Reshaping US aid to the Palestinians

[member]

RE: Reshaping US aid to the Palestinians
※→ P F Tinmore, et al,

Well, you are wrong... But I can see that there is no changing your mind. (See Posting #904)

Well, that defines Israel.

(COMMENT)

There is a difference between:

✪ The Israelis in the role of the Occupation Power in support of the protection of sovereignty and territorial integrity... using the same methods as any similar conventional warfare appartus of the 21st Century.
............................................................................ •• AND ••
✪ The Arab Palestinians using terrorist acts to intentionally prevent the success in the establishment of order and safety.​

For so long as the Arab Palestinian see Armed Struggle and Jihadism/Radical Activism as the preferred method of diplomacy over the Principles of the Rule of Law - and - Principles of Freindly Relations, so long will they paint themselves as standing outside the International Conventions, the Heague Regulations, with the Customary and International Humanitarian Law.

Most Respectfully,
R

"Well...............




.......... you are wrong..."











". . .But I can see that there is no changing your mind."

 

[P F Tinmore]

✪ Helping Israel perform its duties and employ the necessary measures in it's power to restore, and ensure, as far as possible, public order and safety under Article 43 of the Harue Regulation.

Israel destroys homes and businesses, destroys crops and trees, destroys water sources, steals land, controls travel trade and tourism, throttles the economy, gasses and shoots unarmed protestors.

What does that have to do with public order and safety?

 

[P F Tinmore]

RE: Reshaping US aid to the Palestinians
※→ ILOVEISRAEL, et al,

This is a one-sided opinion on the part of the various pro-Hostile Arab Palestinian (HoAP) Movements.

International Aid & the Palestinians: Supporting Israel's Occupation?

(COMMENT)

Of course, the other side to that opinion is that America is:

✪ Helping Israel to defend itself against the Arab Palestinians support designated EU terrorist groups like:

• Hamas-Izz al-Din al-Qassem (terrorist wing of Hamas);
• PIJ (Palestinian Islamic Jihad).

✪ Helping Israel perform its duties and employ the necessary measures in it's power to restore, and ensure, as far as possible, public order and safety under Article 43 of the Harue Regulation.

✪ Helping Israel to establish a Rule of Law program (under the 1997 International Convention for the Suppression of Terrorist Bombings) over the unlawful and intentional use of explosives and other lethal devices which HoAP emply against various defined public places with intent to kill or cause serious bodily injury, or with intent to cause extensive destruction of the public place.

✪ Israel in the enforcement of the 2005 Protocol to the Convention for the Suppression of Unlawful Acts against the Safety of Maritime Navigation.

• 
  
  
  • Criminalizes the use of a ship as a device to further an act of terrorism;
  • Criminalizes the transport on board a ship various materials knowing that they are intended to be used to cause, or in a threat to cause, death or serious injury or damage to further an act of terrorism;
  • Criminalizes the transporting on board a ship of persons who have committed an act of terrorism; and
  • Introduces procedures for governing the boarding of a ship believed to have committed an offence under the Convention.

Of course, the pro-HoAP Movements have claimed for decades that they are exempt from the international law that punishes pro-HoAP who commit an offense which is solely intended to harm the Occupying Power. The acts by the pro-HoAP which are either designed or likely to provoke or encourage and threat to the peace, breach of the peace, or act of aggression. This includes the promotions to the effect that the pro-HoAP have some legal right to attack the Israelis.

✪ Any time a people condone the use of forces specifically punishable by Customary and International Humanitarian Law, they are themselves participating in the objective element of a crime; incitement.

✪ The UN Security Council [S/RES/1624 (2005)] Condemns, in the strongest terms, the incitement of terrorist acts and terrorist acts that may incite further terrorist acts for which the HoAP of the West Bank (including Jerusalem) and Gaza Strip have an established a pattern of criminal behavior.

✪ Reaffirming that acts, methods, and practices of terrorism are contrary to the purposes and principles of the United Nations and that knowingly financing, planning and inciting terrorist acts are also contrary to the purposes and principles of the United Nations,
​

The UN Security Council has called upon all States to adopt such measures as may be necessary and
appropriate and in accordance with their obligations under international law to:

(a) Prohibit by law incitement to commit a terrorist act or acts;
(b) Prevent such conduct;
(c) Deny safe haven to any persons with respect to whom there is credible and relevant information giving serious reasons for considering that they have been guilty of such conduct;

✪ Inciting, aiding or abetting, and attempting

1. Each European Union (EU) Member State shall take the necessary measures to ensure that inciting or aiding or abetting an offence --- is made punishable.

2. Each EU Member State shall take the necessary measures to ensure that attempting to commit an offence referred --- is made punishable.
​

This is what it is all about. The pro-HoAP believe that they are a special circumstance and should be exempt from the Customary IHL and Criminalization of the acts they promote. They should remember that:

Most Respectfully,
R

How much of this data dump applies to the Palestinian that does not apply to Israel more?

 

[P F Tinmore]

RESPONSE: WHEN? 1948, 1967, 1973, 1994, yesterday - today →

Yes.

 

[flacaltenn]

Is Gaza allowed to enter independent trade agreements with other nations?

Gaza is under multi-national embargo for being governed by a terrorist proxy of Iran and a danger to Egypt as well as Israel -- AND THEIR OWN Palestinian Authority..

YET -- They DO survive on UNWRA funds and various NGO support? What aid do you think Gaza ought to get? Because they are powered and watered and fed by Israel.. That's MORE AID than they get from Mahmoud Abbas or the rest of the ENTIRE Arab world.

Why did you bring this up? You got a plan to re-unite the Palestinians or something?

 

[Ecocertifmrl]

Is Gaza allowed to enter independent trade agreements with other nations?

Gaza is under multi-national embargo for being governed by a terrorist proxy of Iran and a danger to Egypt as well as Israel -- AND THEIR OWN Palestinian Authority..

YET -- They DO survive on UNWRA funds and various NGO support? What aid do you think Gaza ought to get? Because they are powered and watered and fed by Israel.. That's MORE AID than they get from Mahmoud Abbas or the rest of the ENTIRE Arab world.

Why did you bring this up? You got a plan to re-unite the Palestinians or something?

More like an Israeli embargo

 

[Ecocertifmrl]

Why single Palestine out?

Killing their daughters and wives while calling it "honor"

where?

 

[Shusha]

Is Gaza allowed to enter independent trade agreements with other nations?

They clearly have no trouble with trade agreements with Iran.

 

[Shusha]

Israel destroys homes and businesses, destroys crops and trees, destroys water sources ...

Only those illegally built in Area C. How's the farming going along the fence line at Gaza? Pumpkins ready yet?

 

[Mindful]

Speaking of funds. Did you know:

The United States is doing more to fight Yemen's Humanitarian Crisis than the Press knows?

 

[Ecocertifmrl]

It is not Islam that is against Jews - it is all in the Quran - but Palestinians. And lets not get into the rest of your bull$hit.

The supremacist manifesto called the Quoran instructs followers not to take Jews and Christians as friends and encourages lying to them.

Quote that part. good luck!

Quran 5:51 "O you who believe! do not take the Jews and the Christians for friends; they are friends of each other; and whoever amongst you takes them for a friend, then surely he is one of them; surely Allah does not guide the unjust people."

Quran 5:80 "You will see many of them befriending those who disbelieve; certainly evil is that which their souls have sent before for them, that Allah became displeased with them and in chastisement shall they abide."

Quran 3:28 Let not the believers Take for friends or helpers Unbelievers rather than believers: if any do that, in nothing will there be help from Allah: except by way of precaution, that ye may Guard yourselves from them..."

Quran 3:118 Let not the believers Take for friends or helpers Unbelievers rather than believers: if any do that, in nothing will there be help from Allah: except by way of precaution, that ye may Guard yourselves from them..."

those are just some.

Some people like to translate the arab word awliya as friend, but others translate it as meaning ally, patron, protector or guardian.

When the Quran says this it refers to the jewish-christian -coalation that attacked Islam and was in fact predicted to do so. It does not refer to all jewish and christian people.

The part about believers and non-believers is about a muslim siding with unbelievers against their fellow muslims.

I don't see where lying comes into it.

 

[RoccoR]

RE: Reshaping US aid to the Palestinians
※→ P F Tinmore, et al,

The Arab Palestinians always tried to play the victim and the good guys! They try to portray themselves as guys who didn't know they were bad guys doing bad things. They are villains that run into walls all the time and are not intellectually able to workout the dilemma as if pinned in a coffin. But they don't think they are doing anything wrong murder, terror, mayhem; but nothing wrong. IIn many ways they think they are cunning and smart. When the Arab Palestinian break laws and ethical rules, they justify it in their own terms.

We live in a world where Arab Palestinian thinks they do the right thing when they use
intimidation, extortion, and the destabilizing or the destruction of fundamental political, economic or social structures.
What is very dangerous is that
they truly believe they are entitled to do wrong
simply because they believed they were the victims of a political wrong.
So as far as they are concerned --- the ends can justify the means.
​

✪ Helping Israel perform its duties and employ the necessary measures in it's power to restore, and ensure, as far as possible, public order and safety under Article 43 of the Harue Regulation.

Israel destroys homes and businesses, destroys crops and trees, destroys water sources, steals land, controls travel trade and tourism, throttles the economy, gasses and shoots unarmed protestors.

What does that have to do with public order and safety?

(COMMENT)

Remember that it was and has been, for nearly a century, the policy of the Arab Palestinian People to roam outside the political process and reject the opportunities to be involved in the self-governing institutions that establish the conditions that developed the destruction of homes and businesses, crops and trees. It was the choices made by the Arab Palestinians that set the conditions that lost them the control of minerialrights and water aquifers as well as the diversion of lands and properties. The adverse consequences felt in the economy are a direct result of, NOT peaceful and neighborly actions, but the fear they project in the Middle East and abroad. The Arab Palestinians do not represent a positive value to adjacent neighbors. No one is beating down the door asking for more Arab Palestinian representation. It is exactly the opposite. The thriving nations of the world want those that can contribute at the advanced level. The Middle East and the world want Nobel Lauriet quality people; engineers and scientists --- medical professionals and exemplarary academisians. No one is asking for skilled Jihadist, Fedayeen Activist, Hostile Insurgents, Radicalized Islamic Followers, and Asymmetric Fighters in the form of Arab Palestinians.

How much of this data dump applies to the Palestinian that does not apply to Israel more?

(COMMENT)

Countries that successfully defend against the Jihadist, Fedayeen Activist, Hostile Insurgents, Radicalized Islamic Followers, and Asymmetric Fighters of the world, also are adept at using deadly force. The Arab Palestinian plays the part of the victim as a means to justify their use of death, destruction, intimidation, and coercion as a means to secure their objective through alternative means of peaceful negotiation.

Nothing in "this data dump applies" to Israel's reflect and response to hostilities originating from the Arab Palestinians policy of "Armed Struggle" and "jihad."

RESPONSE: WHEN? 1948, 1967, 1973, 1994, yesterday - today →

Yes.

(COMMENT)

• In 1948, the Arab League invaded Israel as an act of aggression under the false color of liberation.
• In 1967, the Arab League pushed peace keepers out of the way and attempt to intimidate Israel with massing military forces on the borders.
• In 1973, the Arab League launched a sneak attack on the Jewish Religious Holiday of Yom Kipper.
etc, etc, etc
• Today, the Hostile Arab Palestinian is demonstrating on mass on the border of Israel and proclaiming that they will come across and kill Israelis.

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[rylah]

Aren't those the jobs of the government of that territory? To provide for its people with basics like entertainment and water and schools and infrastructure?

If the government is inadequate, or the economic situation situation dire, aid can help.

In fact, aid is frequently used to help hospitals and schools in many countries, and I have never before heard this argument made against them.

For how long?

I have never seen time limits placed on aid. Presumably until it is no longer needed, or otherwise ended.

This can only happen with clear frames and outlined goals, including time limits.
Otherwise You can't make a distinction when it is actually needed.

Junkies on the streets "need aid", does it help or worsen the situation if You give 'em Your paycheck with no conditions? A road to where is paved with good intentions?

How do you determine time limits when you are dealing with a catastrophic drought, or a civil war ? I agree on conditions though.

By applying the same standards as in similar cases.
The US, unfortunately has vast experience of dealing with catastrophic events on its' soil.

As for the civil war between Hamas and PLO all aid should be stopped, dry them up until all weapons they've left is forks. In my opinion only viable investment is in regional cooperation and normalization,anything else is counterproductive and prolonging the problem.

 

[rylah]

This can only happen with clear frames and outlined goals, including time limits.
Otherwise You can't make a distinction when it is actually needed.

Junkies on the streets "need aid", does it help or worsen the situation if You give 'em Your paycheck with no conditions? A road to where is paved with good intentions?

How do you determine time limits when you are dealing with a catastrophic drought, or a civil war ? I agree on conditions though.

By applying the same standards as in similar cases.
The US, unfortunately has vast experience of dealing with catastrophic events on its' soil.

As for the civil war between Hamas and PLO all aid should be stopped, dry them up until all weapons they've left is forks. In my opinion only viable investment is in regional cooperation and normalization,anything else is counterproductive and prolonging the problem.

When I read that I felt physical nausea because of your stupidity.

For all I care You can sneeze out that pea brain of Yours,
and relieve humanity of Your useless existence.

I sense frustration.

That's ironic,
isn't this whole thread about the frustration of You Jihadi welfare frauds?

 

[P F Tinmore]

We live in a world where Arab Palestinian thinks they do the right thing when they use
intimidation, extortion, and the destabilizing or the destruction of fundamental political, economic or social structures.
What is very dangerous is that
they truly believe they are entitled to do wrong
simply because they believed they were the victims of a political wrong.
So as far as they are concerned --- the ends can justify the means.

The Palestinians have been under military occupation, by world superpowers, for a hundred years and you say they are the aggressor.

You are too funny.

 

[P F Tinmore]

Remember that it was and has been, for nearly a century, the policy of the Arab Palestinian People to roam outside the political process and reject the opportunities to be involved in the self-governing institutions that establish the conditions that developed the destruction of homes and businesses, crops and trees.

Many times the Palestinians have been "offered" to surrender and hold their hand out for whatever crumbs they could get.

Why should the Palestinians be the ones to surrender?

 

[P F Tinmore]

• Today, the Hostile Arab Palestinian is demonstrating on mass on the border of Israel and proclaiming that they will come across and kill Israelis.

It is Israel's war. It can stop it any time it wants.

 

[P F Tinmore]

Countries that successfully defend against the Jihadist, Fedayeen Activist, Hostile Insurgents, Radicalized Islamic Followers, and Asymmetric Fighters of the world, also are adept at using deadly force.

The Palestinians are attacked every day yet they are expected to sit on their hands.

 

[Hollie]

Countries that successfully defend against the Jihadist, Fedayeen Activist, Hostile Insurgents, Radicalized Islamic Followers, and Asymmetric Fighters of the world, also are adept at using deadly force.

The Palestinians are attacked every day yet they are expected to sit on their hands.

I guess those 10,000 rockets, missiles, attacks by Islamic terrorists over the last decades are just an entitlement?

 

[rylah]

Countries that successfully defend against the Jihadist, Fedayeen Activist, Hostile Insurgents, Radicalized Islamic Followers, and Asymmetric Fighters of the world, also are adept at using deadly force.

The Palestinians are attacked every day yet they are expected to sit on their hands.

How about BDS and their handers stop promising to behead every Jew "from the river to the sea"?