Poverty and ignorance breeds crime. Economic immigrants and refugees are poor and uneducated. 2+2=4

[Coyote]

Actually the article I quoted also mentions the greater amount of economic poverty in Mexican immigrants. Again, I suspect you did not actually read it so I will help you out here:

But broadly speaking, Mexican immigrants are disproportionately less educated and poor, typically working in agriculture, low-paying service jobs, manufacturing, or construction;

Exactly it has nothing to do with poverty at all, but using an overly biased article (from aa far left hack site) does not help your case.

So you really have anything are do you just get away with derailing the thread with far left religious dogma?

But you do prove that the far left does not see a different in "illegal" and "legal" immigration!

So again what doe sit have to do with poverty?

It is part of the broader conversation in this thread which you are trying to troll and derail because you you got spanked for derailing another thread. If you want to continue down this road Kosh we can go there. I can ask another mod to take a look so you can’t whine about bias. It is your choice.

I see that your personal feelings spill into the conversation, but yes please do it. Especially since you mention moderator actions in your post!

Once again the far left troll derails the thread and the claims someone else is doing it. Now that is rich!

Again what does that have to do with poverty? Can you answer the question or not?

It is a moderator message Kosh, and clearly being nice and low key about it isn’t working, you just want to keep escalating. Knock it off or take this fight to the FZ.

Sorry you mentioned past moderation actions not me, so please get all senior mods and administration to look.

Done.

 

[Coyote]

Perhaps for those people, who seem to fill jobs no one one else will, we should have more work visa’s instead of citizenship.

They do not want to go through the legal process, that is what you far left drones fail to grasp!

They might if there were an efficient legal process that fit our need for workers and their need for work.

See how the far left justifies "illegal" immigration?

They do not want it, that is what you far left drones fail to understand which you have just proven with this post!

But again what does it have to do with poverty?

It isn’t justifying illegal immigration, except in your little echo chamber of thought. It is looking at providing a legal avenue of immigration to reduce the pressure to immigrate illegally. As to what it has to do with poverty, that is pretty simple...even you should grasp it. Poverty is what is driving economic migrants,

Again far left drone troll, they do not want to go through any process.

A process already exists and if the far left wanted to fix it they could, but they choose not to. So it must not be a problem now is it?

Get your side to fix it and change it instead of allowing it!

In this case it is your side that holds all the power. Why can’t you fix it?

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

Many immigrants come to America out of poverty through out our history.

Is there a point here?

This is the year 2018 and we face problems unique to the era we live in. The left wants to invite in millions of immigrants/refugees and ignore millions more illegal ones, and God only knows how bad it would be without Republican opposition. How can we hope to have affordable social programs for Americans with that going on? Also poor and uneducated people are going to commit more crime. I recognize not all of them will do that, but a lot will because they're poor and uneducated. I personally can't justify increased victimization of Americans for the sake of foreigners.

Unsurprisingly diminishing the quality of life in America for the sake of foreigners is becoming more and more unpopular among voters.

This is as ignorant as it is ridiculous, hateful, and wrong.

We are a Nation of immigrants, they are our greatest asset – enhancing and improving our quality of life.

 

[Kosh]

See how the far left justifies "illegal" immigration?

They do not want it, that is what you far left drones fail to understand which you have just proven with this post!

But again what does it have to do with poverty?

It isn’t justifying illegal immigration, except in your little echo chamber of thought. It is looking at providing a legal avenue of immigration to reduce the pressure to immigrate illegally. As to what it has to do with poverty, that is pretty simple...even you should grasp it. Poverty is what is driving economic migrants,

Again far left drone troll, they do not want to go through any process.

A process already exists and if the far left wanted to fix it they could, but they choose not to. So it must not be a problem now is it?

Get your side to fix it and change it instead of allowing it!

No one side can fix immigration, it is a bipartisan problem needing bipartisan solutions.

Show where your far left masters want to fix the problem!

There have been multiple immigration bills attempted by the Dems that never gain traction. Same with Republicans. Congress as a whole does not want to deal with it or can not.

Yes and how many of the (D) addressed this particular problem?

Please cite the bills where they address this..

 

[Confounding]

How much of our own comfort are we willing to sacrifice for this feel good bullshit? Do you have any idea how many poor and desperate people there are in the world? I'll give you a hint; there are a **** load. The first world can't save everybody, and in attempting to do so we're just going to shoot ourselves in the foot. If the left got its way we would actually be fucked. The Republicans do a lot of stupid shit, but thank **** for their stance on immigration. If we actually want to help these people we need to figure out how to help them where they live.

Do you disappointed lefties want to know why Trump won, and why he will win again? It's because you people would **** up everything if you had full control of the immigration situation. That one issue is hurting the left badly. If you'd just pull your heads out of your asses and focus on Americans you would start dominating elections.

“Poverty and ignorance breeds crime. Economic immigrants and refugees are poor and uneducated. 2+2=4”

This fails as a confusion of correlation and causation fallacy.

It’s also factually wrong:

Contrary to Trump’s Claims, Immigrants Are Less Likely to Commit Crimes

“A central point of an executive order President Trump signed on Wednesday — and a mainstay of his campaign speeches — is the view that undocumented immigrants pose a threat to public safety.

But several studies, over many years, have concluded that immigrants are less likely to commit crimes than people born in the United States. And experts say the available evidence does not support the idea that undocumented immigrants commit a disproportionate share of crime.”

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/01/26/us/trump-illegal-immigrants-crime.html

Trump won in part the consequence of ignorance, hate, and an unwarranted fear of immigrants – having nothing to do with ‘the left.’

The same ignorance and hate exhibited in this thread’s premise.

Poor and ignorant people commit more crime. That's true all over the world. Their being immigrants is irrelevant. America does not need more poor people.

 

[Confounding]

This is as ignorant as it is ridiculous, hateful, and wrong.

We are a Nation of immigrants, they are our greatest asset – enhancing and improving our quality of life.

You're insane if you think refugees and economic immigrants pouring in from our southern border is going to improve our quality of life.

 

[Kosh]

They do not want to go through the legal process, that is what you far left drones fail to grasp!

They might if there were an efficient legal process that fit our need for workers and their need for work.

See how the far left justifies "illegal" immigration?

They do not want it, that is what you far left drones fail to understand which you have just proven with this post!

But again what does it have to do with poverty?

It isn’t justifying illegal immigration, except in your little echo chamber of thought. It is looking at providing a legal avenue of immigration to reduce the pressure to immigrate illegally. As to what it has to do with poverty, that is pretty simple...even you should grasp it. Poverty is what is driving economic migrants,

Again far left drone troll, they do not want to go through any process.

A process already exists and if the far left wanted to fix it they could, but they choose not to. So it must not be a problem now is it?

Get your side to fix it and change it instead of allowing it!

In this case it is your side that holds all the power. Why can’t you fix it?

My side is not supporting the far left!

They tried to fix it, the (D) will block anything being part of the resistance, it is your side being the problem and not wanting to fix anything!

They only want to give out free money other than that they do not have any interest in fixing any problems on the border. Your side promotes the problem by ignoring it!

Again what does it have to do with poverty?

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

The population of the world is 7.5 billion people. How many of those 7.5 billion should we offer refuge in your opinion as a Blame America First citizen?

Are you saying we have no responsibility for the countries we wrecked (thinking of Iraq here...)?

Yes, that's exactly what I'm saying. In most cases we go into those war torn nations and spend tens of billions rebuilding. That's enough as far as I'm concerned. We can't give a free pass to people where our battles are fought as an excuse to get into this country.

Disagree. We invaded and destabilized a country - and not for self defense.

We have a moral obligation.

And this moral obligation is written where? Why should those people be allowed in our country with a free pass because they allowed a dictator to run their country that we had to get rid of?

Why should we INVADE another country and wreck it?

So ‘we’ can get reelected president in 2004.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

If you and your ancestors thought the same millions of natives didnt have to lose their lives and land.

Yeah, I'm sorry about the native Americans, but that shit happened and we are where we are. Do you have a realistic argument to make?

You first.

 

[Coyote]

It isn’t justifying illegal immigration, except in your little echo chamber of thought. It is looking at providing a legal avenue of immigration to reduce the pressure to immigrate illegally. As to what it has to do with poverty, that is pretty simple...even you should grasp it. Poverty is what is driving economic migrants,

Again far left drone troll, they do not want to go through any process.

A process already exists and if the far left wanted to fix it they could, but they choose not to. So it must not be a problem now is it?

Get your side to fix it and change it instead of allowing it!

No one side can fix immigration, it is a bipartisan problem needing bipartisan solutions.

Show where your far left masters want to fix the problem!

There have been multiple immigration bills attempted by the Dems that never gain traction. Same with Republicans. Congress as a whole does not want to deal with it or can not.

Yes and how many of the (D) addressed this particular problem?

Please cite the bills where they address this..

No, google is your friend if you are that curious.

Here is one article of an idea that was being proposed though but the sticking point was Dems wanted to offer a path to citizenship as well. I agree with the Republicans on this one.

Should foreign farm workers be allowed to become citizens? GOP, Democrats disagree

 

[Coyote]

How much of our own comfort are we willing to sacrifice for this feel good bullshit? Do you have any idea how many poor and desperate people there are in the world? I'll give you a hint; there are a **** load. The first world can't save everybody, and in attempting to do so we're just going to shoot ourselves in the foot. If the left got its way we would actually be fucked. The Republicans do a lot of stupid shit, but thank **** for their stance on immigration. If we actually want to help these people we need to figure out how to help them where they live.

Do you disappointed lefties want to know why Trump won, and why he will win again? It's because you people would **** up everything if you had full control of the immigration situation. That one issue is hurting the left badly. If you'd just pull your heads out of your asses and focus on Americans you would start dominating elections.

“Poverty and ignorance breeds crime. Economic immigrants and refugees are poor and uneducated. 2+2=4”

This fails as a confusion of correlation and causation fallacy.

It’s also factually wrong:

Contrary to Trump’s Claims, Immigrants Are Less Likely to Commit Crimes

“A central point of an executive order President Trump signed on Wednesday — and a mainstay of his campaign speeches — is the view that undocumented immigrants pose a threat to public safety.

But several studies, over many years, have concluded that immigrants are less likely to commit crimes than people born in the United States. And experts say the available evidence does not support the idea that undocumented immigrants commit a disproportionate share of crime.”

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/01/26/us/trump-illegal-immigrants-crime.html

Trump won in part the consequence of ignorance, hate, and an unwarranted fear of immigrants – having nothing to do with ‘the left.’

The same ignorance and hate exhibited in this thread’s premise.

Poor and ignorant people commit more crime. That's true all over the world. Their being immigrants is irrelevant. America does not need more poor people.

Poor people can also work their way out of poverty and in the case of immigrants coming here, many do by the next generation.

 

[Kosh]

Again far left drone troll, they do not want to go through any process.

A process already exists and if the far left wanted to fix it they could, but they choose not to. So it must not be a problem now is it?

Get your side to fix it and change it instead of allowing it!

No one side can fix immigration, it is a bipartisan problem needing bipartisan solutions.

Show where your far left masters want to fix the problem!

There have been multiple immigration bills attempted by the Dems that never gain traction. Same with Republicans. Congress as a whole does not want to deal with it or can not.

Yes and how many of the (D) addressed this particular problem?

Please cite the bills where they address this..

No, google is your friend if you are that curious.

Here is one article of an idea that was being proposed though but the sticking point was Dems wanted to offer a path to citizenship as well. I agree with the Republicans on this one.

Should foreign farm workers be allowed to become citizens? GOP, Democrats disagree

That has nothing to do with what you posted making easier to get work visas.

And you still did not cite where the (D)'s want to really fix the problem. Just another article that derails from the point you were even trying to make.

Yes you would agree as it is about amnesty! That is the far left drone in you that agrees with that!

 

[Coyote]

They might if there were an efficient legal process that fit our need for workers and their need for work.

See how the far left justifies "illegal" immigration?

They do not want it, that is what you far left drones fail to understand which you have just proven with this post!

But again what does it have to do with poverty?

It isn’t justifying illegal immigration, except in your little echo chamber of thought. It is looking at providing a legal avenue of immigration to reduce the pressure to immigrate illegally. As to what it has to do with poverty, that is pretty simple...even you should grasp it. Poverty is what is driving economic migrants,

Again far left drone troll, they do not want to go through any process.

A process already exists and if the far left wanted to fix it they could, but they choose not to. So it must not be a problem now is it?

Get your side to fix it and change it instead of allowing it!

In this case it is your side that holds all the power. Why can’t you fix it?

My side is not supporting the far left!

They tried to fix it, the (D) will block anything being part of the resistance, it is your side being the problem and not wanting to fix anything!

They only want to give out free money other than that they do not have any interest in fixing any problems on the border. Your side promotes the problem by ignoring it!

Again what does it have to do with poverty?

You asked me a question, I answered it. Improving the process for worker Visas might reduce the flow on the illegal side. These are economic migrants, not necessarily looking for citizenship.

 

[Kosh]

How much of our own comfort are we willing to sacrifice for this feel good bullshit? Do you have any idea how many poor and desperate people there are in the world? I'll give you a hint; there are a **** load. The first world can't save everybody, and in attempting to do so we're just going to shoot ourselves in the foot. If the left got its way we would actually be fucked. The Republicans do a lot of stupid shit, but thank **** for their stance on immigration. If we actually want to help these people we need to figure out how to help them where they live.

Do you disappointed lefties want to know why Trump won, and why he will win again? It's because you people would **** up everything if you had full control of the immigration situation. That one issue is hurting the left badly. If you'd just pull your heads out of your asses and focus on Americans you would start dominating elections.

“Poverty and ignorance breeds crime. Economic immigrants and refugees are poor and uneducated. 2+2=4”

This fails as a confusion of correlation and causation fallacy.

It’s also factually wrong:

Contrary to Trump’s Claims, Immigrants Are Less Likely to Commit Crimes

“A central point of an executive order President Trump signed on Wednesday — and a mainstay of his campaign speeches — is the view that undocumented immigrants pose a threat to public safety.

But several studies, over many years, have concluded that immigrants are less likely to commit crimes than people born in the United States. And experts say the available evidence does not support the idea that undocumented immigrants commit a disproportionate share of crime.”

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/01/26/us/trump-illegal-immigrants-crime.html

Trump won in part the consequence of ignorance, hate, and an unwarranted fear of immigrants – having nothing to do with ‘the left.’

The same ignorance and hate exhibited in this thread’s premise.

Poor and ignorant people commit more crime. That's true all over the world. Their being immigrants is irrelevant. America does not need more poor people.

Poor people can also work their way out of poverty and in the case of immigrants coming here, many do by the next generation.

Yes we have many generations of illegal in the country, you would think after being here a few years they would want to be here legally.

See the far left doe snot care about the laws on the books, they just want to ignore them for their new special group.

Just like tthose that have been here for over 15 years complaining about being deported when they refused to go through the legal process.

 

[BookShaka]

We need to quit making other nations suffer for our gain.

I agree, but overloading our social programs with poor migrants that are high risk to commit crimes because of their impoverished status is not the answer. Even if everything is our fault the answer is not to bring them here. It won't work, and a lot of people are waking up. Donald WILL win again if the left doesn't start to change its tune on immigration, especially illegal immigration.

How do we make our own people (especially anti-Trumpers) understand that the reasons the right don’t want the country flooded unchecked with foreigners is bc it’s not in our best interest? These people refuse to see beyond their inaccurate belief that it’s bc of racism and attempts to make them see things rationally is usually a waste of time bc they’re incapable of getting past their own bias.

If Americans were more open-minded and we didn’t have a government set on playing partisan games over doing what’s best for the people, we’d be a whole lot better off. Sadly I don’t see either of these things happening anytime soon.

 

[TheDude]

Go here, and click on the "Rate" column. This provides the proof necessary to show the progressive stance on immigration is another demonstration of contrary thought. List of countries by intentional homicide rate - Wikipedia

 

[Kosh]

See how the far left justifies "illegal" immigration?

They do not want it, that is what you far left drones fail to understand which you have just proven with this post!

But again what does it have to do with poverty?

It isn’t justifying illegal immigration, except in your little echo chamber of thought. It is looking at providing a legal avenue of immigration to reduce the pressure to immigrate illegally. As to what it has to do with poverty, that is pretty simple...even you should grasp it. Poverty is what is driving economic migrants,

Again far left drone troll, they do not want to go through any process.

A process already exists and if the far left wanted to fix it they could, but they choose not to. So it must not be a problem now is it?

Get your side to fix it and change it instead of allowing it!

In this case it is your side that holds all the power. Why can’t you fix it?

My side is not supporting the far left!

They tried to fix it, the (D) will block anything being part of the resistance, it is your side being the problem and not wanting to fix anything!

They only want to give out free money other than that they do not have any interest in fixing any problems on the border. Your side promotes the problem by ignoring it!

Again what does it have to do with poverty?

You asked me a question, I answered it. Improving the process for worker Visas might reduce the flow on the illegal side. These are economic migrants, not necessarily looking for citizenship.

Yes I asked a question and your article did not even come to close to what you posted. It is typical far left drone troll derailment.

It talks about amnesty. Not streaming the current work visa process.

 

[Coyote]

No one side can fix immigration, it is a bipartisan problem needing bipartisan solutions.

Show where your far left masters want to fix the problem!

There have been multiple immigration bills attempted by the Dems that never gain traction. Same with Republicans. Congress as a whole does not want to deal with it or can not.

Yes and how many of the (D) addressed this particular problem?

Please cite the bills where they address this..

No, google is your friend if you are that curious.

Here is one article of an idea that was being proposed though but the sticking point was Dems wanted to offer a path to citizenship as well. I agree with the Republicans on this one.

Should foreign farm workers be allowed to become citizens? GOP, Democrats disagree

That has nothing to do with what you posted making easier to get work visas.

And you still did not cite where the (D)'s want to really fix the problem. Just another article that derails from the point you were even trying to make.

Yes you would agree as it is about amnesty! That is the far left drone in you that agrees with that!

Did you even read it Kosh? I swear, you act like a little automatim with a fixed set of index cards with which to answer from. You did not read it. The sticking point is whether to provide a path to citizenship for agricultural workers who came in illegally. I agree with the Republicans on this. Increasing and streamlining the worker visa system, allowing them to apply and get a legal worker status (as long as they haven’t committed serious crimes) but no jumping to the head of the immigration line would be a possible solution.

 

[Coyote]

We need to quit making other nations suffer for our gain.

I agree, but overloading our social programs with poor migrants that are high risk to commit crimes because of their impoverished status is not the answer. Even if everything is our fault the answer is not to bring them here. It won't work, and a lot of people are waking up. Donald WILL win again if the left doesn't start to change its tune on immigration, especially illegal immigration.

How do we make our own people (especially anti-Trumpers) understand that the reasons the right don’t want the country flooded unchecked with foreigners is bc it’s not in our best interest? These people refuse to see beyond their inaccurate belief that it’s bc of racism and attempts to make them see things rationally is usually a waste of time bc they’re incapable of getting past their own bias.

If Americans were more open-minded and we didn’t have a government set on playing partisan games over doing what’s best for the people, we’d be a whole lot better off. Sadly I don’t see either of these things happening anytime soon.

There is no unchecked flood of foreigners nor is anyone advocating that.

 

[BookShaka]

That means if they are begging for asylum, they get their hearings, without having their children ripped away and thrown into foster care. It's nothing more than than behaving like a civilized country.

Of course the media isn’t reporting this, but some of these children who’ve been “ripped away” were with dangerous people, some of them who weren’t who they said they were in relation to the child. I guess you’d rather keep children with criminals than make sure they’re in a safe situation? The biggest problem I see with lefties is they can’t see past their own nose and this is a good example of that. Before getting all fired up about child separations, maybe think of WHY they may be happening in the first place—is that not reasonable?