Obama asserts executive priviledge over fast and furious documents

[Conservative]

Hmm. Didn't Issa claim he had NO knowledge of the gun-running program?

Daily Kos: 2008: Darrell Issa Voted "YES" to Fund Project Gunrunner & Merida Initiative

Link to Issa claiming no knowledge of Project Gun Runner please.

 

[ConservaDerrps]

The voting record:

HR 6028 Assistance for Mexico and Central America for Anti-Drug Programs (Merida Program) - Voting Record - Project Vote Smart

 

[GuyPinestra]

More facts that Conservatives on this board won't know about because they refuse to read this stuff because they think it comes from a "hate site."

Five Things To Know About The Republican Witchhunt Against Attorney General Holder | ThinkProgress

1. Issa Has No Case: Issa’s uncovered no evidence showing Holder bears any blame for the botched operations begun under George W. Bush, even though the Justice Department turned over thousands of pages of documents concerning the operations. Instead of accepting this fact, Issa has requested many more documents containing confidential information regarding ongoing law enforcement investigations, and is now threatening to hold Holder in contempt if these documents are not turned over. Holder is entirely correct to withhold these documents, however, because Justice Department documents are not subject to congressional subpoena if they would reveal “strategies and procedures that could be used by individuals seeking to evade [DOJ's] law enforcement efforts.”
2. Reagan’s Justice Department Agreed With Holder: President Reagan’s Justice Department warned in the 1980s that the Constitution’s separation of powers prevents the kind of documents Issa is seeking from being revealed to Congress because of the risk that the legislature could “exert pressure or attempt to influence the prosecution of criminal cases.”
3. Law Enforcement Rejects Issa’s Witchhunt: Issa’s efforts to embarrass Holder are an unnecessary distraction that hinders the Department of Justice’s ability to do its real job. As an organization representing numerous senior law enforcement officials warned Issa, his efforts are “an impediment to the vigorous enforcement of violence and crime.”
4. Even Top Republicans Think Issa Goes Too Far: After Issa leaked his plans to pursue contempt charges to the media, the House Republican leadership pressured him to back off. Indeed, even House Majority Leader Eric Cantor (R-VA) has indicated that Issa is overreaching.
5. Issa Is Fixated On A Conspiracy Theory: Perhaps the most bizarre aspect of this affair is what Issa once suggested his investigation will uncover. In an interview with Sean Hannity, Issa claimed that the Obama administration “made a crisis” when they continued the Bush-era gunrunning operations because they wanted to “us[e] this crisis to somehow take away or limit people’s Second Amendment rights.” This accusation originates from a former militiaman who supports violent resistance to imagined government attempts to seize his guns. And it amounts to an accusation that a series of botched gun stings that begun during the Bush Administration were actually part of a secret Obama plot to release guns to Mexican drug lords, so that those guns could then be used to kill federal agents, which would then cause a national uprising in support of gun control.

And this isn't a partisan which hunt, right?

When the very first sentence in the article is a bald-faced lie it's easy to dismiss the rest as total partisan garbage... F & F didn't start until 2009, Bozo...

 

[Conservative]

The voting record:

HR 6028 Assistance for Mexico and Central America for Anti-Drug Programs (Merida Program) - Voting Record - Project Vote Smart

So, Issa voting for HR 6028 somehow proves he said he knew nothing about Project Gunrunner?

How did you make that leap?

 

[rightwinger]

I would like to see this use of executive privilege go to the SCOTUS just before the election for all to see that his act is that of a dictator, not a president.

I just have to love the Constitutional outrage from Republicans the first time Obama uses Executive Privilege

Where were you the six times Bush used it to protect Cheney, Rove and company?

 

[Conservative]

I would like to see this use of executive privilege go to the SCOTUS just before the election for all to see that his act is that of a dictator, not a president.

I just have to love the Constitutional outrage from Republicans the first time Obama uses Executive Privilege

Where were you the six times Bush used it to protect Cheney, Rove and company?

Personally, I only got into political boards around 2008, so I missed commenting on those instances. If they were justified and legal, then I have no problem with them. If they were not justified or illegal, then I have a problem with them. Same as here.

 

[Conservative]

The voting record:

HR 6028 Assistance for Mexico and Central America for Anti-Drug Programs (Merida Program) - Voting Record - Project Vote Smart

So, Issa voting for HR 6028 somehow proves he said he knew nothing about Project Gunrunner?

How did you make that leap?

Hey Derpshit... you gonna explain to us how Issa voting for the bill somehow proves he said he never heard of Gunrunner???

 

[Google]

I would like to see this use of executive privilege go to the SCOTUS just before the election for all to see that his act is that of a dictator, not a president.

I just have to love the Constitutional outrage from Republicans the first time Obama uses Executive Privilege

Where were you the six times Bush used it to protect Cheney, Rove and company?

Personally, I only got into political boards around 2008, so I missed commenting on those instances. If they were justified and legal, then I have no problem with them. If they were not justified or illegal, then I have a problem with them. Same as here.

No, don't let them do this. This is not about Bush, he is no longer in office and has not been for sometime. I'm sick of liberals invoking Bush to justify what Obama is doing. I'm not a fan of Bush, and I, along with plenty of conservatives, were vocal in our criticism of his administration--something that can not be said about today's liberals.

Liberals stench of hypocrisy and desperation is pungent when they have to invoke Bush to justify what Obama is doing.

Bush isn't the correct analogy anyway, Nixon is.

 

[ConservaDerrps]

Looking for it now. I did find this link, which shows Issa's camp denying he was briefed in 2010, which kind of makes it sound like he was in the dark about it.

Issa camp says Washington Post wrong on Gunrunner story | The Daily Caller

 

[Conservative]

I just have to love the Constitutional outrage from Republicans the first time Obama uses Executive Privilege

Where were you the six times Bush used it to protect Cheney, Rove and company?

Personally, I only got into political boards around 2008, so I missed commenting on those instances. If they were justified and legal, then I have no problem with them. If they were not justified or illegal, then I have a problem with them. Same as here.

No, don't let them do this. This is not about Bush, he is no longer in office and has not been for sometime. I'm sick of liberals invoking Bush to justify what Obama is doing. I'm not a fan of Bush, and I, along with plenty of conservatives, were vocal in our criticism of his administration--something that can not be said about today's liberals.

Liberals stench of hypocrisy and desperation is pungent when they have to invoke Bush to justify what Obama is doing.

Bush isn't the correct analogy anyway, Nixon is.

Not letting them do anything. Simply answering a question. Both instances bother me, if they are illegal or not justified. Same goes for Clinton's use and Nixon's.

 

[ConservaDerrps]

Also, to me the bigger point isn't whether Issa knew about Gunrunner, he obviously did since he VOTED FOR IT. I think it just kind of drives home the point that at the end of the day, this is a partisan attack. There is not a higher-level conspiracy to take away guns in THIS country by giving them to Mexican cartels. That conspiracy theory is so full of shit it makes Birtherism look half-smart.

I feel like it was a monumental mistake, this program, but on both sides of the aisle, and if you can't at least admit that Issa voting FOR the bill that funded the program and then leading some crusade against the program is disingenuous at best and blatant hypocritical political rhetoric at worst, and I really don't care how much you're going to spin this. He knew about it, he voted for it, therefore he, and anyone else who voted for it, should be held just as accountable. Don't agree? Show your partisan stripes some more.

 

[Conservative]

Looking for it now. I did find this link, which shows Issa's camp denying he was briefed in 2010, which kind of makes it sound like he was in the dark about it.

Issa camp says Washington Post wrong on Gunrunner story | The Daily Caller

So, you've gone from 'Didn't he deny knowing about it' to 'it sounds like he was in the dark'.

Let me know when you get to 'Gee, I guess I was wrong about Issa claiming he did not know about it', and I'll pos rep you for honesty.

 

[ConservaDerrps]

I don't need your pos-rep. Just as much as I don't care how many times you neg-rep me. I believe Issa has been acting as if he was in the dark when clearly he wasn't.

Why don't you actually address my points about how utterly partisan this investigation is when it's being headed by someone who voted for the very program under investigation to be funded? Why don't you stop trying to "gotcha" me on the least important factor of this, and focus more on the larger picture here.

I've said all along this was a bad fucking idea. What I've also said is that Republican hand-wringing and histrionics are empty. And now, we can see just how empty it is. You won't admit it, I'm sure, but no matter what this investigation will always be partisan because instead of going after the ATF, the actual department that fucked up, Issa went after Holder and Obama.

 

[Conservative]

I don't need your pos-rep. Just as much as I don't care how many times you neg-rep me. I believe Issa has been acting as if he was in the dark when clearly he wasn't.

Why don't you actually address my points about how utterly partisan this investigation is when it's being headed by someone who voted for the very program under investigation to be funded? Why don't you stop trying to "gotcha" me on the least important factor of this, and focus more on the larger picture here.

I've said all along this was a bad fucking idea. What I've also said is that Republican hand-wringing and histrionics are empty. And now, we can see just how empty it is. You won't admit it, I'm sure, but no matter what this investigation will always be partisan because instead of going after the ATF, the actual department that fucked up, Issa went after Holder and Obama.

you can believe the moon is made of cottage cheese too. Doesn't make it fact just because 'you' believe it.

 

[ConservaDerrps]

I don't need your pos-rep. Just as much as I don't care how many times you neg-rep me. I believe Issa has been acting as if he was in the dark when clearly he wasn't.

Why don't you actually address my points about how utterly partisan this investigation is when it's being headed by someone who voted for the very program under investigation to be funded? Why don't you stop trying to "gotcha" me on the least important factor of this, and focus more on the larger picture here.

I've said all along this was a bad fucking idea. What I've also said is that Republican hand-wringing and histrionics are empty. And now, we can see just how empty it is. You won't admit it, I'm sure, but no matter what this investigation will always be partisan because instead of going after the ATF, the actual department that fucked up, Issa went after Holder and Obama.

you can believe the moon is made of cottage cheese too. Doesn't make it fact just because 'you' believe it.

Dodge #2

 

[Annie]

I don't need your pos-rep. Just as much as I don't care how many times you neg-rep me. I believe Issa has been acting as if he was in the dark when clearly he wasn't.

Why don't you actually address my points about how utterly partisan this investigation is when it's being headed by someone who voted for the very program under investigation to be funded? Why don't you stop trying to "gotcha" me on the least important factor of this, and focus more on the larger picture here.

I've said all along this was a bad fucking idea. What I've also said is that Republican hand-wringing and histrionics are empty. And now, we can see just how empty it is. You won't admit it, I'm sure, but no matter what this investigation will always be partisan because instead of going after the ATF, the actual department that fucked up, Issa went after Holder and Obama.

you can believe the moon is made of cottage cheese too. Doesn't make it fact just because 'you' believe it.

Dodge #2

By your logic then, the years of repudiations by Democrats that voted for the Iraq 2003 invasion are responsible for that. Their claims of not having 'all the information' are partisan lies.

 

[ConservaDerrps]

you can believe the moon is made of cottage cheese too. Doesn't make it fact just because 'you' believe it.

Dodge #2

By your logic then, the years of repudiations by Democrats that voted for the Iraq 2003 invasion are responsible for that. Their claims of not having 'all the information' are partisan lies.

i don't think your first sentence makes much sense, but if you're saying that the Democrats who voted for the Iraq 2003 invasion are culpable for the clusterfuck that war was, then yes, I agree. Unfortunately there's not much that can be done to "punish" them other than to not vote for them, though.

But yes, I do think anyone who voted for the Iraq war should be held responsible. Of course, they were given completely false intelligence data to sway them. And I'm not sure exactly how false the Bush II Team knew the data was, but clearly there were some mitigating circumstances.

HR6028 spelled out what the funds were for; Issa voted for them. So that's where the comparison sharply turns.

 

[Dr.Drock]

Dodge #2

By your logic then, the years of repudiations by Democrats that voted for the Iraq 2003 invasion are responsible for that. Their claims of not having 'all the information' are partisan lies.

i don't think your first sentence makes much sense, but if you're saying that the Democrats who voted for the Iraq 2003 invasion are culpable for the clusterfuck that war was, then yes, I agree. Unfortunately there's not much that can be done to "punish" them other than to not vote for them, though.

But yes, I do think anyone who voted for the Iraq war should be held responsible. Of course, they were given completely false intelligence data to sway them. And I'm not sure exactly how false the Bush II Team knew the data was, but clearly there were some mitigating circumstances.

HR6028 spelled out what the funds were for; Issa voted for them. So that's where the comparison sharply turns.

That's not just it, any dem or rep who agreed on a budget that included funding for the Iraq War were also voting in favor of continuing it. Can't just look at the inital vote.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

 

[GuyPinestra]

Dodge #2

By your logic then, the years of repudiations by Democrats that voted for the Iraq 2003 invasion are responsible for that. Their claims of not having 'all the information' are partisan lies.

i don't think your first sentence makes much sense, but if you're saying that the Democrats who voted for the Iraq 2003 invasion are culpable for the clusterfuck that war was, then yes, I agree. Unfortunately there's not much that can be done to "punish" them other than to not vote for them, though.

But yes, I do think anyone who voted for the Iraq war should be held responsible. Of course, they were given completely false intelligence data to sway them. And I'm not sure exactly how false the Bush II Team knew the data was, but clearly there were some mitigating circumstances.

HR6028 spelled out what the funds were for; Issa voted for them. So that's where the comparison sharply turns.

I'm sorry to disappoint you, but HR 6028 didn't spell out the operational details of ANYTHING. You can go read all 50-some pages of it here Text of H.R.6028 as Referred in Senate: Merida Initiative to Combat Illicit Narcotics and Reduce Organized Crime... OpenCongress if you'd like.