Psych exams for gun purchases

[Big Bend Texas]

Boy, that's certainly the pot calling the kettle black.

When I asked you the basis on which you would deny Ramos the right to buy a gun, you gave me two ivalid answers. The first answer had to do with his age. Well, you can't deny someone that Constitutional right because it's perfectly lawful for an 18 year old to buy a rifle. If you don't like that, change the law, but you can't deny someone their right because you don't happen to agree with it.

The second reason you gave was his past criminal history. Well, as of right now it's not even clear whether or not he eve had a juvenile record. You can't deny someone their Constitutional right based on your fear that he may have a juvenile record.

So, you want to have a discussion, let's have it: On what valid basis would you have denied Ramos the right to buy a rifle?

Juvenile records are also sealed when you turn 18 and are not used against you as an adult on background checks.

 

[Canon Shooter]

Juvenile records are also sealed when you turn 18 and are not used against you as an adult on background checks.

Oh, I'm well aware.

I just don't think YoursTruly knows that...

 

[Big Bend Texas]

Oh, I'm well aware.

I just don't think YoursTruly knows that...

Nor apparently much of anything else.

 

[YoursTruly]

Boy, that's certainly the pot calling the kettle black.

When I asked you the basis on which you would deny Ramos the right to buy a gun, you gave me two ivalid answers. The first answer had to do with his age. Well, you can't deny someone that Constitutional right because it's perfectly lawful for an 18 year old to buy a rifle. If you don't like that, change the law, but you can't deny someone their right because you don't happen to agree with it.

The second reason you gave was his past criminal history. Well, as of right now it's not even clear whether or not he eve had a juvenile record. You can't deny someone their Constitutional right based on your fear that he may have a juvenile record.

So, you want to have a discussion, let's have it: On what valid basis would you have denied Ramos the right to buy a rifle?

You can't deny those things because of the current laws that needs to be addressed to cover people who are actually not mentally stable. The only way to find out is by a psych exam.

 

[YoursTruly]

Oh, I'm well aware.

I just don't think YoursTruly knows that...

Yes I am.

 

[Big Bend Texas]

You can't deny those things because of the current laws that needs to be addressed to cover people who are actually not mentally stable. The only way to find out is by a psych exam.

We have laws to deal with them already, just enforce them. You don't then have to infringe on the rights of the other 300,000,000 Americans to accomplish something that might make a difference.

 

[Big Bend Texas]

Yes I am.

Then what in this young man's record would have prevented him from purchasing a firearm?

 

[Nuthin' Fancy]

No….we know that leftists would weaponize mental health care against gun owners and republicans

We know Trump and his cult has been weaponizing mental health against Americans.

November 6 2017
On Sunday morning, a man opened fire on a congregation at a Baptist church in Sutherland Springs, Texas. According to the most recent count, the gunman killed at least 26 people. The attack, which is the 378th mass shooting in 2017, was met online with a mixture of sadness and cynicism.

President Trump, who is currently traveling in Asia, explained why he thinks gun control is definitely not the problem when he answered questions about the shooting on Monday morning:

Mental health is your problem here. This was a very—based on preliminary reports—a very deranged individual. A lot of problems over a long period of time. We have a lot of mental health problems in our country, as do other countries. But this isn’t a guns situation. I mean, we could go into it, but it’s a little bit soon to go into it. … But this is a mental health problem at the highest level. It’s a very, very sad event. It’s—these are great people, and a very, very sad event. But that’s the way I view it.

February 15 2018
President Donald Trump offered some solemn remarks Thursday addressing the mass shooting at a Florida high school which left at least 17 dead. Trump laid the blame on the mental health of the shooter and declined to mention the issues of gun violence or gun control.

“We are committed to working with state and local leaders to help secure our schools and tackle the difficult issue of mental health,” said Trump. “Later this month, I will be meeting with the nation’s governors and attorney generals, where making our schools and our children safer will be our top priority.”

August 5 2019
Last week, Donald Trump responded to the mass shootings in El Paso, Texas, and Dayton, Ohio, by saying that “mental illness and hatred pulls the trigger, not the gun.”


During his speech at the NRA convention in Houston, former President Donald Trump said the U.S. needs to “drastically change” its approach to mental health and called for more school security. Trump’s comments come in the wake of a shooting at Robb Elementary School in Uvalde, Texas, where 19 students and two teachers were killed.

 

[Nuthin' Fancy]

But the orange retard, granted them the right to own them.

August 5 2019
President Donald Trump responded to the El Paso and Dayton mass shootings by insisting Monday that “mental illness pulls the trigger not the gun,” but shortly after taking office he quietly rolled back an Obama-era regulation that would have made it harder for people with mental illness to buy guns.

Trump did so without any fanfare. In fact, the news that Trump had signed the bill was at the bottom of a White House email that alerted the media to other legislation signed by the president.

"It has been the NRA’s long-standing position that those who have been adjudicated as a danger to themselves or others should not have access to firearms and should be admitted for treatment," it said.

But two years ago, the NRA insisted the Obama rule infringed on Second Amendment rights to buy guns, even though the regulation specifically targeted people who were diagnosed with mental illness.

The NRA “applauded” Trump’s action at the time and then-executive director Chris Cox said the move “marks a new era for law-abiding gun owners, as we now have a president who respects and supports our arms.”

 

[there4eyeM]

There are no "rights" that exist out of the context of responsibility, with perhaps the exception of the right to remain silent.
One has the right to powerful projectile weapons when one demonstrates requisite responsibility. Those who wrote the Constitution knew that so well that writing it didn't occur to them. It is brainless to provide unlimited firepower to the witless.

 

[Canon Shooter]

You can't deny those things because of the current laws that needs to be addressed to cover people who are actually not mentally stable. The only way to find out is by a psych exam.

So, would you then agree that, at the time he purchased the gun he used, that there was legal reason to not sell him the firearm?

 

[Canon Shooter]

Yes I am.

You just don't care.

That's even worse than not knowing...

 

[Canon Shooter]

One has the right to powerful projectile weapons when one demonstrates requisite responsibility.

Perhaps in some jurisdictions, but that's simply not true for all jurusdictions...

 

[SweetSue92]

The times are uh changin. If the right doesn't do something about the lefts newly attempts to dismantle the 2A, the red flood coming in Nov. won't be much more than a small wave.

The right better do something besides ignore this situation that's upon them. Speaking from a political strategy stand point, if the right tries to ignore this gun violence issue, they won't gain near as many seats.

So, I was thinking (Oh noooo. Here he goes again)
If the right came up with a law that states one must pass a psych exam in order to purchase a gun, what should applicants be disqualified for.

I know, I know. It's retarded. But doing nothing is the government allowing more mass killings. I get the point, because I'm pro 2A. Laws don't stop crime. Gun laws aren't going to stop mass shooting. I get all that. So I'm asking for some common sense here.

Me personally, I didn't mind getting a gun permit. In fact, I bragged about it when I first got it. Even thought having to get one, meant I was allowing the state government to infringe upon my 2A. But in the end, I'm still able to carry. I'm still able to put myself in a position to save lives if the chance arises.

So I'm thinking, the things that would disqualify someone from legally buying a gun would be the following. Please add your ideas.

1. Anyone with a record of violence in their recent history. Say 5 years. (per 911 calls or provable reports)
2. Anyone who's committed any sort of crime, using a gun. Whether it was fired or not. (holstered doesn't count as using)
3. Anyone with a history of mental disorders in the last 5 years. Especially those on mental meds to control their behavior.

One thing that needs to be highly protected are decent gun owners from false accusations. Decent gun owners pose no threat to society. In fact, in many instances, they've protected and saved many lives using their weapons. Those peoples rights should in no way, shape or form, be infringed upon.
People like Ramos, I could care less about their rights.



Let's dance.

I am a Christian conservative. So half this country (liberals) already think I am mentally ill.

So no. There's your answer. No.

 

[CommieKillingMommy]

Psych exams for gun purchases

YOU need an exam. All you do is whine like a little girl about guns. My God, grow a pai will you? You are embarrassing.

 

[BluesLegend]

That's exactly what I'd like to avoid. How many times must I say it, "We can't have laws that restrict decent gun owners. But we need a system in place, backed by laws, that prevent mentally ill people from LEGALLY buying guns. The only way to reduce the threat is to force people to take some sort of legitimate psych exam before they're eligible to buy a gun.
I don't like that idea, but until the people of this country calm the F down and stop shooting everyone, I don't see any other way.
I can pass a psych test. Almost everyone I know can pass one.

Is it a 100% solution? Of course not. Nothing is, when it comes to humans. No one is looking for perfection. It's stupid to even think perfection can be accomplished.

The goal is to put the guns into the hands of decent people & reduce the amount of psycho's with guns. Psych exams can show signs of some mental or anger issues.

A decent psychologist could've spent 5 minutes with this Ramos dude and discovered there was something wrong. Just the fact that he was living with his grandparents, instead of his parents showed something was wrong. An interview with his parents, to get both sides of the story would've undoubtedly put Ramos on the no buy list.

Again, it's not 100%. No one is looking for perfection.

^^^ THIS is how you solve the problem, by focusing on the root cause. Well done sir!

It's not the instrument of their evil act, it's that they are f'ed up in the head. Take away one instrument and they will find another. Bomb, truck, small plane instruments are plenty.

 

[2aguy]

We know Trump and his cult has been weaponizing mental health against Americans.

November 6 2017
On Sunday morning, a man opened fire on a congregation at a Baptist church in Sutherland Springs, Texas. According to the most recent count, the gunman killed at least 26 people. The attack, which is the 378th mass shooting in 2017, was met online with a mixture of sadness and cynicism.

President Trump, who is currently traveling in Asia, explained why he thinks gun control is definitely not the problem when he answered questions about the shooting on Monday morning:





February 15 2018
President Donald Trump offered some solemn remarks Thursday addressing the mass shooting at a Florida high school which left at least 17 dead. Trump laid the blame on the mental health of the shooter and declined to mention the issues of gun violence or gun control.

“We are committed to working with state and local leaders to help secure our schools and tackle the difficult issue of mental health,” said Trump. “Later this month, I will be meeting with the nation’s governors and attorney generals, where making our schools and our children safer will be our top priority.”

August 5 2019
Last week, Donald Trump responded to the mass shootings in El Paso, Texas, and Dayton, Ohio, by saying that “mental illness and hatred pulls the trigger, not the gun.”


During his speech at the NRA convention in Houston, former President Donald Trump said the U.S. needs to “drastically change” its approach to mental health and called for more school security. Trump’s comments come in the wake of a shooting at Robb Elementary School in Uvalde, Texas, where 19 students and two teachers were killed.

How does Trump have anything to do with any of that, you dumb ass?

The guy who tried to murder the Republican baseball team? A left wing democrat supporter of Bernie Sanders, and Elizabeth Warren.......

Black racist ran over Whites at the Christmas parade in Waukesha...

Blm Supporter murdered 6 police officer in Dallas...

Left wing racist just murdered 10 people in Buffalo.....

Communist Chinese man murdered 6 Taiwanese Americans in California.....

 

[2aguy]

But the orange retard, granted them the right to own them.

August 5 2019
President Donald Trump responded to the El Paso and Dayton mass shootings by insisting Monday that “mental illness pulls the trigger not the gun,” but shortly after taking office he quietly rolled back an Obama-era regulation that would have made it harder for people with mental illness to buy guns.

Trump did so without any fanfare. In fact, the news that Trump had signed the bill was at the bottom of a White House email that alerted the media to other legislation signed by the president.

"It has been the NRA’s long-standing position that those who have been adjudicated as a danger to themselves or others should not have access to firearms and should be admitted for treatment," it said.

But two years ago, the NRA insisted the Obama rule infringed on Second Amendment rights to buy guns, even though the regulation specifically targeted people who were diagnosed with mental illness.

The NRA “applauded” Trump’s action at the time and then-executive director Chris Cox said the move “marks a new era for law-abiding gun owners, as we now have a president who respects and supports our arms.”

Nope.....Trump stopped assholes like you from weaponizing mental health against gun owners.....and he did so with the ACLU and 23 other mental health groups supporting him....you dumb ass

Gun Control Laws Should Be Fair

But gun control laws, like any law, should be fair, effective and not based on prejudice or stereotype. This rule met none of those criteria.

In this era of “alternative facts,” we must urge politicians to create laws based on reliable evidence and solid data.

The thousands of Americans whose disability benefits are managed by someone else range from young people with depression and financial inexperience to older adults with Down syndrome needing help with a limited budget. But no data — none — show that these individuals have a propensity for violence in general or gun violence in particular.

To the contrary, studies show that people with mental disabilities are less likely to commit firearm crimes than to be the victimsof violence by others.

--------------------------
The ACLU and 23 national disability groups did not oppose this rule because we want more guns in our community. This is about more than guns. Adding more innocent Americans to the National Instant Criminal Background database because of a mental disability is a disturbing trend — one that could be applied to voting, parenting or other rights dearer than gun ownership. We opposed it because it would do little to stem gun violence but do much to harm our civil rights.

 

[2aguy]

So, would you then agree that, at the time he purchased the gun he used, that there was legal reason to not sell him the firearm?

Yeah....but the gun store didn't know it because his family, his school, and the police didn't do anything that would have flagged him on his background check...

Government failed...again, as they do in too many of these cases....

Normal gun owners? Didn't do anything wrong that day.

 

[Canon Shooter]

Yeah....but the gun store didn't know it because his family, his school, and the police didn't do anything that would have flagged him on his background check...

Government failed...again, as they do in too many of these cases....

Normal gun owners? Didn't do anything wrong that day.

You're really not making a great deal of sense.

Why would the police have been involved? There's currently no evidence that he had a juvenile record. If he didn't that would certainly explain the lack of action taken by law enforcement. His family? His school? What did he do that should've been reported to the authorities by his family or teachers?