Obamacare's Looming Land Mine

[ScreamingEagle]

Sorry to oppose you SE but with 70% of doctors and hospitals opting out of Obamacare and full subsidies only available in 15 states this will be a highly localized problem.

understood....but this example shows how little they care about socking the middle class with higher costs....they are only concerned with providing 'coverage'.....and of course blaming the insurance companies for everything...

 

[LoneLaugher]

There is a masterstroke hidden inside the Affordable Care Act that will ensure not only the rapid move to a single-payer system, but also the full government takeover of the medical industry.

Articles: ObamaCare's Looming Land Mine

This link is misleading for two reasons. First the yearly maximum out of pocket costs have been decreased in most plans. In many plans it's the same or very close to same as the deductible. Also the $15,000+ catastrophic plans have been eliminated as well as employee turnover rate plans. Second single payer is not near as popular among Democrats as Republicans assume. Obama's first choice was single payer. Only after he was assured that it would never pass a Democratic control House and Senate did he agree to the current federally regulated insurance based plan.

i think the max oop is 6,350 single / 12,700 family....that includes deductibles, coinsurance, co-pays, fees...

correct me if i'm wrong but i don't believe the max oop includes premiums.....so a family could run up a 20-25,000 bill pretty fast...on an annual basis for long term situations...

It does not include premiums.

 

[LoneLaugher]

g5, you claim to be a Republican, but are defending a Democratic disaster. How on Earth do you do it?

The consensus is that G is schizophrenic... or a habitual drug abuser. He's all over the map.

G5 is one of the honest conservatives that we all find so rare. One of this forum's most intelligent people. Period.

 

[LoneLaugher]

By the way....this is a duplicate nutter thread. So rare!

 

[dblack]

By the way....this is a duplicate nutter thread. So rare!

Yup. Now that you've posted, it's officially a 'nutter thread'.

 

[LoneLaugher]

By the way....this is a duplicate nutter thread. So rare!

Yup. Now that you've posted, it's officially a 'nutter thread'.

I am shocked. A nutter has picked a piece of low hanging fruit! Cool.

 

[dblack]

By the way....this is a duplicate nutter thread. So rare!

Yup. Now that you've posted, it's officially a 'nutter thread'.

I am shocked. A nutter has picked a piece of low hanging fruit! Cool.

If nutters are picking fruit we should tax them and take some of it. Who do they think they are??

 

[LoneLaugher]

Yup. Now that you've posted, it's officially a 'nutter thread'.

I am shocked. A nutter has picked a piece of low hanging fruit! Cool.

If nutters are picking fruit we should tax them and take some of it. Who do they think they are??

Don't forget...you can also have my nuts.

 

[Flopper]

There is a masterstroke hidden inside the Affordable Care Act that will ensure not only the rapid move to a single-payer system, but also the full government takeover of the medical industry.

Articles: ObamaCare's Looming Land Mine

This link is misleading for two reasons. First the yearly maximum out of pocket costs have been decreased in most plans. In many plans it's the same or very close to same as the deductible. Also the $15,000+ catastrophic plans have been eliminated as well as employee turnover rate plans. Second single payer is not near as popular among Democrats as Republicans assume. Obama's first choice was single payer. Only after he was assured that it would never pass a Democratic control House and Senate did he agree to the current federally regulated insurance based plan.

i think the max oop is 6,350 single / 12,700 family....that includes deductibles, coinsurance, co-pays, fees...

correct me if i'm wrong but i don't believe the max oop includes premiums.....so a family could run up a 20-25,000 bill pretty fast...on an annual basis for long term situations...

You are correct, $6,350 for an individual or $12,700 is the maximum medical expense a family would have to pay. This includes the deductible but not premiums. What the family expenses might be of course depends on premium, expense, and income. Using a Florida quote for a 30 yr old couple with 3 kids with the above out of pocket expense and deductible from United Healthcare, premium is $877. For this premium and a seriously ill member of the family the maximum medical expense including premium would be $16,874 for the year. This is for an individual plan which in most cases is much more expense than an employee sponsored plan.

Keep in mind that the actual medical expense depends on family income under Obamacare. If the family income is less than $26,000 with expanded Medicaid, there is no Medical expense because it's all covered by Medicaid.

For the same family with an income of $50,000, there is a $3,000 subsidy which would reduce the medical expenses including premiums to a maximum of $13,384. So even though there might be $100,000 medical expenses $13,874 is most the family would have to pay. The family would also be able to deduct $13,874 from income taxes which could reduce the medical expense a bit more. Also, there are 20 preventive services that are included in all plans and are not subject to a deductible.

 

[Flopper]

Now here is where I fervently hope the GOP does not fall on its face once again.

FACT: ObamaCare will not reduce medical bankruptcies.

So is the Right going to come up with solutions to reduce medical bankruptcies? Or are they just going to continue to do monkey dances over the poor rollout of ObamaCare and its failures?

If you aren't part of the solution, you are part of the problem.

Instead of trying to repeal ObamaCare (never going to happen) and being the party that actually cheers and dances about when people get fucked over, offer up additions and repairs.

why the hell should the right try to 'fix' Obamacare....?

in any case once you are bankrupt and poor you are eligible for Medicaid....

There is nothing to fix in the law at this point in time. In a year or so the needed changes will be obvious. If Democrats don't fix it, the Republicans will have to. Repealing the law in 2014 will not be possible.

 

[GWV5903]

Now here is where I fervently hope the GOP does not fall on its face once again.

FACT: ObamaCare will not reduce medical bankruptcies.

So is the Right going to come up with solutions to reduce medical bankruptcies? Or are they just going to continue to do monkey dances over the poor rollout of ObamaCare and its failures?

If you aren't part of the solution, you are part of the problem.

Instead of trying to repeal ObamaCare (never going to happen) and being the party that actually cheers and dances about when people get fucked over, offer up additions and repairs.

why the hell should the right try to 'fix' Obamacare....?

in any case once you are bankrupt and poor you are eligible for Medicaid....

There is nothing to fix in the law at this point in time. In a year or so the needed changes will be obvious. If Democrats don't fix it, the Republicans will have to. Repealing the law in 2014 will not be possible.

Why?

 

[william the wie]

Flopper you are assuming two things:

That the GOP will not be happy with D voters swamping compliant states while investment leaves those states.

And that there are fixes acceptable both to congress and the administration.

I consider it dubious that either of those conditions will be met much less both and both are needed prior to the 2016 election.

 

[Flopper]

why the hell should the right try to 'fix' Obamacare....?

in any case once you are bankrupt and poor you are eligible for Medicaid....

There is nothing to fix in the law at this point in time. In a year or so the needed changes will be obvious. If Democrats don't fix it, the Republicans will have to. Repealing the law in 2014 will not be possible.

Why?

Why? Seriously. It would require a 2/3 vote from the Senate and the House to override a presidential veto which would be required. Even if this were possible, there would have to be a law that transition from the current healthcare system under Obamacare back to 2009 or something else. Insurance companies, hospitals, and drug companies which stand to benefit from the current law would fight this all the way.

 

[dblack]

There is nothing to fix in the law at this point in time. In a year or so the needed changes will be obvious. If Democrats don't fix it, the Republicans will have to. Repealing the law in 2014 will not be possible.

Why?

Why? Seriously. It would require a 2/3 vote from the Senate and the House to override a presidential veto which would be required. Even if this were possible, there would have to be a law that transition from the current healthcare system under Obamacare back to 2009 or something else. Insurance companies, hospitals, and drug companies which stand to benefit from the current law would fight this all the way.

Yep. We're pretty much fucked.

 

[Flopper]

Why?

Why? Seriously. It would require a 2/3 vote from the Senate and the House to override a presidential veto which would be required. Even if this were possible, there would have to be a law that transition from the current healthcare system under Obamacare back to 2009 or something else. Insurance companies, hospitals, and drug companies which stand to benefit from the current law would fight this all the way.

Yep. We're pretty much fucked.

Far from it. There is no doubt in my mind that this law will be changed but not until it is has been implemented in both the individual and employee sponsored healthcare markets. Change will be possible once you start seeing realist proposals.

 

[dblack]

Why? Seriously. It would require a 2/3 vote from the Senate and the House to override a presidential veto which would be required. Even if this were possible, there would have to be a law that transition from the current healthcare system under Obamacare back to 2009 or something else. Insurance companies, hospitals, and drug companies which stand to benefit from the current law would fight this all the way.

Yep. We're pretty much fucked.

Far from it. There is no doubt in my mind that this law will be changed but not until it is has been implemented in both the individual and employee sponsored healthcare markets. Change will be possible once you start seeing realist proposals.

I'm sure it will change. Based on how it's gone so far, especially the influences you yourself cite above, what makes you think it will change for the better?

Hope?

 

[GWV5903]

There is nothing to fix in the law at this point in time. In a year or so the needed changes will be obvious. If Democrats don't fix it, the Republicans will have to. Repealing the law in 2014 will not be possible.

Why?

Why? Seriously. It would require a 2/3 vote from the Senate and the House to override a presidential veto which would be required. Even if this were possible, there would have to be a law that transition from the current healthcare system under Obamacare back to 2009 or something else. Insurance companies, hospitals, and drug companies which stand to benefit from the current law would fight this all the way.

Yee of little faith, tough task, not impossible for the single largest mistake in our history...