Religions are fairy tales for adults. Should we encourage them to grow up?

[C_Clayton_Jones]

Again why we're the Egyptian's building pyramids around the same time the Aztecs were?

They were separated by oceans


And why did they abandoned the practice?

This fails as an appeal to ignorance fallacy.

That you don't know why the Egyptians were building pyramids around the same time as the Aztecs doesn't mean the 'answer' is 'god.'

A better question would be how did we make the huge mental leap forward all of the sudden? And why haven't any other animals gotten smart?

Then it turns out dolphins may in some ways be smarter than us and dogs are getting smarter living along side us. Who knows in 1000 years dogs might talk. If that happens they'll say its a miracle but its actually science.

Many underestimate the abilities of ancient man, throughout human history man has been capable of remarkable accomplishments.

 

[Sun Devil 92]

Some believe in science and deny religion. Some believe in religion and deny science. Some are smarter than either of those.

And some understand they are not mutually exclusive.

God comes up very little in a science lab. That's because after all the experiments nothing has ever proved a God exists and never will.

Yes, well, please tell me what the science lab in 1950 didn't have in it (both in terms of theories and capabilities) that you'll find in today's labs.

The story in science is never finished.

No saying God won't show up one day.

 

[Campbell]

Some believe in science and deny religion. Some believe in religion and deny science. Some are smarter than either of those.

And then there are those that have faith in the LORD and realize that science is only as absolute as man is perfect.

By the time I was four or five years old my maternal grandmother was already working hard on my brainwashing. If I did something a little naughty or against her personal belief she would tell me, "Old Scratch Will Get You!" Old Scratch being her name for Satan. She would walk over a mile in the snow to make church services on a Wednesday evening or Sunday Morning.

In grammar school, 3rd and 4th grades my west TN teachers would begin each day with the pledge of allegiance and the Lord's Prayer. On Mondays they assigned each student a bible verse to memorize and recite back to the class on Thursday or Friday. I read the bible and the book of Mormon through while I was still in my teens. I had read the new testament no less than ten times while I was in my twenties. I was baptized in a Baptist church before a congregation of nearly a thousand on a Sunday morning in the spring of 1957. I was a Sunday school teacher, a member of the building committee and the Brotherhood. I worked with RA Boys and coached one of their baseball teams. I was a substitute usher. I spoke with personal testimony in nearby small churches. I visited the sick on Tuesday evenings and twice a year we visited a prison or a jail. We tithed our gross. I walked the walk.

I used to sit in the sanctuary on Sunday mornings and look around at the faces of others and wonder if they doubted the way I did. I was two-faced until I was over sixty years old. After I retired I made a major decision. I did not want to keep living a lie.....I never believed all that malarkey.

I had most of the new testament memorized chapter and verse while I was still in my twenties and 90% of Christians don't know (*)(*)(*)(*) about the bible. Most have a few favorite verses and listen to the self serving messages from a preacher when they go to church but that's usually it. I love to see the look on their faces when I lace them with a couple of verses which absolutely states the opposite of something they have declared.

The good news is that primitive beliefs are on the way out. The organized brainwashing of young, innocent, gullible children by their adult church goers is the reason that after 2000 years it's still alive. You can teach a child anything. For thousands of years tribes of cannibals taught their young to consume human flesh as a religious ritual. Ironically they were converted from their faith to another one which consumes a cracker and some grape juice to simulate eating flesh and drinking blood. It's all such a load of crap written by primitive sheep herders who believed in witches and thought the earth was flat. Again....I've turned 80. I've seen a lot during the last 75 years. The thing that pleases me most is the results of studies like this one. There's still hope:

Survey: One in five Americans has no religion

By Dan Merica

Washington – The fastest growing "religious" group in America is made up of people with no religion at all, according to a Pew survey showing that one in five Americans is not affiliated with any religion.

The number of these Americans has grown by 25% just in the past five years, according to a survey released Tuesday by the Pew Forum on Religion and Public Life.

The survey found that the ranks of the unaffiliated are growing even faster among younger Americans.

Thirty-three million Americans now have no religious affiliation, with 13 million in that group identifying as either atheist or agnostic, according to the new survey.

Pew found that those who are religiously unaffiliated are strikingly less religious than the public at large. They attend church infrequently, if at all, are largely not seeking out religion and say that the lack of it in their lives is of little importance.

Better to know the truth. In fact I feel very lucky in the dice roll of life. Not too poor, wasn't born in a bad century, healthy, loving parents. When its over I'm going to thank my great grandparents for mating 2000 years ago, not Jesus.

I heard that. Screw all of the ancient gods and invisible "MEN" in the sky. Men wrote the book and is it any surprise that men are in charge?

I am so glad to see religions are losing their grip on Europe Canada America Australia. I know we are thousands of years away from outgrowing gods because we have the bible belt Israel Mormons and Islam. None of them are going away any time soon. Too much appeal. People will always be conned by these cults. Hopefully their numbers decline enough their status gets downgraded from religions to cults.

How many Christians don't even believe Mary was a virgin or Jesus was a God? Allegories. Yet they call themselves Christians because they follow Christ as a teacher?

It's the brainwashing of innocent children which keeps it going. When I was a youngster over 70 years ago the Catholics had a saying about that: "Give Me A Child To Age Ten And I'll Give You a Catholic For Life!"

Some of the church's most faithful have begun to send their children to private church schools. That way the children are shielded from the non-believing children.

 

[danielpalos]

In my opinion, if Persons of Religion can lay Any claim and attempt to Establish Any basis for Any form of Holiness through Any form of Morality; then, I say "go for it" as a (junior) Elder.

 

[Campbell]

In my opinion, if Persons of Religion can lay Any claim and attempt to Establish Any basis for Any form of Holiness through Any form of Morality; then, I say "go for it" as a (junior) Elder.

Or....if anyone believes aliens have an earthly base set up at the bottom of the Atlantic......"go for that too!"

 

[RandomVariable]

In my opinion, if Persons of Religion can lay Any claim and attempt to Establish Any basis for Any form of Holiness through Any form of Morality; then, I say "go for it" as a (junior) Elder.

If it were just one person with one belief about how he should behave that would be one thing. Religion is a bit more involved than that however. Religion has also seemed to evolve. The Hebrews were simple enough. They had their belief and their group should follow it or face the consequences. The consequences were harsh but if one did not like it I guess they could always just pick up their tent and go live some place else. Then this guy Jesus came along. He said the god of the Hebrews was the god for all mankind. If one did not learn to follow god, whom he represented, they were going to hell. That was not too bad though as Jesus was going love everyone no matter what. Then Mohammad came along. He said, yes, everyone should follow the god of the Hebrews, Abraham anyway, and if you did not you should be killed.

So as you can see people can get really carried away with this religion stuff. Just saying it is a belief system and all is good could wind up getting you killed these days.

 

[Campbell]

In my opinion, if Persons of Religion can lay Any claim and attempt to Establish Any basis for Any form of Holiness through Any form of Morality; then, I say "go for it" as a (junior) Elder.

If it were just one person with one belief about how he should behave that would be one thing. Religion is a bit more involved than that however. Religion has also seemed to evolve. The Hebrews were simple enough. They had their belief and their group should follow it or face the consequences. The consequences were harsh but if one did not like it I guess they could always just pick up their tent and go live some place else. Then this guy Jesus came along. He said the god of the Hebrews was the god for all mankind. If one did not learn to follow god, whom he represented, they were going to hell. That was not too bad though as Jesus was going love everyone no matter what. Then Mohammad came along. He said, yes, everyone should follow the god of the Hebrews, Abraham anyway, and if you did not you should be killed.

So as you can see people can get really carried away with this religion stuff. Just saying it is a belief system and all is good could wind up getting you killed these days.

Carried Away Indeed. Here's a list......pick one for yourself:

Aphrodite LOVE GODDESSES
Apollo SUN GODS AND GODDESSES
Apsu
Ares WAR GODS AND GODDESSES
Artemis MOON GODS AND GODDESSES
Asclepius
Athena WAR GODS AND GODDESSES
Athirat
Athtart
LOVE GODDESSES | WAR GODS AND GODDESSES
Atlas






Baal
Ba Xian
Bacchus
Balder
Bast
Bellona WAR GODS AND GODDESSES
Bergelmir
Bes
Bixia Yuanjin
Bragi
Brahma
Brigit




Camaxtli WAR GODS AND GODDESSES
Ceres
Ceridwen
Cernunnos
Chac
Chalchiuhtlicue
Chang Hsi See Heng-O.
Charun
Chemosh WAR GODS AND GODDESSES
Cheng-huang
Cybele




Dagon
Damkina (Dumkina)
Davlin
Dawn
Demeter
Diana MOON GODS AND GODDESSES
Di Cang
Dionysus




Ea
El
Enki
Enlil
Eos
Epona
Ereskigal




Farbauti
Fenrir
Forseti
Fortuna
Freya LOVE GODDESSES
Freyr SUN GODS AND GODDESSES
Frigg




Gaia
Ganesha
Ganga
Garuda SUN GODS AND GODDESSES
Gauri
Geb
Geong Si
Guanyin




Hades
Hanuman
Hathor LOVE GODDESSES
Hecate (Hekate)
Helios SUN GODS AND GODDESSES
Heng-o (Chang-o or Chang Hsi) MOON GODS AND GODDESSES
Hephaestus
Hera
Hermes
Hestia
Hod
Hoderi
Hoori
Horus
Hotei
Huitzilopochtli
WAR GODS AND GODDESSES | SUN GODS AND GODDESSES
Hsi-Wang-Mu
Hygeia




Inanna
LOVE GODDESSES | WAR GODS AND GODDESSES
Inti SUN GODS AND GODDESSES
Iris
Ishtar LOVE GODDESSES
Isis LOVE GODDESSES
Ixtab
Izanaki
Izanami




Janus WAR GODS AND GODDESSES
Jesus
Juno
Jupiter
Juturna




Kagutsuchi
Kartikeya WAR GODS AND GODDESSES
Khepri
Ki
Kingu
Kinich Ahau
Kishar
Krishna
Kuan-yin
Kukulcan
Kvasir




Lakshmi
Leto
Liza SUN GODS AND GODDESSES
Loki
Lugh SUN GODS AND GODDESSES
Luna MOON GODS AND GODDESSES





Magna Mater
Maia
Marduk
Mars WAR GODS AND GODDESSES
Mazu
Medb
Mercury
Mimir
Min
Minerva WAR GODS AND GODDESSES
Mithras SUN GODS AND GODDESSES
Morrigan WAR GODS AND GODDESSES
Mot
Mummu
Muses


Nammu
Nanna MOON GODS AND GODDESSES
Nanna (Norse)
Nanse
Neith WAR GODS AND GODDESSES
Nemesis
Nephthys
Neptune
Nergal
Ninazu
Ninhurzag
Nintu
Ninurta WAR GODS AND GODDESSES
Njord
Nugua LOVE GODDESSES
Nut




Odin
Ohkuninushi
Ohyamatsumi
Orgelmir
Osiris
Ostara




Pan
Parvati
Phaethon
Phoebe
Phoebus Apollo
Pilumnus
Poseidon




Quetzalcoatl




Rama
Re SUN GODS AND GODDESSES
Rhea




Sabazius
Sarapis
Sarasvati
Selene MOON GODS AND GODDESSES
Shiva
Seshat
Seti (Set) WAR GODS AND GODDESSES
Shamash
Shapsu
Shen Yi
Shiva
Shu
Si-Wang-Mu
Sin MOON GODS AND GODDESSES
Sirona
Sol SUN GODS AND GODDESSES
Surya
Susanoh




Tawaret
Tefnut
Tezcatlipoca
Thanatos
Thor
Thoth
Tiamat
Tianhou
Tlaloc
Tonatiuh SUN GODS AND GODDESSES
Toyo-Uke-Bime
Tyche
Tyr WAR GODS AND GODDESSES




Utu SUN GODS AND GODDESSES
Ullr
Uzume




Vediovis
Venus LOVE GODDESSES
Vesta
Vishnu
Volturnus
Vulcan




Xipe
Xi Wang-mu
Xochipilli
Xochiquetzal




Yam
Yarikh MOON GODS AND GODDESSES
Yhwh
Ymir
Yu-huang
Yum Kimil



Zeus

 

[RandomVariable]

In my opinion, if Persons of Religion can lay Any claim and attempt to Establish Any basis for Any form of Holiness through Any form of Morality; then, I say "go for it" as a (junior) Elder.

If it were just one person with one belief about how he should behave that would be one thing. Religion is a bit more involved than that however. Religion has also seemed to evolve. The Hebrews were simple enough. They had their belief and their group should follow it or face the consequences. The consequences were harsh but if one did not like it I guess they could always just pick up their tent and go live some place else. Then this guy Jesus came along. He said the god of the Hebrews was the god for all mankind. If one did not learn to follow god, whom he represented, they were going to hell. That was not too bad though as Jesus was going love everyone no matter what. Then Mohammad came along. He said, yes, everyone should follow the god of the Hebrews, Abraham anyway, and if you did not you should be killed.

So as you can see people can get really carried away with this religion stuff. Just saying it is a belief system and all is good could wind up getting you killed these days.

Carried Away Indeed. Here's a list......pick one for yourself:

Aphrodite LOVE GODDESSES
Apollo SUN GODS AND GODDESSES
Apsu
Ares WAR GODS AND GODDESSES
Artemis MOON GODS AND GODDESSES
Asclepius
Athena WAR GODS AND GODDESSES
Athirat
Athtart
LOVE GODDESSES | WAR GODS AND GODDESSES
Atlas






Baal
Ba Xian
Bacchus
Balder
Bast
Bellona WAR GODS AND GODDESSES
Bergelmir
Bes
Bixia Yuanjin
Bragi
Brahma
Brigit




Camaxtli WAR GODS AND GODDESSES
Ceres
Ceridwen
Cernunnos
Chac
Chalchiuhtlicue
Chang Hsi See Heng-O.
Charun
Chemosh WAR GODS AND GODDESSES
Cheng-huang
Cybele




Dagon
Damkina (Dumkina)
Davlin
Dawn
Demeter
Diana MOON GODS AND GODDESSES
Di Cang
Dionysus




Ea
El
Enki
Enlil
Eos
Epona
Ereskigal




Farbauti
Fenrir
Forseti
Fortuna
Freya LOVE GODDESSES
Freyr SUN GODS AND GODDESSES
Frigg




Gaia
Ganesha
Ganga
Garuda SUN GODS AND GODDESSES
Gauri
Geb
Geong Si
Guanyin




Hades
Hanuman
Hathor LOVE GODDESSES
Hecate (Hekate)
Helios SUN GODS AND GODDESSES
Heng-o (Chang-o or Chang Hsi) MOON GODS AND GODDESSES
Hephaestus
Hera
Hermes
Hestia
Hod
Hoderi
Hoori
Horus
Hotei
Huitzilopochtli
WAR GODS AND GODDESSES | SUN GODS AND GODDESSES
Hsi-Wang-Mu
Hygeia




Inanna
LOVE GODDESSES | WAR GODS AND GODDESSES
Inti SUN GODS AND GODDESSES
Iris
Ishtar LOVE GODDESSES
Isis LOVE GODDESSES
Ixtab
Izanaki
Izanami




Janus WAR GODS AND GODDESSES
Jesus
Juno
Jupiter
Juturna




Kagutsuchi
Kartikeya WAR GODS AND GODDESSES
Khepri
Ki
Kingu
Kinich Ahau
Kishar
Krishna
Kuan-yin
Kukulcan
Kvasir




Lakshmi
Leto
Liza SUN GODS AND GODDESSES
Loki
Lugh SUN GODS AND GODDESSES
Luna MOON GODS AND GODDESSES





Magna Mater
Maia
Marduk
Mars WAR GODS AND GODDESSES
Mazu
Medb
Mercury
Mimir
Min
Minerva WAR GODS AND GODDESSES
Mithras SUN GODS AND GODDESSES
Morrigan WAR GODS AND GODDESSES
Mot
Mummu
Muses


Nammu
Nanna MOON GODS AND GODDESSES
Nanna (Norse)
Nanse
Neith WAR GODS AND GODDESSES
Nemesis
Nephthys
Neptune
Nergal
Ninazu
Ninhurzag
Nintu
Ninurta WAR GODS AND GODDESSES
Njord
Nugua LOVE GODDESSES
Nut




Odin
Ohkuninushi
Ohyamatsumi
Orgelmir
Osiris
Ostara




Pan
Parvati
Phaethon
Phoebe
Phoebus Apollo
Pilumnus
Poseidon




Quetzalcoatl




Rama
Re SUN GODS AND GODDESSES
Rhea




Sabazius
Sarapis
Sarasvati
Selene MOON GODS AND GODDESSES
Shiva
Seshat
Seti (Set) WAR GODS AND GODDESSES
Shamash
Shapsu
Shen Yi
Shiva
Shu
Si-Wang-Mu
Sin MOON GODS AND GODDESSES
Sirona
Sol SUN GODS AND GODDESSES
Surya
Susanoh




Tawaret
Tefnut
Tezcatlipoca
Thanatos
Thor
Thoth
Tiamat
Tianhou
Tlaloc
Tonatiuh SUN GODS AND GODDESSES
Toyo-Uke-Bime
Tyche
Tyr WAR GODS AND GODDESSES




Utu SUN GODS AND GODDESSES
Ullr
Uzume




Vediovis
Venus LOVE GODDESSES
Vesta
Vishnu
Volturnus
Vulcan




Xipe
Xi Wang-mu
Xochipilli
Xochiquetzal




Yam
Yarikh MOON GODS AND GODDESSES
Yhwh
Ymir
Yu-huang
Yum Kimil



Zeus

One picked me. The God of Abraham.

 

[Darkwind]

Atheists......Talking primates that have learned to mimic a higher life form.

 

[Campbell]

Atheists......Talking primates that have learned to mimic a higher life form.

"I cannot imagine a God who rewards and punishes the objects of his creation, whose purposes are modeled after our own--a God, in short, who is but a reflection of human fraility. Neither can I believe that the individual survives the death of his body, although feeble souls harbor such thoughts through fear or ridiculous egotism. It is enough for me to contemplate the mystery of conscious life perpetuating itself through all eternity, to reflect upon the marvelous structure of the universe which we can dimly perceive, and to try humbly to comprehend even an infinitesimal part of the intelligence manifested in nature.

~Dr. Albert Einstein~ (at the time of his death, 1955.)

"And the day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus, by the supreme being as his father in the womb of a virgin will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter. But we may hope that the dawn of reason and freedom of thought in these United States will do away with all this artificial scaffolding"

~Thomas Jefferson~ (excerpt from a letter to John Adams, April 1823)

 

[Dajjal]

Daniel Dennett annoys the hell out of me. He had the gall to write a book called consciousness explained without explaining anything. He just skips over Descartes point that the mind is an un-extended thinking thing but the body is an extended unthinking thing. Hence the concept of dualism of which I am an advocate. As for theists they fall down because they stick to outdated religious doctrines. Myself I am a deist who believes God is the first cause of creation, and he set the laws of physics into motion as a perfect plan to allow us to evolve by personal experience. I think there is more truth in eastern religions than in the Abrahamic religions. But all religions are bound to fail to get a handle on an infinite divine mind.

And you come to this conclusion with a lack of evidence. How wise is that? To assume a God created the universe without any facts or evidence verifying this this not even a theory. God is just a hypothesis. Do you get that? And what's the purpose? The universe is 14 billion years old and has less than 10 billion years to go. Everything dies including you. No soul moves on afterward

The evidence I have comes from thirty years of attending spiritualist churches. In the first two years I came to believe that mediums were mostly doing what they said they were doing, and talking to the spirits of the dead.
After that I studied the teachings of several trance mediums and got an over view of the mystery's of life.
I came to believe there is a God who is a vast formless mind and he is the source of creation. We are a small part of the godhead, and we are sent out on a long journey of self realization over many incarnations. We reincarnate of many different planets in the course of our evolution, until reaching a state of grace, or enlightenment. After which we continue to grow as immortal beings in higher realms.

What evidence do you have? You listened to to the rantings of a bunch of spiritualists.

Tell me some of the evidence you gathered for example, that reincarnation is real.

My personal evidence of survival of my relatives was from dozens of messages I received from them over the years, from different mediums in different churches. The most evidential message I received was from a brother who died in the war as a baby. Until I received a message from him I did not even know he existed. The medium even told me his name, and I had never seen this medium before as she was visiting the church from out of town. I went home after the meeting and asked my mother if she had a baby that died in the war and she said yes. But my mother was not a spiritualist and she had never been to the church. She was shocked when I told her I had a message from her son who had grown up in the spirit world.
In any case I had many other messages from my grandparents telling me things that the mediums could not have known.
As for reincarnation I have no proof of it but it is what the spirits teach.

 

[Campbell]

Daniel Dennett annoys the hell out of me. He had the gall to write a book called consciousness explained without explaining anything. He just skips over Descartes point that the mind is an un-extended thinking thing but the body is an extended unthinking thing. Hence the concept of dualism of which I am an advocate. As for theists they fall down because they stick to outdated religious doctrines. Myself I am a deist who believes God is the first cause of creation, and he set the laws of physics into motion as a perfect plan to allow us to evolve by personal experience. I think there is more truth in eastern religions than in the Abrahamic religions. But all religions are bound to fail to get a handle on an infinite divine mind.

And you come to this conclusion with a lack of evidence. How wise is that? To assume a God created the universe without any facts or evidence verifying this this not even a theory. God is just a hypothesis. Do you get that? And what's the purpose? The universe is 14 billion years old and has less than 10 billion years to go. Everything dies including you. No soul moves on afterward

The evidence I have comes from thirty years of attending spiritualist churches. In the first two years I came to believe that mediums were mostly doing what they said they were doing, and talking to the spirits of the dead.
After that I studied the teachings of several trance mediums and got an over view of the mystery's of life.
I came to believe there is a God who is a vast formless mind and he is the source of creation. We are a small part of the godhead, and we are sent out on a long journey of self realization over many incarnations. We reincarnate of many different planets in the course of our evolution, until reaching a state of grace, or enlightenment. After which we continue to grow as immortal beings in higher realms.

What evidence do you have? You listened to to the rantings of a bunch of spiritualists.

Tell me some of the evidence you gathered for example, that reincarnation is real.

My personal evidence of survival of my relatives was from dozens of messages I received from them over the years, from different mediums in different churches. The most evidential message I received was from a brother who died in the war as a baby. Until I received a message from him I did not even know he existed. The medium even told me his name, and I had never seen this medium before as she was visiting the church from out of town. I went home after the meeting and asked my mother if she had a baby that died in the war and she said yes. But my mother was not a spiritualist and she had never been to the church. She was shocked when I told her I had a message from her son who had grown up in the spirit world.
In any case I had many other messages from my grandparents telling me things that the mediums could not have known.
As for reincarnation I have no proof of it but it is what the spirits teach.

Just curious.....do you use that stuff in the stock market? I've always wondered why prophets, mediums, psychics, fortune tellers etc. aren't rich. Better yet prophesy up a good number for the lottery. All that stuff should be relegated to carnivals and side shows. Anybody who believes it ain't got the good gumption of a chicken.

 

[sealybobo]

Daniel Dennett annoys the hell out of me. He had the gall to write a book called consciousness explained without explaining anything. He just skips over Descartes point that the mind is an un-extended thinking thing but the body is an extended unthinking thing. Hence the concept of dualism of which I am an advocate. As for theists they fall down because they stick to outdated religious doctrines. Myself I am a deist who believes God is the first cause of creation, and he set the laws of physics into motion as a perfect plan to allow us to evolve by personal experience. I think there is more truth in eastern religions than in the Abrahamic religions. But all religions are bound to fail to get a handle on an infinite divine mind.

And you come to this conclusion with a lack of evidence. How wise is that? To assume a God created the universe without any facts or evidence verifying this this not even a theory. God is just a hypothesis. Do you get that? And what's the purpose? The universe is 14 billion years old and has less than 10 billion years to go. Everything dies including you. No soul moves on afterward

The evidence I have comes from thirty years of attending spiritualist churches. In the first two years I came to believe that mediums were mostly doing what they said they were doing, and talking to the spirits of the dead.
After that I studied the teachings of several trance mediums and got an over view of the mystery's of life.
I came to believe there is a God who is a vast formless mind and he is the source of creation. We are a small part of the godhead, and we are sent out on a long journey of self realization over many incarnations. We reincarnate of many different planets in the course of our evolution, until reaching a state of grace, or enlightenment. After which we continue to grow as immortal beings in higher realms.

What evidence do you have? You listened to to the rantings of a bunch of spiritualists.

Tell me some of the evidence you gathered for example, that reincarnation is real.

My personal evidence of survival of my relatives was from dozens of messages I received from them over the years, from different mediums in different churches. The most evidential message I received was from a brother who died in the war as a baby. Until I received a message from him I did not even know he existed. The medium even told me his name, and I had never seen this medium before as she was visiting the church from out of town. I went home after the meeting and asked my mother if she had a baby that died in the war and she said yes. But my mother was not a spiritualist and she had never been to the church. She was shocked when I told her I had a message from her son who had grown up in the spirit world.
In any case I had many other messages from my grandparents telling me things that the mediums could not have known.
As for reincarnation I have no proof of it but it is what the spirits teach.

Just curious.....do you use that stuff in the stock market? I've always wondered why prophets, mediums, psychics, fortune tellers etc. aren't rich. Better yet prophesy up a good number for the lottery. All that stuff should be relegated to carnivals and side shows. Anybody who believes it ain't got the good gumption of a chicken.

So true. "they knew things they couldn't have possibly known" they always say.

While I can't answer how the trick is done, I also can't tell you how David Blane, Penn & Teller or David Copperfield do it either. But we all know it ain't magic. And some medium telling you about your dead relative aint god either.

 

[sealybobo]

Daniel Dennett annoys the hell out of me. He had the gall to write a book called consciousness explained without explaining anything. He just skips over Descartes point that the mind is an un-extended thinking thing but the body is an extended unthinking thing. Hence the concept of dualism of which I am an advocate. As for theists they fall down because they stick to outdated religious doctrines. Myself I am a deist who believes God is the first cause of creation, and he set the laws of physics into motion as a perfect plan to allow us to evolve by personal experience. I think there is more truth in eastern religions than in the Abrahamic religions. But all religions are bound to fail to get a handle on an infinite divine mind.

And you come to this conclusion with a lack of evidence. How wise is that? To assume a God created the universe without any facts or evidence verifying this this not even a theory. God is just a hypothesis. Do you get that? And what's the purpose? The universe is 14 billion years old and has less than 10 billion years to go. Everything dies including you. No soul moves on afterward

The evidence I have comes from thirty years of attending spiritualist churches. In the first two years I came to believe that mediums were mostly doing what they said they were doing, and talking to the spirits of the dead.
After that I studied the teachings of several trance mediums and got an over view of the mystery's of life.
I came to believe there is a God who is a vast formless mind and he is the source of creation. We are a small part of the godhead, and we are sent out on a long journey of self realization over many incarnations. We reincarnate of many different planets in the course of our evolution, until reaching a state of grace, or enlightenment. After which we continue to grow as immortal beings in higher realms.

What evidence do you have? You listened to to the rantings of a bunch of spiritualists.

Tell me some of the evidence you gathered for example, that reincarnation is real.

My personal evidence of survival of my relatives was from dozens of messages I received from them over the years, from different mediums in different churches. The most evidential message I received was from a brother who died in the war as a baby. Until I received a message from him I did not even know he existed. The medium even told me his name, and I had never seen this medium before as she was visiting the church from out of town. I went home after the meeting and asked my mother if she had a baby that died in the war and she said yes. But my mother was not a spiritualist and she had never been to the church. She was shocked when I told her I had a message from her son who had grown up in the spirit world.
In any case I had many other messages from my grandparents telling me things that the mediums could not have known.
As for reincarnation I have no proof of it but it is what the spirits teach.

I love it when Christians tell me they believe in ghosts. They don't even have the common sense to know their religion doesn't believe in them.

In the King James Version of the Bible, the word ghost appears 108 times. Of these, the word is never used in the sense of the disembodied spirit of someone who has died. The Bible refers to the spirits of the dead as “familiar spirits,” and warns against having anything to do with them.

It’s in the Bible, Job 7:9-10, NKJV. “As the cloud disappears and vanishes away, so he who goes down to the grave does not come up. He shall never return to his house, Nor shall his place know him anymore."

It’s in the Bible, Ecclesiastes 9:5-6, NKJV. “For the living know that they will die; But the dead know nothing, and they have no more reward, For the memory of them is forgotten. Also their love, their hatred, and their envy have now perished; nevermore will they have a share in anything done under the sun.”

“And when they say to you, ‘Consult the mediums and the spiritists who whisper and mutter.’ Should not a people consult their God? Should they consult the dead on behalf of the living?” vs. 20, KJV. “To the law and to the testimony, if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.”

What does the Bible say about those who communicate with familiar spirits? It's in the Bible, Leviticus 19:31, NKJV. "Give no regard to mediums and familiar spirits; do not seek after them, to be defiled by them: I am the LORD your God."

Ghosts are real, but they are not angels from God or our dead loved ones. They are fallen angels trying to deceive us. It’s in the Bible, Ephesians 6:11-12, KJV. "Put on the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil. For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.

It’s in the Bible, 2 Corinthians 11:14-15, NIV. "And no wonder, for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light. It is not surprising, then, if his servants masquerade as servants of righteousness. Their end will be what their actions deserve."


Should we be afraid of ghosts?
We do not have to be afraid of Satan and his impersonations of the living and the dead, if we give our hearts to Jesus and stay away from all satanic activities such as séances, ouija boards, and other activities of spiritism. It’s in the Bible, 1 John 4:1,4, NKJV. “Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits, whether they are of God. . . You are of God, little children, and have overcome them, because He who is in you is greater than he who is in the world.” It's in the Bible, James 4:7-8, NKJV. “Therefore submit to God. Resist the devil and he will flee from you. Draw near to God and He will draw near to you.”

 

[sealybobo]

Daniel Dennett annoys the hell out of me. He had the gall to write a book called consciousness explained without explaining anything. He just skips over Descartes point that the mind is an un-extended thinking thing but the body is an extended unthinking thing. Hence the concept of dualism of which I am an advocate. As for theists they fall down because they stick to outdated religious doctrines. Myself I am a deist who believes God is the first cause of creation, and he set the laws of physics into motion as a perfect plan to allow us to evolve by personal experience. I think there is more truth in eastern religions than in the Abrahamic religions. But all religions are bound to fail to get a handle on an infinite divine mind.

And you come to this conclusion with a lack of evidence. How wise is that? To assume a God created the universe without any facts or evidence verifying this this not even a theory. God is just a hypothesis. Do you get that? And what's the purpose? The universe is 14 billion years old and has less than 10 billion years to go. Everything dies including you. No soul moves on afterward

The evidence I have comes from thirty years of attending spiritualist churches. In the first two years I came to believe that mediums were mostly doing what they said they were doing, and talking to the spirits of the dead.
After that I studied the teachings of several trance mediums and got an over view of the mystery's of life.
I came to believe there is a God who is a vast formless mind and he is the source of creation. We are a small part of the godhead, and we are sent out on a long journey of self realization over many incarnations. We reincarnate of many different planets in the course of our evolution, until reaching a state of grace, or enlightenment. After which we continue to grow as immortal beings in higher realms.

What evidence do you have? You listened to to the rantings of a bunch of spiritualists.

Tell me some of the evidence you gathered for example, that reincarnation is real.

My personal evidence of survival of my relatives was from dozens of messages I received from them over the years, from different mediums in different churches. The most evidential message I received was from a brother who died in the war as a baby. Until I received a message from him I did not even know he existed. The medium even told me his name, and I had never seen this medium before as she was visiting the church from out of town. I went home after the meeting and asked my mother if she had a baby that died in the war and she said yes. But my mother was not a spiritualist and she had never been to the church. She was shocked when I told her I had a message from her son who had grown up in the spirit world.
In any case I had many other messages from my grandparents telling me things that the mediums could not have known.
As for reincarnation I have no proof of it but it is what the spirits teach.

The Bible speaks quite clearing about the use of mediums, fortune-tellers and spirit guides. Starting with Leviticus 19:31, God says "Do not turn to mediums or seek out spiritists, for you will be defiled by them. I am the LORD your God." He goes on to say in Leviticus 20:6, "I will set my face against the person who turns to mediums and spiritists to prostitute himself by following them, and I will cut him off from his people."

"Let no one be found among you who sacrifices his son or daughter in the fire, who practices divination or sorcery, interprets omens, engages in witchcraft, or casts spells, or who is a medium or spiritist or who consults the dead. Anyone who does these things is detestable to the LORD, and because of these detestable practices the LORD your God will drive out those nations before you."

God calls these things "detestable" and tells the Israelites He will destroy the nations surrounding them because they practice it.

 

[sealybobo]

Go see a psychic or medium and 10:13-14 "Saul died because he was unfaithful to the LORD; he did not keep the word of the LORD and even consulted a medium for guidance, and did not inquire of the LORD. So the LORD put him to death and turned the kingdom over to David son of Jesse."

 

[sealybobo]

Daniel Dennett annoys the hell out of me. He had the gall to write a book called consciousness explained without explaining anything. He just skips over Descartes point that the mind is an un-extended thinking thing but the body is an extended unthinking thing. Hence the concept of dualism of which I am an advocate. As for theists they fall down because they stick to outdated religious doctrines. Myself I am a deist who believes God is the first cause of creation, and he set the laws of physics into motion as a perfect plan to allow us to evolve by personal experience. I think there is more truth in eastern religions than in the Abrahamic religions. But all religions are bound to fail to get a handle on an infinite divine mind.

And you come to this conclusion with a lack of evidence. How wise is that? To assume a God created the universe without any facts or evidence verifying this this not even a theory. God is just a hypothesis. Do you get that? And what's the purpose? The universe is 14 billion years old and has less than 10 billion years to go. Everything dies including you. No soul moves on afterward

The evidence I have comes from thirty years of attending spiritualist churches. In the first two years I came to believe that mediums were mostly doing what they said they were doing, and talking to the spirits of the dead.
After that I studied the teachings of several trance mediums and got an over view of the mystery's of life.
I came to believe there is a God who is a vast formless mind and he is the source of creation. We are a small part of the godhead, and we are sent out on a long journey of self realization over many incarnations. We reincarnate of many different planets in the course of our evolution, until reaching a state of grace, or enlightenment. After which we continue to grow as immortal beings in higher realms.

What evidence do you have? You listened to to the rantings of a bunch of spiritualists.

Tell me some of the evidence you gathered for example, that reincarnation is real.

My personal evidence of survival of my relatives was from dozens of messages I received from them over the years, from different mediums in different churches. The most evidential message I received was from a brother who died in the war as a baby. Until I received a message from him I did not even know he existed. The medium even told me his name, and I had never seen this medium before as she was visiting the church from out of town. I went home after the meeting and asked my mother if she had a baby that died in the war and she said yes. But my mother was not a spiritualist and she had never been to the church. She was shocked when I told her I had a message from her son who had grown up in the spirit world.
In any case I had many other messages from my grandparents telling me things that the mediums could not have known.
As for reincarnation I have no proof of it but it is what the spirits teach.

It is very apparent that God does not want us fooling around this type of thing. Mediums and people who "channel" are most often frauds. In 1 Samuel 28:12, the medium actually seemed surprised that she was able to "call Samuel up". Bible scholars have interpreted this to mean that she had never actually done it before. (1)
The amount of "personal" information that can be located about a person is truly amazing. With the advent of the Internet, more information then ever before, can be summoned up at the click of a mouse. This can give a medium the appearance of "communing with the dead".
In cases where mediums and people who channel, actually know information that no one else but the dead person could know, keep in mind that they are most likely involved with very evil spiritual beings. In simpler terms, a demon; Satan’s fallen angels.
Even though demons have become less apparent and have to hide better from our "enlightened" minds, they still exist and will do everything they can to confuse, corrupt and mislead people.

So its very possible that it was a devil who read your mind and told you something only you and your dead love one would know. OR they used the internet. Or whatever other tricks they use. Did you pre register to go see this person?

Bottom line is, we laugh at people who believe mediums.

 

[Campbell]

Daniel Dennett annoys the hell out of me. He had the gall to write a book called consciousness explained without explaining anything. He just skips over Descartes point that the mind is an un-extended thinking thing but the body is an extended unthinking thing. Hence the concept of dualism of which I am an advocate. As for theists they fall down because they stick to outdated religious doctrines. Myself I am a deist who believes God is the first cause of creation, and he set the laws of physics into motion as a perfect plan to allow us to evolve by personal experience. I think there is more truth in eastern religions than in the Abrahamic religions. But all religions are bound to fail to get a handle on an infinite divine mind.

And you come to this conclusion with a lack of evidence. How wise is that? To assume a God created the universe without any facts or evidence verifying this this not even a theory. God is just a hypothesis. Do you get that? And what's the purpose? The universe is 14 billion years old and has less than 10 billion years to go. Everything dies including you. No soul moves on afterward

The evidence I have comes from thirty years of attending spiritualist churches. In the first two years I came to believe that mediums were mostly doing what they said they were doing, and talking to the spirits of the dead.
After that I studied the teachings of several trance mediums and got an over view of the mystery's of life.
I came to believe there is a God who is a vast formless mind and he is the source of creation. We are a small part of the godhead, and we are sent out on a long journey of self realization over many incarnations. We reincarnate of many different planets in the course of our evolution, until reaching a state of grace, or enlightenment. After which we continue to grow as immortal beings in higher realms.

What evidence do you have? You listened to to the rantings of a bunch of spiritualists.

Tell me some of the evidence you gathered for example, that reincarnation is real.

My personal evidence of survival of my relatives was from dozens of messages I received from them over the years, from different mediums in different churches. The most evidential message I received was from a brother who died in the war as a baby. Until I received a message from him I did not even know he existed. The medium even told me his name, and I had never seen this medium before as she was visiting the church from out of town. I went home after the meeting and asked my mother if she had a baby that died in the war and she said yes. But my mother was not a spiritualist and she had never been to the church. She was shocked when I told her I had a message from her son who had grown up in the spirit world.
In any case I had many other messages from my grandparents telling me things that the mediums could not have known.
As for reincarnation I have no proof of it but it is what the spirits teach.

It is very apparent that God does not want us fooling around this type of thing. Mediums and people who "channel" are most often frauds. In 1 Samuel 28:12, the medium actually seemed surprised that she was able to "call Samuel up". Bible scholars have interpreted this to mean that she had never actually done it before. (1)
The amount of "personal" information that can be located about a person is truly amazing. With the advent of the Internet, more information then ever before, can be summoned up at the click of a mouse. This can give a medium the appearance of "communing with the dead".
In cases where mediums and people who channel, actually know information that no one else but the dead person could know, keep in mind that they are most likely involved with very evil spiritual beings. In simpler terms, a demon; Satan’s fallen angels.
Even though demons have become less apparent and have to hide better from our "enlightened" minds, they still exist and will do everything they can to confuse, corrupt and mislead people.

So its very possible that it was a devil who read your mind and told you something only you and your dead love one would know. OR they used the internet. Or whatever other tricks they use. Did you pre register to go see this person?

Bottom line is, we laugh at people who believe mediums.

I've been laughing at folks like that all my life.....'course I'm just 81

I don't believe in ghosts....holy or otherwise

 

[Dajjal]

Daniel Dennett annoys the hell out of me. He had the gall to write a book called consciousness explained without explaining anything. He just skips over Descartes point that the mind is an un-extended thinking thing but the body is an extended unthinking thing. Hence the concept of dualism of which I am an advocate. As for theists they fall down because they stick to outdated religious doctrines. Myself I am a deist who believes God is the first cause of creation, and he set the laws of physics into motion as a perfect plan to allow us to evolve by personal experience. I think there is more truth in eastern religions than in the Abrahamic religions. But all religions are bound to fail to get a handle on an infinite divine mind.

And you come to this conclusion with a lack of evidence. How wise is that? To assume a God created the universe without any facts or evidence verifying this this not even a theory. God is just a hypothesis. Do you get that? And what's the purpose? The universe is 14 billion years old and has less than 10 billion years to go. Everything dies including you. No soul moves on afterward

The evidence I have comes from thirty years of attending spiritualist churches. In the first two years I came to believe that mediums were mostly doing what they said they were doing, and talking to the spirits of the dead.
After that I studied the teachings of several trance mediums and got an over view of the mystery's of life.
I came to believe there is a God who is a vast formless mind and he is the source of creation. We are a small part of the godhead, and we are sent out on a long journey of self realization over many incarnations. We reincarnate of many different planets in the course of our evolution, until reaching a state of grace, or enlightenment. After which we continue to grow as immortal beings in higher realms.

What evidence do you have? You listened to to the rantings of a bunch of spiritualists.

Tell me some of the evidence you gathered for example, that reincarnation is real.

My personal evidence of survival of my relatives was from dozens of messages I received from them over the years, from different mediums in different churches. The most evidential message I received was from a brother who died in the war as a baby. Until I received a message from him I did not even know he existed. The medium even told me his name, and I had never seen this medium before as she was visiting the church from out of town. I went home after the meeting and asked my mother if she had a baby that died in the war and she said yes. But my mother was not a spiritualist and she had never been to the church. She was shocked when I told her I had a message from her son who had grown up in the spirit world.
In any case I had many other messages from my grandparents telling me things that the mediums could not have known.
As for reincarnation I have no proof of it but it is what the spirits teach.

Just curious.....do you use that stuff in the stock market? I've always wondered why prophets, mediums, psychics, fortune tellers etc. aren't rich. Better yet prophesy up a good number for the lottery. All that stuff should be relegated to carnivals and side shows. Anybody who believes it ain't got the good gumption of a chicken.

It is bad karma to use occult powers for worldly gain. However I was given five winning lottery numbers from the spirit world by telepathy in 1998. At the time I was broke and could not afford a decent computer so the spirit world gave me a five number win to buy one. But they have never given me any more numbers because as I say it would be bad karma to cheat the lottery for a big win in this way. By the way the fact they could give me five winning numbers days in advance of the draw show the spirit world can see in to the future.

 

[Dajjal]

Daniel Dennett annoys the hell out of me. He had the gall to write a book called consciousness explained without explaining anything. He just skips over Descartes point that the mind is an un-extended thinking thing but the body is an extended unthinking thing. Hence the concept of dualism of which I am an advocate. As for theists they fall down because they stick to outdated religious doctrines. Myself I am a deist who believes God is the first cause of creation, and he set the laws of physics into motion as a perfect plan to allow us to evolve by personal experience. I think there is more truth in eastern religions than in the Abrahamic religions. But all religions are bound to fail to get a handle on an infinite divine mind.

And you come to this conclusion with a lack of evidence. How wise is that? To assume a God created the universe without any facts or evidence verifying this this not even a theory. God is just a hypothesis. Do you get that? And what's the purpose? The universe is 14 billion years old and has less than 10 billion years to go. Everything dies including you. No soul moves on afterward

The evidence I have comes from thirty years of attending spiritualist churches. In the first two years I came to believe that mediums were mostly doing what they said they were doing, and talking to the spirits of the dead.
After that I studied the teachings of several trance mediums and got an over view of the mystery's of life.
I came to believe there is a God who is a vast formless mind and he is the source of creation. We are a small part of the godhead, and we are sent out on a long journey of self realization over many incarnations. We reincarnate of many different planets in the course of our evolution, until reaching a state of grace, or enlightenment. After which we continue to grow as immortal beings in higher realms.

What evidence do you have? You listened to to the rantings of a bunch of spiritualists.

Tell me some of the evidence you gathered for example, that reincarnation is real.

My personal evidence of survival of my relatives was from dozens of messages I received from them over the years, from different mediums in different churches. The most evidential message I received was from a brother who died in the war as a baby. Until I received a message from him I did not even know he existed. The medium even told me his name, and I had never seen this medium before as she was visiting the church from out of town. I went home after the meeting and asked my mother if she had a baby that died in the war and she said yes. But my mother was not a spiritualist and she had never been to the church. She was shocked when I told her I had a message from her son who had grown up in the spirit world.
In any case I had many other messages from my grandparents telling me things that the mediums could not have known.
As for reincarnation I have no proof of it but it is what the spirits teach.

It is very apparent that God does not want us fooling around this type of thing. Mediums and people who "channel" are most often frauds. In 1 Samuel 28:12, the medium actually seemed surprised that she was able to "call Samuel up". Bible scholars have interpreted this to mean that she had never actually done it before. (1)
The amount of "personal" information that can be located about a person is truly amazing. With the advent of the Internet, more information then ever before, can be summoned up at the click of a mouse. This can give a medium the appearance of "communing with the dead".
In cases where mediums and people who channel, actually know information that no one else but the dead person could know, keep in mind that they are most likely involved with very evil spiritual beings. In simpler terms, a demon; Satan’s fallen angels.
Even though demons have become less apparent and have to hide better from our "enlightened" minds, they still exist and will do everything they can to confuse, corrupt and mislead people.

So its very possible that it was a devil who read your mind and told you something only you and your dead love one would know. OR they used the internet. Or whatever other tricks they use. Did you pre register to go see this person?

Bottom line is, we laugh at people who believe mediums.

I do not believe in the devil, because for one thing I used to be able to feel psychic energy myself and I could tell if it was a good or evil presence. I once walked into a Franciscan monastery in Italy and it almost blew my socks off there was so much positive energy there. My nervous system was like a psychic barometer and I could feel the psychic atmosphere in old churches. I could also feel the negative energy in the streets of London and I used to go into old churches for respite, and as soon as I walked in the door I could feel a psychic warmth. But it only worked in old churches, as new buildings have not had time for the energy to build up.
As for mediums using the internet to get information about you, it did not exist at the time I was a regular church goer. I went to church regularly from the late sixties, and I have not been to a church now for some years.