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OPINION: Why mRNA Vaccines are failing.

EvMetro

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According all documents I have read
This is the reason why there is such a political divide in covid culture. There is a broad range of news, data, and information about mask. Covid, and vaccines, but most people limit their consumption of this to just the part of the broad range that supports what they want to hear or know. Unless you switch to objectively searching for the truth instead of subjectively searching for what you want the truth to be, you will never find anything but what you WANT the truth to be.
 

SweetSue92

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I guess you didn’t read page 6 where it says the opposite.

They can cite studies going back to the early days of the vaccines all they like. The current data says otherwise.
 

colfax_m

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They can cite studies going back to the early days of the vaccines all they like. The current data says otherwise.
The current data is unfiltered. Making conclusions based on the raw data is not good science. There's so many variables you aren't taking into account.

The studies they cite were rigorous and controlled. That's why their conclusions are more valid than your assertion.
 

SweetSue92

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colfax_m

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One such study CONCLUDED on March 3, 2021. Right, when vaccines were at their most effective. As I said, this is obvious. As it is obvious that these "vaccines" are not so much.

No vaccines that I have ever encountered are basically useless after, say, 9 months.

Here: ‘Effect of vaccination on transmission of COVID-19: an observational study in healthcare workers and their households.’
As if there were no more up to date studies.


But I welcome you producing a study which shows that the vaccine is "useless" after 9 months.
 

SweetSue92

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As if there were no more up to date studies.


But I welcome you producing a study which shows that the vaccine is "useless" after 9 months.

That study ended July 4th, and so the vast majority of the data was collected well before that--before Delta. So no. I'm guessing you know this.

I don't understand why people fight this battle. "Boosters" are already rolled out. That's an admission that yeah, the vaccines do not work all that well. Why are you still fighting a losing battle? I don't get it.
 

colfax_m

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That study ended July 4th, and so the vast majority of the data was collected well before that--before Delta. So no. I'm guessing you know this.

I don't understand why people fight this battle. "Boosters" are already rolled out. That's an admission that yeah, the vaccines do not work all that well. Why are you still fighting a losing battle? I don't get it.
It's an admission that efficacy wanes, but saying their "worthless" is ridiculous. Vaccines work a LOT better than nothing. That much is 100% clear.

I'm still interested in seeing a study supporting your assertion. So far we haven't seen anything.
 

SweetSue92

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It's an admission that efficacy wanes, but saying their "worthless" is ridiculous. Vaccines work a LOT better than nothing. That much is 100% clear.

I'm still interested in seeing a study supporting your assertion. So far we haven't seen anything.

Red herring. Don't need a "study". It's in the data. It's in the fact that there are "boosters". The end.

And you're right, for a lot of people the vaccines are beyond worthless. They have ruined lives with debilitating side effects.
 

colfax_m

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Red herring. Don't need a "study". It's in the data. It's in the fact that there are "boosters". The end.

And you're right, for a lot of people the vaccines are beyond worthless. They have ruined lives with debilitating side effects.
You do need a study. How else are you going to account for observation bias? What about identifying the number at risk? What about other confounders like behavioral differences? Differences in underlying health risk factors?

If vaccines are so worthless why isn’t the UK seeing a massive surge in deaths associated with the delta variant?
 

SweetSue92

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You do need a study. How else are you going to account for observation bias? What about identifying the number at risk? What about other confounders like behavioral differences? Differences in underlying health risk factors?

If vaccines are so worthless why isn’t the UK seeing a massive surge in deaths associated with the delta variant?

We are in a Moral Panic, so the real testing, study and data on vaccine harms are being hidden away. So yes, while the vaccines have a short window of preventing deaths of some people, they are doing harm to many people as well.

That information is being suppressed.

For now.
 

colfax_m

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We are in a Moral Panic, so the real testing, study and data on vaccine harms are being hidden away. So yes, while the vaccines have a short window of preventing deaths of some people, they are doing harm to many people as well.

That information is being suppressed.

For now.
If it truly were a short window that vaccines saved lives, wouldn’t you expect to see a massive surge of deaths in the UK already?

Is that happening?
 

SweetSue92

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If it truly were a short window that vaccines saved lives, wouldn’t you expect to see a massive surge of deaths in the UK already?

Is that happening?

All cause deaths are up there. Here as well.

Totally incurious about that, of course.
 

colfax_m

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All cause deaths are up there. Here as well.

Totally incurious about that, of course.
I look forward to a paper investigating all cause mortality.

But back to the original question, are COVID deaths spiking to pre-vaccine levels as one would expect based on your assertion?
 

Independentthinker

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You statement that the vaccinated are responsible for the continued epidemic is so ridiculous, it does not deserve a reply.
Several countries with the highest vaccination rates are experiencing surges. Think about it man. It is the vaccinated spreading the virus much more than the unvaccinated, particularly when the unvaccinated aren't even out as much because they aren't allowed in places and are getting fired from their jobs. Who spreads the virus more, a group of 25 unvaccinated persons congregating together or a group of 80,000 fully vaccinated attending a football game where the unvaccinated aren't allowed in? Who spreads the virus more, unvaccinated health care workers who get tested weekly or vaccinated health care workers who don't do weekly tests?
 

JohnDB

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The UK invested a lot of money in it's AstraZeneca Oxford vaccine...

Despite the numerous warnings about the formula they used, they went forward and made a standard formula vaccine. Then their paperwork and administration of the testing was so convoluted it didn't get past the FDA. Meanwhile the mRNA vaccines have had astounding success with great numbers even though the protection wanes.
So....of course Page Six is going to run contrary articles...but it's on Page Six... meaning that you know it's a dubious story.
 
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Billy_Bob

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You statement that the vaccinated are responsible for the continued epidemic is so ridiculous, it does not deserve a reply.
His statement is factually correct.

Because the human immune system operates on the "mass" to trigger a response, the spike proteins are not large enough to trigger one early on. The viral load becomes massive and those persons become infective to others. Once there is enough mass of the spike proteins and a response is generated, it kills the infection. The human body never learns the virus so the next time it encounters it, once again, we have massive spread. Once these "fooled into making" antibodies are gone so are your protections.
 
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Bob Blaylock

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The current data is unfiltered. Making conclusions based on the raw data is not good science.

Right.

You need to filter the data, first, to emphasize that which supports the preconceived conclusion that you a re trying to support.

That's a major part of how left wrong wing “science” works.
 

Bob Blaylock

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If it truly were a short window that vaccines saved lives, wouldn’t you expect to see a massive surge of deaths in the UK already?

A disease with a 99.7%+ recovery rate is not going to produce any “massive surge of deaths”, no matter what you do or do not do about it; unless what you do about it, itself ends up causing more deaths that the disease itself. Which, in fact, we have been seeing.
 

colfax_m

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Right.

You need to filter the data, first, to emphasize that which supports the preconceived conclusion that you a re trying to support.

That's a major part of how left wrong wing “science” works.
Adjusting data is always a major part of how science works especially when you’re going off retrospective data.

Otherwise you’d be putting yourself at risk of missing confounders.
 

colfax_m

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A disease with a 99.7%+ recovery rate is not going to produce any “massive surge of deaths”, no matter what you do or do not do about it; unless what you do about it, itself ends up causing more deaths that the disease itself. Which, in fact, we have been seeing.
Deaths in the UK haven’t come anywhere close to the levels they were last winter.
 

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