NSA - Surveillance Stopped 50 Terror Plots

[daveman]

How many were stopped by intercepting domestic to foreign calls...the original intention of the Patriot Act...and how many were stopped by the practice of spying on 315 million Americans?

I suspect ALL were stopped by intercepting FOREIGN calls...meaning it's total BS as it relates to the practice of spying on all Americans.

Really? Do you think that all foreign terrorists in the US planning an attack never talk to each other?

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Seems like the NSA phone surveillance program has already paid off, at least in one case where it could have really affected us where Khalid Ouazzani for allegedly plotting with Yemeni co-conspirators to blow up the New York Stock Exchange.

Such a case makes the surveillance worth the effort.

National Security Agency Director Keith Alexander testified Tuesday before the House Intelligence Committee that phone and Internet surveillance programs made public by former defense contractor Edward Snowden prevented approximately 50 terrorist plots since 2001, 10 of which targeted the U.S., and said new policies are being crafted to prevent another large-scale leak.

Alexander disclosed that approximately 1,000 people are currently employed as NSA systems administrators – the position Snowden held – and that the agency is "working to come up with a two-person rule" to prevent people "from taking information out of our system." Snowden was a contractor assigned to the NSA by Booz Allen Hamilton before he downloaded and released information on the top-secret programs.

The intelligence agency leader didn't go into detail about what precisely the new "two person" rule would entail. "When one of those persons misuses their authority, that is a huge problem," Alexander said.

The government officials present at Tuesday's hearing publicly disclosed two cases they said were cracked with the broad communications surveillance: One in 2010, in which investigators nabbed Khalid Ouazzani for allegedly plotting with Yemeni co-conspirators to blow up the New York Stock Exchange and another in which a man was arrested for providing "financial support" to an extremist group in Somalia.

Rep. Mac Thornberry, R-Texas, questioned FBI Deputy Director Sean Joyce at the hearing, inquiring if the NYSE plotters were serious or if the plans were "something they kind of dreamed about talking among their buddies." Joyce said the conviction of plotters showed it was a serious plan.

NSA Director: Surveillance Stopped 50 Terror Plots - US News and World Report


More.......

Gov't claims spying programs stopped plot to bomb New York Stock Exchange - Jun. 18, 2013

Seems like you will believe anything the government tells you.

 

[Mertex]

Seems like the NSA phone surveillance program has already paid off, at least in one case where it could have really affected us where Khalid Ouazzani for allegedly plotting with Yemeni co-conspirators to blow up the New York Stock Exchange.

Such a case makes the surveillance worth the effort.

National Security Agency Director Keith Alexander testified Tuesday before the House Intelligence Committee that phone and Internet surveillance programs made public by former defense contractor Edward Snowden prevented approximately 50 terrorist plots since 2001, 10 of which targeted the U.S., and said new policies are being crafted to prevent another large-scale leak.

Alexander disclosed that approximately 1,000 people are currently employed as NSA systems administrators – the position Snowden held – and that the agency is "working to come up with a two-person rule" to prevent people "from taking information out of our system." Snowden was a contractor assigned to the NSA by Booz Allen Hamilton before he downloaded and released information on the top-secret programs.

The intelligence agency leader didn't go into detail about what precisely the new "two person" rule would entail. "When one of those persons misuses their authority, that is a huge problem," Alexander said.

The government officials present at Tuesday's hearing publicly disclosed two cases they said were cracked with the broad communications surveillance: One in 2010, in which investigators nabbed Khalid Ouazzani for allegedly plotting with Yemeni co-conspirators to blow up the New York Stock Exchange and another in which a man was arrested for providing "financial support" to an extremist group in Somalia.

Rep. Mac Thornberry, R-Texas, questioned FBI Deputy Director Sean Joyce at the hearing, inquiring if the NYSE plotters were serious or if the plans were "something they kind of dreamed about talking among their buddies." Joyce said the conviction of plotters showed it was a serious plan.

NSA Director: Surveillance Stopped 50 Terror Plots - US News and World Report


More.......

Gov't claims spying programs stopped plot to bomb New York Stock Exchange - Jun. 18, 2013

Seems like you will believe anything the government tells you.

Not really, but it seems you believe everything Glenn Beck tells you.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

Seems like the NSA phone surveillance program has already paid off, at least in one case where it could have really affected us where Khalid Ouazzani for allegedly plotting with Yemeni co-conspirators to blow up the New York Stock Exchange.

Such a case makes the surveillance worth the effort.

National Security Agency Director Keith Alexander testified Tuesday before the House Intelligence Committee that phone and Internet surveillance programs made public by former defense contractor Edward Snowden prevented approximately 50 terrorist plots since 2001, 10 of which targeted the U.S., and said new policies are being crafted to prevent another large-scale leak.

Alexander disclosed that approximately 1,000 people are currently employed as NSA systems administrators – the position Snowden held – and that the agency is "working to come up with a two-person rule" to prevent people "from taking information out of our system." Snowden was a contractor assigned to the NSA by Booz Allen Hamilton before he downloaded and released information on the top-secret programs.

The intelligence agency leader didn't go into detail about what precisely the new "two person" rule would entail. "When one of those persons misuses their authority, that is a huge problem," Alexander said.

The government officials present at Tuesday's hearing publicly disclosed two cases they said were cracked with the broad communications surveillance: One in 2010, in which investigators nabbed Khalid Ouazzani for allegedly plotting with Yemeni co-conspirators to blow up the New York Stock Exchange and another in which a man was arrested for providing "financial support" to an extremist group in Somalia.

Rep. Mac Thornberry, R-Texas, questioned FBI Deputy Director Sean Joyce at the hearing, inquiring if the NYSE plotters were serious or if the plans were "something they kind of dreamed about talking among their buddies." Joyce said the conviction of plotters showed it was a serious plan.

NSA Director: Surveillance Stopped 50 Terror Plots - US News and World Report


More.......

Gov't claims spying programs stopped plot to bomb New York Stock Exchange - Jun. 18, 2013

WOW so the people who are tracking the American people are saying that it has stopped attacks? No shit they'll say anything to keep the power.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

I feel just bewildered; as if there's no hope.

We are caught between the Devil and the Deep Blue Sea --

Between terrorists on the left hand and the government Stasi spying on us all on the other hand.

truth be told some of those terrorist were created by our very own government. You can't have all these tracking programs without an enemy

 

[flacaltenn]

How many were stopped by intercepting domestic to foreign calls...the original intention of the Patriot Act...and how many were stopped by the practice of spying on 315 million Americans?

I suspect ALL were stopped by intercepting FOREIGN calls...meaning it's total BS as it relates to the practice of spying on all Americans.

I'm with ya on this.. There's a logic and reason problem to their "need" to query 140 Million phone records..

If the object is to match a "known terrorist" with calls and rings of associations made solely of US persons ----- Why the heck don't they KNOW the numbers dialed from the suspect foreign phone?? Lots of public knowledge --- that NSA has methods of tapping the cables and satellites bringing calls to the US. If they already have a suspect number, they can camp out on these international links and KNOW if calls are made into the US.. Even for the hard traffic routes like Canada and Mexico, we must have reciprocal agreements with THEIR intelligience offices to alert on traffic between countries.. But moreover, once they have a FOREIGN suspect number, they can easily camp on that number in that country with no violation of domestic rights.

http://www.zdnet.com/news/spy-agency-taps-into-undersea-cable/115877

So that is just a bad excuse for a fishing expedition..

Now DAVEMAN gets us a little closer to the truth...

Really? Do you think that all foreign terrorists in the US planning an attack never talk to each other?

No.. Probably not the smart dangerous ones.. They use couriers or pigeons thru the network of natural support hidden in radical Mosques and front organizations. HOWEVER -- you got real close to a REAL justification for that massive complex in Utah..

Even if you turn up a new pigeon or courier, you could get a standard warrant to pursue them without limitations.

HOWEVER --- If you MINE that 150 million identity data base for PATTERNS of ASSOCIATION, you can then find those networks of associates INDEPENDENT of an actual suspect foreign number.

And that is FAR more likely use for the sophisticated methods that NSA can deliver. Dianne Feinstein and all the apologists for this may be too stupid to understand the nuances. OR they are fine with this kind of "fishing"..

The lying and excuses don't pass minimum standards for logic and reason..

 

[daveman]

How many were stopped by intercepting domestic to foreign calls...the original intention of the Patriot Act...and how many were stopped by the practice of spying on 315 million Americans?

I suspect ALL were stopped by intercepting FOREIGN calls...meaning it's total BS as it relates to the practice of spying on all Americans.

I'm with ya on this.. There's a logic and reason problem to their "need" to query 140 Million phone records..

If the object is to match a "known terrorist" with calls and rings of associations made solely of US persons ----- Why the heck don't they KNOW the numbers dialed from the suspect foreign phone?? I know for a FACT --- that NSA has a virtual LOCK on the satellite and underwater cables bringing calls to the US. If they already have a suspect number, they can camp out on these international links and KNOW if calls are made into the US.. Even for the hard traffic routes like Canada and Mexico, we must have reciprocal agreements with THEIR intelligience offices to alert on traffic between countries..

So that is just a bad excuse for a fishing expedition..

Now DAVEMAN gets us a little closer to the truth...

Really? Do you think that all foreign terrorists in the US planning an attack never talk to each other?

No.. Probably not the smart dangerous ones.. They use couriers or pigeons thru the network of natural support hidden in radical Mosques and front organizations. HOWEVER -- you got real close to a REAL justification for that massive complex in Utah..

Even if you turn up a new pigeon or courier, you could get a standard warrant to pursue them without limitations.

HOWEVER --- If you MINE that 150 million identity data base for PATTERNS of ASSOCIATION, you can then find those networks of associates INDEPENDENT of an actual suspect foreign number.

And that is FAR more likely use for the sophisticated methods that NSA can deliver. Dianne Feinstein and all the apologists for this may be too stupid to understand the nuances. OR they are fine with this kind of "fishing"..

The lying and excuses don't pass minimum standards for logic and reason..

Indeed.

I don't mind tracking calls when one of the numbers is overseas to a terrorist-haven nation. I don't mind tracking domestic calls when one of the numbers is from a known terrorist.

What I DO mind is tracking ALL the calls and looking for those associations -- and then keeping all the metadata from Joe Regular Guy who goes bowling on Wednesdays and to church on Sunday.

Start with known numbers and go from there. Leave my number out of it unless I call a known terrorist.

 

[flacaltenn]

How many were stopped by intercepting domestic to foreign calls...the original intention of the Patriot Act...and how many were stopped by the practice of spying on 315 million Americans?

I suspect ALL were stopped by intercepting FOREIGN calls...meaning it's total BS as it relates to the practice of spying on all Americans.

I'm with ya on this.. There's a logic and reason problem to their "need" to query 140 Million phone records..

If the object is to match a "known terrorist" with calls and rings of associations made solely of US persons ----- Why the heck don't they KNOW the numbers dialed from the suspect foreign phone?? I know for a FACT --- that NSA has a virtual LOCK on the satellite and underwater cables bringing calls to the US. If they already have a suspect number, they can camp out on these international links and KNOW if calls are made into the US.. Even for the hard traffic routes like Canada and Mexico, we must have reciprocal agreements with THEIR intelligience offices to alert on traffic between countries..

So that is just a bad excuse for a fishing expedition..

Now DAVEMAN gets us a little closer to the truth...

Really? Do you think that all foreign terrorists in the US planning an attack never talk to each other?

No.. Probably not the smart dangerous ones.. They use couriers or pigeons thru the network of natural support hidden in radical Mosques and front organizations. HOWEVER -- you got real close to a REAL justification for that massive complex in Utah..

Even if you turn up a new pigeon or courier, you could get a standard warrant to pursue them without limitations.

HOWEVER --- If you MINE that 150 million identity data base for PATTERNS of ASSOCIATION, you can then find those networks of associates INDEPENDENT of an actual suspect foreign number.

And that is FAR more likely use for the sophisticated methods that NSA can deliver. Dianne Feinstein and all the apologists for this may be too stupid to understand the nuances. OR they are fine with this kind of "fishing"..

The lying and excuses don't pass minimum standards for logic and reason..

Indeed.

I don't mind tracking calls when one of the numbers is overseas to a terrorist-haven nation. I don't mind tracking domestic calls when one of the numbers is from a known terrorist.

What I DO mind is tracking ALL the calls and looking for those associations -- and then keeping all the metadata from Joe Regular Guy who goes bowling on Wednesdays and to church on Sunday.

Start with known numbers and go from there. Leave my number out of it unless I call a known terrorist.

Or a known terrorist dials you by mistake !!

Which BTW is an easy way to defeat all this.. All a major terrorist org would have to do to bring the US to civil insurrection, would be to buy 1000 disposable cell phones and start making calls to random numbers inside the USA.. And toss in a couple CongressCritters for good measure..

 

[daveman]

Or a known terrorist dials you by mistake !!

Which BTW is an easy way to defeat all this.. All a major terrorist org would have to do to bring the US to civil insurrection, would be to buy 1000 disposable cell phones and start making calls to random numbers inside the USA.. And toss in a couple CongressCritters for good measure..

That'd give Obama a good justification for declaring martial law, wouldn't it? Massive numbers of "terrorists" in the population, as well as some Congressmen.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Seems like the NSA phone surveillance program has already paid off, at least in one case where it could have really affected us where Khalid Ouazzani for allegedly plotting with Yemeni co-conspirators to blow up the New York Stock Exchange.

Such a case makes the surveillance worth the effort.

National Security Agency Director Keith Alexander testified Tuesday before the House Intelligence Committee that phone and Internet surveillance programs made public by former defense contractor Edward Snowden prevented approximately 50 terrorist plots since 2001, 10 of which targeted the U.S., and said new policies are being crafted to prevent another large-scale leak.

Alexander disclosed that approximately 1,000 people are currently employed as NSA systems administrators – the position Snowden held – and that the agency is "working to come up with a two-person rule" to prevent people "from taking information out of our system." Snowden was a contractor assigned to the NSA by Booz Allen Hamilton before he downloaded and released information on the top-secret programs.

The intelligence agency leader didn't go into detail about what precisely the new "two person" rule would entail. "When one of those persons misuses their authority, that is a huge problem," Alexander said.

The government officials present at Tuesday's hearing publicly disclosed two cases they said were cracked with the broad communications surveillance: One in 2010, in which investigators nabbed Khalid Ouazzani for allegedly plotting with Yemeni co-conspirators to blow up the New York Stock Exchange and another in which a man was arrested for providing "financial support" to an extremist group in Somalia.

Rep. Mac Thornberry, R-Texas, questioned FBI Deputy Director Sean Joyce at the hearing, inquiring if the NYSE plotters were serious or if the plans were "something they kind of dreamed about talking among their buddies." Joyce said the conviction of plotters showed it was a serious plan.

NSA Director: Surveillance Stopped 50 Terror Plots - US News and World Report


More.......

Gov't claims spying programs stopped plot to bomb New York Stock Exchange - Jun. 18, 2013

Seems like you will believe anything the government tells you.

Not really, but it seems you believe everything Glenn Beck tells you.

Did the government tell you I listen to Beck, or was it the voices in your head?

One question, can you point out when Khalid Ouazzani was charged with plotting to blow up the Exchange? I am just asking because everyone, including the FBI agents that investigated him, are saying he never plotted to blow it up.

 

[tubig]

truth be told some of those terrorist were created by our very own government. You can't have all these tracking programs without an enemy

The modern superpower creates its own enemies on demand. We saw during the aftermath of the Cuban Crisis fifty years ago that the Pentagon is willing lie, attack America and kill Americans to create the political motive to go to war. Do people here actually think America has become morally better since then? I certainly do not think so.

 

[blackhawk]

I guess the million dollar question is do you believe the government version of this story? They may very well be telling the truth but when you lie as often as they it's next to impossible to accept anything they say at face value.

 

[Mertex]

Well, it certainly is refreshing to see so many conservatives on the same side as the ACLU, one of the most left-wing organizations which most right-wingers hate. The ACLU has filed a suit against the NSA, and the right is agreeing with them.

I wonder what will happen.


In an unusual move, the ACLU is suing on behalf of itself as customers of Verizon, arguing that the program " infringes upon the ACLU's First Amendment rights, including the twin liberties of free expression and free association," according to a statement on the website. The suit also argues that the program constitutes a violation of the Fourth Amendment's protection against unreasonable search and seizure, as well as Section 215 of the Patriot Act:


ACLU Sues Over NSA Phone Surveillance

 

[numan]

truth be told some of those terrorist were created by our very own government. You can't have all these tracking programs without an enemy

The modern superpower creates its own enemies on demand. We saw during the aftermath of the Cuban Crisis fifty years ago that the Pentagon is willing lie, attack America and kill Americans to create the political motive to go to war. Do people here actually think America has become morally better since then? I certainly do not think so.

Congratulations on being able to see the obvious.

The lying was even more obvious in starting the Vietnam War and the Iraq War.

If there were not so many dopey, gullible Americans -- if there were more Americans like you -- the USA would be a great country, instead of the out-of-control mental asylum it presently is.
.