Ravens "likely" (see what I did there?) eliminated from playoffs by an atrocious replay review overrule.

[MarathonMike]

Late in the 4th quarter Isaiah Likely catches a pass in the end zone with control and takes two full steps. Ruled a touchdown. BUT WAIT!! Replay review immediately intervenes and within seconds decides control and two full steps was not enough and overrules the catch! WTF? We have 4 and 5 minute reviews on catches in the second quarter of games FFS! That call probably knocked the Ravens out of the playoffs. The NFL came out with some word salad that would make Kamala blush. IMO that is the worst overrule of the year and Ravens fans have every right to be PO-ed.

 

[1srelluc]

I think it is two steps and CONTROL. He did not have full control of the ball......Good call.

 

[toobfreak]

Late in the 4th quarter Isaiah Likely catches a pass in the end zone with control and takes two full steps. Ruled a touchdown. BUT WAIT!! Replay review immediately intervenes and within seconds decides control and two full steps was not enough and overrules the catch! WTF?

I saw the catch. Even sports analysts are conflicted to understand the NFL rules. There seems to be different rules for every way you catch or run a ball into the end zone!

1. If you just point the ball in your hand past the goal line before any other part of your body touches the ground - YOU'VE SCORED.
2. If a runner carrying the ball just crosses through the end zone enough to plunk the little foam marker at the corner - HE SCORES.
3. If a receiver catches a pass in the end zone with both feet making contact with the turf then falls out of bounds with possession - HE SCORES.
4. But if you catch a pass inside the end zone.

• You must catch and possess the ball maintaining control.
• Both feet must be down.
• After catching the ball with both feet down you must prove possession and control of the ball by following through with a "football move."

Got that?

They say that had Likely maintained possession a few milliseconds longer to make another step after getting both feet down, he would have qualified as having made a football move. Fact of the matter is that to anyone watching the game live, he scored. No one could makes these rules or hair-splitting decisions without 40 cameras and instant slo-mo replay.

But technically, because Pittsburgh's defender knocked the ball out of his hands before he completed that last football move, it became an incompletion. Baltimore falls from 4th seed through the wildcards all the way down to just being in the hunt. But the rest of Baltimore's schedule is pretty tough.

The end result is that now, the Ravens may or may not make it into the Playoffs at all (where they will surely fail quickly unless Jackson makes a remarkable recovery) and now the Steelers with a slightly easier schedule will now likely MAKE the Playoffs, probably as a wild card, and then get beaten to a pulp mercilessness by a good team.

All because of a split-second technicality.

 

[leftwinger]

He had that ball two steps, completeing a "football move". He thought it was over as did millions watching.

On a sneak, if the tip appears to wave above the goal line for 1ms it is a score. Even if the ball is slapped out of the hands right near the goal line. Crazy crazy.

 

[MarathonMike]

I think it is two steps and CONTROL. He did not have full control of the ball......Good call.

You have no clue. He took two full steps WITH control, then on the THIRD step the ball was knocked loose. Atrocious call that probably took the Ravens out of the playoffs. You are probably just fishing for reactions to move up the leader board.

 

[MarathonMike]

I saw the catch. Even sports analysts are conflicted to understand the NFL rules. There seems to be different rules for every way you catch or run a ball into the end zone!

1. If you just point the ball in your hand past the goal line before any other part of your body touches the ground - YOU'VE SCORED.
2. If a runner carrying the ball just crosses through the end zone enough to plunk the little foam marker at the corner - HE SCORES.
3. If a receiver catches a pass in the end zone with both feet making contact with the turf then falls out of bounds with possession - HE SCORES.
4. But if you catch a pass inside the end zone.

• You must catch and possess the ball maintaining control.
• Both feet must be down.
• After catching the ball with both feet down you must prove possession and control of the ball by following through with a "football move."

Got that?

They say that had Likely maintained possession a few milliseconds longer to make another step after getting both feet down, he would have qualified as having made a football move. Fact of the matter is that to anyone watching the game live, he scored. No one could makes these rules or hair-splitting decisions without 40 cameras and instant slo-mo replay.

But technically, because Pittsburgh's defender knocked the ball out of his hands before he completed that last football move, it became an incompletion. Baltimore falls from 4th seed through the wildcards all the way down to just being in the hunt. But the rest of Baltimore's schedule is pretty tough.

The end result is that now, the Ravens may or may not make it into the Playoffs at all (where they will surely fail quickly unless Jackson makes a remarkable recovery) and now the Steelers with a slightly easier schedule will now likely MAKE the Playoffs, probably as a wild card, and then get beaten to a pulp mercilessness by a good team.

All because of a split-second technicality.

Excellent summation. And whatever happened to MUST BE CLEAR AND CONVINCING TO OVERTURN? FFS this one play encapsulates everything that is wrong with both the "completed catch" word salad and misapplication of replay review.

 

[toobfreak]

He had that ball two steps, completeing a "football move". He thiught it was overas did millions watching.

Apparently, getting both feet down does not also qualify as a football move. You have to make a football move /AFTER/ both catching the ball and getting both feet down---

--- except when you then fall out of the back of the end zone with the ball where no other moves are possible.

 

[1srelluc]

You have no clue. He took two full steps WITH control, then on the THIRD step the ball was knocked loose. Atrocious call that probably took the Ravens out of the playoffs. You are probably just fishing for reactions to move up the leader board.

I watched it myself, no control through the two step process.....But yeah it was damn close.

All scoring plays are reviewed.....Brought to you by Draft Kings.

 

[leftwinger]

Apparently, getting both feet down does not also qualify as a football move. You have to make a football move /AFTER/ both catching the ball and getting both feet down---

--- except when you then fall out of the back of the end zone with the ball where no other moves are possible.

He ran two steps holding the ball in Two hands weirdly out front away from the defender behind. He appeared to drop it willingly to go celebrate

I know. Its weird. Inconsistent rules. Just nicks an endzone marker waving above and you are in. Sigh.

 

[toobfreak]

Atrocious call that probably took the Ravens out of the playoffs.

Excellent summation. And whatever happened to MUST BE CLEAR AND CONVINCING TO OVERTURN? FFS this one play encapsulates everything that is wrong with both the "completed catch" word salad and misapplication of replay review.

On the first point: Yep, probably millions of dollars and people careers and a team's whole season were all determined in 1 millisecond by that one call.

One can certainly argue the contradictions. Even some of the experts in the NFL thought it was a catch. The ref on the field RULED it a catch. They OVERTURNED the field decision based on the "conclusive" evidence availed in replay that Likely did not make enough of a "football move" after establishing the catch AND getting both feet down to establish that he had possession and control of the ball all they way through the catch.

So, the degree of proof changes with how and where you catch the ball in the end zone. If you get the ball anywhere near the end zone most ways, you've scored, but if you catch the ball right in the middle of the zone, you have a higher standard of proof showing that you both CAUGHT the ball, got both feet down, and MAINTAINED posession and control of the ball through the catch and completion of the catch!

Remember, this is the NFL which often rules a ball incomplete even if, upon review, they even see movement of the ball in your hands after the catch indicating any looseness to the grip.

I wonder how long one must hold onto the ball after a catch with both feet down without any defender around to be ruled a TD? What if they simply drop, throw away or give the ball away back to a Ref after the catch without making any particular "football move"? I will be watching subsequent games now trying to find an answer to that question.

 

[MarathonMike]

I watched it myself, no control through the two step process.....But yeah it was damn close.

All scoring plays are reviewed.....Brought to you by Draft Kings.

We see that EXACT SAME CATCH made on the sidelines on every NFL Sunday. They always stand as called. It was a mind boggling overturn that virtually eliminates a team from the playoffs.

 

[MarathonMike]

What if they simply drop, throw away or give the ball away back to a Ref after the catch without making any particular "football move"?

Maybe if Likely had made a Heisman pose after his two steps with control, that would have satisfied the NFL for a "football move". The NFL has muddied the waters so they can pick and choose who they want in the playoffs. Just my cynical opinion.

 

[toobfreak]

He ran two steps holding the ball in Two hands weirdly out front away from the defender behind. He appeared to drop it willingly to go celebrate. I know. Its weird. Inconsistent rules. Just Knicks a marker and you are in. Sigh.

Well, he caught the ball with one foot already down, then a second later, he got his other shoe on the turf, so both feet were down. But I don't think you can count the action of getting both feet down in the end zone also as the "football move." I think the football move must be made after that showing a completion of the catch process with the player controlling the ball through the catch moving on to the next action after that.

Likerly was holding the ball out from his body away from the defender and after the catch, the defender with his arm inside the catcher's arms, managed to knock the ball free; I'm sure the way many people look at it (including Harbaugh) is that once the ball is caught, grip established and both feet are down, just as with any other catch in the end zone, it becomes a TD and a completion. What is confusing is this extra standard of a football move being required when it isn't needed in certain other situations.

What is confusing is the varying standard for a TD, depending on how and where it crosses the goal plane, and I have to conclude that having thought it thorough and discussed it at length in the past, the NFL rules committee decided that the lesser standards used like when a runner crosses the plane is reasoned this way:

• These other standards of both feet down and possession and control making a football move through the TD are not possible because of the different circumstances in these other ways of scoring, therefore not needed.
• In these other ways of scoring, possession and control, etc. were already established by the runner before or as he crossed the plane, so satisfied.

It is all very technical, LW--- if you had a slide rule and knew calculus, I could explain it better to you.

 

[toobfreak]

We see that EXACT SAME CATCH made on the sidelines on every NFL Sunday. They always stand as called.

^^^^^^^^FACT. Every game, receivers catch balls as completions just by catching the ball and getting both feet down. So I have to assume their rationale is that these sideline catches are not TDs and that a football move after the catch is not possible if falling out of the field after the catch!

This would also explain TD catches where the receiver falls out of the zone after the catch, but still, it isn't very satisfying. I think the NFL needs more consistent, less convoluted rules:

Any reception in the end zone is a score so long as his feet are down and he demonstrates control of the ball (actually gripping it) for a time as he catches it.

Forget these football moves. If you catch the ball and control and hold onto it long enough to see that you possessed it even for a second, that is a score, even if a second later the defender, still struggling to break up the play, knocks the ball from your hand after the fact.

Put another way, had Joey Porter not been there, what Likely did would have been good enough to be a TD. If not for Instant Slo-mo Replay, it would have been a catch.

Apparently the intention of the NFL is to make the referees an active part of the game and each team not only has their opponent now, but the referees to play against and defeat as well.

 

[toobfreak]

The NFL has muddied the waters so they can pick and choose who they want in the playoffs. Just my cynical opinion.

Not an unreasonable position considering that:

1. The NFL actively juggles schedules hoping to pit more interesting contests between teams.
2. The NFL juggles broadcast times hoping to pit more interesting contests on MNF and SNF.
3. The NFL is looking to go global now with games now in Europe and beyond.
4. Betting on these games is now both legal and widely supported.
5. The NFL makes a lot more money having a "popular" team like the Chiefs in the Super Bowl than they would say with Cleveland or Cincinnati in the game.

 

[toobfreak]

Maybe if Likely had made a Heisman pose after his two steps with control, that would have satisfied the NFL for a "football move".

It probably would have.

If a receiver catches a TD pass in the end zone with both feet down, it is still not counted as a TD if the receiver then loses the ball on the way down after the catch whether in or falling out of the EZ.

That is my only conclusion here--- just as the receiver must maintain possession after the catch, so too must I assume the receiver must maintain possession in the EZ after the catch enough to show he definitely controlled and possessed the ball.

Except when run in, where the ball need only cross the plane of the goal because control and possession were already established by the run.

Interestingly enough, Mike Tomlin of the Steelers is on the NFL Rules Committee which decides all this stuff.

 

[XponentialChaos]

I give up trying to understand what is and isn’t considered a catch.

 

[leftwinger]

I said decades back the TD rules are a joke. Go to Rugby rules or something....must down the ball with two hands on the turf if running in. Must have two feet in + clear possession when shoved out on pass plays near boundary (like it is).

If a running catch? I guess now add-on must pull to chest possesion with two feet in? The rules vary too much?

Lively thought he had it clean, taunted the guy behind him a little bit with keep away...then seemed to drop it willingly as he knew he had two feet or steps? Be more careful?

 

[leftwinger]

Balt stinks. The overrule was not all that killed them.

Two minutes left they get ball. No replay? holding called? Then they wasted 1.5 min doing what? Huddling up, gaining 8 yards with 2 or three timeouts on the books!!!!

They deserved to lose on that alone. Stupidity off the charts somewhere? LAMAR? Harbaugh? Can't criticize all Black QB....my bad.

 

[MarathonMike]

I give up trying to understand what is and isn’t considered a catch.

One of the examples of a "football move" according to the NFL is "extending the ball" you know how Likely had the ball controlled and extended throughout his two steps in the end zone. WTF??