Ok. Here goes.

[disskreddit]

So what is to stop us from being good to one another regardless of differetiations in idealistic belief- for the purpose of undermining the powers that divide us?

If all we do is agree that "There are problems politically that require solution" and then leave politics ALONE until we've made a friend and an ally... Well then... We can talk. We can Communicate. My solution is utmost practicality. Solve problems individually and keep idealism out of it.

 

[daveman]

That's a great point-

Suppose we could identify someone's position whether it be public or private --> and yes I am proposing we segregate government employees -- I suggest limitiing animosity to the state and it's agents specifically and only

Speaking as an agent of the State, I think perhaps you're vastly overstating the authority many of us have.

Me, I'm a contract inspector. I make sure Uncle Sam gets the services he pays for. I don't have any employees to supervise. I don't have any authoritative interaction with the general public. If the contractor fails to perform work as specified by the contract, I let him know WHAT he needs to do to be in compliance...but I can't tell him he HAS to do it, nor can I tell him HOW to do it. If his groundskeeping subcontractor wants to bring in a herd of goats to graze the patch of grass the mowers missed, I don't care, as long as the grass winds up within specs...and he picks up the goat poop.

Not every government worker is in a position to make decisions that will affect your lives. And there are a lot more of us support employees than you realize -- none of whom deserving of any animosity.

 

[Votto]

So what is to stop us from being good to one another regardless of differetiations in idealistic belief- for the purpose of undermining the powers that divide us?

.

Raw selfish ambition.

In reality, we are all political creatures who seek to gain an edge over his fellow man. Government is merely the same crap on a much larger and ominous scale.

 

[Duped]

Man is born with a sinful nature; there is something called evil. No matter how many suppress that negativity, their will be masses who want to embrace it. You can not systemically change that one of mankinds inherent flaws! The road to hell is paved with good intentions. How do you intend to pay for this stupendous, malignant campaign?
Ideology vs. pratical application!

 

[FA_Q2]

So what is to stop us from being good to one another regardless of differetiations in idealistic belief- for the purpose of undermining the powers that divide us?

If all we do is agree that "There are problems politically that require solution" and then leave politics ALONE until we've made a friend and an ally... Well then... We can talk. We can Communicate. My solution is utmost practicality. Solve problems individually and keep idealism out of it.

You’re missing one basic reality though in that theory. That idea that we all want to get along without division ignores the basic concept that, though we all want the ‘utopia that you spoke about, none of us see the same utopia that another sees. For instance, no matter how much ‘loving and acceptance’ I try, rightwinger and I will NEVER agree on the basic purpose and running of government. That simply is not going to happen because we are diametrically opposed in our views.

To be honest, there really is nothing wrong with division. It gives us options and responses to failure. If we all agreed, that means none of us are thinking. What is wrong is the vitriol that we currently have in politics. No longer are people realizing like you have that the other side is simply wrong. Instead, they think the other side is evil or seeking the destruction of the nation. How many times have we heard that Obama want to DESTROY America? How many times that Bush wanted to do the same?

That is all we hear about now. That is the problem and close to your outline except that division is not the issue – hate is.

 

[disskreddit]

Wow! I've been gone for awhile and just came back today; I've gotta say I am VERY happy to see how this thread came along! Thanks guys! All awesome points!

Now to address a few points:

First

Man is born with a sinful nature; there is something called evil. No matter how many suppress that negativity, their will be masses who want to embrace it. You can not systemically change that one of mankinds inherent flaws! The road to hell is paved with good intentions. How do you intend to pay for this stupendous, malignant campaign?
Ideology vs. pratical application!

Ok- What I'm talking about here is not systematically removing the flaw itself... Unless you can offer me a good reason to believe otherwise, I'm simply looking to stop talking about left, right, religion and race.

Second- I am very aware that the road to Hell is indeed paved with good intentions, thus the reason why every time I pray I shut up a moment and LISTEN in the hopes that my God will replace the barriers to keep me on the right path

Third: Financing is unnecessary- Culture builds memes of all things that catch fire- a social shift is all that is necessary. Also, I've considered (contacted deans of various local colleges and churches) doing some public speaking on this topic. (for free - willing to pay THEM for the time if necessary) think I can get it done? its an exciting prospect to me.

Fourth:

So what is to stop us from being good to one another regardless of differetiations in idealistic belief- for the purpose of undermining the powers that divide us?

If all we do is agree that "There are problems politically that require solution" and then leave politics ALONE until we've made a friend and an ally... Well then... We can talk. We can Communicate. My solution is utmost practicality. Solve problems individually and keep idealism out of it.

You’re missing one basic reality though in that theory. That idea that we all want to get along without division ignores the basic concept that, though we all want the ‘utopia that you spoke about, none of us see the same utopia that another sees. For instance, no matter how much ‘loving and acceptance’ I try, rightwinger and I will NEVER agree on the basic purpose and running of government. That simply is not going to happen because we are diametrically opposed in our views.

To be honest, there really is nothing wrong with division. It gives us options and responses to failure. If we all agreed, that means none of us are thinking. What is wrong is the vitriol that we currently have in politics. No longer are people realizing like you have that the other side is simply wrong. Instead, they think the other side is evil or seeking the destruction of the nation. How many times have we heard that Obama want to DESTROY America? How many times that Bush wanted to do the same?

That is all we hear about now. That is the problem and close to your outline except that division is not the issue – hate is.

A) I know! That's what's awesome! The reason CB works is because I KNOW your CB is different from mine! I want to know about it! I want to know what puts you at peace. That's what makes you being a left leaning person and me being a hard right libertarian so awesome! because of our differences in CB, I can still massively appreciate your respectful responses and love you as a person! Please, think that one aspect over and tell me how one could not find that amazing!

B) Now as for the running of government, We can take ourselves here for example! I'm glad your here, because here is the practical application of this theory-- You and I are diametrically opposed as to our opinions of government, but let's put that on hold for a second- and ask one question: "Can you agree with me that: The government (in general as an entity) has too much influence on us and our well being?" if the answer to that is "No" then unfortunately, I would believe you to be a statist, and my theory unravels -- But! You'd be surprised how many left-leaning folk want government power in DIFFERENT places than it is, and believe it is putting too much power in it's current focuses- that is the same thing! that works! Even if you'd like to see LESS power, then one of our goals will be reached before the other, THEN we can argue about it later... but you see... your goals, my goals, all of our goals are futile... Nobody is changing ANYONE's mind! that's why we need to cease the division -temporarily --- Do what we as a people are asking our congress to do.

C) Yea, I mean division would be ok if: People weren't being hurt because of it... Can you learn to love people as they are the soul and body? Just that? If you can, then you can see the imperative here... That's the big hang up most folks have, is the dehumanization of our media... When you hear about someone on TV being hurt... It's ok to hurt for them. I mean really it is... It's kindof a bleeding heart humanist approach, but we need a little bit of that right now. Its... a little ways off the ranch if AT LEAST we can't agree that human life is valuable and that our neighbors deserve our love... at least a little bit??? I'd ask that you put a little value in them. just saying.

*edit* re-read your quote -- Hatred is VERY MUCH so the real problem here... I find nipping the bud back down to division kindof circumvents a lot of confusing rhetoric that arises with it. I believe the hatred comes as a direct result of the division so if your only goal is to hit the cue-ball but you aim for 8 ball corner pocket, then you can be sure you hit the cue ball thanks again for that.

If i missed anything call me on it. I'm loving this guys! best thread on USMB in my eyes!