OK, I'll admit it, our friends on the left are correct; there IS a catch to the Trump tax cuts

[dcbl]

I don't need to ask you to do that, I already see you're wrong. The loss of real estate tax deductions are for personal real estate, not for business real estate. You shouldn't discuss things you don't understand.

no sir, you are the one that does not understand

it's been widely reported and acknowledged, even by news outlets that tend to lean left, that this tax bill increases the overall federal tax burden for many of the wealthiest landowners

the little guy gets a break

the super wealthy with expensive property that live off of passive income wind up paying more

sorry this upsets you...

 

[OKTexas]

You know hispanics only make up about 60% of illegals, right? The rest come from virtually every country in the world. Like I said there are no laws that specifically target hispanics, but feel free to continue your lies and I'll continue to laugh at you.


.

Actually Hispanics are over 75% of illegals. And the only way to stop illegals coming in is a SSID card that can't be faked, and Republicans have blocked forever, Dupe.

You prove over and over that you're just not very smart. Anything created by man can be replicated by other men. And laws against illegals are NOT aimed specifically at hispanics, they are aimed at all illegals. The first lame link you posted was about muslims and the second was a State case having nothing to do with the feds and it was long before Trump.

Now, would you like to get back on topic, it's about tax cuts.


.

I don't care if they're Muslims or Mexicans or what. If they are worthy they can stay. Now pass the dam SS ID card and end it.

As for taxes, it's ridiculous to cut taxes on the rich again. The non rich need tax cuts and help. You dupes are out of your mind.

They are not worthy, they are criminals. And everyone got a tax cut, not just the rich. Keep pushing the propaganda, it's quite entertaining.


.

Your party refuses to stop them from coming and working here... It's an open invitation to come and work and have a great life in America. And we have to stop it and a wall and b******* is not going to do it

The wall is just a small part of the over system, and enforced visa entry/exit system is also required. 40+% of illegals come in legally on visas and never leave. Then making e-verify mandatory together with the rest will take care of most of the problem. Of course the ones who came across the border and are working under the table will still be a problem, that's why we need to go after employers who hire them with serious consequences up to and including jail time. Then remove the remainder as we find them, problem solved and no one is rewarded for breaking the law.


.

 

[bgrouse]

Nice theory, but people still file personal returns with non-entities (Schedule Cs) and even in the case of business, people can and do personally guarantee loans.

For very small businesses, the lender will require that the mortgagor be personally responsible. When I was president of a fairly large corporation, I signed a note and mortgage for some land we were purchasing. In it was an exculpatory clause which means I had no personal responsibility for the loan and the bank could only look to the property in the event of a default on the mortgage.

Do you believe everyone should be barred from using bankruptcy to get out from under a mortgage or loans when the economy turns or it just turns out to be a bad venture?

Not sure what this has to do with our discussion. Like I said, I did not say what Trump did was illegal, just that he is a deadbeat. What does any of this have to do with whether or not I support bankruptcy law?

 

[OKTexas]

That is a bald-faced lie, and you know it, or else you would not be arguing so hard to justify your lie!

Quit pussyfooting and dodging, you cowardly turd! Put up or shut up.

What's a lie?

Trump didn't inherit or otherwise receive any considerable amount of money from his parents? Is that what you're saying? This requires a "yes" or "no" answer.

Trump started his business long before his parents died. His father loaned him some seed money, he took it from there.


.

We know how Trump ran his businesses. Get a loan, roll the dice. If he wins, he keeps the money and boasts about what a great businessman he is. If he loses, he tells the creditor to go **** himself. Rinse and repeat. Of course none of this would have been probable without some initial capital (see: daddy). A poor 9-5 manual laborer doesn't just go into a credit union to come out with a $1 million unsecured loan.

Business startups are risky, everyone involved are aware of that FACT. Every airline in the US has filed for bankruptcy at one time or another, some more than once. Trump wasn't the only one that invested in NJ and lost, a bunch of casinos were built and failed. The ones left standing are profitable.

A third of startups fail in the first 2 years, half in 5 years and two thirds in 10. Businesses that survive long term are the exception, not the rule.


.

Wonderful, but he's still a deadbeat.

Yeah, you tell that to the thousands of people that rely on him for their income. A wise man once said if you never fail, you're not trying. Funny how you never call other business failures deadbeats. So run along hack, you have nothing to offer.


.

 

[bgrouse]

I don't need to ask you to do that, I already see you're wrong. The loss of real estate tax deductions are for personal real estate, not for business real estate. You shouldn't discuss things you don't understand.

no sir, you are the one that does not understand

it's been widely reported and acknowledged, even by news outlets that tend to lean left, that this tax bill increases the overall federal tax burden for many of the wealthiest landowners

the little guy gets a break

the super wealthy with expensive property that live off of passive income wind up paying more

sorry this upsets you...

It's right in the tax bill, you idiot.

SEC. 11042. LIMITATION ON DEDUCTION FOR STATE AND LOCAL, ETC. TAXES.

(a) In General.—Subsection (b) of section 164 is amended by adding at the end the following new paragraph:

“(B) the aggregate amount of taxes taken into account under paragraphs (1), (2), and (3) of subsection (a) and paragraph (5) of this subsection for any taxable year shall not exceed $10,000 ($5,000 in the case of a married individual filing a separate return).

If you click on the link of section 164, it leads you to this:

(1) Personal property taxes
The term "personal property tax" means an ad valorem tax which is imposed on an annual basis in respect of personal property.

(2) State or local taxes
A State or local tax includes only a tax imposed by a State, a possession of the United States, or a political subdivision of any of the foregoing, or by the District of Columbia.

(3) Foreign taxes
A foreign tax includes only a tax imposed by the authority of a foreign country.

(5) General sales taxes

It's obviously from Schedule A.

https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/f1040sa.pdf

If you don't believe me, here's a left leaning news source you mentioned:

Under the new plan, taxpayers who itemize will be able to deduct their state individual income, sales and property taxes up to a limit of $10,000 in total starting in 2018.


SALT deductions: Making sense of new state and local tax caps

 

[bgrouse]

Quit pussyfooting and dodging, you cowardly turd! Put up or shut up.

What's a lie?

Trump didn't inherit or otherwise receive any considerable amount of money from his parents? Is that what you're saying? This requires a "yes" or "no" answer.

Trump started his business long before his parents died. His father loaned him some seed money, he took it from there.


.

We know how Trump ran his businesses. Get a loan, roll the dice. If he wins, he keeps the money and boasts about what a great businessman he is. If he loses, he tells the creditor to go **** himself. Rinse and repeat. Of course none of this would have been probable without some initial capital (see: daddy). A poor 9-5 manual laborer doesn't just go into a credit union to come out with a $1 million unsecured loan.

Business startups are risky, everyone involved are aware of that FACT. Every airline in the US has filed for bankruptcy at one time or another, some more than once. Trump wasn't the only one that invested in NJ and lost, a bunch of casinos were built and failed. The ones left standing are profitable.

A third of startups fail in the first 2 years, half in 5 years and two thirds in 10. Businesses that survive long term are the exception, not the rule.


.

Wonderful, but he's still a deadbeat.

Yeah, you tell that to the thousands of people that rely on him for their income. A wise man once said if you never fail, you're not trying. Funny how you never call other business failures deadbeats.

I try to stay on topic.

So run along hack, you have nothing to offer.


.

 

[Markle]

I said Trump got rich via inheritance / getting money from his parents.

Your delusions, on the other hand, are your delusions and your delusions alone.

That is a bald-faced lie, and you know it, or else you would not be arguing so hard to justify your lie!

Quit pussyfooting and dodging, you cowardly turd! Put up or shut up.

What's a lie?

Trump didn't inherit or otherwise receive any considerable amount of money from his parents? Is that what you're saying? This requires a "yes" or "no" answer.

Trump started his business long before his parents died. His father loaned him some seed money, he took it from there.

.

We know how Trump ran his businesses. Get a loan, roll the dice. If he wins, he keeps the money and boasts about what a great businessman he is. If he loses, he tells the creditor to go **** himself. Rinse and repeat. Of course none of this would have been probable without some initial capital (see: daddy). A poor 9-5 manual laborer doesn't just go into a credit union to come out with a $1 million unsecured loan.

Business startups are risky, everyone involved are aware of that FACT. Every airline in the US has filed for bankruptcy at one time or another, some more than once. Trump wasn't the only one that invested in NJ and lost, a bunch of casinos were built and failed. The ones left standing are profitable.

A third of startups fail in the first 2 years, half in 5 years and two thirds in 10. Businesses that survive long term are the exception, not the rule.
.

You know better than to confuse BGROUSE with FACTS. After all, he's just child playing.

 

[Markle]

You don't really think that's going to have a positive impact on BGROUSE do you? He has but one purpose.

You clowns, hiding behind the legal framework of Trump's businesses, are really funny.

You lying about people who inherit money is what is funny. You bigots are sick, jealous and hateful. You sure couldn’t put up but you are still lying. Lol! Dupe!

I've already addressed the people whining about how I'm lying and showed them to be full of shit.

Prove it, because you claimed you did, yet all you did is deflect saying your lie wasn’t important. It is because you are basing your idea on a bigoted view point. So as you continue to lie, we will call you out on them.

I just finished with ADMIRAL ROCKWELL TORY (see his posts in the last 5 hours), an illiterate moron who couldn't figure out what I said and thought I was lying.

You do lie.

 

[francoHFW]

I said Trump got rich via inheritance / getting money from his parents.

Your delusions, on the other hand, are your delusions and your delusions alone.

That is a bald-faced lie, and you know it, or else you would not be arguing so hard to justify your lie!

Quit pussyfooting and dodging, you cowardly turd! Put up or shut up.

What's a lie?

Trump didn't inherit or otherwise receive any considerable amount of money from his parents? Is that what you're saying? This requires a "yes" or "no" answer.

Trump started his business long before his parents died. His father loaned him some seed money, he took it from there.


.

I just wish he wouldn't listen to Fox News all the time and believe it Alex Jones oh my God. Hopefully smarter than everybody but doesn't seem like it... Nobody could call him a great businessman really. But he knew his brand was great.

Yeah, everyone pretends Trump is stupid with zero evidence of it. Yet during the tax negotiations he could site specific sections of the the bill unaided, which floored some congresscritters. He's doing what he thinks is best for the country and at this point he has done nothing that would change my opinion.

You can continue your class warfare chants, it just makes reasonable people think you're an idiot.


.

Every other country has a progressive tax system, here we don't anymore. Federal income taxes are much smaller now and the only Progressive one.

 

[OKTexas]

Trump started his business long before his parents died. His father loaned him some seed money, he took it from there.


.

We know how Trump ran his businesses. Get a loan, roll the dice. If he wins, he keeps the money and boasts about what a great businessman he is. If he loses, he tells the creditor to go **** himself. Rinse and repeat. Of course none of this would have been probable without some initial capital (see: daddy). A poor 9-5 manual laborer doesn't just go into a credit union to come out with a $1 million unsecured loan.

Business startups are risky, everyone involved are aware of that FACT. Every airline in the US has filed for bankruptcy at one time or another, some more than once. Trump wasn't the only one that invested in NJ and lost, a bunch of casinos were built and failed. The ones left standing are profitable.

A third of startups fail in the first 2 years, half in 5 years and two thirds in 10. Businesses that survive long term are the exception, not the rule.


.

Wonderful, but he's still a deadbeat.

Yeah, you tell that to the thousands of people that rely on him for their income. A wise man once said if you never fail, you're not trying. Funny how you never call other business failures deadbeats.

I try to stay on topic.

So run along hack, you have nothing to offer.


.

Trumps business failures have nothing to do with the topic and that pretty much all you've been harping about for a while now.

.

 

[dcbl]

I don't need to ask you to do that, I already see you're wrong. The loss of real estate tax deductions are for personal real estate, not for business real estate. You shouldn't discuss things you don't understand.

no sir, you are the one that does not understand

it's been widely reported and acknowledged, even by news outlets that tend to lean left, that this tax bill increases the overall federal tax burden for many of the wealthiest landowners

the little guy gets a break

the super wealthy with expensive property that live off of passive income wind up paying more

sorry this upsets you...

It's right in the tax bill, you idiot.

SEC. 11042. LIMITATION ON DEDUCTION FOR STATE AND LOCAL, ETC. TAXES.

(a) In General.—Subsection (b) of section 164 is amended by adding at the end the following new paragraph:

“(B) the aggregate amount of taxes taken into account under paragraphs (1), (2), and (3) of subsection (a) and paragraph (5) of this subsection for any taxable year shall not exceed $10,000 ($5,000 in the case of a married individual filing a separate return).

If you click on the link of section 164, it leads you to this:

(1) Personal property taxes
The term "personal property tax" means an ad valorem tax which is imposed on an annual basis in respect of personal property.

(2) State or local taxes
A State or local tax includes only a tax imposed by a State, a possession of the United States, or a political subdivision of any of the foregoing, or by the District of Columbia.

(3) Foreign taxes
A foreign tax includes only a tax imposed by the authority of a foreign country.

(5) General sales taxes

As you can see, the only section being limited to $10,000 that has to do with property taxes is explicitly listed as PERSONAL property taxes and has nothing to do with land investors who do it as a business, especially through business entities.

it also affects vacation (or second) homes; which you only have to use 14 days a year

eliminating state & local taxes as a deductions, especially property taxes increases the tax burden for the really wealthy, the loss of property tax deductions will raise their overall tax burden

calling me an idiot doesn't change this

yes, you are correct that it does not include investment properties; and I did get that part wrong

good catch, I have to give you that one

 

[francoHFW]

That is a bald-faced lie, and you know it, or else you would not be arguing so hard to justify your lie!

Quit pussyfooting and dodging, you cowardly turd! Put up or shut up.

What's a lie?

Trump didn't inherit or otherwise receive any considerable amount of money from his parents? Is that what you're saying? This requires a "yes" or "no" answer.

Trump started his business long before his parents died. His father loaned him some seed money, he took it from there.


.

I just wish he wouldn't listen to Fox News all the time and believe it Alex Jones oh my God. Hopefully smarter than everybody but doesn't seem like it... Nobody could call him a great businessman really. But he knew his brand was great.

Yeah, everyone pretends Trump is stupid with zero evidence of it. Yet during the tax negotiations he could site specific sections of the the bill unaided, which floored some congresscritters. He's doing what he thinks is best for the country and at this point he has done nothing that would change my opinion.

You can continue your class warfare chants, it just makes reasonable people think you're an idiot.


.

Every other country has a progressive tax system, here we don't anymore. Federal income tax much smaller now and the only Progressive one.

state and local taxes are regressive. Our tax rates are a disgrace and are ruining everything but the rich.

 

[bgrouse]

We know how Trump ran his businesses. Get a loan, roll the dice. If he wins, he keeps the money and boasts about what a great businessman he is. If he loses, he tells the creditor to go **** himself. Rinse and repeat. Of course none of this would have been probable without some initial capital (see: daddy). A poor 9-5 manual laborer doesn't just go into a credit union to come out with a $1 million unsecured loan.

Business startups are risky, everyone involved are aware of that FACT. Every airline in the US has filed for bankruptcy at one time or another, some more than once. Trump wasn't the only one that invested in NJ and lost, a bunch of casinos were built and failed. The ones left standing are profitable.

A third of startups fail in the first 2 years, half in 5 years and two thirds in 10. Businesses that survive long term are the exception, not the rule.


.

Wonderful, but he's still a deadbeat.

Yeah, you tell that to the thousands of people that rely on him for their income. A wise man once said if you never fail, you're not trying. Funny how you never call other business failures deadbeats.

I try to stay on topic.

So run along hack, you have nothing to offer.


.

Trumps business failures have nothing to do with the topic and that pretty much all you've been harping about for a while now.

.

Someone asked me for proof some rich people are deadbeats, or something to that extent. I picked Trump as my example.

 

[francoHFW]

Actually Hispanics are over 75% of illegals. And the only way to stop illegals coming in is a SSID card that can't be faked, and Republicans have blocked forever, Dupe.

You prove over and over that you're just not very smart. Anything created by man can be replicated by other men. And laws against illegals are NOT aimed specifically at hispanics, they are aimed at all illegals. The first lame link you posted was about muslims and the second was a State case having nothing to do with the feds and it was long before Trump.

Now, would you like to get back on topic, it's about tax cuts.


.

I don't care if they're Muslims or Mexicans or what. If they are worthy they can stay. Now pass the dam SS ID card and end it.

As for taxes, it's ridiculous to cut taxes on the rich again. The non rich need tax cuts and help. You dupes are out of your mind.

They are not worthy, they are criminals. And everyone got a tax cut, not just the rich. Keep pushing the propaganda, it's quite entertaining.


.

Your party refuses to stop them from coming and working here... It's an open invitation to come and work and have a great life in America. And we have to stop it and a wall and b******* is not going to do it

The wall is just a small part of the over system, and enforced visa entry/exit system is also required. 40+% of illegals come in legally on visas and never leave. Then making e-verify mandatory together with the rest will take care of most of the problem. Of course the ones who came across the border and are working under the table will still be a problem, that's why we need to go after employers who hire them with serious consequences up to and including jail time. Then remove the remainder as we find them, problem solved and no one is rewarded for breaking the law.


.

So they'll still be able to work under the table and that'll be fine that's... That is the system we have now. we need a SSID card that can't be faked.

 

[Markle]

Nice theory, but people still file personal returns with non-entities (Schedule Cs) and even in the case of business, people can and do personally guarantee loans.

For very small businesses, the lender will require that the mortgagor be personally responsible. When I was president of a fairly large corporation, I signed a note and mortgage for some land we were purchasing. In it was an exculpatory clause which means I had no personal responsibility for the loan and the bank could only look to the property in the event of a default on the mortgage.

Do you believe everyone should be barred from using bankruptcy to get out from under a mortgage or loans when the economy turns or it just turns out to be a bad venture?

Not sure what this has to do with our discussion. Like I said, I did not say what Trump did was illegal, just that he is a deadbeat. What does any of this have to do with whether or not I support bankruptcy law?

Just proves you're a hypocrite spouting off only because President Donald Trump is immensely successful as a businessman and President and it galls you no end. You'd rather take a sharp stick in the eye and admit he is right and doing a great job.

 

[bgrouse]

I don't need to ask you to do that, I already see you're wrong. The loss of real estate tax deductions are for personal real estate, not for business real estate. You shouldn't discuss things you don't understand.

no sir, you are the one that does not understand

it's been widely reported and acknowledged, even by news outlets that tend to lean left, that this tax bill increases the overall federal tax burden for many of the wealthiest landowners

the little guy gets a break

the super wealthy with expensive property that live off of passive income wind up paying more

sorry this upsets you...

It's right in the tax bill, you idiot.

SEC. 11042. LIMITATION ON DEDUCTION FOR STATE AND LOCAL, ETC. TAXES.

(a) In General.—Subsection (b) of section 164 is amended by adding at the end the following new paragraph:

“(B) the aggregate amount of taxes taken into account under paragraphs (1), (2), and (3) of subsection (a) and paragraph (5) of this subsection for any taxable year shall not exceed $10,000 ($5,000 in the case of a married individual filing a separate return).

If you click on the link of section 164, it leads you to this:

(1) Personal property taxes
The term "personal property tax" means an ad valorem tax which is imposed on an annual basis in respect of personal property.

(2) State or local taxes
A State or local tax includes only a tax imposed by a State, a possession of the United States, or a political subdivision of any of the foregoing, or by the District of Columbia.

(3) Foreign taxes
A foreign tax includes only a tax imposed by the authority of a foreign country.

(5) General sales taxes

As you can see, the only section being limited to $10,000 that has to do with property taxes is explicitly listed as PERSONAL property taxes and has nothing to do with land investors who do it as a business, especially through business entities.

it also affects vacation (or second) homes; which you only have to use 14 days a year

eliminating state & local taxes as a deductions, especially property taxes increases the tax burden for the really wealthy, the loss of property tax deductions will raise their overall tax burden

calling me an idiot doesn't change this

yes, you are correct that it does not include investment properties; and I did get that part wrong

good catch, I have to give you that one

By my rough calculations, a person making $10,000,000 a year in taxable income will save a little under $300,000 in tax under the new tax rules from the brackets. Sorry, I just don't see too many rich people losing out because of real estate taxes.

 

[bgrouse]

Nice theory, but people still file personal returns with non-entities (Schedule Cs) and even in the case of business, people can and do personally guarantee loans.

For very small businesses, the lender will require that the mortgagor be personally responsible. When I was president of a fairly large corporation, I signed a note and mortgage for some land we were purchasing. In it was an exculpatory clause which means I had no personal responsibility for the loan and the bank could only look to the property in the event of a default on the mortgage.

Do you believe everyone should be barred from using bankruptcy to get out from under a mortgage or loans when the economy turns or it just turns out to be a bad venture?

Not sure what this has to do with our discussion. Like I said, I did not say what Trump did was illegal, just that he is a deadbeat. What does any of this have to do with whether or not I support bankruptcy law?

Just proves you're a hypocrite spouting off only because President Donald Trump is immensely successful as a businessman and President and it galls you no end. You'd rather take a sharp stick in the eye and admit he is right and doing a great job.

I fail to see how this makes me a hypocrite. Can you expand on that?

 

[francoHFW]

Actually Hispanics are over 75% of illegals. And the only way to stop illegals coming in is a SSID card that can't be faked, and Republicans have blocked forever, Dupe.

You prove over and over that you're just not very smart. Anything created by man can be replicated by other men. And laws against illegals are NOT aimed specifically at hispanics, they are aimed at all illegals. The first lame link you posted was about muslims and the second was a State case having nothing to do with the feds and it was long before Trump.

Now, would you like to get back on topic, it's about tax cuts.


.

I don't care if they're Muslims or Mexicans or what. If they are worthy they can stay. Now pass the dam SS ID card and end it.

As for taxes, it's ridiculous to cut taxes on the rich again. The non rich need tax cuts and help. You dupes are out of your mind.

They are not worthy, they are criminals. And everyone got a tax cut, not just the rich. Keep pushing the propaganda, it's quite entertaining.


.

I think people in blue States aren't going to get tax cuts. And the rich are getting 4% tax cuts while the poor are getting two or 1% tax cuts. I hope he's a goddamn genius but I wouldn't hold your breath they're liars and thieves more likely...

The poor don't pay income taxes how can they get cuts?


.

They need cuts in state and local taxes. That could take time and more federal aid I guess...

 

[OKTexas]

That is a bald-faced lie, and you know it, or else you would not be arguing so hard to justify your lie!

Quit pussyfooting and dodging, you cowardly turd! Put up or shut up.

What's a lie?

Trump didn't inherit or otherwise receive any considerable amount of money from his parents? Is that what you're saying? This requires a "yes" or "no" answer.

Trump started his business long before his parents died. His father loaned him some seed money, he took it from there.


.

I just wish he wouldn't listen to Fox News all the time and believe it Alex Jones oh my God. Hopefully smarter than everybody but doesn't seem like it... Nobody could call him a great businessman really. But he knew his brand was great.

Yeah, everyone pretends Trump is stupid with zero evidence of it. Yet during the tax negotiations he could site specific sections of the the bill unaided, which floored some congresscritters. He's doing what he thinks is best for the country and at this point he has done nothing that would change my opinion.

You can continue your class warfare chants, it just makes reasonable people think you're an idiot.


.

Every other country has a progressive tax system, here we don't anymore. Federal income taxes are much smaller now and the only Progressive one.

Damn, two sentences, and one contradicts the other. LMAO


.

 

[francoHFW]

Actually Hispanics are over 75% of illegals. And the only way to stop illegals coming in is a SSID card that can't be faked, and Republicans have blocked forever, Dupe.

You prove over and over that you're just not very smart. Anything created by man can be replicated by other men. And laws against illegals are NOT aimed specifically at hispanics, they are aimed at all illegals. The first lame link you posted was about muslims and the second was a State case having nothing to do with the feds and it was long before Trump.

Now, would you like to get back on topic, it's about tax cuts.


.

I don't care if they're Muslims or Mexicans or what. If they are worthy they can stay. Now pass the dam SS ID card and end it.

As for taxes, it's ridiculous to cut taxes on the rich again. The non rich need tax cuts and help. You dupes are out of your mind.

They are not worthy, they are criminals. And everyone got a tax cut, not just the rich. Keep pushing the propaganda, it's quite entertaining.


.

I think people in blue States aren't going to get tax cuts. And the rich are getting 4% tax cuts while the poor are getting two or 1% tax cuts. I hope he's a goddamn genius but I wouldn't hold your breath they're liars and thieves more likely...

The poor don't pay income taxes how can they get cuts?


.

You can see in the graph the poorest quintile pays 18% in all taxes state and local too.