Pastor's Anti-Gay Rights speech

[Gadawg73]

Are pedophiles born that way?

If so then how can they be blamed for their actions?

You may want to make homosexuality a crime but I don't.
Acting on one's pedophillia is a crime.
People are born with it and when they act on it, molesting CHILDREN, that is criminal.
I do not want to make homosexuality a crime.
How many years do you propose gays get for being gay?
Felony or misdemeanor?

It doesn't matter, if a person is born a certain way then his actions should be overlooked. That's the argument you are trying to make. And yes in some states certain homosexual acts are illegal.

So far we have your claim that homosexuality is abnormal and I agree 100%.
Nothing normal about it.
Herschel Walker was abnormal.
Da Vinci was abnormal.
Edison was abnormal.
Swingers are abnormal.
Murderers are abnormal.
So far the only group you want to persecute are queers.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

You wouldn't want anyone meddling in your church and the decisions you and they make there so why do you care what other churches do?
What you do in your church I respect and stay out of.
Same with all churches.
Causes less problems when we all mind our own business when it comes to other's religious beliefs.

A pastor of a church is supposed to believe in the Bible and lead his congregation according to biblical principals.

If he strays away from that and puts social issues ahead of christian theology and doctrine.

Then he needs to step down and find another vocation that matches his beliefs.

Your own religion has varying and different interpretations of the Quran, go around slaughtering each other over those varying interpretations and you are telling a Christian pastor what they should and should not do.

Try sorting out your own religious problems and get back to us when that is done.

Why the strawman?

The Quran nor Islam is the focus of the debate, unless you want us to believe the "pastor" is actually an Imam.

Read the Bible and see what it says about homosexuals then get back to us.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

You may want to make homosexuality a crime but I don't.
Acting on one's pedophillia is a crime.
People are born with it and when they act on it, molesting CHILDREN, that is criminal.
I do not want to make homosexuality a crime.
How many years do you propose gays get for being gay?
Felony or misdemeanor?

It doesn't matter, if a person is born a certain way then his actions should be overlooked. That's the argument you are trying to make. And yes in some states certain homosexual acts are illegal.

So far we have your claim that homosexuality is abnormal and I agree 100%.
Nothing normal about it.
Herschel Walker was abnormal.
Da Vinci was abnormal.
Edison was abnormal.
Swingers are abnormal.
Murderers are abnormal.
So far the only group you want to persecute are queers.

Where have stated I wanted to persecute anyone?

And I'd argue that none of the things you mentioned are abnormal.

Can you be more specific as to how each of the persons you mentioned are abnormal.

 

[Gadawg73]

A pastor of a church is supposed to believe in the Bible and lead his congregation according to biblical principals.

If he strays away from that and puts social issues ahead of christian theology and doctrine.

Then he needs to step down and find another vocation that matches his beliefs.

Your own religion has varying and different interpretations of the Quran, go around slaughtering each other over those varying interpretations and you are telling a Christian pastor what they should and should not do.

Try sorting out your own religious problems and get back to us when that is done.

Why the strawman?

The Quran nor Islam is the focus of the debate, unless you want us to believe the "pastor" is actually an Imam.

Read the Bible and see what it says about homosexuals then get back to us.

Read the Bible and see what it says about hog sammich eaters, folks that round off their haircuts, pulls out before planting their seed (Genesis 38:9) where Onan committed suicide for God because he did, tattos (Leviticus 19:28), wear polyester clothes, divorce, letting men without testicles into the church (Deuteronomy 12:1), wearing gold or pearls to church, eating any shellfish like oysters and shrimp or any of them and Deuteronomy where a woman is banned from grabbing a man's testicles if 2 of them are fighting.
Need more?
I would already be in hell because even though I played on the defense I did touch the ball as often as I could "You should not eat their flesh or touch their carcaases, they are unclean to you". Leviticus 11:8.
You are going to hell if you do any of those things.
You selectively quote the Bible. I have read the entire thing many times.

 

[Gadawg73]

It doesn't matter, if a person is born a certain way then his actions should be overlooked. That's the argument you are trying to make. And yes in some states certain homosexual acts are illegal.

So far we have your claim that homosexuality is abnormal and I agree 100%.
Nothing normal about it.
Herschel Walker was abnormal.
Da Vinci was abnormal.
Edison was abnormal.
Swingers are abnormal.
Murderers are abnormal.
So far the only group you want to persecute are queers.

Where have stated I wanted to persecute anyone?

And I'd argue that none of the things you mentioned are abnormal.

Can you be more specific as to how each of the persons you mentioned are abnormal.

Come to think of it you have never struck me as the homophobic type.
Same as most all Texans I know.

Murder is not normal. Same as all the others.
Look up the defnintion of abnormal.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

Your own religion has varying and different interpretations of the Quran, go around slaughtering each other over those varying interpretations and you are telling a Christian pastor what they should and should not do.

Try sorting out your own religious problems and get back to us when that is done.

Why the strawman?

The Quran nor Islam is the focus of the debate, unless you want us to believe the "pastor" is actually an Imam.

Read the Bible and see what it says about homosexuals then get back to us.

Read the Bible and see what it says about hog sammich eaters, folks that round off their haircuts, pulls out before planting their seed (Genesis 38:9) where Onan committed suicide for God because he did, tattos (Leviticus 19:28), wear polyester clothes, divorce, letting men without testicles into the church (Deuteronomy 12:1), wearing gold or pearls to church, eating any shellfish like oysters and shrimp or any of them and Deuteronomy where a woman is banned from grabbing a man's testicles if 2 of them are fighting.
Need more?
I would already be in hell because even though I played on the defense I did touch the ball as often as I could "You should not eat their flesh or touch their carcaases, they are unclean to you". Leviticus 11:8.
You are going to hell if you do any of those things.
You selectively quote the Bible. I have read the entire thing many times.

That's the Old Testament. A new covenant was made when Jesus came along.

If you had read the Bible you would know that.

Mark 7:18 (NIV) "Are you so dull?" he asked. "Don't you see that nothing that enters a man from the outside can make him 'unclean'?
Mark 7:19 (NIV) For it doesn't go into his heart but into his stomach, and then out of his body." (In saying this, Jesus declared all foods "clean.")


ACTS 10:9-16 (KJV)

The Vision Of Peter

9
On the morrow, as they went on their journey, and
drew nigh unto the city, Peter went up upon the
housetop to pray about the sixth hour:
10
And he became very hungry, and would have eaten: but
while they made ready, he fell into a trance,
11
And saw heaven opened, and a certain vessel
descending upon him, as it had been a great sheet
knit at the four corners, and let down to the earth:
12
Wherein were all manner of fourfooted beasts of the
earth, and wild beasts, and creeping things, and
fowls of the air.
13
And there came a voice to him, Rise, Peter; kill, and
eat.
14
But Peter said, Not so, Lord; for I have never eaten
any thing that is common or unclean.
15
And the voice spake unto him again the second time,
What God hath cleansed, that call not thou common.
16
This was done thrice: and the vessel was received up
again into heaven.

ROMANS 14:12-23 (KJV)

12
So then every one of us shall give account of himself to God.
13
Let us not therefore judge one another any more: but judge this
rather, that no man put a stumblingblock or an occasion to fall
in his brother's way.
14
I know, and am persuaded by the Lord Jesus, that there is
nothing unclean of itself: but to him that esteemeth any thing
to be unclean, to him it is unclean.
15
But if thy brother be grieved with thy meat, now walkest thou
not charitably. Destroy not him with thy meat, for whom Christ
died.
16
Let not then your good be evil spoken of:
17
For the kingdom of God is not meat and drink; but
righteousness, and peace, and joy in the Holy Ghost.
18
For he that in these things serveth Christ is acceptable to
God, and approved of men.
19
Let us therefore follow after the things which make for peace,
and things wherewith one may edify another.
20
For meat destroy not the work of God. All things indeed are
pure; but it is evil for that man who eateth with offence.
21
It is good neither to eat flesh, nor to drink wine, nor any
thing whereby thy brother stumbleth, or is offended, or is made
weak.
22
Hast thou faith? have it to thyself before God. Happy is he
that condemneth not himself in that thing which he alloweth.
23
And he that doubteth is damned if he eat, because he eateth not
of faith: for whatsoever is not of faith is sin.

 

[Gadawg73]

Why the strawman?

The Quran nor Islam is the focus of the debate, unless you want us to believe the "pastor" is actually an Imam.

Read the Bible and see what it says about homosexuals then get back to us.

Read the Bible and see what it says about hog sammich eaters, folks that round off their haircuts, pulls out before planting their seed (Genesis 38:9) where Onan committed suicide for God because he did, tattos (Leviticus 19:28), wear polyester clothes, divorce, letting men without testicles into the church (Deuteronomy 12:1), wearing gold or pearls to church, eating any shellfish like oysters and shrimp or any of them and Deuteronomy where a woman is banned from grabbing a man's testicles if 2 of them are fighting.
Need more?
I would already be in hell because even though I played on the defense I did touch the ball as often as I could "You should not eat their flesh or touch their carcaases, they are unclean to you". Leviticus 11:8.
You are going to hell if you do any of those things.
You selectively quote the Bible. I have read the entire thing many times.

That's the Old Testament. A new covenant was made when Jesus came along.

If you had read the Bible you would know that.

Mark 7:18 (NIV) "Are you so dull?" he asked. "Don't you see that nothing that enters a man from the outside can make him 'unclean'?
Mark 7:19 (NIV) For it doesn't go into his heart but into his stomach, and then out of his body." (In saying this, Jesus declared all foods "clean.")


ACTS 10:9-16 (KJV)

The Vision Of Peter

9
On the morrow, as they went on their journey, and
drew nigh unto the city, Peter went up upon the
housetop to pray about the sixth hour:
10
And he became very hungry, and would have eaten: but
while they made ready, he fell into a trance,
11
And saw heaven opened, and a certain vessel
descending upon him, as it had been a great sheet
knit at the four corners, and let down to the earth:
12
Wherein were all manner of fourfooted beasts of the
earth, and wild beasts, and creeping things, and
fowls of the air.
13
And there came a voice to him, Rise, Peter; kill, and
eat.
14
But Peter said, Not so, Lord; for I have never eaten
any thing that is common or unclean.
15
And the voice spake unto him again the second time,
What God hath cleansed, that call not thou common.
16
This was done thrice: and the vessel was received up
again into heaven.

ROMANS 14:12-23 (KJV)

12
So then every one of us shall give account of himself to God.
13
Let us not therefore judge one another any more: but judge this
rather, that no man put a stumblingblock or an occasion to fall
in his brother's way.
14
I know, and am persuaded by the Lord Jesus, that there is
nothing unclean of itself: but to him that esteemeth any thing
to be unclean, to him it is unclean.
15
But if thy brother be grieved with thy meat, now walkest thou
not charitably. Destroy not him with thy meat, for whom Christ
died.
16
Let not then your good be evil spoken of:
17
For the kingdom of God is not meat and drink; but
righteousness, and peace, and joy in the Holy Ghost.
18
For he that in these things serveth Christ is acceptable to
God, and approved of men.
19
Let us therefore follow after the things which make for peace,
and things wherewith one may edify another.
20
For meat destroy not the work of God. All things indeed are
pure; but it is evil for that man who eateth with offence.
21
It is good neither to eat flesh, nor to drink wine, nor any
thing whereby thy brother stumbleth, or is offended, or is made
weak.
22
Hast thou faith? have it to thyself before God. Happy is he
that condemneth not himself in that thing which he alloweth.
23
And he that doubteth is damned if he eat, because he eateth not
of faith: for whatsoever is not of faith is sin.

LOL, YOU were the one that brought up the Bible and homosexuality, NOT me.
Jesus says nothing bad about homosexuals.
Jesus IS to be followed to be Christlike.
Being Christlike is being a true Christian.
Love thy neighbor. Jesus does not distinguish between folks.
But you do.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

Read the Bible and see what it says about hog sammich eaters, folks that round off their haircuts, pulls out before planting their seed (Genesis 38:9) where Onan committed suicide for God because he did, tattos (Leviticus 19:28), wear polyester clothes, divorce, letting men without testicles into the church (Deuteronomy 12:1), wearing gold or pearls to church, eating any shellfish like oysters and shrimp or any of them and Deuteronomy where a woman is banned from grabbing a man's testicles if 2 of them are fighting.
Need more?
I would already be in hell because even though I played on the defense I did touch the ball as often as I could "You should not eat their flesh or touch their carcaases, they are unclean to you". Leviticus 11:8.
You are going to hell if you do any of those things.
You selectively quote the Bible. I have read the entire thing many times.

That's the Old Testament. A new covenant was made when Jesus came along.

If you had read the Bible you would know that.

Mark 7:18 (NIV) "Are you so dull?" he asked. "Don't you see that nothing that enters a man from the outside can make him 'unclean'?
Mark 7:19 (NIV) For it doesn't go into his heart but into his stomach, and then out of his body." (In saying this, Jesus declared all foods "clean.")


ACTS 10:9-16 (KJV)

The Vision Of Peter

9
On the morrow, as they went on their journey, and
drew nigh unto the city, Peter went up upon the
housetop to pray about the sixth hour:
10
And he became very hungry, and would have eaten: but
while they made ready, he fell into a trance,
11
And saw heaven opened, and a certain vessel
descending upon him, as it had been a great sheet
knit at the four corners, and let down to the earth:
12
Wherein were all manner of fourfooted beasts of the
earth, and wild beasts, and creeping things, and
fowls of the air.
13
And there came a voice to him, Rise, Peter; kill, and
eat.
14
But Peter said, Not so, Lord; for I have never eaten
any thing that is common or unclean.
15
And the voice spake unto him again the second time,
What God hath cleansed, that call not thou common.
16
This was done thrice: and the vessel was received up
again into heaven.

ROMANS 14:12-23 (KJV)

12
So then every one of us shall give account of himself to God.
13
Let us not therefore judge one another any more: but judge this
rather, that no man put a stumblingblock or an occasion to fall
in his brother's way.
14
I know, and am persuaded by the Lord Jesus, that there is
nothing unclean of itself: but to him that esteemeth any thing
to be unclean, to him it is unclean.
15
But if thy brother be grieved with thy meat, now walkest thou
not charitably. Destroy not him with thy meat, for whom Christ
died.
16
Let not then your good be evil spoken of:
17
For the kingdom of God is not meat and drink; but
righteousness, and peace, and joy in the Holy Ghost.
18
For he that in these things serveth Christ is acceptable to
God, and approved of men.
19
Let us therefore follow after the things which make for peace,
and things wherewith one may edify another.
20
For meat destroy not the work of God. All things indeed are
pure; but it is evil for that man who eateth with offence.
21
It is good neither to eat flesh, nor to drink wine, nor any
thing whereby thy brother stumbleth, or is offended, or is made
weak.
22
Hast thou faith? have it to thyself before God. Happy is he
that condemneth not himself in that thing which he alloweth.
23
And he that doubteth is damned if he eat, because he eateth not
of faith: for whatsoever is not of faith is sin.

LOL, YOU were the one that brought up the Bible and homosexuality, NOT me.
Jesus says nothing bad about homosexuals.
Jesus IS to be followed to be Christlike.
Being Christlike is being a true Christian.
Love thy neighbor. Jesus does not distinguish between folks.
But you do.

Yes but it must be read and understood in context.

And yes if you read the New Testament it does mention homosexuals.

They exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served created things rather than the Creator-- who is forever praised. Amen. Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones. In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed indecent acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion. (NIV, Romans 1:25-27)

We also know that the law is made not for the righteous but for lawbreakers and rebels, the ungodly and sinful, the unholy and irreligious, for those who kill their fathers or mothers, for murderers, for the sexually immoral, for those practicing homosexuality, for slave traders and liars and perjurers—and for whatever else is contrary to the sound doctrine (1 Tim. 1:9–10).

Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God. And that is what some of you were. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God. (NIV, 1st Corinthians 6:9-11)

Jesus was not here to judge, but to save. Judgement will come later.

And since he never talked specifically about homosexuals there is no way of knowing his thoughts on the subject.

Jude 23
Rescue others by snatching them from the flames of judgment. Show mercy to still others, but do so with great caution, hating the sins that contaminate their lives

(love the sinner, hate the sin)

 

[amrchaos]

What if those homos are not christian?

What if they are un-affiliated theist that resist organized religion? What good is quoting the bible then?

 

[Lonestar_logic]

What if those homos are not christian?

What if they are un-affiliated theist that resist organized religion? What good is quoting the bible then?

I don't play the "what if" game.

Either you believe or you don't. I personally do not care.

 

[amrchaos]

What if those homos are not christian?

What if they are un-affiliated theist that resist organized religion? What good is quoting the bible then?

I don't play the "what if" game.

Either you believe or you don't. I personally do not care.

OK--let say they do not believe in that key statement about homosexuals.

In fact, they claim that was a mistranslation of the actual Bible and they believe everything else.

Are we then to force them to behave according to a mainstream version of the Bible and keep them from marrying, or are we to allow them to marry according to their own beliefs?

By the way, there are people that are non-affiliated with any christian denomination. That is no an "what if" but actual reality that should be considered.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

What if those homos are not christian?

What if they are un-affiliated theist that resist organized religion? What good is quoting the bible then?

I don't play the "what if" game.

Either you believe or you don't. I personally do not care.

OK--let say they do not believe in that key statement about homosexuals.

In fact, they claim that was a mistranslation of the actual Bible and they believe everything else.

Are we then to force them to behave according to a mainstream version of the Bible and keep them from marrying, or are we to allow them to marry according to their own beliefs?

By the way, there are people that are non-affiliated with any christian denomination. That is no an "what if" but actual reality that should be considered.

No one is forcing anyone to do anything.

They are perfectly capable of entering into a civil union, but marriage is defined as a union between one man and one woman. So whatever they do, they just can't call it a marriage.

Since a marriage contract is a legal binding document the terms must be defined and in that document the definiton of marriage is as I've stated, a union between one man and one woman. Seek to change the law if you wish. Many have tried and some have succeeded.

 

[WorldWatcher]

I don't play the "what if" game.

Either you believe or you don't. I personally do not care.

OK--let say they do not believe in that key statement about homosexuals.

In fact, they claim that was a mistranslation of the actual Bible and they believe everything else.

Are we then to force them to behave according to a mainstream version of the Bible and keep them from marrying, or are we to allow them to marry according to their own beliefs?

By the way, there are people that are non-affiliated with any christian denomination. That is no an "what if" but actual reality that should be considered.

No one is forcing anyone to do anything.

Yes they are, they are forcing them NOT to enter into Civil Marriages because they are denied that option (in many places).

They are perfectly capable of entering into a civil union,

Not "perfectly capable" as many states that passed constitutional amendments denied them even access to Civil Unions.

but marriage is defined as a union between one man and one woman.

Not necessarily. Civil Marriage is defined as one man and one woman in some places, one man and many women in others, and two consenting adults on others. As a matter of fact there are 7 legal entities in the United States the define it as two consenting adults.

Religion Marriage and Civil Marriage often have different definitions.

So whatever they do, they just can't call it a marriage.

Sure they can call it marriage, that's what it is. It's Civil Marriage under the authority of the legal entity issuing the license.

Since a marriage contract is a legal binding document the terms must be defined and in that document the definiton of marriage is as I've stated, a union between one man and one woman. Seek to change the law if you wish. Many have tried and some have succeeded.

I'm sorry, but you are wrong again. No where on my marriage license does it "define" marriage (and mine was issued in 1987). But you are incorrect that Civil Marriage licenses all say Civil Marriage is between a man and a woman. Same-sex Couples have received Civil Marriage Licenses under State authority since 2004.



>>>>

 

[Gadawg73]

That's the Old Testament. A new covenant was made when Jesus came along.

If you had read the Bible you would know that.

Mark 7:18 (NIV) "Are you so dull?" he asked. "Don't you see that nothing that enters a man from the outside can make him 'unclean'?
Mark 7:19 (NIV) For it doesn't go into his heart but into his stomach, and then out of his body." (In saying this, Jesus declared all foods "clean.")


ACTS 10:9-16 (KJV)

The Vision Of Peter

9
On the morrow, as they went on their journey, and
drew nigh unto the city, Peter went up upon the
housetop to pray about the sixth hour:
10
And he became very hungry, and would have eaten: but
while they made ready, he fell into a trance,
11
And saw heaven opened, and a certain vessel
descending upon him, as it had been a great sheet
knit at the four corners, and let down to the earth:
12
Wherein were all manner of fourfooted beasts of the
earth, and wild beasts, and creeping things, and
fowls of the air.
13
And there came a voice to him, Rise, Peter; kill, and
eat.
14
But Peter said, Not so, Lord; for I have never eaten
any thing that is common or unclean.
15
And the voice spake unto him again the second time,
What God hath cleansed, that call not thou common.
16
This was done thrice: and the vessel was received up
again into heaven.

ROMANS 14:12-23 (KJV)

12
So then every one of us shall give account of himself to God.
13
Let us not therefore judge one another any more: but judge this
rather, that no man put a stumblingblock or an occasion to fall
in his brother's way.
14
I know, and am persuaded by the Lord Jesus, that there is
nothing unclean of itself: but to him that esteemeth any thing
to be unclean, to him it is unclean.
15
But if thy brother be grieved with thy meat, now walkest thou
not charitably. Destroy not him with thy meat, for whom Christ
died.
16
Let not then your good be evil spoken of:
17
For the kingdom of God is not meat and drink; but
righteousness, and peace, and joy in the Holy Ghost.
18
For he that in these things serveth Christ is acceptable to
God, and approved of men.
19
Let us therefore follow after the things which make for peace,
and things wherewith one may edify another.
20
For meat destroy not the work of God. All things indeed are
pure; but it is evil for that man who eateth with offence.
21
It is good neither to eat flesh, nor to drink wine, nor any
thing whereby thy brother stumbleth, or is offended, or is made
weak.
22
Hast thou faith? have it to thyself before God. Happy is he
that condemneth not himself in that thing which he alloweth.
23
And he that doubteth is damned if he eat, because he eateth not
of faith: for whatsoever is not of faith is sin.

LOL, YOU were the one that brought up the Bible and homosexuality, NOT me.
Jesus says nothing bad about homosexuals.
Jesus IS to be followed to be Christlike.
Being Christlike is being a true Christian.
Love thy neighbor. Jesus does not distinguish between folks.
But you do.

Yes but it must be read and understood in context.

And yes if you read the New Testament it does mention homosexuals.

They exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served created things rather than the Creator-- who is forever praised. Amen. Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones. In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed indecent acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion. (NIV, Romans 1:25-27)

We also know that the law is made not for the righteous but for lawbreakers and rebels, the ungodly and sinful, the unholy and irreligious, for those who kill their fathers or mothers, for murderers, for the sexually immoral, for those practicing homosexuality, for slave traders and liars and perjurers—and for whatever else is contrary to the sound doctrine (1 Tim. 1:9–10).

Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God. And that is what some of you were. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God. (NIV, 1st Corinthians 6:9-11)

Jesus was not here to judge, but to save. Judgement will come later.

And since he never talked specifically about homosexuals there is no way of knowing his thoughts on the subject.

Jude 23
Rescue others by snatching them from the flames of judgment. Show mercy to still others, but do so with great caution, hating the sins that contaminate their lives

(love the sinner, hate the sin)

\

He never condemned them like you do.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

OK--let say they do not believe in that key statement about homosexuals.

In fact, they claim that was a mistranslation of the actual Bible and they believe everything else.

Are we then to force them to behave according to a mainstream version of the Bible and keep them from marrying, or are we to allow them to marry according to their own beliefs?

By the way, there are people that are non-affiliated with any christian denomination. That is no an "what if" but actual reality that should be considered.

No one is forcing anyone to do anything.

Yes they are, they are forcing them NOT to enter into Civil Marriages because they are denied that option (in many places).




Not "perfectly capable" as many states that passed constitutional amendments denied them even access to Civil Unions.



Not necessarily. Civil Marriage is defined as one man and one woman in some places, one man and many women in others, and two consenting adults on others. As a matter of fact there are 7 legal entities in the United States the define it as two consenting adults.

Religion Marriage and Civil Marriage often have different definitions.

So whatever they do, they just can't call it a marriage.

Sure they can call it marriage, that's what it is. It's Civil Marriage under the authority of the legal entity issuing the license.

Since a marriage contract is a legal binding document the terms must be defined and in that document the definiton of marriage is as I've stated, a union between one man and one woman. Seek to change the law if you wish. Many have tried and some have succeeded.

I'm sorry, but you are wrong again. No where on my marriage license does it "define" marriage (and mine was issued in 1987). But you are incorrect that Civil Marriage licenses all say Civil Marriage is between a man and a woman. Same-sex Couples have received Civil Marriage Licenses under State authority since 2004.



>>>>

How is marriage defined in the United States? Currently 37 states have passed laws which define marriage as limited to a union between one man and one woman: 33 state legislatures have passed statutes to that effect, and 4 states (Alaska, Hawaii, Nebraska and Nevada) have, by popular vote, passed Defense of Marriage Acts (DOMAs) as constitutional amendments; the Ohio state legislature is currently debating a Defense of Marriage Act. Thirteen states, therefore, do not currently have laws on their books which limit marriage to a union between one man and one woman.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

LOL, YOU were the one that brought up the Bible and homosexuality, NOT me.
Jesus says nothing bad about homosexuals.
Jesus IS to be followed to be Christlike.
Being Christlike is being a true Christian.
Love thy neighbor. Jesus does not distinguish between folks.
But you do.

Yes but it must be read and understood in context.

And yes if you read the New Testament it does mention homosexuals.

They exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served created things rather than the Creator-- who is forever praised. Amen. Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones. In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed indecent acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion. (NIV, Romans 1:25-27)

We also know that the law is made not for the righteous but for lawbreakers and rebels, the ungodly and sinful, the unholy and irreligious, for those who kill their fathers or mothers, for murderers, for the sexually immoral, for those practicing homosexuality, for slave traders and liars and perjurers—and for whatever else is contrary to the sound doctrine (1 Tim. 1:9–10).

Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God. And that is what some of you were. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God. (NIV, 1st Corinthians 6:9-11)

Jesus was not here to judge, but to save. Judgement will come later.

And since he never talked specifically about homosexuals there is no way of knowing his thoughts on the subject.

Jude 23
Rescue others by snatching them from the flames of judgment. Show mercy to still others, but do so with great caution, hating the sins that contaminate their lives

(love the sinner, hate the sin)

\

He never condemned them like you do.

He never mentioned them at all whether to condemn or not.

It is foolish to say that lack of condemnation = acceptance.

And where exactly have I condemned them?
Is believing that gays live an abominal lifestyle a condemnation?
Is believing in the sanctity of marriage to create a stable home in which children can grow and thrive condemnation?

 

[WorldWatcher]

No one is forcing anyone to do anything.

Yes they are, they are forcing them NOT to enter into Civil Marriages because they are denied that option (in many places).




Not "perfectly capable" as many states that passed constitutional amendments denied them even access to Civil Unions.



Not necessarily. Civil Marriage is defined as one man and one woman in some places, one man and many women in others, and two consenting adults on others. As a matter of fact there are 7 legal entities in the United States the define it as two consenting adults.

Religion Marriage and Civil Marriage often have different definitions.



Sure they can call it marriage, that's what it is. It's Civil Marriage under the authority of the legal entity issuing the license.

Since a marriage contract is a legal binding document the terms must be defined and in that document the definiton of marriage is as I've stated, a union between one man and one woman. Seek to change the law if you wish. Many have tried and some have succeeded.

I'm sorry, but you are wrong again. No where on my marriage license does it "define" marriage (and mine was issued in 1987). But you are incorrect that Civil Marriage licenses all say Civil Marriage is between a man and a woman. Same-sex Couples have received Civil Marriage Licenses under State authority since 2004.



>>>>

How is marriage defined in the United States? Currently 37 states have passed laws which define marriage as limited to a union between one man and one woman: 33 state legislatures have passed statutes to that effect, and 4 states (Alaska, Hawaii, Nebraska and Nevada) have, by popular vote, passed Defense of Marriage Acts (DOMAs) as constitutional amendments; the Ohio state legislature is currently debating a Defense of Marriage Act. Thirteen states, therefore, do not currently have laws on their books which limit marriage to a union between one man and one woman.

How is marriage defined in the United States

This is now different from what was asked/stated earlier which implied a universal definition of "marriage" as one man and one woman which is fundamentally incorrect.

How is marriage defined in the United States

What do you mean by "marriage", it helps if you provide some context during our discussion/exchange of ideas.

"Marriage" exists in two realms: Religious and Civil. Religious is that recognized by a religious organization while Civil Marriage is that entered under the jurisdiction of a legal entity empowered to establish a family relationship between non-related consenting adults.

Some religious organizations recognize only the union of one man and one woman, some religious organizations recognize the union of one man and one woman, and some religious organizations recognize the union of two consenting adults.

Some legal entities recognize only the union of one man and one woman and some recognize two consenting non-related adults.


Therefore there is no one definition of "marriage", be it religious or civil, in the United States.

Currently 37 states have passed laws which define marriage as limited to a union between one man and one woman: 33 state legislatures have passed statutes to that effect, and 4 states (Alaska, Hawaii, Nebraska and Nevada) have, by popular vote, passed Defense of Marriage Acts (DOMAs) as constitutional amendments; the Ohio state legislature is currently debating a Defense of Marriage Act. Thirteen states, therefore, do not currently have laws on their books which limit marriage to a union between one man and one woman.

Interesting. You ask a question and then provide a reasonably summarized answer to your own question. Reasonable, yet it omits one important element. There are 7 States (Connecticut, Iowa, Massachusetts, New Hampshire, New York, Vermont, and California**) which recognize Same-sex Civil Marriage within their borders and the District of Columbia. Two more have passed laws approving Same-sex Civil Marriage (Washington and Maryland) but are waiting ballot approval or rejection to determine if they can be implemented.

Since different legal entities define Civil Marriage differently there is no one universal Civil Marriage definition operable in the United States.

Since different religious organizations define Religious Marriage differently there is no one universal Religious Marriage definition operable in the United States.



**California still recognizes Civil Marriages performed during the period June 2008 and November 2008 prior to the passage of Prop 8 which prevents any new Civil Marriages in the State.


>>>>

 

[Gadawg73]

State Legislatures pass legislation to have referendums on gay marriage and that takes priority over the dozens of other problems we face.
Where is gay marriage on everyone'e priority list?
127th or 128th?

 

[AmericanFirst]

You must believe the argument that a person is born gay.

Tell us about how you chose to be straight.
Choice means you contemplated all of your options.
Tell us how long you weighed in on the pros and cons of being gay.
Never happened that way to me. I was born straight.
I fell in love with a woman. Gays fall in love with folk of the same sex.
But if you were different and it worked different for you please tell us about it.

The thought of becoming gay has never crossed my mind.


You can no more prove gays are born that way than I can prove otherwise. It's my opinion that gays fall back on the "I was born that way " line in an effort to somehow justify their abnormal lifestyle.

You hit the nail on the head.

 

[AmericanFirst]

Read the Bible and see what it says about hog sammich eaters, folks that round off their haircuts, pulls out before planting their seed (Genesis 38:9) where Onan committed suicide for God because he did, tattos (Leviticus 19:28), wear polyester clothes, divorce, letting men without testicles into the church (Deuteronomy 12:1), wearing gold or pearls to church, eating any shellfish like oysters and shrimp or any of them and Deuteronomy where a woman is banned from grabbing a man's testicles if 2 of them are fighting.
Need more?
I would already be in hell because even though I played on the defense I did touch the ball as often as I could "You should not eat their flesh or touch their carcaases, they are unclean to you". Leviticus 11:8.
You are going to hell if you do any of those things.
You selectively quote the Bible. I have read the entire thing many times.

That's the Old Testament. A new covenant was made when Jesus came along.

If you had read the Bible you would know that.

Mark 7:18 (NIV) "Are you so dull?" he asked. "Don't you see that nothing that enters a man from the outside can make him 'unclean'?
Mark 7:19 (NIV) For it doesn't go into his heart but into his stomach, and then out of his body." (In saying this, Jesus declared all foods "clean.")


ACTS 10:9-16 (KJV)

The Vision Of Peter

9
On the morrow, as they went on their journey, and
drew nigh unto the city, Peter went up upon the
housetop to pray about the sixth hour:
10
And he became very hungry, and would have eaten: but
while they made ready, he fell into a trance,
11
And saw heaven opened, and a certain vessel
descending upon him, as it had been a great sheet
knit at the four corners, and let down to the earth:
12
Wherein were all manner of fourfooted beasts of the
earth, and wild beasts, and creeping things, and
fowls of the air.
13
And there came a voice to him, Rise, Peter; kill, and
eat.
14
But Peter said, Not so, Lord; for I have never eaten
any thing that is common or unclean.
15
And the voice spake unto him again the second time,
What God hath cleansed, that call not thou common.
16
This was done thrice: and the vessel was received up
again into heaven.

ROMANS 14:12-23 (KJV)

12
So then every one of us shall give account of himself to God.
13
Let us not therefore judge one another any more: but judge this
rather, that no man put a stumblingblock or an occasion to fall
in his brother's way.
14
I know, and am persuaded by the Lord Jesus, that there is
nothing unclean of itself: but to him that esteemeth any thing
to be unclean, to him it is unclean.
15
But if thy brother be grieved with thy meat, now walkest thou
not charitably. Destroy not him with thy meat, for whom Christ
died.
16
Let not then your good be evil spoken of:
17
For the kingdom of God is not meat and drink; but
righteousness, and peace, and joy in the Holy Ghost.
18
For he that in these things serveth Christ is acceptable to
God, and approved of men.
19
Let us therefore follow after the things which make for peace,
and things wherewith one may edify another.
20
For meat destroy not the work of God. All things indeed are
pure; but it is evil for that man who eateth with offence.
21
It is good neither to eat flesh, nor to drink wine, nor any
thing whereby thy brother stumbleth, or is offended, or is made
weak.
22
Hast thou faith? have it to thyself before God. Happy is he
that condemneth not himself in that thing which he alloweth.
23
And he that doubteth is damned if he eat, because he eateth not
of faith: for whatsoever is not of faith is sin.

LOL, YOU were the one that brought up the Bible and homosexuality, NOT me.
Jesus says nothing bad about homosexuals.
Jesus IS to be followed to be Christlike.
Being Christlike is being a true Christian.
Love thy neighbor. Jesus does not distinguish between folks.
But you do.

Jesus did mention fornication which all sexual sin including homosexuality falls under. That is also a lame defense saying that just because Jesus didn't say anything about it means it is alright.