Open Carry vs Concealed carry.

[RandallFlagg]

I think open carry is stupid and pointless (although I've done it a couple of times myself when the weather gets really hot). That said, I don't think we need to criminalize bad behavior. If carry were more common people would get used to seeing it.

I always laugh when this subject comes up. Have we forgotten so quickly that the American people have ALWAYS "open-carried" when this country was young? Have these clowns never watched a John Wayne movie? or a Gene Autry movie? or EVER watched a show on the history of America? Wyatt Earp?? Deadwood?

Yeah, I know the liberal argument…."A civilized society shouldn't have the need to carry a gun"

Uh-Huh….walk down any inner city street after midnight. Tell me there isn't still a Dodge City….

When the hell did we become "civilized"!?!?!

 

[Delta4Embassy]

Reason we as a society used to all open-carry sidearms is still extant is the crazy part. We think because most don't anymore that we became "civilized." And while most of us have, the reasons to have a sidearm is just as it's always been - not everyone is civilized.

 

[Spoonman]

Here is a great example of how stupid and dangerous liberal gun laws are. in NJ, you pretty much can't get a concealed carry. you can get a permit where you can carry your gun with you, not on your person, but in your car if you are going to the range. but the gun has to be unloaded and the gun and the bullets in separate compartments. i.e the gun in the trunk, the bullets in the glove box. so now you get car jacked. your protection is useless. thanks libs. your car is stolen. thanks libs. if you are lucky and the God libs tells us doesn't exist protects you, you get out alive and unharmed. thanks libs. and oh yea, that's to brain dead gun grabbing lib laws, yet another weapon is now in the hands of a criminal. along with your car. thanks libs

 

[hazlnut]

Washington State is a prime example of why stupid laws exist about open carry. When I lived there there was no law against open carry. However there was a law that stated you could not intimidate others with a weapon.

Guess who got to decide when open carry was intimidation? That's right the local DA.

Open Carry Activists are gay little fools. I love it when cops bust them, break their little cameras and take away their little toys.

Then lock them up.

 

[RandallFlagg]

Here is a great example of how stupid and dangerous liberal gun laws are. in NJ, you pretty much can't get a concealed carry. you can get a permit where you can carry your gun with you, not on your person, but in your car if you are going to the range. but the gun has to be unloaded and the gun and the bullets in separate compartments. i.e the gun in the trunk, the bullets in the glove box. so now you get car jacked. your protection is useless. thanks libs. your car is stolen. thanks libs. if you are lucky and the God libs tells us doesn't exist protects you, you get out alive and unharmed. thanks libs. and oh yea, that's to brain dead gun grabbing lib laws, yet another weapon is now in the hands of a criminal. along with your car. thanks libs

Well, to further show the stupidity of the liberals - I have a great friend (served with him in Moscow) who lives with his Wife in a suburb of Denver. Colorado passed a law outlawing high capacity magazines. MAGPUL (anyone who owns firearms knows MAGPUL) packed up and left Colorado. The state loses 20 Million dollars a year in tax revenue.

My friend owns a AR-15 and a .308. He and his Wife go Kansas and buy any magazines that he wants and bring them home. The guy at Bass Pro says that (literally) HUNDREDS of Colorado license plates can be seen at their store throughout the year and they have to order magazines every week now.

Smart move Colorado - but at least folks can get high there….

 

[RandallFlagg]

Washington State is a prime example of why stupid laws exist about open carry. When I lived there there was no law against open carry. However there was a law that stated you could not intimidate others with a weapon.

Guess who got to decide when open carry was intimidation? That's right the local DA.

Open Carry Activists are gay little fools. I love it when cops bust them, break their little cameras and take away their little toys.

Then lock them up.

What are you? 13!?!?! Go back to your Mom's basement and leave the adults alone little boy.

 

[Spoonman]

Here is a great example of how stupid and dangerous liberal gun laws are. in NJ, you pretty much can't get a concealed carry. you can get a permit where you can carry your gun with you, not on your person, but in your car if you are going to the range. but the gun has to be unloaded and the gun and the bullets in separate compartments. i.e the gun in the trunk, the bullets in the glove box. so now you get car jacked. your protection is useless. thanks libs. your car is stolen. thanks libs. if you are lucky and the God libs tells us doesn't exist protects you, you get out alive and unharmed. thanks libs. and oh yea, that's to brain dead gun grabbing lib laws, yet another weapon is now in the hands of a criminal. along with your car. thanks libs

Well, to further show the stupidity of the liberals - I have a great friend (served with him in Moscow) who lives with his Wife in a suburb of Denver. Colorado passed a law outlawing high capacity magazines. MAGPUL (anyone who owns firearms knows MAGPUL) packed up and left Colorado. The state loses 20 Million dollars a year in tax revenue.

My friend owns a AR-15 and a .308. He and his Wife go Kansas and buy any magazines that he wants and bring them home. The guy at Bass Pro says that (literally) HUNDREDS of Colorado license plates can be seen at their store throughout the year and they have to order magazines every week now.

Smart move Colorado - but at least folks can get high there….

everyone in NY either drives across the border into PA or VT and gets what ever they want. NY's loss. Go to a PA gun show and the lot is more than half full of NY plates. the ammo guys are coming with truckloads to sell. and the NY buyers are walking out with thousands of rounds. cuomos law banning internet sales has been a boon to bordering states. its also funny because when I take a ride up to the local cabellas more often then not I can find some enterprising individual with a trunk full or van full of ammo he has driven across the border and is selling in the parking lot. take away the legal avenue and the illegal one will quickly take its place

 

[RandallFlagg]

Here is a great example of how stupid and dangerous liberal gun laws are. in NJ, you pretty much can't get a concealed carry. you can get a permit where you can carry your gun with you, not on your person, but in your car if you are going to the range. but the gun has to be unloaded and the gun and the bullets in separate compartments. i.e the gun in the trunk, the bullets in the glove box. so now you get car jacked. your protection is useless. thanks libs. your car is stolen. thanks libs. if you are lucky and the God libs tells us doesn't exist protects you, you get out alive and unharmed. thanks libs. and oh yea, that's to brain dead gun grabbing lib laws, yet another weapon is now in the hands of a criminal. along with your car. thanks libs

Well, to further show the stupidity of the liberals - I have a great friend (served with him in Moscow) who lives with his Wife in a suburb of Denver. Colorado passed a law outlawing high capacity magazines. MAGPUL (anyone who owns firearms knows MAGPUL) packed up and left Colorado. The state loses 20 Million dollars a year in tax revenue.

My friend owns a AR-15 and a .308. He and his Wife go Kansas and buy any magazines that he wants and bring them home. The guy at Bass Pro says that (literally) HUNDREDS of Colorado license plates can be seen at their store throughout the year and they have to order magazines every week now.

Smart move Colorado - but at least folks can get high there….

everyone in NY either drives across the border into PA or VT and gets what ever they want. NY's loss. Go to a PA gun show and the lot is more than half full of NY plates. the ammo guys are coming with truckloads to sell. and the NY buyers are walking out with thousands of rounds. cuomos law banning internet sales has been a boon to bordering states. its also funny because when I take a ride up to the local cabellas more often then not I can find some enterprising individual with a trunk full or van full of ammo he has driven across the border and is selling in the parking lot. take away the legal avenue and the illegal one will quickly take its place

Yeah, I have to admit that I just don't get it. It's almost like these liberal states have the thought process of "well, we banned them, so now we have nothing to worry about". I just don't get their thought process…or rather the lack of it.

Today, I was talking to my buddy in Denver and he tells me that the news reported there, the other night, that heroin has made a HUGE comeback now in Colorado….wow. Who would have figured that that would have happened……………..legalize mary jane and "they will come"…….directly from Columbia. Unbelievable.

 

[Spoonman]

Well, to further show the stupidity of the liberals - I have a great friend (served with him in Moscow) who lives with his Wife in a suburb of Denver. Colorado passed a law outlawing high capacity magazines. MAGPUL (anyone who owns firearms knows MAGPUL) packed up and left Colorado. The state loses 20 Million dollars a year in tax revenue.

My friend owns a AR-15 and a .308. He and his Wife go Kansas and buy any magazines that he wants and bring them home. The guy at Bass Pro says that (literally) HUNDREDS of Colorado license plates can be seen at their store throughout the year and they have to order magazines every week now.

Smart move Colorado - but at least folks can get high there….

everyone in NY either drives across the border into PA or VT and gets what ever they want. NY's loss. Go to a PA gun show and the lot is more than half full of NY plates. the ammo guys are coming with truckloads to sell. and the NY buyers are walking out with thousands of rounds. cuomos law banning internet sales has been a boon to bordering states. its also funny because when I take a ride up to the local cabellas more often then not I can find some enterprising individual with a trunk full or van full of ammo he has driven across the border and is selling in the parking lot. take away the legal avenue and the illegal one will quickly take its place

Yeah, I have to admit that I just don't get it. It's almost like these liberal states have the thought process of "well, we banned them, so now we have nothing to worry about". I just don't get their thought process…or rather the lack of it.

Today, I was talking to my buddy in Denver and he tells me that the news reported there, the other night, that heroin has made a HUGE comeback now in Colorado….wow. Who would have figured that that would have happened……………..legalize mary jane and "they will come"…….directly from Columbia. Unbelievable.

the enemy within. and that enemy is liberals.

 

[Mr. H.]

I'm expecting my Illinois permit by May. I didn't submit prints so it'll be an extra 30 day wait.

 

[RandallFlagg]

everyone in NY either drives across the border into PA or VT and gets what ever they want. NY's loss. Go to a PA gun show and the lot is more than half full of NY plates. the ammo guys are coming with truckloads to sell. and the NY buyers are walking out with thousands of rounds. cuomos law banning internet sales has been a boon to bordering states. its also funny because when I take a ride up to the local cabellas more often then not I can find some enterprising individual with a trunk full or van full of ammo he has driven across the border and is selling in the parking lot. take away the legal avenue and the illegal one will quickly take its place

Yeah, I have to admit that I just don't get it. It's almost like these liberal states have the thought process of "well, we banned them, so now we have nothing to worry about". I just don't get their thought process…or rather the lack of it.

Today, I was talking to my buddy in Denver and he tells me that the news reported there, the other night, that heroin has made a HUGE comeback now in Colorado….wow. Who would have figured that that would have happened……………..legalize mary jane and "they will come"…….directly from Columbia. Unbelievable.

the enemy within. and that enemy is liberals.

Indeed. And this enemy has been trying to destroy this country since the 60s. The hell of it? They are succeeding, albeit slowly but surely. Republicans are no better. They are at odds with those who, in their party, don't walk the line; that want to return to small government and common sense values. These "conservatives" are as bad as their Fidel loving counterparts on the other side of the aisle.

 

[OriginalShroom]

One correction regarding your first line,

"The 2nd Amendment states clearly that we Americans have the Right to keep and bear arms."

Actually it doesn't. A literal reading of the 2nd Amendment makes it clear a "well-regulated militia" has such a right. As it happens, it's the Supreme Court who has decided that it also means individual citizens have the right, militia or not. Give credit where credit's due.

As to the topic of open-carry. If it's legal where you are, and you're ok answering law enforcements' questions everytime one shows up go right ahead. Still subject to any other local laws which apply to CCW like gun-free zones so you'd either have to not shop at such places or come up with some means of functioning in your area if such zones exist and you need to make use of them.

Are good sites to help with understanding your local laws like
OpenCarry.org | ?A Right Unexercised is a Right Lost?

I see you fail reading comprehesion classes. Or are simply unable to read and comprehend basic English, being influenced by the Left Wing Gun Grabbers.

Either way.. The Second Amendment reads,

"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."

Clearly it is the "People" who have the right to keep and bear arms, not the militia. The Militia is necessary to the security of a Free State. The Second Amendment is an expression of two concepts.

Just as you fail to understand the 2nd Amendment, you fail to understand the purpose of this thread. It is not to discuss the laws of open carry, but how the police should handle calls by "scared" citizens because someone is open carrying where it is already legal.

 

[percysunshine]

This is silly. We have people vociferously agreeing with each other.

 

[OriginalShroom]

Is that a bad thing? Sadly I just watched another video where a cop decided that he needed to lecture two guys legally open carrying on how they were hurting the 2nd Amendment by being so egregious in asserting their right to legally open carry.

Molon Labe

 

[bayoubill]

The 2nd Amendment states clearly that we Americans have the Right to keep and bear arms.

I want to discuss the "Bear" part.

I don't open carry. Not because I oppose it, but because I would rather my weapon be a surprise to someone who is wanting to do harm. I don't want to put a target on my back.

But then the open carry would, could, and should let those who would do harm to me know upfront that they are going to a fight on their hands and prevent most of it.

It's a "Six of one, half dozen of the other" situation.

I've been watching videos on youtube of the open carry people who are stopped by the police. While there are the few who simply treat it as it should be treated. A person who is no more a threat than a person who is concealed carrying.

But then there have been the others who say that the open carry "scares and alarms" the citizens and is a basis for charging them with disturbing the peace.

I support those who are open carrying in States where it is legal. I believe it should be legal everywhere.

If a citizen calls in saying they are afraid because someone is open carrying, they need to be asked or told that unless that person is waving the gun around, pointing it at people, threatening to shoot someone, there is no law being broken.

How would/should the police respond to a caller saying they are afraid because there is a group of Black men or Hispanic men walking down the street at night? They aren't doing anything illegal, just exerting their right to walk down a street.


Should a person's right be restricted simply because someone is "afraid"?

I'm all for law-abiding folks being able to have whatever guns they want, 'n bein' able to carry a concealed firearm wherever they go...

but, imho, the folks who insist on openly carrying a gun in public (albeit lawfully) are simply being dumb-shit assholes trying to make a point... and not doing a very good job of it...

 

[OriginalShroom]

I'm all for law-abiding folks being able to have whatever guns they want, 'n bein' able to carry a concealed firearm wherever they go...

but, imho, the folks who insist on openly carrying a gun in public (albeit lawfully) are simply being dumb-shit assholes trying to make a point... and not doing a very good job of it...

Up until last week I agreed with you.

Then it dawned on me that this is a tactic that has been used by the left to push their agenda for years.

"We're here, we're queer" The Gay day parades. Just two examples. Eventually it got to the point that even prime-time television is now showing two men kissing, and not just a peck either. By constantly shoving their lifestyle in our faces, it took the shock value out of it.

Remember the mess when Ellen DeGeneres came out as gay? Now a major College football palyer, should be a top 50 to 100 draft pick, comes out as gay and there is no chance that he won't get picked up. That wouldn't have happened a decade ago.

No one is going to protect our rights as gun owners for us. The Left Wing media isn't going to make the 2nd Amendment a cause they are going to fight for. They aren't going to be show casing gun owners on Television as the man or woman next door. They aren't going to show the average person doing an Open Carry as they do their grocery shopping.

So if we want to have gun ownership recognized as being what it is.. A right that is being used by thousands of "normal" Americans of all races, men and women. Lawyers, Car mechanics, Teachers, Doctors, Nurses, Hotel workers, Sandwich shop workers, the gal who makes your coffee, the newspaper man, College student, etc.

It's not just "rednecks" or the pyscho who carry a gun any more.

But we have to get the Police to recognize the fact that just because I am carrying a gun that doesn't give them reason to throw me face down in the dirt to verify that I am one of the "good gun owners".

We have to use court rulings, such as Terry V Ohio , US V Deberry , Delaware v. Prouse , Brown V Texas .

Here is an example of what I mean.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F9a_cBxnE5Q]KNOW YOUR RIGHTS!! If you know them! - YouTube[/ame]

We have rights. Just as two gay men can kiss in the middle of Times Square at high noon while wearing leather straps and tutus without worry of being stopped by the police, I should be able to walk down the street with a holstered weapon or a rifle slung across my back without the police accosting me.

 

[bayoubill]

I'm all for law-abiding folks being able to have whatever guns they want, 'n bein' able to carry a concealed firearm wherever they go...

but, imho, the folks who insist on openly carrying a gun in public (albeit lawfully) are simply being dumb-shit assholes trying to make a point... and not doing a very good job of it...

Up until last week I agreed with you.

Then it dawned on me that this is a tactic that has been used by the left to push their agenda for years.

"We're here, we're queer" The Gay day parades. Just two examples. Eventually it got to the point that even prime-time television is now showing two men kissing, and not just a peck either. By constantly shoving their lifestyle in our faces, it took the shock value out of it.

Remember the mess when Ellen DeGeneres came out as gay? Now a major College football palyer, should be a top 50 to 100 draft pick, comes out as gay and there is no chance that he won't get picked up. That wouldn't have happened a decade ago.

No one is going to protect our rights as gun owners for us. The Left Wing media isn't going to make the 2nd Amendment a cause they are going to fight for. They aren't going to be show casing gun owners on Television as the man or woman next door. They aren't going to show the average person doing an Open Carry as they do their grocery shopping.

So if we want to have gun ownership recognized as being what it is.. A right that is being used by thousands of "normal" Americans of all races, men and women. Lawyers, Car mechanics, Teachers, Doctors, Nurses, Hotel workers, Sandwich shop workers, the gal who makes your coffee, the newspaper man, College student, etc.

It's not just "rednecks" or the pyscho who carry a gun any more.

But we have to get the Police to recognize the fact that just because I am carrying a gun that doesn't give them reason to throw me face down in the dirt to verify that I am one of the "good gun owners".

We have to use court rulings, such as Terry V Ohio , US V Deberry , Delaware v. Prouse , Brown V Texas .

Here is an example of what I mean.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F9a_cBxnE5Q]KNOW YOUR RIGHTS!! If you know them! - YouTube[/ame]

We have rights. Just as two gay men can kiss in the middle of Times Square at high noon while wearing leather straps and tutus without worry of being stopped by the police, I should be able to walk down the street with a holstered weapon or a rifle slung across my back without the police accosting me.

regarding public perception, in-your-face open-carry in public goes way farther than two guys kissing in public...

it's more on the same level as two guys butt-fucking in public...

 

[OriginalShroom]

regarding public perception, in-your-face open-carry in public goes way farther than two guys kissing in public...

it's more on the same level as two guys butt-fucking in public...

I have to disagree with you..

To get to that "butt-fucking" level, the guns would have to be out of the holsters.

 

[RKMBrown]

The 2nd Amendment states clearly that we Americans have the Right to keep and bear arms.

I want to discuss the "Bear" part.

I don't open carry. Not because I oppose it, but because I would rather my weapon be a surprise to someone who is wanting to do harm. I don't want to put a target on my back.

But then the open carry would, could, and should let those who would do harm to me know upfront that they are going to a fight on their hands and prevent most of it.

It's a "Six of one, half dozen of the other" situation.

I've been watching videos on youtube of the open carry people who are stopped by the police. While there are the few who simply treat it as it should be treated. A person who is no more a threat than a person who is concealed carrying.

But then there have been the others who say that the open carry "scares and alarms" the citizens and is a basis for charging them with disturbing the peace.

I support those who are open carrying in States where it is legal. I believe it should be legal everywhere.

If a citizen calls in saying they are afraid because someone is open carrying, they need to be asked or told that unless that person is waving the gun around, pointing it at people, threatening to shoot someone, there is no law being broken.

How would/should the police respond to a caller saying they are afraid because there is a group of Black men or Hispanic men walking down the street at night? They aren't doing anything illegal, just exerting their right to walk down a street.


Should a person's right be restricted simply because someone is "afraid"?

Depends.. how about someone walking around with a dynamite jacket in the middle of grand central station?

What about someone open carrying within spitting range of the president?

What about someone that's drunk and carrying? What if he's merely drunk with rage, such as road rage?

I think at some point, a line has to be drawn between reasonable/acceptable risk and ones liberty to defend oneself.

That said.. fear is the mind killer and we should avoid letting our fears run our lives, or take away our liberty.

 

[Ringel05]

I'm all for law-abiding folks being able to have whatever guns they want, 'n bein' able to carry a concealed firearm wherever they go...

but, imho, the folks who insist on openly carrying a gun in public (albeit lawfully) are simply being dumb-shit assholes trying to make a point... and not doing a very good job of it...

Up until last week I agreed with you.

Then it dawned on me that this is a tactic that has been used by the left to push their agenda for years.

"We're here, we're queer" The Gay day parades. Just two examples. Eventually it got to the point that even prime-time television is now showing two men kissing, and not just a peck either. By constantly shoving their lifestyle in our faces, it took the shock value out of it.

Remember the mess when Ellen DeGeneres came out as gay? Now a major College football palyer, should be a top 50 to 100 draft pick, comes out as gay and there is no chance that he won't get picked up. That wouldn't have happened a decade ago.

No one is going to protect our rights as gun owners for us. The Left Wing media isn't going to make the 2nd Amendment a cause they are going to fight for. They aren't going to be show casing gun owners on Television as the man or woman next door. They aren't going to show the average person doing an Open Carry as they do their grocery shopping.

So if we want to have gun ownership recognized as being what it is.. A right that is being used by thousands of "normal" Americans of all races, men and women. Lawyers, Car mechanics, Teachers, Doctors, Nurses, Hotel workers, Sandwich shop workers, the gal who makes your coffee, the newspaper man, College student, etc.

It's not just "rednecks" or the pyscho who carry a gun any more.

But we have to get the Police to recognize the fact that just because I am carrying a gun that doesn't give them reason to throw me face down in the dirt to verify that I am one of the "good gun owners".

We have to use court rulings, such as Terry V Ohio , US V Deberry , Delaware v. Prouse , Brown V Texas .

Here is an example of what I mean.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F9a_cBxnE5Q]KNOW YOUR RIGHTS!! If you know them! - YouTube[/ame]

We have rights. Just as two gay men can kiss in the middle of Times Square at high noon while wearing leather straps and tutus without worry of being stopped by the police, I should be able to walk down the street with a holstered weapon or a rifle slung across my back without the police accosting me.

regarding public perception, in-your-face open-carry in public goes way farther than two guys kissing in public...

it's more on the same level as two guys butt-fucking in public...

Most people are clueless, simply non-observant of those around them. Unless it is a hand cannon strapped to someone's waist they think they see a PDA or a large cell phone with the half a glance they normally give. Only a very, very few will do a doubletake, some will stop a few seconds later and wonder what they did see.