CDZ OK, I'll Try Again, How Can We Save Obamacare and Make it Actually Work for ALL of Us?

[Oddball]

The ACA is flabby crap, and we have to stop putting band aids on everything.

Expand the current and popular Medicare / Medicare Advantage / Medicare Supplement system to all, with some tweaks. An excellent blend of a public foundation and free market choice, competition & innovation, and individual/portable so that we take a massive cost monkey off the backs of American employers.

Sadly, this solution is too obvious and would require collaboration from both whacked-out sides, something of which we are no longer capable.
.

That's it....The State has totally fucked up the works, so the answer it to turn nearly all of it over to them.

How did we all miss such an obvious solution?

 

[JimBowie1958]

There exists public vs private insurance. Both pay for goods and services provided by private entities. No one has seriously proposed a VA For All plan. Soldiers and veterans have earned that. No one else. Medicare For All compromises more than enough already. Get a job. Pay your taxes. Help everyone stay healthy so they can maximally do the same.

The same goes for retirees and Medicare.

Dont touch my Medicare, losers.

 

[Mac1958]

The ACA is flabby crap, and we have to stop putting band aids on everything.

Expand the current and popular Medicare / Medicare Advantage / Medicare Supplement system to all, with some tweaks. An excellent blend of a public foundation and free market choice, competition & innovation, and individual/portable so that we take a massive cost monkey off the backs of American employers.

Sadly, this solution is too obvious and would require collaboration from both whacked-out sides, something of which we are no longer capable.
.

That's it....The State has totally fucked up the works, so the answer it to turn nearly all of it over to them.

How did we all miss such an obvious solution?

Another one who doesn't know how it works.
.

 

[dblack]

The ACA is flabby crap, and we have to stop putting band aids on everything.

Expand the current and popular Medicare / Medicare Advantage / Medicare Supplement system to all, with some tweaks. An excellent blend of a public foundation and free market choice, competition & innovation, and individual/portable so that we take a massive cost monkey off the backs of American employers.

Sadly, this solution is too obvious and would require collaboration from both whacked-out sides, something of which we are no longer capable.
.

That's it....The State has totally fucked up the works, so the answer it to turn nearly all of it over to them.

How did we all miss such an obvious solution!

'cause the Koch brothers tricked us.

 

[JimBowie1958]

a strong free market component

..equals deliberately injecting tons of ppw and waste for continued billionaire profits at everyone's expense. Medicare A remains pristine. B is perhaps still tolerable. C, wtf is C? D has always been complete garbage, designed to rob the elderly while destroying Medicare. There is no fucking "free market." Right wingers are actually the ones always looking for free shit, especially from government. There exists public vs private insurance. Both pay for goods and services provided by private entities. No one has seriously proposed a VA For All plan. Soldiers and veterans have earned that. No one else. Medicare For All compromises more than enough already. Get a job. Pay your taxes. Help everyone stay healthy so they can maximally do the same.

Right now, we have seven (7) different health care delivery/payment systems in this country, none of which communicates directly with the other:

1. Individual/ACA
2. Group, at a high cost to our employers
3. VA
4. Medicare
5. Medicaid
   
6. Worker's Compensation
7. Indigent

-7-

Does that sound like the foundation of a smart, efficient health care system to you?
.

So why not use MedicAID?

You have not explained that yet.

 

[Mac1958]

So why not use MedicAID?

Because I want a strong free market component. Plus, contract reimbursement rates to providers are so low that a majority avoid Medicaid entirely.
.

 

[Oddball]

The ACA is flabby crap, and we have to stop putting band aids on everything.

Expand the current and popular Medicare / Medicare Advantage / Medicare Supplement system to all, with some tweaks. An excellent blend of a public foundation and free market choice, competition & innovation, and individual/portable so that we take a massive cost monkey off the backs of American employers.

Sadly, this solution is too obvious and would require collaboration from both whacked-out sides, something of which we are no longer capable.
.

That's it....The State has totally fucked up the works, so the answer it to turn nearly all of it over to them.

How did we all miss such an obvious solution?

Another one who doesn't know how it works.
.

I know how it works...With each passing day, this quotation becomes more prescient and apropos....

 

[Mac1958]

The ACA is flabby crap, and we have to stop putting band aids on everything.

Expand the current and popular Medicare / Medicare Advantage / Medicare Supplement system to all, with some tweaks. An excellent blend of a public foundation and free market choice, competition & innovation, and individual/portable so that we take a massive cost monkey off the backs of American employers.

Sadly, this solution is too obvious and would require collaboration from both whacked-out sides, something of which we are no longer capable.
.

That's it....The State has totally fucked up the works, so the answer it to turn nearly all of it over to them.

How did we all miss such an obvious solution?

Another one who doesn't know how it works.
.

I know how it works...With each passing day, this quotation becomes more prescient and apropos....

View attachment 289115

I can't make you educate yourself on this. If you want to spray out talking points, platitudes and memes, that's up to you.
.

 

[Oddball]

There exists public vs private insurance. Both pay for goods and services provided by private entities. No one has seriously proposed a VA For All plan. Soldiers and veterans have earned that. No one else. Medicare For All compromises more than enough already. Get a job. Pay your taxes. Help everyone stay healthy so they can maximally do the same.

The same goes for retirees and Medicare.

Dont touch my Medicare, losers.

Medicare is fucking doomed....I made peace with that fact back in the 1990s, and started making my preparations then.

 

[Grumblenuts]

Just a little note regarding the OP's source for this topic:

Job Creators Network ("JCN") is association of corporate leaders best known for its E2E employee communications program, which encourages CEOs to pressure their employees to vote for and otherwise support the corporate political agenda. In 2015, it launched the web-based advocacy campaign, "Defend Main Street," which attacks the National Labor Relations Board’s decision to consider McDonald's a "joint employer" of franchise employees, possibly making the corporate giant liable for labor law violations.

JCN describes itself as a "nonpartisan organization founded by entrepreneurs like Home Depot co-founder Bernie Marcus who believe that government policies are breaking the backs of business owners and killing job creation."[1] Based in Texas and Georgia, JCN is comprised of two non-profit organizations: a 501(c)(3) foundation -- Job Creators Network Foundation -- and a 501(c)(4) advocacy group -- Job Creators Network Inc.[2][3]

JCN has ties to notorious PR flak Richard Berman, president of Berman & Co. Berman specializes in front groups and misleading PR campaigns.

JCN describes its own mission as "involv[ing] employees in the fight to defend free enterprise," "inform[ing] employees how government policies impact America’s jobs," and "inspir[ing] employees to become more informed citizens."[1] JCN believes that "employees, particularly non-union employees, are an untapped reservoir of support for free enterprise"[4] -- i.e. policies like increasing the definition of full-time work from 30 hours per week to 40 hours per week for healthcare coverage,[5] cutting the corporate tax rate to 25 percent,[6] making reductions in entitlement programs,[6] destroying or suppressing the minimum wage,[7] and so-called "right to work" that harms employee unions.[8]

In other words, the billionaires recommend we do this.

 

[dblack]

So why not use MedicAID?

Because I want a strong free market component.

What you propose is not a free market. It's the opposite - a feeding-trough for well connect corporate interests.

 

[Oddball]

The ACA is flabby crap, and we have to stop putting band aids on everything.

Expand the current and popular Medicare / Medicare Advantage / Medicare Supplement system to all, with some tweaks. An excellent blend of a public foundation and free market choice, competition & innovation, and individual/portable so that we take a massive cost monkey off the backs of American employers.

Sadly, this solution is too obvious and would require collaboration from both whacked-out sides, something of which we are no longer capable.
.

That's it....The State has totally fucked up the works, so the answer it to turn nearly all of it over to them.

How did we all miss such an obvious solution?

Another one who doesn't know how it works.
.

I know how it works...With each passing day, this quotation becomes more prescient and apropos....

View attachment 289115

I can't make you educate yourself on this. If you want to spray out talking points, platitudes and memes, that's up to you.
.

Oh bite me....Your "solution" is no different in substance from the rock heads who claim that Marxism hasn't yet worked, because we haven't put the right people in charge of it.

The system is fucked up because of meddling from The State, not despite it or because the right level of central control hasn't yet been achieved.

 

[JimBowie1958]

So why not use MedicAID?

Because I want a strong free market component. Plus, contract reimbursement rates to providers are so low that a majority avoid Medicaid entirely.
.

So why not save MedicAID by converting it to a government run insurance program?

And why do you think that the MedicAID low reimbursement rates wont become the norm for a universalized Medicare system?

That is all you will do, turn Medicare which does work into a MedicAID 2 that does not work.

 

[Mac1958]

The ACA is flabby crap, and we have to stop putting band aids on everything.

Expand the current and popular Medicare / Medicare Advantage / Medicare Supplement system to all, with some tweaks. An excellent blend of a public foundation and free market choice, competition & innovation, and individual/portable so that we take a massive cost monkey off the backs of American employers.

Sadly, this solution is too obvious and would require collaboration from both whacked-out sides, something of which we are no longer capable.
.

That's it....The State has totally fucked up the works, so the answer it to turn nearly all of it over to them.

How did we all miss such an obvious solution?

Another one who doesn't know how it works.
.

I know how it works...With each passing day, this quotation becomes more prescient and apropos....

View attachment 289115

I can't make you educate yourself on this. If you want to spray out talking points, platitudes and memes, that's up to you.
.

Oh bite me....Your "solution" is no different in substance from the rock heads who claim that Marxism hasn't yet worked, because we haven't put the right people in charge of it.

The system is fucked up because of meddling from The State, not despite it or because the right level of central control hasn't yet been achieved.

Well, it's quite different, but you're just not informed enough to understand that.

Whatever you do, don't educate yourself on this. It's better to just spray the talking points.
.

 

[Votto]

OK, Trump could take the wind out of a lot of Democrat sails if whe would do two things:
1) Adopt this Personalized Health Care proposal; Personalized Healthcare - Healthcare for You

Putting patients in charge by removing barriers that separate them from their doctors.

• We must remove unnecessary red tape that separates doctors and patients. Under Obamacare’s electronic health record (EHR) regulation, doctors are required to spend about half of their time on paperwork and data entry instead of patient care. Regulations like that have put a literal and figurative screen between doctors and patients.
• Red tape and regulations are driving physicians out of private practice; we need more independent doctors, not fewer. 53 percent of doctors are now payroll physicians employed by hospitals. Those doctors are beholden to the hospital and not their patients.
• The doctor-patient relationship is intimate and personal; no one knows better what kind of treatment a patient needs than that patient’s doctor.

Reform: Eliminate unnecessary government red tape that create hours of unnecessary paperwork and strangle the patient-doctor relationship.

Personal Health Management Accounts to give patients more control over their healthcare dollars.

• Personal Health Management accounts allow patients to purchase insurance plans that are customized to their needs and portable—similar to life and auto insurance—so individuals can take it with them from job to job. This eliminates the fear of losing health insurance when you change jobs or move.
• Employers can opt to contribute directly to these accounts, getting them out of the insurance business which puts healthcare decisions in the hands of their employees, not employers and their third-party administrators.
• This allows employees to use pre-tax dollars to pay for healthcare and gives them the same tax benefits enjoyed by employers.
• Allows patients to only pay for what they need, not a one size fits all government plan like Medicare For All.

Reform: Change current rules around Health Savings Accounts by a) increasing the maximum HSA contribution, b) allowing people to pay for insurance premiums from an HSA account so individuals have the same tax advantage currently enjoyed by corporate employees, c) repeal the requirement that exclusively links HSAs to certain high deductible plans and d) allow people to contribute to an HSA and use it to fund a Medical Cost Sharing plan or a Direct Medical Care arrangement.

Expanding Direct Medical Care to increase choices and lower costs.

• Putting patients back in charge of their healthcare spending through expanded pre-tax accounts will vastly increase direct medical care, which cuts out middlemen to lower costs and gives patients more choice.
• For family care needs, direct medical care is known as direct primary care, which offers families all their primary medical care needs for one low monthly membership fee – no insurance or middlemen necessary. Patients can get access to their regular doctors at any time through call, text, or telemedicine.
• For other procedures – at surgery centers, for instance – direct medical care means transparent cash prices, which will allow patients to price shop, lowering prices.
• Cash prices are often cheaper than what insurers can offer. According to Vanderbilt economist Larry Van Horn, cash healthcare prices are 40 percent lower than insurers’ negotiated rates.
• Whether it’s a monthly membership fee for Direct Primary Care, posted pricing at a surgical center, or fee for service from a specialist, patients will be able to get healthcare at a lower price and have more choice.

Reform: Eliminate rules that restrict the use of direct medical care and encourage patients to take advantage of alternative avenues to receiving health services.

Lowering insurance premiums through increased choice and price transparency.

• In every industry where we have more choice and price transparency, we see lower prices and more innovation; healthcare is not an exception to this economic fact.
• End inefficient federal rules and requirements on private insurance plans and allow states to expand and regulate their private insurance markets to offer more choice and better options.
• Let patients purchase plans that are customized to their needs like they do with auto and life insurance
• Rather than another centralized federal experiment, we should remove federal regulations on this private market and let the state insurance departments and lawmakers tackle problems or concerns. What works best in New York may not work for Kansas. You should not be required to pay for features that you don’t want.
• End federal restrictions on modern healthcare advances like telemedicine, which allows patients to access their physicians via text, email and SKYPE, decreasing time spent waiting in doctors’ offices to be seen for minor issues.

Reform: End rules that regulate what should be included in a healthcare plan, how you can access it and when you can keep it.

Lowering drug prices.

• Return savings back to the patients instead of medicine middlemen; right now $250 billion per year goes to middlemen.
• Nearly all the recent increases in drug list prices can be chalked up to rising rebates.

Reform: Repeal the legislation that exempts these middlemen from penalty for violating the federal anti-kickback law.

Protecting against pre-existing conditions.

• Patients will be covered even if they have a pre-existing condition.
• Allow employees to use Personal Health Management Accounts to buy their own health insurance which prevents any lapse in coverage when changing jobs. This change helps address some of the problems of pre-existing conditions.

Reform: Give states the autonomy to guarantee a health insurance policy that cannot raise people’s rates or drop them from coverage due to health conditions. Many states have these laws in place, but they are moot under the ACA. Others can amend their laws to include it, or they can set up risk pools.​

And ...
2) Reform MedicAID into a government run health insurance system that is pro-rated for income level and the premium based on national averages - 20%.

I think if you do that, most moderates thinking about a Democrat will jump over to Trump because we get national health care coverage for everyone, and keep our private insurance too.

I don't see how something that was never meant to work.................work.

After all, the same voices that passed Obamacare are now saying we need socialist medicine and the ink on the legislation is not even dry.

Just admit that you and the rest of the country were duped. It was meant to fail so they could "fix" it with their fabulous new socialized medicine.

 

[Grumblenuts]

Remember.. it was Romneycare before it was Obamacare..

 

[Mac1958]

So why not use MedicAID?

Because I want a strong free market component. Plus, contract reimbursement rates to providers are so low that a majority avoid Medicaid entirely.
.

So why not save MedicAID by converting it to a government run insurance program?

And why do you think that the MedicAID low reimbursement rates wont become the norm for a universalized Medicare system?

That is all you will do, turn Medicare which does work into a MedicAID 2 that does not work.

All I'm doing is expanding a system that already works.

Not only would it end this stupid seven-headed beast of a system that we have, it would also take a massive cost monkey off the backs of American employers.

Reimbursement rates would almost certainly have to increase, there's no doubt about that. But health care costs are not linear. They explode after age 60, and most of that is already covered by Medicare. All we're doing, then, is providing mostly foundational and catastrophic coverage.

What I'm talking about is much simpler than you think. There is no reason to include Medicaid in the conversation.
.

 

[dblack]

Remember.. it was Romneycare before it was Obamacare..

Yep. The main reason I could never support Romney.

 

[JimBowie1958]

What I'm talking about is much simpler than you think. There is no reason to include Medicaid in the conversation.
.

Yes there is. Medicare is specifically tailored to retirees while MedicAID is targeting poor people who need free healthcare.

If you turn Medicare into universal coverage, it will develop the exact same problems that MedicAID currently has.

Just ignoring this and repeating 'there is no connection' does not prove there is no connection whatsoever.

 

[Mac1958]

What I'm talking about is much simpler than you think. There is no reason to include Medicaid in the conversation.
.

Yes there is. Medicare is specifically tailored to retirees while MedicAID is targeting poor people who need free healthcare.

If you turn Medicare into universal coverage, it will develop the exact same problems that MedicAID currently has.

Just ignoring this and repeating 'there is not connection' doe snot prove there is no connection whatsoever.

I don't know what you're talking about. There is no free market payment component to share/mitigate cost risk with Medicaid.
.