy candidate.

Most are saying that. There are a few scattered exceptions.

Personally, I'm far more concerned with the behavior of the Republicans who are treating the potential of adversarial influence in our elections, no matter how small, with the same seriousness as they might a Sponge Bob™ episode, probably because they won and that's enough for them.
.

Security is a serious issue. Assange has said that the cyber security of just about everything involved with the federal government is preposterously weak.

As far as republicans are concerned, I can't explain their nonchalance. It might not be the case if this wasn't the latest in a train of excuses thrown out by the democrats to explain their recent ass kicking, though I can't say I speak for them.

 

[AnCap'n_Murica]

It doesn't matter who won the Presidency - though Trump is certainly more desirable for Putin. What matters is that Putin legitimizes his own position by discrediting and diminishing American democracy.

I tend to disagree. Putin more than certainly had all the "missing" Hillary home server emails, which contained all sorts of classified information and personal dirt. If that's me, I want someone in the WH whom I can easily logroll and blackmail.

 

[Timmy]

Dems !? News flash trumpbot , GOP and Dems both agree Putin was up to billshit.

Trump is the lone standout .