Poll: Who has enforcement authority of the 14th Amendment to the US Constitution?

[TroglocratsRdumb]

The die-hard crazy Insurrection Conspiracy Theorists are too dumb to be embarrassed.

 

[BlindBoo]

They should hold off on making any decision and expedite Jack Smith's Jan 6th case by ruling quickly on the delay tactic of endless and baseless appeals.

 

[meaner gene]

As it originally passed the House, the 14th Amendment's third section was not nearly as broad as the version now being invoked to strike Trump's name from the ballot. It was narrowly crafted to apply only to those who willingly took part in the Civil War, and it was only meant to deprive former confederates of their right to cast ballots in federal elections. It also had an expiration date.

The 14th wasn't narrowly tailored. It used insurrection and not civil war as the standard. And was aimed to make sure those that commit or assist insurrection can't get their hands on any government office, federal or state. With no limits on its application.

 

[meaner gene]

You're right, SCOTUS will tell the States that they have no authority to unilaterally declare an individual guilty of a federal crime, for which that individual has never been charged or convicted. Plus the individual voters that initiated the actions had no standing to do so.

Insurrection is a crime against either the federal or state government. The constitution requires both the federal government and all the states to follow the constitution. The 14th puts a bar on all offices, federal and state, appointed and elected.
And with the number of offices covered, literally hundreds of thousands, the decision has to be made by the person controlling those offices.

 

[Concerned American]

that is why no one thinks of it. if we read the accounts of the "radical republicans" who wrote the 14th the confederates would be exactly who they had as original intent.

but among the federalist justices this may conflict with the literal words of the paragraph

among us, the intent of the article was more general, and common sense: a person who can break their oath to the constitution really should not be trusted to uphold and defemd same in the future.

Which is exactly why Biden shouldn't be there. He took an oath to defend our borders which he has failed to do.

 

[BackAgain]

There seems to be some confusion on this, so I will post the 14th Amendment to the US Constitution in it's entirety so all can read from beginning to end to find the answer. I will include a link so I can't be accused of altering the text.

Fourteenth Amendment​

Fourteenth Amendment Explained

Section 1​

All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

Section 2​

Representatives shall be apportioned among the several States according to their respective numbers, counting the whole number of persons in each State, excluding Indians not taxed. But when the right to vote at any election for the choice of electors for President and Vice-President of the United States, Representatives in Congress, the Executive and Judicial officers of a State, or the members of the Legislature thereof, is denied to any of the male inhabitants of such State, being twenty-one years of age, and citizens of the United States, or in any way abridged, except for participation in rebellion, or other crime, the basis of representation therein shall be reduced in the proportion which the number of such male citizens shall bear to the whole number of male citizens twenty-one years of age in such State.

Section 3​

No person shall be a Senator or Representative in Congress, or elector of President and Vice-President, or hold any office, civil or military, under the United States, or under any State, who, having previously taken an oath, as a member of Congress, or as an officer of the United States, or as a member of any State legislature, or as an executive or judicial officer of any State, to support the Constitution of the United States, shall have engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the same, or given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof. But Congress may by a vote of two-thirds of each House, remove such disability.

Section 4​

The validity of the public debt of the United States, authorized by law, including debts incurred for payment of pensions and bounties for services in suppressing insurrection or rebellion, shall not be questioned. But neither the United States nor any State shall assume or pay any debt or obligation incurred in aid of insurrection or rebellion against the United States, or any claim for the loss or emancipation of any slave; but all such debts, obligations and claims shall be held illegal and void.

Section 5​

The Congress shall have the power to enforce, by appropriate legislation, the provisions of this article.

U.S. Constitution - Fourteenth Amendment | Resources | Constitution Annotated | Congress.gov | Library of Congress

The original text of the Fourteenth Amendment of the Constitution of the United States.

constitution.congress.gov

I maintain that once the candidate has been tried in a federal criminal court and convicted of “insurrection,” any state can make use of its own election law to remove that now disqualified candidate.


Alternatively, Congress could pass an enabling Act directing that the Amendment and Section are triggered for all states upon such a conviction.

 

[Rogue AI]

Fourteenth Amendment Equal Protection and Other Rights​

• Section 3 Disqualification from Holding Office​

  No person shall be a Senator or Representative in Congress, or elector of President and Vice-President, or hold any office, civil or military, under the United States, or under any State, who, having previously taken an oath, as a member of Congress, or as an officer of the United States, or as a member of any State legislature, or as an executive or judicial officer of any State, to support the Constitution of the United States, shall have engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the same, or given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof. But Congress may by a vote of two-thirds of each House, remove such disability. ______________It seems like this isn't a matter for the court , it says the only way it can be overturned is by 2/3rds vote of both houses.

Again, highlighting the fact the 14th cannot and does not apply to the President, as Congress has no Constitutional power to overturn presidential elections.

 

[Concerned American]

Again, highlighting the fact the 14th cannot and does not apply to the President, as Congress has no Constitutional power to overturn presidential elections.

How do you account for impeachment and removal from office? There are ways that the constitution has provided to overturn presidential elections. But the 14th isn't one of them.

 

[Rogue AI]

How do you account for impeachment and removal from office? There are ways that the constitution has provided to overturn presidential elections. But the 14th isn't one of them.

Impeachment and removal is not an election activity, but specific to acts themselves. Only possible after an election.

 

[Batcat]

The 14th wasn't narrowly tailored. It used insurrection and not civil war as the standard. And was aimed to make sure those that commit or assist insurrection can't get their hands on any government office, federal or state. With no limits on its application.

That’s your modern interpretation of the 14th. You can’t admit that it was designed to apply to those who fought for the South in the Civil War as that would mean the term insurrection meant a conflict much later than a riot that lasted only a few hours.

Intro.3.4 Civil War Amendments (Thirteenth, Fourteenth, and Fifteenth Amendments)​

https://constitution.congress.gov/browse/essay/intro.3-4/ALDE_00000388/

Fourteenth Amendment

www.law.cornell.edu

snip

Disqualification for Rebellion​

Section Three of the Fourteenth Amendment disqualifies an individual from serving as a state or federal official if that person has "engaged in insurrection or rebellion against" the United States. Although the clause was written in the context of the Civil War, it would theoretically still apply for members of future rebellions or insurrections against the United States.

LETTER: The Civil War was an insurrection - not Jan. 6

LETTER: Reader Sidney Hansen writes that calling the one-day Jan. 6, 2021 "political...

www.ourmidland.com

Snip


The 13th Amendment to the Constitution was later adopted by Congress in December 1865 ending slavery in all parts of the United States.

By contrast, the treatment of the Jan. 6, 2021 one-day political demonstration at our nation’s capital as an insurrection is pettiness to the extreme.

 

[jbander]

That's not what Section 5 says at all. It says that Congress can overturn the removal of a name from the ballot, not that they have the authority to ban someone.

It says that Congress has the power to enforce Section 5, but it doesn' say who has the power to determine who should be removed. I guess it would depend on what office the person is running for.

Only Clarence Thomas has that sole authority if he so wants it.

View attachment 883791

Read the dam

Again, highlighting the fact the 14th cannot and does not apply to the President, as Congress has no Constitutional power to overturn presidential elections.

That's stupid ,

Section 3.​

No person shall be a Senator or Representative in Congress, or elector of President and Vice President, or hold any office, civil or military, under the United States, or under any state, who, having previously taken an oath, as a member of Congress, or as an officer of the United States, or as a member of any state legislature, or as an executive or judicial officer of any state, to support the Constitution of the United States, shall have engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the same, or given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof. But Congress may by a vote of two-thirds of each House, remove such disability.
Read the dam amendment.you clowns think you can make up a interpretation of the constitution or in fact any law and then demand that your goof ball interpretation is the last word on the constitution or law. You people are cartoon characters.

 

[meaner gene]

I maintain that once the candidate has been tried in a federal criminal court and convicted of “insurrection,” any state can make use of its own election law to remove that now disqualified candidate.


Alternatively, Congress could pass an enabling Act directing that the Amendment and Section are triggered for all states upon such a conviction.

Why would you need a conviction for the insurrection disqualification, and not for the other 3 prior constitutional disqualifications for President.

If the 14th added the conviction requirement, they would have said convicted of, instead of engaged in.

 

[jbander]

The 14th wasn't narrowly tailored. It used insurrection and not civil war as the standard. And was aimed to make sure those that commit or assist insurrection can't get their hands on any government office, federal or state. With no limits on its application.

The 14th couldn't be clearer , that is to anyone who has the capacity to think.

 

[Concerned American]

Read the dam amendment.you clowns think you can make up a interpretation of the constitution or in fact any law and then demand that your goof ball interpretation is the last word on the constitution or law.

You are putting the cart before the horse. There was NO insurrection OR rebellion. The fourteenth is contingent on the fact that there was one. If there wasn't, the fourteenth is moot. Give it up. You're howling at the moon.

 

[scruffy]

There seems to be some confusion on this, so I will post the 14th Amendment to the US Constitution in it's entirety so all can read from beginning to end to find the answer. I will include a link so I can't be accused of altering the text.

Fourteenth Amendment​

Fourteenth Amendment Explained

Section 1​

All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

Section 2​

Representatives shall be apportioned among the several States according to their respective numbers, counting the whole number of persons in each State, excluding Indians not taxed. But when the right to vote at any election for the choice of electors for President and Vice-President of the United States, Representatives in Congress, the Executive and Judicial officers of a State, or the members of the Legislature thereof, is denied to any of the male inhabitants of such State, being twenty-one years of age, and citizens of the United States, or in any way abridged, except for participation in rebellion, or other crime, the basis of representation therein shall be reduced in the proportion which the number of such male citizens shall bear to the whole number of male citizens twenty-one years of age in such State.

Section 3​

No person shall be a Senator or Representative in Congress, or elector of President and Vice-President, or hold any office, civil or military, under the United States, or under any State, who, having previously taken an oath, as a member of Congress, or as an officer of the United States, or as a member of any State legislature, or as an executive or judicial officer of any State, to support the Constitution of the United States, shall have engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the same, or given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof. But Congress may by a vote of two-thirds of each House, remove such disability.

Section 4​

The validity of the public debt of the United States, authorized by law, including debts incurred for payment of pensions and bounties for services in suppressing insurrection or rebellion, shall not be questioned. But neither the United States nor any State shall assume or pay any debt or obligation incurred in aid of insurrection or rebellion against the United States, or any claim for the loss or emancipation of any slave; but all such debts, obligations and claims shall be held illegal and void.

Section 5​

The Congress shall have the power to enforce, by appropriate legislation, the provisions of this article.

U.S. Constitution - Fourteenth Amendment | Resources | Constitution Annotated | Congress.gov | Library of Congress

The original text of the Fourteenth Amendment of the Constitution of the United States.

constitution.congress.gov

Poll answer: none of the above.

The Constitution clearly states, it is the PRESIDENT's responsibility to enforce laws.

 

[meaner gene]

Again, highlighting the fact the 14th cannot and does not apply to the President, as Congress has no Constitutional power to overturn presidential elections.

Congress under the 12th

and if no person have such majority, then from the persons having the highest numbers not exceeding three on the list of those voted for as President, the House of Representatives shall choose immediately, by ballot, the President.

Here congress can clearly override the will of the people, or the will of the EC.

 

[Nostra]

Read the dam

That's stupid ,

Section 3.​

No person shall be a Senator or Representative in Congress, or elector of President and Vice President, or hold any office, civil or military, under the United States, or under any state, who, having previously taken an oath, as a member of Congress, or as an officer of the United States, or as a member of any state legislature, or as an executive or judicial officer of any state, to support the Constitution of the United States, shall have engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the same, or given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof. But Congress may by a vote of two-thirds of each House, remove such disability.
Read the dam amendment.you clowns think you can make up a interpretation of the constitution or in fact any law and then demand that your goof ball interpretation is the last word on the constitution or law. You people are cartoon characters.

What does section 5 say, vermin?

 

[Nostra]

Why would you need a conviction for the insurrection disqualification, and not for the other 3 prior constitutional disqualifications for President.

If the 14th added the conviction requirement, they would have said convicted of, instead of engaged in.

So you think the 14th nullifies the 5th.

 

[Nostra]

The 14th couldn't be clearer , that is to anyone who has the capacity to think.

Which is why you are getting it wrong, Simp.

 

[meaner gene]

What does section 5 say, vermin?

The same thing Article I says, and the same thing for every Amendment.

Congress shall have power to enforce this article by appropriate legislation.