Out-Sourcing American Jobs

[HenryBHough]

Yes!

Far better to offshore entire companies than just jobs. Americans will have no choice to buy their goods as imports 'cause whatever they are they will NOT be being manufactured in The U.S.

We're import dependent now. We produce very little of what we use and consume. The "Made In U.S.A." label is hard to find, especially on retail store shelves. It would be better to severely penalize companies that off-shore out-source jobs.

When entire companies have moved offshore and have zero assets in The U.S. to tax or confiscate then how do you propose they be penalized? Maybe by banning the importation of everything they make? Or maybe levying huge import duties setting off a trade war?

 

[Sonny Clark]

We produce very little of what we use and consume.

How much of what we consume do what produce?

Reason I ask is despite decrease in manufacturing employment over past few decades the United States is still a massive production powerhouse. GE, Ford, Proctor & Gamble, Intel, Pfizer, Dow Chemical, Johnson & Johnson, Caterpillar, United Technologies, Kraft Foods, Merck, Coke, DuPont, Cisco, Abbot, Tyson, 3M etc. on and on we make a ton of shit and a lot of it is consumed right here in the United States.

Yes, we do use and consume American made goods here in the U.S., of course. But, most of what we use and consume is imported. Examples: Textiles, appliances, furniture, tools, toys, steel, farm equipment, electronics, automotive parts and supplies, etc. Check your local store shelves and see how many "Made IN U.S.A." labels you find. Go to any Wal-Mart and see if you can find shoes, shirts, bath towels, bed sheets, or electronics that was NOT made outside of this country. Go to your local Auto Zone and try to find a socket or end wrench made in the U.S. You may be able to find one or two out a couple of dozen on the shelf. Go to Rent-To-Own and see how many pieces of furniture are imported. Go to any appliance store and see how many U.S.A. made appliances there are compared to the imports. Go to a farm equipment supply store and see how many foreign made pieces of equipment they carry. The point is, we import most of what we use and consume. Some of our food is imported. We are import dependent.

What would happen if we didn't import clothes, appliances, toys, steel, automotive parts and supplies? What if the supply of those items suddenly stopped? What if we stopped importing everything that could be made, manufactured, and produced here in the U.S.? A little side note here, if I may. How many of our poor, less fortunate, disabled, and elderly, could afford to buy everything American made? How about the unemployed? Could they shop for "only" American made items and necessities? As it stands now, most Americans can not shop on Fifth Avenue. We are a poor and dependent society, and getting poorer by the day. Cheap imports enable consumers to buy necessities, and buy a few non-necessities. Why?

Back in the 50's and 60's, there were plants and factories on almost every street corner. We had jobs that covered all education and skill levels. Those were self-supporting jobs. Then unions got greedy, and American made goods became expensive, more expensive than imports. In addition, our government enacted unfair, unjust, and one-sided foreign trade agreements and policies, which made the situation worse. Then next, we closed the steel factories, the textile plants, we lost the electronics industry, and on and on and on and on. So, between the greedy unions asking for $20.00 an hour for the floor sweeper, and the unfair, unjust, and one-sided foreign trade agreements and policies, we lost industry after industry until we were out of work, standing in unemployment lines, and living off of government assistance programs. Now, we're import dependent, and produce very little of what we use and consume. As our population grew, there were fewer and fewer self-supporting opportunities available for our work force. In addition, we started importing labor, off-shore out-sourcing labor, and allowing millions of illegal immigrants to live and work in this country.

The net results is a poor and dependent society, living off of unemployment checks, government assistance programs, and charity. A lot of what we actually produce, is exported, and not purchased by Americans. Most Americans can't afford to buy what we produce. Part-time jobs, temporary jobs, low wage jobs, and side-line work can't pay the price to shop for American made goods. We have over 47 million on food stamps. Can they buy union made products that are produced here in America?

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

We produce very little of what we use and consume.

How much of what we consume do what produce?

Reason I ask is despite decrease in manufacturing employment over past few decades the United States is still a massive production powerhouse. GE, Ford, Proctor & Gamble, Intel, Pfizer, Dow Chemical, Johnson & Johnson, Caterpillar, United Technologies, Kraft Foods, Merck, Coke, DuPont, Cisco, Abbot, Tyson, 3M etc. on and on we make a ton of shit and a lot of it is consumed right here in the United States.

Yes, we do use and consume American made goods here in the U.S., of course. But, most of what we use and consume is imported. Examples: Textiles, appliances, furniture, tools, toys, steel, farm equipment, electronics, automotive parts and supplies, etc. Check your local store shelves and see how many "Made IN U.S.A." labels you find. Go to any Wal-Mart and see if you can find shoes, shirts, bath towels, bed sheets, or electronics that was NOT made outside of this country. Go to your local Auto Zone and try to find a socket or end wrench made in the U.S. You may be able to find one or two out a couple of dozen on the shelf. Go to Rent-To-Own and see how many pieces of furniture are imported. Go to any appliance store and see how many U.S.A. made appliances there are compared to the imports. Go to a farm equipment supply store and see how many foreign made pieces of equipment they carry. The point is, we import most of what we use and consume. Some of our food is imported. We are import dependent.

What would happen if we didn't import clothes, appliances, toys, steel, automotive parts and supplies? What if the supply of those items suddenly stopped? What if we stopped importing everything that could be made, manufactured, and produced here in the U.S.? A little side note here, if I may. How many of our poor, less fortunate, disabled, and elderly, could afford to buy everything American made? How about the unemployed? Could they shop for "only" American made items and necessities? As it stands now, most Americans can not shop on Fifth Avenue. We are a poor and dependent society, and getting poorer by the day. Cheap imports enable consumers to buy necessities, and buy a few non-necessities. Why?

Back in the 50's and 60's, there were plants and factories on almost every street corner. We had jobs that covered all education and skill levels. Those were self-supporting jobs. Then unions got greedy, and American made goods became expensive, more expensive than imports. In addition, our government enacted unfair, unjust, and one-sided foreign trade agreements and policies, which made the situation worse. Then next, we closed the steel factories, the textile plants, we lost the electronics industry, and on and on and on and on. So, between the greedy unions asking for $20.00 an hour for the floor sweeper, and the unfair, unjust, and one-sided foreign trade agreements and policies, we lost industry after industry until we were out of work, standing in unemployment lines, and living off of government assistance programs. Now, we're import dependent, and produce very little of what we use and consume. As our population grew, there were fewer and fewer self-supporting opportunities available for our work force. In addition, we started importing labor, off-shore out-sourcing labor, and allowing millions of illegal immigrants to live and work in this country.

The net results is a poor and dependent society, living off of unemployment checks, government assistance programs, and charity. A lot of what we actually produce, is exported, and not purchased by Americans. Most Americans can't afford to buy what we produce. Part-time jobs, temporary jobs, low wage jobs, and side-line work can't pay the price to shop for American made goods. We have over 47 million on food stamps. Can they buy union made products that are produced here in America?

Clarke lacks the IQ to understand free trade. The basic principle is that the more with whom you trade the richer you get and the fewer with whom you trade the poorer you get. Its perhaps the one thing economists agree upon.

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

It would be better to severely penalize companies that off-shore out-source jobs.

too stupid!! then states will stop importing from other states too. then cities will require that all goods be made within city limits. Econ 101. Did you ever think of college???

 

[SteadyMercury]

But, most of what we use and consume is imported.

This is where I'm looking for clarification, are you just assuming this or do you have a source that attempts to break out consumables for the average American by their primary source of manufacturing? Do you also take into account how much of a product manufactured in China still creates jobs and profit along the food chain domestically? From the overpaid union fucks loading it off the ship, to the people moving it on a train, to a truck driver, to a store where stocker cashier etc. and all the centralized operations of those parts, something made in China is a lot more than just Xiao Wu toiling away in Shen Zhen.

If I take a quick look at my household budget things like clothes and tools aren't a significant monthly slice of the pie. A lot of what we consume are services... be it health insurance, car insurance, internet, electricity, Netflix, Amazon Prime, the Wall Street Journal, YMCA my wife does yoga with some really hot milfs, HOA fees, etc. For tangible products that come in the door very consistently it is mostly food and gas. Obviously some fruits/sugar/coffee is coming from overseas but I bet the overwhelming majority of food is domestically produced be it manufactured or grown. Entertainment budget is mostly going to restaurants/bars/movies and travel.

We own our home but I suspect for most people the #1 monthly expense is related to housing. Mortgage (mainly a service), rent, whatever.

I'd be interested to see the breakout of the average American's consumption and see how much is actually related to things produce domestically, as opposed to us in here just taking guesses based on our assumptions.

 

[Sonny Clark]

But, most of what we use and consume is imported.

This is where I'm looking for clarification, are you just assuming this or do you have a source that attempts to break out consumables for the average American by their primary source of manufacturing? Do you also take into account how much of a product manufactured in China still creates jobs and profit along the food chain domestically? From the overpaid union fucks loading it off the ship, to the people moving it on a train, to a truck driver, to a store where stocker cashier etc. and all the centralized operations of those parts, something made in China is a lot more than just Xiao Wu toiling away in Shen Zhen.

If I take a quick look at my household budget things like clothes and tools aren't a significant monthly slice of the pie. A lot of what we consume are services... be it health insurance, car insurance, internet, electricity, Netflix, Amazon Prime, the Wall Street Journal, YMCA my wife does yoga with some really hot milfs, HOA fees, etc. For tangible products that come in the door very consistently it is mostly food and gas. Obviously some fruits/sugar/coffee is coming from overseas but I bet the overwhelming majority of food is domestically produced be it manufactured or grown. Entertainment budget is mostly going to restaurants/bars/movies and travel.

We own our home but I suspect for most people the #1 monthly expense is related to housing. Mortgage (mainly a service), rent, whatever.

I'd be interested to see the breakout of the average American's consumption and see how much is actually related to things produce domestically, as opposed to us in here just taking guesses based on our assumptions.

Thanks for the response, I appreciate it. Now, likewise, I'd be very interested in seeing a break-down of actual goods received, the labor ( jobs ) involved in the "middle man operations", and the total benefit compared to the cost in American jobs, including the lost wages. Also, it'd be very interesting to see the numbers for the cost to taxpayers for unemployment, assistance programs, ghost towns created, lost tax revenue ( city, country, state, and federal ), and other related cost for lost industries. In addition, it'd be very interesting to see the overall cost of lost skills, the cost to manufacturers for lost equipment orders, the cost of lost industrial supply companies, etc. In summary, we have lost a lot of jobs, a lot of industries, industry service companies, and not just jobs, but jobs that once provided self-supporting opportunities that covered all education and skill levels.

Our plants and factories were keeping workers off government assistance programs and putting spendable income in their pockets to support the retail sector. I have no idea as to the break-down of benefit versus cost. But, common sense tells me that the net cost is extremely high. Lets look at it in a different way here. We have a rapidly growing population. People need jobs. If we're importing the products that I mentioned, that were once produced here in the U.S., then our work force is buying and not producing. We have idled workers buying imports because our plants and factories are closed. Did those imported products have anything to do with unemployment, dependency on government assistance programs, lost tax revenue, growing poverty, and lost skills? If not, what caused those things to happen?

And, we have to remember also that not everyone can be a doctor, lawyer, engineer, scientist, programmer, nor a corporate CEO. Someone has to sweep the floor, empty the trash, and drive a delivery truck. We need jobs that covers all education and skill levels. We have to realize also that technology, innovation, and automation has taken jobs. This means that businesses are producing more with less employees. Couple that fact with off-shore job out-sourcing, importing labor, and hiring cheap labor that's here illegally, and where are we to work and support ourselves? Are we to continue sacrificing our economic well-being in favor of supporting foreign economies? Are we to continue being import dependent, allow our workers to remain idle and living off of government assistance programs, or making so little that they're not able to support the retail sector?

Where do we draw the line between foreign trade and having a self-supporting population? Do our workers deserve to take a back seat to cheap foreign labor markets? Foreign trade is good, and has been since the beginning of time. I am not against foreign trade. I believe that foreign trade is vital and very much necessary. But, at the same time, I believe that we must provide self-supporting opportunities for our work force. This can be accomplished by re-writing our unfair, unjust, and one-sided foreign trade agreements and policies, so that they become fair, equal, and balanced foreign trade agreements and policies. In addition, I believe that we should penalize businesses that off-shore out-source jobs, import labor, and hire illegal workers.

Getting back to your questions. I'm not sure anyone has the data on the cost vs. benefits. I have no idea as to where to even look for such data. But, I do know that import dependency is hurting us, tremendously. It's obvious by the number of people living off of government assistance programs that could work, want to work, and want to be self-supporting. We have no jobs for our rapidly growing population. We continue to create a poor and dependent society. What is causing it? Our living standard has dropped. The cost of living is out pacing wages. Companies are offering less company paid benefits. In real dollars, we're not progressing at the same rate as cost. In my opinion, we should look after our own first before worrying about supporting foreign economies. We've already seen the results of that. The term "Global Economy" basically means equalization to the lowest level. How close are we to that level?

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

. The term "Global Economy" basically means equalization to the lowest level. How close are we to that level?

Econ 101, class one, day one: the more with whom you trade the richer you get, the fewer the poorer.

Imagine if you had to grow your own bananas and make your own cars.

Simple enough for even you?

 

[Sonny Clark]

. The term "Global Economy" basically means equalization to the lowest level. How close are we to that level?

Econ 101, class one, day one: the more with whom you trade the richer you get, the fewer the poorer.

Imagine if you had to grow your own bananas and make your own cars.

Simple enough for even you?

Then why are we getting poorer, more dependent, and have so many workers unemployed, underemployed, working part-time, temporary jobs, and college grads still living with parents due to taking jobs flipping burgers? Why do we have over 47 million on food stamps? Why do we have so many receiving some form of government assistance? Why does the government continue to prop up the economy with debt? Why is our standard of living declining? Why are wages not keeping up with the cost of living? Why are companies offering less company paid benefits? Why are cities going bankrupt? Why are pension funds in trouble? Why don't we have enough money to repair and upgrade our infrastructure? Why have home owners lost so much equity in their homes? Why do we have so many workers that have given up looking for employment?

No, it's not simple, it's sad and shameful, to put it mildly. Can you please address and answer the above questions? I would greatly appreciate it if you would. Your explanation of the above questions might make it simple for me. Would you mind answering them to educate me on economics? Obviously, you think that I need educating and brought up to speed on economics.

Oh, and one more question if you don't mind. If trade is so important and vital to our economy, and to our economic well-being, why have we closed so many plants and factories over the past 50 plus years? Why have we lost so many industries over that time span? Doesn't it seem like, according to your reasoning, that we would have had a lot more to trade if they had been keep open and operating? Just curious. Thanks in advance for you response. Looking forward to your answers and the education that I'll get from you.

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

Then why are we getting poorer,.

dear, I ve told you 10 times but you lack the IQ to understand:
1) liberal unions drove 30 million jobs off shore
2) liberal taxes drove 10 million jobs off shore
3) deficits drove 5 million jobs off shore
4) 20 million liberal illegals took the remaining jobs and further drove wages down for the few jobs that remained.

notice I defeat you with 2-3 % of the words you use to make your idiotic liberal non-arguments.

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

, why have we closed so many plants and factories over the past 50 plus years? .

dear, I ve told you 10 times but you lack the IQ to understand:
1) liberal unions drove 30 million jobs off shore
2) liberal taxes drove 10 million jobs off shore
3) deficits drove 5 million jobs off shore
4) 20 million liberal illegals took the remaining jobs and further drove wages down for the few jobs that remained.

notice I defeat you with 2-3 % of the words you use to make your idiotic liberal non-arguments.

 

[Sonny Clark]

Then why are we getting poorer,.

dear, I ve told you 10 times but you lack the IQ to understand:
1) liberal unions drove 30 million jobs off shore
2) liberal taxes drove 10 million jobs off shore
3) deficits drove 5 million jobs off shore
4) 20 million liberal illegals took the remaining jobs and further drove wages down for the few jobs that remained.

notice I defeat you with 2-3 % of the words you use to make your idiotic liberal non-arguments.

Whooooooooooooo, wait, please. So, if what you say is true, and I don't disagree, then where is all the riches that come from our import / export that you have said makes us richer? Did you not tell me that trade makes us better off, richer? Did I misunderstand you? Go back and read what you said about econo 101.

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

where is all the riches that come from our import / export that you have said makes us richer?.

dear, Walmart stuff is mostly imported. They alone save Americans $2500 per family per year. Do you grasp the concept? Being slow you look at low wages and ignore low prices.

 

[Sonny Clark]

, why have we closed so many plants and factories over the past 50 plus years? .

dear, I ve told you 10 times but you lack the IQ to understand:
1) liberal unions drove 30 million jobs off shore
2) liberal taxes drove 10 million jobs off shore
3) deficits drove 5 million jobs off shore
4) 20 million liberal illegals took the remaining jobs and further drove wages down for the few jobs that remained.

notice I defeat you with 2-3 % of the words you use to make your idiotic liberal non-arguments.

Whooooooooooooo, wait just a minute here, please. Are you not contradicting yourself? Seems that you are. First you tell me that econo 101 says that we're richer due to trade, import / export. Now, you're telling me why we've lost so many jobs, closed our plants and factories, and put our work force in unemployment lines and on government assistance programs. In other words, now you're saying the exact things that I have said, and you called me uneducated as to economics. Why gives here? Make your mind up, please. Is import / export ( as presently conducted ) making us richer or not? You can't play both sides against the middle. It either has to be one way or the other, and not both.

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

Is import / export ( as presently conducted ) making us richer or not?

dear there is small down turn as China and India come one stream but without trade we'd have to make everything ourselves and then be very very poor.

 

[Sonny Clark]

where is all the riches that come from our import / export that you have said makes us richer?.

dear, Walmart stuff is mostly imported. They alone save Americans $2500 per family per year. Do you grasp the concept? Being slow you look at low wages and ignore low prices.

Ah, but Wal-Mart doesn't make us richer. Wal-Mart enabled the poor and less fortunate to shop for necessities and a few non-necessities. Wal-Mart pays low wages, offers health insurance with $6,000 deductibles, and offers mostly part-time work way under 40 hours a week. I fail to see where Wal-Mart makes anyone richer except the Walton heirs. Can you explain where I'm wrong here, please? Thanks.

 

[Sonny Clark]

Is import / export ( as presently conducted ) making us richer or not?

dear there is small down turn as China and India come one stream but without trade we'd have to make everything ourselves and then be very very poor.

Whoooo, wait just a minute here please. So, if we open our plants and factories back up, provide self-supporting opportunities for all education and skill levels, put untold millions back to work, we'd be poorer? What's wrong with this picture? We'd be poorer by putting our work force back to work in living wage jobs like it was back in the 50's and 60's? I'm sorry, I don't see how getting people off of government assistance programs and unemployment checks will make us poorer. And, you're saying that by putting them back to work, supporting the retail sector with the spendable income in their pockets, will make us poorer? So, you're saying that having an internal positive cash flow within our own economy, will make us poorer? I really don't understand that. Could you please explain where I'm wrong here? I would really appreciate it if you would tell me where I'm going wrong here. Thanks.

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

Ah, but Wal-Mart doesn't make us richer..

actually $2500 per family!! Any business that lowers prices makes us richer. Does the goof liberal think that raising prices makes richer? Should we pass a law that every business must make raise prices to make us richer?

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

dear there is small down turn as China and India come one stream but without trade we'd have to make everything ourselves and then be very very poor.[/QUOTE]

Whoooo, wait just a minute here please. So, if we open our plants and factories back up, provide self-supporting opportunities for all education and skill levels, put untold millions back to work, we'd be poorer?

Econ 101 dear, class one day one, if you pass a law such that non competitive businesses win and competitive business lose then yes you'd be getting poorer and poorer.

Still over the liberals bird brain?

 

[Sonny Clark]

dear there is small down turn as China and India come one stream but without trade we'd have to make everything ourselves and then be very very poor.

Whoooo, wait just a minute here please. So, if we open our plants and factories back up, provide self-supporting opportunities for all education and skill levels, put untold millions back to work, we'd be poorer?

Econ 101 dear, class one day one, if you pass a law such that non competitive businesses win and competitive business lose then yes you'd be getting poorer and poorer.

Still over the liberals bird brain?[/QUOTE]
Whooooooooooooooo, wait a second please. Put the horses back in the barn for a minute. First, I have never ever said anything about making laws, not one single word concerning this conversation. It would not take passing a law to reopen our plants and factories, so why would I even mention a law? Please show where I have said anything about a law. Secondly, back in the 50's and 60's when we had plants and factories on almost every street corner, the competition is what kept them in business, and consumer prices low. ( econo 101 ). Fair competition for market share is what business is all about ( econo 101 ). When businesses compete, the consumer always wins. Fair competition for market share is a necessary catalyst for economic health and stability ( econo 101 ).

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

. Secondly, back in the 50's and 60's when we had plants and factories on almost every street corner, the competition is what kept them in business, and consumer prices low.

dear, there is a huge huge differene between intranational competition and international competition. Remember the rule: the more with whom you trade the richer you get, the fewer the poorer.

Still over your head?