Question

[meaner gene]

And where does it say that Presidents are not allowed to have presidential records?

It's in the title.

And of course in the body of the law.

 

[meaner gene]

Specifically, the PRA:

Establishes public ownership of all Presidential records and defines the term Presidential records.
Requires that Vice-Presidential records be treated in the same way as Presidential records.

Establishes that Presidential records automatically transfer into the legal custody of the Archivist as soon as the President leaves office.

 

[frigidweirdo]

Trump gave them what they asked for. Boxes and boxes of it. No stalling. No complaints. Handed them over. Then the FBI came calling in the spring and asked to see any other docs Trump took with him. They were let into the storage room and allowed to go through every single box, see what was there, take with them anything they wanted, were told if they wanted anything other than what was in the storage room just ask and it would be produced. They asked for nothing, took nothing, asked that an extra lock be put on the storage room door and left.

If there was anything else they needed, all they had to do was ask for it later. They didn't.

Then just before the midterms, there was the Gestapo type raid on Mar-a-lago, the FBI kicked Trump's lawyer and staff off the premises so nobody could see what they were doing, they ransacked the place, spread empty folders on the floor for a photo op, took boxes with them including personal papers they had no right to have--that it was illegal for them to take--made sure the media had lots of opportunity to take what looked like incriminating photos, and left.

If the FBI had found ANYTHING in all of that they could say was incriminating, you can be damn sure the whole world would have known about it before the midterms as the whole operation was to damage Trump and the GOP before the midterms. They kept even the existence of Biden's docs quiet until after the midterms so as not to hurt the Democrats.

The double standard, the lack of due process, the obvious bias and partisanship, the willingness to bear false witness. . .all of that is pure evil.

Absolute nonsense. Trump played games and people got into trouble for it.

In December 2021 Trump told the National Archives that he would return all the documents that needed to be returned. January 2022 they started to talk to Trump about that process and documents were then sent to the National Archives.
However in May 2022 they seemed to find out that not all documents had been sent to the National Archives. In June they went and Christina Bobb, Trump's attorney at the time, signed a document saying a diligent search had been conducted and all documents responsive to the subpoena were being turned over.

Justice Dept. alleges "obstructive conduct" occurred at Mar-a-Lago after request for classified documents

The Justice Department says Trump's legal team tried to conceal or remove certain records from investigators in the months leading up to the Aug. 8 search.

www.cbsnews.com

"The government alleges that "obstructive conduct" occurred at Mar-a-Lago after Trump's legal team allegedly tried to conceal or remove certain records from investigators in the months leading up to the Aug. 8 search."

Hardly what you'd call giving them everything they asked for, is it? I mean, he should have given EVERYTHING in January, by June he was getting people to lie for him.

 

[BWK]

Other Trump claims:
He had standing declassification orders for documents taken from the oval office and moved to the residence.

Then he didn't need to tell anybody, because he declassified those documents just by thinking about it.

But but, but, he said the FBI planted them there. Trump is so damn ridiculous. And those who defend him have to be feeling abundantly stupid.

 

[BWK]

Deeper and deeper. You really ought to quit before you aren't able to climb out at all.

Climb out of what? I'm not in your rubber duck suit, you are.

 

[Oddball]

Whataboutism? That's all you got?

No whataboutism....Just evidence that you're full of shit.

 

[Oddball]

That's because a federal judge ruled that they were personal records, not presidential records.

Federal Judge

They were (are) both, fool.

 

[Oddball]

Trump did everything wrong. Explain in critical thinking terms how you can claim the documents are yours, yet, accuse the FBI of planting them?

Yet he remains indicted.

He did nothing wrong.

 

[Coyote]

And now Pence found classified documents he says were inadvertently boxed up and sent to his Indiana home.

This on top of the drip-drip-drip of classified docs found in Biden's home and the Penn Biden Center.

All documents presumably they should not have had.

But only Trump's Mar-a-lago home was raided and savaged in the wee hours of the morning to retrieve illegal classified documents so we were told.

QUESTION:

How is it the National Archives didn't know anything about all those documents in Biden's and Pence's possession, never asked for them back, didn't advise the FBI they were missing, but notified the FBI that Trump was illegally keeping documents at Mar-a-lago?

I don’t think there is anything nefarious here. The archives may not be aware of every document, especially since you talking about a couple of dozen over a long span of time. I think the red flag with Trump was that it was boxes of documents that were missing. Archives asked Trump to return them and after a year he had only returned some of them. The FBI was only notified when they found classified material among the files because prior to that it was only related to the Presidential Records Act. With Biden and Pence, the notified the FBI themselves when they found classified material among their records and voluntarily returned them.

What should be the point is how have we gotten so careless?

 

[Foxfyre]

It's in the title.

And of course in the body of the law.

So you don't know. I didn't think so. But have a good night.

 

[Foxfyre]

Absolute nonsense. Trump played games and people got into trouble for it.

In December 2021 Trump told the National Archives that he would return all the documents that needed to be returned. January 2022 they started to talk to Trump about that process and documents were then sent to the National Archives.
However in May 2022 they seemed to find out that not all documents had been sent to the National Archives. In June they went and Christina Bobb, Trump's attorney at the time, signed a document saying a diligent search had been conducted and all documents responsive to the subpoena were being turned over.

Justice Dept. alleges "obstructive conduct" occurred at Mar-a-Lago after request for classified documents

The Justice Department says Trump's legal team tried to conceal or remove certain records from investigators in the months leading up to the Aug. 8 search.

www.cbsnews.com

"The government alleges that "obstructive conduct" occurred at Mar-a-Lago after Trump's legal team allegedly tried to conceal or remove certain records from investigators in the months leading up to the Aug. 8 search."

Hardly what you'd call giving them everything they asked for, is it? I mean, he should have given EVERYTHING in January, by June he was getting people to lie for him.

Your version and I'm sure you believe every word of that. And you can't provide a shred of evidence for it other than for biased media opinion that taught you that version and want you to believe it. They have no evidence either.

 

[Foxfyre]

Climb out of what? I'm not in your rubber duck suit, you are.

Have a good night.

 

[Foxfyre]

I don’t think there is anything nefarious here. The archives may not be aware of every document, especially since you talking about a couple of dozen over a long span of time. I think the red flag with Trump was that it was boxes of documents that were missing. Archives asked Trump to return them and after a year he had only returned some of them. The FBI was only notified when they found classified material among the files because prior to that it was only related to the Presidential Records Act. With Biden and Pence, the notified the FBI themselves when they found classified material among their records and voluntarily returned them.

What should be the point is how have we gotten so careless?

You could be right. I have said all along it all is much ado about nothing, but it is the way that it has all been handled that makes it sinister, ugly, maybe criminal.

And I could be right that from all appearances, NARA has been weaponized to take down Trump along with the DOJ/FBI and the leftwing media. To me, the double standard has become so glaring and obvious, only those really desperate to believe that the Biden Administration are the good guys or totally obsessed with TDS can't see it.

 

[frigidweirdo]

Your version and I'm sure you believe every word of that. And you can't provide a shred of evidence for it other than for biased media opinion that taught you that version and want you to believe it. They have no evidence either.

Right, I can't provide the evidence for it without using sources that you'll dismiss out of hand because.... because.... because you won't believe anything that goes against your narrative.

Seems pretty pointless having a conversation with you then. Bye

 

[Foxfyre]

Right, I can't provide the evidence for it without using sources that you'll dismiss out of hand because.... because.... because you won't believe anything that goes against your narrative.

Seems pretty pointless having a conversation with you then. Bye

So good that you've arrived at that conclusion so I won't have to keep repeating myself over and over and over and over. . .

Good night.

 

[Coyote]

You could be right. I have said all along it all is much ado about nothing, but it is the way that it has all been handled that makes it sinister, ugly, maybe criminal.

I wouldn’t say it is much ado about nothing…the fact that some of it was extremely sensitive and at the highest level of classification and was handled recklessly indicates we have a problem tracking and handling classified material. Three people have now been found to have had it and likely there are more. It is understandable given the chaos and rush of packing during a transition but still it is a problem.

And I could be right that from all appearances, NARA has been weaponized to take down Trump along with the DOJ/FBI and the leftwing media. To me, the double standard has become so glaring and obvious, only those really desperate to believe that the Biden Administration are the good guys or totally obsessed with TDS can't see it.

I don’t think they’ve been weaponized and I think there is a danger in assuming an agency has been weaponized simply because it goes after Trump without considering the bigger picture. NARA spent a year discretely trying to get the documents back that belonged to it per the Presidential Records Act. Did you read anything about it during that time? I didn’t, so if it was in the news it certainly didn’t rise to the level of a headline. It didn’t get much attention until NARA discovered classified material in the boxes it finally got and that drastically changed it from a simple dispute over the presidential records act to a much more serious issue.

I think it also can’t be ignored that Trump obstructed and fought returning more documents and did not allow an extensive search of his properties while both Biden and Pence reported what was found and allowed unobstructed access. I don’t think it is a double standard.

 

[SC Patriot]

They have temporary SCIFs that are moveable.

So? Thats a diversion.

A SCIF is a SCIF. There are rules. You cant enter with anything that may allow you to record, photo or copy and you may not leave with anything.

Next you will say...

Well, a SCIF can be found in any state.

I see your approach

 

[sparky]

Jesus suggested those who bore false witness, ie those who accused without evidence or witnesses, might be in serious moral jeopardy.

I would consider a giant smoking hole , where DC used to be, evidence of His return Fox.......~S~

 

[OldFlame]

So good that you've arrived at that conclusion so I won't have to keep repeating myself over and over and over and over. . .

Good night.

Unfortunately, as evidenced in this thread, you can provide facts and it won't matter to these willfully ignorant idiots that make up their own 'facts'. It's an effort in futility to even argue with them, but I certainly respect your effort and your civility, far better than I could do.

 

[Independent thinker]

And now Pence found classified documents he says were inadvertently boxed up and sent to his Indiana home.

This on top of the drip-drip-drip of classified docs found in Biden's home and the Penn Biden Center.

All documents presumably they should not have had.

But only Trump's Mar-a-lago home was raided and savaged in the wee hours of the morning to retrieve illegal classified documents so we were told.

QUESTION:

How is it the National Archives didn't know anything about all those documents in Biden's and Pence's possession, never asked for them back, didn't advise the FBI they were missing, but notified the FBI that Trump was illegally keeping documents at Mar-a-lago?

It's a question the left can't answer without tripping all over themselves.