Our Kennedy.

[Oldstyle]

Nixon inherited a war from Johnson that he subsequently ended. So does he get credit for saving lives at that point forward or only held responsible for the deaths that happened BEFORE he ended the war? I know this is tough stuff for a liberal to deal with, Sallow...the guys who SHOULD have ended the war DIDN'T and the guy who SHOULDN'T have ended the war...DID!

 

[Sallow]

Additionally, yeah..Nixon initially SUPPORTED the Khmer Rouge.

Nixon supported the Khmer Rouge? When did this take place? I'd give up on this string if I were you, Sallow. Your lack of knowledge is getting embarrassing.

Initially?

He sure did.

It was part of the reason for bombing Cambodia.

He knew that it would cause them to come into power and they fight the North Vietnamese.

It took Vietnam to oust the Khmer Rouge.

What's embarrassing is YOUR lack of knowledge.

 

[Sallow]

Nixon inherited a war from Johnson that he subsequently ended. So does he get credit for saving lives at that point forward or only held responsible for the deaths that happened BEFORE he ended the war? I know this is tough stuff for a liberal to deal with, Sallow...the guys who SHOULD have ended the war DIDN'T and the guy who SHOULDN'T have ended the war...DID!

Not "tough" at all.

I hold that Johnson was one of America's worst Presidents because of his escalation of the Vietnamese war.

 

[Oldstyle]

Additionally, yeah..Nixon initially SUPPORTED the Khmer Rouge.

Nixon supported the Khmer Rouge? When did this take place? I'd give up on this string if I were you, Sallow. Your lack of knowledge is getting embarrassing.

Initially?

He sure did.

It was part of the reason for bombing Cambodia.

He knew that it would cause them to come into power and they fight the North Vietnamese.

It took Vietnam to oust the Khmer Rouge.

What's embarrassing is YOUR lack of knowledge.

Since the Khmer Rouge were backed by the North Vietnamese...why would you think that they would "fight" them?

 

[Sallow]

And Nixon would have never ended the war without the protests.

Remember? When he was shooting kids at Kent State?

 

[Sallow]

Nixon supported the Khmer Rouge? When did this take place? I'd give up on this string if I were you, Sallow. Your lack of knowledge is getting embarrassing.

Initially?

He sure did.

It was part of the reason for bombing Cambodia.

He knew that it would cause them to come into power and they fight the North Vietnamese.

It took Vietnam to oust the Khmer Rouge.

What's embarrassing is YOUR lack of knowledge.

Since the Khmer Rouge were backed by the North Vietnamese...why would you think that they would "fight" them?

They weren't backed by the North Vietnamese. They were enemies.

Khmer Rouge jailer says U.S. contributed to Pol Pot rise | Reuters
History News Network | Wrestling with the Khmer Rouge Legacy

This landmark decision came only days after the U.S. Embassy in Phnom Penh celebrated the sixtieth anniversary of the restoration of U.S.-Cambodian relations. U.S. officials made no mention of their critical role in helping Pol Pot’s forces come to power. Nor did the trio of former U.S. ambassadors—Charles Ray, Kent Wiedemann, and Joseph Mussomeli—issue any apologies during the two-day celebration for the Nixon administration’s secret B-52 bombings that inflicted massive destruction on the Cambodian countryside or for U.S. diplomatic support for the Khmer Rouge from 1979 to 1990.

During his trial, Duch testified that the Khmer Rouge would have likely died out if the United States had not promoted a military coup d'état in 1970 against the non-aligned government led by Prince Norodom Sihanouk. "I think the Khmer Rouge would already have been demolished," he said of their status by 1970,"But Mr. Kissinger [then U.S. secretary of state] and Richard Nixon were quick [to back coup leader] Gen. Lon Nol, and then the Khmer Rouge noted the golden opportunity."

Because of this alliance, the Khmer Rouge was able to build up its power over the course of their 1970-75 war against the Lon Nol regime, Duch told the tribunal.

You guys are something else.

Any other fucked up history you wanna re-write?

 

[Sallow]

Here's another FY ******* I for you Oldstyle.

1979 - Vietnam invades Cambodia and ousts the Khmer Rouge regime of Pol Pot. In response, Chinese troops cross Vietnam's northern border. They are pushed back by Vietnamese forces. The number of "boat people" trying to leave Vietnam causes international concern.

BBC News - Vietnam profile - Timeline

 

[Oldstyle]

And Nixon would have never ended the war without the protests.

Remember? When he was shooting kids at Kent State?

I'm pretty sure Tricky Dick wasn't at Kent State, Sallow...that was some freaked out National Guardsmen pulling those triggers.

You can argue WHY Nixon ended the war but it won't change the fact that he DID end the war that Kennedy and Johnson escalated.

 

[Oldstyle]

Initially?

He sure did.

It was part of the reason for bombing Cambodia.

He knew that it would cause them to come into power and they fight the North Vietnamese.

It took Vietnam to oust the Khmer Rouge.

What's embarrassing is YOUR lack of knowledge.

Since the Khmer Rouge were backed by the North Vietnamese...why would you think that they would "fight" them?

They weren't backed by the North Vietnamese. They were enemies.

Khmer Rouge jailer says U.S. contributed to Pol Pot rise | Reuters
History News Network | Wrestling with the Khmer Rouge Legacy

This landmark decision came only days after the U.S. Embassy in Phnom Penh celebrated the sixtieth anniversary of the restoration of U.S.-Cambodian relations. U.S. officials made no mention of their critical role in helping Pol Pot’s forces come to power. Nor did the trio of former U.S. ambassadors—Charles Ray, Kent Wiedemann, and Joseph Mussomeli—issue any apologies during the two-day celebration for the Nixon administration’s secret B-52 bombings that inflicted massive destruction on the Cambodian countryside or for U.S. diplomatic support for the Khmer Rouge from 1979 to 1990.

During his trial, Duch testified that the Khmer Rouge would have likely died out if the United States had not promoted a military coup d'état in 1970 against the non-aligned government led by Prince Norodom Sihanouk. "I think the Khmer Rouge would already have been demolished," he said of their status by 1970,"But Mr. Kissinger [then U.S. secretary of state] and Richard Nixon were quick [to back coup leader] Gen. Lon Nol, and then the Khmer Rouge noted the golden opportunity."

Because of this alliance, the Khmer Rouge was able to build up its power over the course of their 1970-75 war against the Lon Nol regime, Duch told the tribunal.

You guys are something else.

Any other fucked up history you wanna re-write?

So Nixon backs Lon Nol...who ISN'T part of the Khmer Rouge...and somehow THAT translates into backing the Khmer Rouge because they subsequently overthrow Lon Nol? Is that your logic? LOL

 

[Sallow]

And Nixon would have never ended the war without the protests.

Remember? When he was shooting kids at Kent State?

I'm pretty sure Tricky Dick wasn't at Kent State, Sallow...that was some freaked out National Guardsmen pulling those triggers.

You can argue WHY Nixon ended the war but it won't change the fact that he DID end the war that Kennedy and Johnson escalated.

Yeah..he personally was responsible for about a million deaths, helped put into power one of the bloodiest regimes known to man which killed about another million people, secretly bombed 2 countries not involved in the fighting, but he ended the war after much domestic civil unrest.

Yay..score one for your side, Oldstyle.

 

[Oldstyle]

And who's word do you take as gospel on this? The chief torturer of the Pol Pot regime? Could you get any more ridiculous?

 

[Oldstyle]

And Nixon would have never ended the war without the protests.

Remember? When he was shooting kids at Kent State?

I'm pretty sure Tricky Dick wasn't at Kent State, Sallow...that was some freaked out National Guardsmen pulling those triggers.

You can argue WHY Nixon ended the war but it won't change the fact that he DID end the war that Kennedy and Johnson escalated.

Yeah..he personally was responsible for about a million deaths, helped put into power one of the bloodiest regimes known to man which killed about another million people, secretly bombed 2 countries not involved in the fighting, but he ended the war after much domestic civil unrest.

Yay..score one for your side, Oldstyle.

Nixon isn't on "my side", idiot. At the time I was a blissfully naive college student marching against the war. I'm simply pointing out that no matter how you feel about Nixon (and trust me...I loathed the man) he did in fact end the Vietnam war.

 

[Sallow]

Since the Khmer Rouge were backed by the North Vietnamese...why would you think that they would "fight" them?

They weren't backed by the North Vietnamese. They were enemies.

Khmer Rouge jailer says U.S. contributed to Pol Pot rise | Reuters
History News Network | Wrestling with the Khmer Rouge Legacy

This landmark decision came only days after the U.S. Embassy in Phnom Penh celebrated the sixtieth anniversary of the restoration of U.S.-Cambodian relations. U.S. officials made no mention of their critical role in helping Pol Pot’s forces come to power. Nor did the trio of former U.S. ambassadors—Charles Ray, Kent Wiedemann, and Joseph Mussomeli—issue any apologies during the two-day celebration for the Nixon administration’s secret B-52 bombings that inflicted massive destruction on the Cambodian countryside or for U.S. diplomatic support for the Khmer Rouge from 1979 to 1990.

During his trial, Duch testified that the Khmer Rouge would have likely died out if the United States had not promoted a military coup d'état in 1970 against the non-aligned government led by Prince Norodom Sihanouk. "I think the Khmer Rouge would already have been demolished," he said of their status by 1970,"But Mr. Kissinger [then U.S. secretary of state] and Richard Nixon were quick [to back coup leader] Gen. Lon Nol, and then the Khmer Rouge noted the golden opportunity."

Because of this alliance, the Khmer Rouge was able to build up its power over the course of their 1970-75 war against the Lon Nol regime, Duch told the tribunal.

You guys are something else.

Any other fucked up history you wanna re-write?

So Nixon backs Lon Nol...who ISN'T part of the Khmer Rouge...and somehow THAT translates into backing the Khmer Rouge because they subsequently overthrow Lon Nol? Is that your logic? LOL

They weren't "overthrown"..they were ousted by Vietnam.

Man. And Lon Nol was part of their government.

Seriously dude.

 

[Oldstyle]

And just for your edification...the Khmer Rouge killed 3 million not 1! They are the shining example of just how awful communism can be when it is taken to it's extremes.

 

[Oldstyle]

They weren't backed by the North Vietnamese. They were enemies.

Khmer Rouge jailer says U.S. contributed to Pol Pot rise | Reuters
History News Network | Wrestling with the Khmer Rouge Legacy



You guys are something else.

Any other fucked up history you wanna re-write?

So Nixon backs Lon Nol...who ISN'T part of the Khmer Rouge...and somehow THAT translates into backing the Khmer Rouge because they subsequently overthrow Lon Nol? Is that your logic? LOL

They weren't "overthrown"..they were ousted by Vietnam.

Man. And Lon Nol was part of their government.

Seriously dude.

Lon Nol was part of the Khmer Rouge? God, but you are clueless! When the Khmer Rouge took power, Lon Nol went into exile, living in California I believe. He was NOT part of their government!

 

[Oldstyle]

What's the matter, Sallow? Don't want to play history anymore?

 

[Oldstyle]

Can't believe you gave me a neg rep and then tucked tail and RAN from this string because you were showing yourself to absolutely ignorant about the Khmer Rouge. "The Big Bad Wolf"? You're more like a little lap dog that piddles on itself when it gets scared.

 

[Bfgrn]

Kennedy DID use the military during the Bay of Pigs...the main reason the operation turned into the fiasco that it did was that he only used HALF the air power that was originally allotted to take out Castro's fighter aircraft AND THAT DIDN'T DO THE JOB! Remember those scathing comments made about Kennedy by high ranking military officials you provided earlier? The REASON they disliked Kennedy was because he changed his mind at the last moment and only allowed 8 bombers to be used instead of the 16 that the military thought would be needed. The reason they didn't like Kennedy was that they found him to be indecisive.

Kennedy DID use the military during the Cuban Missile Crisis...he did so when he imposed an armed blockade of shipping in International Waters. Not only did he USE the military...he used them in a totally illegal action.

As for using the military to retaliate for the Berlin Wall? What pray tell COULD Kennedy have done militarily to halt the construction of a wall inside of communist controlled Eastern Europe? Your contention that non action on THAT proves that Kennedy was a dove is amusing.

AGAIN, I told you I have let you slide. Not anymore...link up buster...

Your argument has failed. Admit it. Hawks, don't send less, they send MORE. Hawks don't opt for a blockade when all the military advisers wanted to 'fry' Cuba, AND...A 'hawk' is not indecisive.

http://ibdogs.files.wordpress.com/2009/11/bayofpigs7.pdf

The Bay of Pigs - John F. Kennedy Presidential Library & Museum

#4: Kennedy?s Failure at the Bay of Pigs (Top 10 Mistakes by U.S. Presidents) | Britannica Blog

Cuba: The Bay of Pigs Invasion

History News Network | Failures of the Presidents: JFK's Bay of Pigs Disaster

Your problem, Bfgrn...is that you've chosen to believe the Kennedy "myth" that was created posthumously by people like Arthur Schlesinger, who painted JFK in an absurdly flattering manner.

Your problem, you need to READ what you linked...LOL

Here are some key points.

#4: Kennedy?s Failure at the Bay of Pigs (Top 10 Mistakes by U.S. Presidents) | Britannica Blog

Eisenhower approved a budget of $13 million for the operation, but stipulated that no U.S. military personnel could be part of the combat force.

Ideally the president would have liked the invasion and the overthrow of Castro to appear to be the work entirely of the Cuban exile community. He wanted to be able to deny that the U.S. government had had a hand in any of it. But Dulles and Bissell realized “the noise” was essential to this mission: if U.S. air craft would not support the Cuban brigade from the air, and if there were no U.S. battleships offshore full of U.S. troops ready to back up the exile fighters, then the invasion was likely to fail. The presence of the U.S. military was the key to a successful invasion and a successful uprising of Cubans disenchanted with the Castro regime. But neither Dulles nor Bissell revealed their worries to the president. And there was one more point they failed to mention and which Kennedy may or may not have known: with 200,000 troops and militia at his disposal, Castro would have no trouble disposing of 1,300 volunteers, most of whom had no battlefield experience.

Many of the approximately 1,300 CIA-trained Cuban exiles believed fervently that they were the first wave of Cuban freedom fighters who would liberate their homeland from Castro. They were convinced that as they stormed ashore they would be supported overhead by some of the finest fighter pilots of the U.S. Air Force, and as they advanced into Cuba, the U.S. Marines would be right behind them. These men were sorely mistaken.

 

[thanatos144]

All that Kennedy money was well spent in spinning a mediocre president as a good one

tapatalk post

 

[Sallow]

Can't believe you gave me a neg rep and then tucked tail and RAN from this string because you were showing yourself to absolutely ignorant about the Khmer Rouge. "The Big Bad Wolf"? You're more like a little lap dog that piddles on itself when it gets scared.

Erm..

No.

You negged rep me over something stupid..and I returned the favor.

Dude..if you don't like negs..don't give them.