Poll: Voters think preventing gun violence is more important than protecting gun rights

[TemplarKormac]

These things don't happen regularly where there is strong gun control. FACT!

No. Screaming "FACT!" at the top of your digital lungs does not make it fact. It just makes you look like a petulant child without a cogent argument.

Then prove me wrong. When was the last school shooting in the UK? Japan?

The UK and Japan have banned guns... but in their enormous abundance of foresight, they forgot that murders (school or otherwise) can be perpetrated with knives, or other weapons. When you take away one weapon, one will simply look for another.

Nice goalpost-move attempt but the topic of "mass shootings" is not the topic of "murder". Entirely different things you're trying to conflate here.

Wait...

Aren't we splitting hairs here? Because shooting and murder go hand in hand, someone or some group can die as a result of a shooting. Cause and effect.

That is not a "goalpost-move".

 

[JGalt]

Too bad removing gun rights won't prevent gun violence.

Poll: Voters think preventing gun violence is more important than protecting gun rights

A majority of voters in a new poll thinks it is more important to prevent gun violence than to protect gun rights.

Well this just proves what the left has been saying all along: FOX News watchers are idiots.

They sure as hell didn't ask me because as far as I'm concerned, the only way to prevent gun violence is to protect gun rights.

 

[depotoo]

This is thru 2016, and it is reported it will drop again for 2017-

And this is from the Brennan Center,
Year-End Analysis: Crime and Murder Down in 2017
“Once again crime rates remain near historic lows. This is welcome news as 2017 comes to an end, and a clear indication that claims of rising crime are unfounded,” said Ames Grawert, a counsel in the Brennan Center’s Justice Program. “However, there are some cities where violence has increased, and those concerning spikes need to be better understood and addressed.”

Key findings from the analysis include:

• The overall crime rate in the 30 largest cities in 2017 is estimated to decline slightly from 2016, falling by 2.7 percent.
• The violent crime rate will also decrease slightly, by 1.1 percent, essentially remaining stable.
• The 2017 murder rate in the 30 largest cities is estimated to decline by 5.6 percent. Large decreases this year in Chicago (down 11.9 percent) and Detroit (down 9.8 percent), as well as small decreases in other cities, contributed to this decline. New York City’s murder rate will also decline again, to 3.3 killings per 100,000 people.
• Some cities are projected to see their murder rates rise, including Charlotte (54.6 percent) and Baltimore (11.3 percent).

German violent crime has once again increased.

 

[Brain357]

This is thru 2016, and it is reported it will drop again for 2017-
View attachment 184669
And this is from the Brennan Center,
Year-End Analysis: Crime and Murder Down in 2017
“Once again crime rates remain near historic lows. This is welcome news as 2017 comes to an end, and a clear indication that claims of rising crime are unfounded,” said Ames Grawert, a counsel in the Brennan Center’s Justice Program. “However, there are some cities where violence has increased, and those concerning spikes need to be better understood and addressed.”

Key findings from the analysis include:

• The overall crime rate in the 30 largest cities in 2017 is estimated to decline slightly from 2016, falling by 2.7 percent.
• The violent crime rate will also decrease slightly, by 1.1 percent, essentially remaining stable.
• The 2017 murder rate in the 30 largest cities is estimated to decline by 5.6 percent. Large decreases this year in Chicago (down 11.9 percent) and Detroit (down 9.8 percent), as well as small decreases in other cities, contributed to this decline. New York City’s murder rate will also decline again, to 3.3 killings per 100,000 people.
• Some cities are projected to see their murder rates rise, including Charlotte (54.6 percent) and Baltimore (11.3 percent).

German violent crime has once again increased.

Homicide rate
US 4.88
Germany .85

 

[LuckyDuck]

Too bad removing gun rights won't prevent gun violence.

Poll: Voters think preventing gun violence is more important than protecting gun rights

A majority of voters in a new poll thinks it is more important to prevent gun violence than to protect gun rights.

I say, let the Civil War begin.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

We've been through this before about a dozen times. Other countries do have their problems just like we do. You can't compare a mostly or all white country with ours. Our violent crime and gun crime has been on the decrease since the 90's up until the Ferguson effect kicked in. We are in 11th place when it comes to mass murders in the world.

Yes we can be compared to other civilized countries. I understand it doesn't work too well for you. We are 11th with only 3rd world countries ahead of us? Violent crime is up for 2 years in a row and counting. And we regularly bury our police and have mass shootings. These things don't happen regularly where there is strong gun control. FACT!

Yes, as I said, our violent and gun crime decreased until the Ferguson Effect kicked in, and only then did it start to go up. It has nothing to do with guns, how many guns, or what type of guns. It has to do with the MSM exciting all these lowlifes and they respond.

So you mean after police shot an unarmed man? Something that doesn't happen in countries with strong gun control? Sorry, but your claimed cause is obviously because we have weak gun laws and too many guns. Because we have so many guns our police are regularly shot and killed. Because our police are regularly shot and killed they shoot and kill many people.

They always did. So why the increase in gun and violence since Ferguson? More guns????

Things finally erupted when they had enough. Just like our children are now sick of seeing so many people shot and killed.

They are being led in dog chains by the Democrat party. They're kids. WTF do they know about the world?

And what did these people have enough of, police officers protecting themselves?

 

[Pogo]

These things don't happen regularly where there is strong gun control. FACT!

No. Screaming "FACT!" at the top of your digital lungs does not make it fact. It just makes you look like a petulant child without a cogent argument.

Then prove me wrong. When was the last school shooting in the UK? Japan?

The UK and Japan have banned guns... but in their enormous abundance of foresight, they forgot that murders (school or otherwise) can be perpetrated with knives, or other weapons. When you take away one weapon, one will simply look for another.

Nice goalpost-move attempt but the topic of "mass shootings" is not the topic of "murder". Entirely different things you're trying to conflate here.

Wait...

Aren't we splitting hairs here? Because shooting and murder go hand in hand, someone or some group can die as a result of a shooting. Cause and effect.

That is not a "goalpost-move".

Really? After all the times this distinction has been laid out on these pages, really?

Hang on, I have a recent post I'll copy in here.

EDIT -- here ya go, all articulated herein. No sense rewriting the whole thing.

a challenge for all of our liberal posters:

please give us the language of a bill that you believe would stop gun violence. give us the exact wording, and then explain in detail how it would stop all mass murders in the USA.

then, how about a bill to stop murders by truck, bomb, knife, hammer, baseball bat, fist. please post the legislation that you believe will fix these problems.

This is a serious request, we will anxiously await your proposed bill language.

It's the wrong question. For multiple reasons.

The first being (the base issue being mass gun slaughter), this is a cultural infection. As such it's not seriously curtailed by "bills". It's curtailed by cultural change, which is an entirely different approach.

The second reason it's the wrong question is the false comparison between the issue as stated, and "murder". "Murder" may be the legal term describing the result of mass gun slaughter but it is not the objective of the slaughterer. Even if it is the inevitable end result. Therefore it's an entirely different motivation.

The (true) murderer targets specifically. An unfaithful spouse, a cheating business partner, a witness who knows too much. Specific and personal. His objective is to take out that person/people, for reasons specific TO those people. The mass shooter has no such specificity in mind; taking advantage of any target that happens to present. Doesn't matter who it is. The mass shooter's objective is carnage; the sensory input of seeing people (again, makes no difference which people) squirm and scream and bleed and drop in powerless pain. The shooter is feeding his sensory addiction, usually out of his own real or imagined sense of powerlessness (which is why the mass shooter is virtually always a "he") with the sensory input that only a firearm can provide.

And that's exactly why we have mass shootings and not so much mass stabbings, mass poisonings, mass hammer or baseball attacks, etc. Those cannot provide the immediate sensory input a firearm can, from a remote-control safe distance, even from one's hotel room or tower perch. That's also why their weapon of choice is a specifically military infantry model designed specifically for rapidly strafing a line of "enemy" infantry armed with the same thing -- because it delivers MAXIMUM carnage --- which is what they, the mass shooter, seek. In other words we have mass gun slaughter because we have a gun culture. If we had a poisoning culture, where you couldn't flip through any TV dial or any movie theater or any video game without encountering a depiction of somebody being poisoned -- then we'd have mass poisonings. Because we would have made poisoning "cool".

Which returns us to the cultural --- if we (seriously) want to eliminate that kind of scene, then it's first necessary to remove the desire for carnage-as-drug. And to get there we have to first quit the whole fetishizing and glorification of guns, right down to the basic idea that the solution for any problem is to shoot at it and blow it up. That death-cult mentality has got to go. Starkly simple as that.

So ultimately the solution for all this is not so much legislative as spritual.

 

[Brain357]

Yes we can be compared to other civilized countries. I understand it doesn't work too well for you. We are 11th with only 3rd world countries ahead of us? Violent crime is up for 2 years in a row and counting. And we regularly bury our police and have mass shootings. These things don't happen regularly where there is strong gun control. FACT!

Yes, as I said, our violent and gun crime decreased until the Ferguson Effect kicked in, and only then did it start to go up. It has nothing to do with guns, how many guns, or what type of guns. It has to do with the MSM exciting all these lowlifes and they respond.

So you mean after police shot an unarmed man? Something that doesn't happen in countries with strong gun control? Sorry, but your claimed cause is obviously because we have weak gun laws and too many guns. Because we have so many guns our police are regularly shot and killed. Because our police are regularly shot and killed they shoot and kill many people.

They always did. So why the increase in gun and violence since Ferguson? More guns????

Things finally erupted when they had enough. Just like our children are now sick of seeing so many people shot and killed.

They are being led in dog chains by the Democrat party. They're kids. WTF do they know about the world?

And what did these people have enough of, police officers protecting themselves?

No they are not. They just aren't scared pussies like most of our men demanding big guns. When was the last school shooting in the UK? Germany? Japan? They can see the effects of weak gun laws.

They had enough of police shooting people. This is something that rarely happens in countries with strong gun control. Just like police themselves are rarely shot and killed where there is strong gun control.

 

[Kosh]

This is thru 2016, and it is reported it will drop again for 2017-
View attachment 184669
And this is from the Brennan Center,
Year-End Analysis: Crime and Murder Down in 2017
“Once again crime rates remain near historic lows. This is welcome news as 2017 comes to an end, and a clear indication that claims of rising crime are unfounded,” said Ames Grawert, a counsel in the Brennan Center’s Justice Program. “However, there are some cities where violence has increased, and those concerning spikes need to be better understood and addressed.”

Key findings from the analysis include:

• The overall crime rate in the 30 largest cities in 2017 is estimated to decline slightly from 2016, falling by 2.7 percent.
• The violent crime rate will also decrease slightly, by 1.1 percent, essentially remaining stable.
• The 2017 murder rate in the 30 largest cities is estimated to decline by 5.6 percent. Large decreases this year in Chicago (down 11.9 percent) and Detroit (down 9.8 percent), as well as small decreases in other cities, contributed to this decline. New York City’s murder rate will also decline again, to 3.3 killings per 100,000 people.
• Some cities are projected to see their murder rates rise, including Charlotte (54.6 percent) and Baltimore (11.3 percent).

German violent crime has once again increased.

Here is a far left religious site you should believe:

Violent Crime in U.S. Rises for Second Consecutive Year

Violent crime, including homicides, rose for the second consecutive year in 2016, driven by increases in a few urban centers including Baltimore, Chicago and Las Vegas, according to F.B.I. data released Monday.

Violent crimes increased nationally last year by 4.1 percent and homicides rose by 8.6 percent, one year after violence increased by 3.9 percent and homicides jumped by 10.8 percent. A total of 17,250 people were murdered in 2016, the F.B.I. said.

 

[cnm]

Too bad removing gun rights won't prevent gun violence.

Except the experience of every other developed nation shows it reduces gun violence to a fraction of that of the US'.

 

[usmbguest5318]

Voters think preventing gun violence is more important than protecting gun rights

That's because gun violence produces more dead people at the hands of unlawful gun users than do gun rights keep people from unlawfully being shot dead by unlawful gun users.

 

[cnm]

All the claimed levels of support for policies which violate the Second Amendment are flat-out lies, and you know it, as do nearly all the others who are spreading them.

Absolutely. Mainly those affected by shootings support gun control. For everyone else the price of other people's school children is quite acceptable in order to maintain easy access to handguns and military style semiautomatic rifles. A bargain.

 

[Mike473]

I wonder why Shumer and Pelosi have not released their proposed constitutional amendment to modify the 2nd yet? Are they waiting until it gets closer to the mid term elections?

 

[depotoo]

Violent crime increased by 6.7 percent last year, rising to 193,542 cases from 181,386 cases in 2015. There was a similar increase in drug-related crime, which rose by 7.1 percent to 302,594 cases in 2016. Perhaps more worryingly, the rise in weapons-related crime was more than double that - up 14.8 percent to 34,443 cases. Nevertheless, the overall statistics showed only a slight increase in crime - up by just 0.7 percent from 2015 to 2016 - or 6.37 million cases in total, and there was a notable drop of 4.4 percent in the rate of theft.

The reported rates of assault, murder, manslaughter and rape all went up last year in Germany. De Maiziere described the developments as worrying, and blamed it on an overall "coarsening" in society. He pointedly refused to blame last year's influx of refugees - or any particular group - for the problem, and said the statistics bore him out. "We are dealing with a rise in hate, lack of respect and violence in general," the minister told reporters. "We would not reduce that to any particular group - whether left, right, or foreigners."


Attacks on asylum-seekers' homes have dropped slightly

Crime among asylum-seekers

Nevertheless, one statistic stuck out in the report - while police had registered only 114,000 criminal incidents among asylum-seekers and refugees in 2015, there were 174,000 in 2016. "Among the violent crimes, there were 1 percent more Germans, but 90 percent more migrant suspects," de Maiziere said - before adding that many of these crimes took place among the asylum-seekers themselves inside shelters.

This is thru 2016, and it is reported it will drop again for 2017-
View attachment 184669
And this is from the Brennan Center,
Year-End Analysis: Crime and Murder Down in 2017
“Once again crime rates remain near historic lows. This is welcome news as 2017 comes to an end, and a clear indication that claims of rising crime are unfounded,” said Ames Grawert, a counsel in the Brennan Center’s Justice Program. “However, there are some cities where violence has increased, and those concerning spikes need to be better understood and addressed.”

Key findings from the analysis include:

• The overall crime rate in the 30 largest cities in 2017 is estimated to decline slightly from 2016, falling by 2.7 percent.
• The violent crime rate will also decrease slightly, by 1.1 percent, essentially remaining stable.
• The 2017 murder rate in the 30 largest cities is estimated to decline by 5.6 percent. Large decreases this year in Chicago (down 11.9 percent) and Detroit (down 9.8 percent), as well as small decreases in other cities, contributed to this decline. New York City’s murder rate will also decline again, to 3.3 killings per 100,000 people.
• Some cities are projected to see their murder rates rise, including Charlotte (54.6 percent) and Baltimore (11.3 percent).

German violent crime has once again increased.

Homicide rate
US 4.88
Germany .85

Crime Threats


Crime rates throughout Germany have been comparable to those in most first-world countries, including the U.S., and comparative analysis of crime data for the U.S. and Germany reveals only marginal differences. Crimes, especially those targeting tourists, are as common as in any large European city. The Bundeskriminalamt’s (BKA) 2015 Police Crime Statistics indicated only minor changes in the number of most of the recorded offenses over 2014, with an increase of 4.1% overall. There was a 157% increase in “Aliens Act-related” crime. There were also marked increases in categories related to credit card fraud. While the 2016 crime statistics are not expected to be published until approximately May 2017, preliminary information indicates a 9.9% increase in residential burglaries.


Some observers have suggested that official statistics may not always provide an accurate accounting of the level of crime. Not all crimes reported to the police are captured in the form of an actual police report. It is common to hear of police dissuading victims from making formal reports citing little chance of capturing the suspect. Such a practice may create a disincentive to report criminal activity.


There have also been reports of crimes, in effect, being de-criminalized due to their frequency and impact on resources. One such report involved a community declaring that petty crimes (shoplifting) would not be investigated by the authorities. Another possible example involves the 2015 New Year’s celebration in Cologne that lead to more than 1,500 crimes recorded by police. There were extensive media reports that not all of those reported crimes were reported in police statistics.


Outspoken representatives of police unions have stated the number of crimes is often drastically under-reported. In 2015, the head of the Bund Deutscher Kriminalbeamter (German Detective Union) accused politicians of “leaving the public in the dark as to the true level of criminality.” He claimed that 75% of domestic burglaries were reported and that sex crimes and cybercrimes were under-reported.
Germany 2017 Crime & Safety Report: Berlin
2. More violent crimes, fewer break-ins

As German media outlets reported last week ahead of the official report's release, the figures for 2016 showed an increase in violent crime and a decrease in home break-ins.

Murder and homicide increased by 14.3 percent, while rape and sexual assault rose by 12.8 percent.
5 things we learned from the latest German national crime report

 

[JGalt]

Too bad removing gun rights won't prevent gun violence.

Except the experience of every other developed nation shows it reduces gun violence to a fraction of that of the US'.

But we aren't "every other nation", nor do we want to be. Every other nation doesn't have the same constitutional right to defend themselves. That's why "every other nation" has been subject to hundreds of years of world war, genocide, revolution, despotism, wholesale slaughter, and tyranny.

 

[depotoo]

Yeah, it did in 2016. It has dropped in 2017. Amazing, huh?

This is thru 2016, and it is reported it will drop again for 2017-
View attachment 184669
And this is from the Brennan Center,
Year-End Analysis: Crime and Murder Down in 2017
“Once again crime rates remain near historic lows. This is welcome news as 2017 comes to an end, and a clear indication that claims of rising crime are unfounded,” said Ames Grawert, a counsel in the Brennan Center’s Justice Program. “However, there are some cities where violence has increased, and those concerning spikes need to be better understood and addressed.”

Key findings from the analysis include:

• The overall crime rate in the 30 largest cities in 2017 is estimated to decline slightly from 2016, falling by 2.7 percent.
• The violent crime rate will also decrease slightly, by 1.1 percent, essentially remaining stable.
• The 2017 murder rate in the 30 largest cities is estimated to decline by 5.6 percent. Large decreases this year in Chicago (down 11.9 percent) and Detroit (down 9.8 percent), as well as small decreases in other cities, contributed to this decline. New York City’s murder rate will also decline again, to 3.3 killings per 100,000 people.
• Some cities are projected to see their murder rates rise, including Charlotte (54.6 percent) and Baltimore (11.3 percent).

German violent crime has once again increased.

Here is a far left religious site you should believe:

Violent Crime in U.S. Rises for Second Consecutive Year

Violent crime, including homicides, rose for the second consecutive year in 2016, driven by increases in a few urban centers including Baltimore, Chicago and Las Vegas, according to F.B.I. data released Monday.

Violent crimes increased nationally last year by 4.1 percent and homicides rose by 8.6 percent, one year after violence increased by 3.9 percent and homicides jumped by 10.8 percent. A total of 17,250 people were murdered in 2016, the F.B.I. said.

 

[depotoo]

Notice Germany’s increased crime rates are being blamed on immigrants...

We’ve only been dealing with open borders forever with illegal immigration happening every single day.

 

[Hossfly]

We've been through this before about a dozen times. Other countries do have their problems just like we do. You can't compare a mostly or all white country with ours. Our violent crime and gun crime has been on the decrease since the 90's up until the Ferguson effect kicked in. We are in 11th place when it comes to mass murders in the world.

Yes we can be compared to other civilized countries. I understand it doesn't work too well for you. We are 11th with only 3rd world countries ahead of us? Violent crime is up for 2 years in a row and counting. And we regularly bury our police and have mass shootings. These things don't happen regularly where there is strong gun control. FACT!

Yes, as I said, our violent and gun crime decreased until the Ferguson Effect kicked in, and only then did it start to go up. It has nothing to do with guns, how many guns, or what type of guns. It has to do with the MSM exciting all these lowlifes and they respond.

So you mean after police shot an unarmed man? Something that doesn't happen in countries with strong gun control? Sorry, but your claimed cause is obviously because we have weak gun laws and too many guns. Because we have so many guns our police are regularly shot and killed. Because our police are regularly shot and killed they shoot and kill many people.

They always did. So why the increase in gun and violence since Ferguson? More guns????

Things finally erupted when they had enough. Just like our children are now sick of seeing so many people shot and killed.

There's a simple solution to the school shootings. How about having the Border Patrol tear down all the fence and walls on the Southern border. We don't need them. Then everyone who wants to can come into the country, get a job and purse their dreams. They're harmless, according to Pelosi and Schumer. After the fences are down, re-assign enough Border Patrol and I.C.E. agents to have one armed agent in each American school and college. The remaining agents can be utilized to fight fires in California. Think of the money saved. The Democrats will be happy because they get more voters and everything will be hunky dory. What say you.

 

[Kosh]

Yeah, it did in 2016. It has dropped in 2017. Amazing, huh?

This is thru 2016, and it is reported it will drop again for 2017-
View attachment 184669
And this is from the Brennan Center,
Year-End Analysis: Crime and Murder Down in 2017
“Once again crime rates remain near historic lows. This is welcome news as 2017 comes to an end, and a clear indication that claims of rising crime are unfounded,” said Ames Grawert, a counsel in the Brennan Center’s Justice Program. “However, there are some cities where violence has increased, and those concerning spikes need to be better understood and addressed.”

Key findings from the analysis include:

• The overall crime rate in the 30 largest cities in 2017 is estimated to decline slightly from 2016, falling by 2.7 percent.
• The violent crime rate will also decrease slightly, by 1.1 percent, essentially remaining stable.
• The 2017 murder rate in the 30 largest cities is estimated to decline by 5.6 percent. Large decreases this year in Chicago (down 11.9 percent) and Detroit (down 9.8 percent), as well as small decreases in other cities, contributed to this decline. New York City’s murder rate will also decline again, to 3.3 killings per 100,000 people.
• Some cities are projected to see their murder rates rise, including Charlotte (54.6 percent) and Baltimore (11.3 percent).

German violent crime has once again increased.

Here is a far left religious site you should believe:

Violent Crime in U.S. Rises for Second Consecutive Year

Violent crime, including homicides, rose for the second consecutive year in 2016, driven by increases in a few urban centers including Baltimore, Chicago and Las Vegas, according to F.B.I. data released Monday.

Violent crimes increased nationally last year by 4.1 percent and homicides rose by 8.6 percent, one year after violence increased by 3.9 percent and homicides jumped by 10.8 percent. A total of 17,250 people were murdered in 2016, the F.B.I. said.

Yes because of far left policies in urban cities, like Chicago an d Baltimore.

That is what the data proves.

Anyone that follows the far left religion should be ashamed.

 

[Brain357]

Too bad removing gun rights won't prevent gun violence.

Except the experience of every other developed nation shows it reduces gun violence to a fraction of that of the US'.

But we aren't "every other nation", nor do we want to be. Every other nation doesn't have the same constitutional right to defend themselves. That's why "every other nation" has been subject to hundreds of years of world war, genocide, revolution, despotism, wholesale slaughter, and tyranny.

I don't see their children regularly being shot and killed.