Naomi Wolf: Mandatory Vaccine Passport Could Lead To The End Of Human Liberty In The West

[DrLove]

Those enlarged heart issues with kids are rarer than hen’s teeth. There have actually been fewer issues with this vaccine than some of the ones that have been around for decades.

That’s weird with your pharmacies. The major national chains like CVS, Walmart, Walgreens, etc say they are available in every store.

They are in some, but not most. They stated they can't get them yet.

The reports out of Israel that I listened to described the heart issues as surging, meaning a hell of a lot more than before the vaccine. Those huge increases are only for the kids and young adults who had the vaccine.

Those are different vaccines - Primarily AstroZenica
Pfizer and Moderna have a pretty amazing record to date!

 

[beautress]

This CNN "expert guest" suggests that with vaccine passports you will gain freedom! You will gain mobility! Nice rhetoric. No problems as long as you have papers! But you shouldn't need an ID to vote.

Covid vaccine passport: Biden administration working to develop a system for people to prove they've been vaccinated - CNNPolitics

The Biden administration previously said the federal government should not be involved in efforts to create a vaccine passport system to verify that people have been vaccinated.

Gee, what changed? You know that Biden is a career politician and in it for personal gain, so I'm sure that if you were able to follow the money on this one, you would know.

The Post, citing five officials who spoke on the condition of anonymity, reported the effort "has been driven largely by arms of the Department of Health and Human Services, including an office devoted to health information technology."

White House coronavirus coordinator Jeff Zients has led the White House's role in coordinating the project, an official told the Post."Our role is to help ensure that any solutions in this area should be simple, free, open source, accessible to people both digitally and on paper, and designed from the start to protect people's privacy," Zients said earlier this month, according to the newspaper.

There you have it, some political science major will determine what kind of papers you have to have to travel and congregate freely in this country. Probably also need them to get certain jobs.

So all this for a vaccine that might be 80% effective against a virus that has a 99% survival rate.

This CNN "expert guest" suggests that with vaccine passports you will gain freedom! You will gain mobility! Nice rhetoric. No problems as long as you have papers! But you shouldn't need an ID to vote.

Covid vaccine passport: Biden administration working to develop a system for people to prove they've been vaccinated - CNNPolitics

The Biden administration previously said the federal government should not be involved in efforts to create a vaccine passport system to verify that people have been vaccinated.

Gee, what changed? You know that Biden is a career politician and in it for personal gain, so I'm sure that if you were able to follow the money on this one, you would know.

The Post, citing five officials who spoke on the condition of anonymity, reported the effort "has been driven largely by arms of the Department of Health and Human Services, including an office devoted to health information technology."

White House coronavirus coordinator Jeff Zients has led the White House's role in coordinating the project, an official told the Post."Our role is to help ensure that any solutions in this area should be simple, free, open source, accessible to people both digitally and on paper, and designed from the start to protect people's privacy," Zients said earlier this month, according to the newspaper.

There you have it, some political science major will determine what kind of papers you have to have to travel and congregate freely in this country. Probably also need them to get certain jobs.

So all this for a vaccine that might be 80% effective against a virus that has a 99% survival rate.

Some people are allergic to vacines. I don't believe that should result in having a passport revoked nor the person with a history of severe and life-threatening problems with flu, pneumonia, co id, et al "preventive" vaccines.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Those are different vaccines - Primarily AstroZenica
Pfizer and Moderna have a pretty amazing record to date!

Yes, for now. But remember we are less than 6 months into vaccinating Americans. Even the CDC is looking into those heart issue numbers in the US. If I were young and healthy, I wouldn't even consider getting this vaccine. If I had children under the age of 18, I would not allow them to get it.

 

[DrLove]

Those are different vaccines - Primarily AstroZenica
Pfizer and Moderna have a pretty amazing record to date!

Yes, for now. But remember we are less than 6 months into vaccinating Americans. Even the CDC is looking into those heart issue numbers in the US. If I were young and healthy, I wouldn't even consider getting this vaccine. If I had children under the age of 18, I would not allow them to get it.

I’d totally vax a 12-16 y/o that was living with me & back in school this fall.
Gotta play the odds!

 

[justoffal]

Does the Cleveland clinic have a mask policy and do the doctors support the vaccine? Just curious

Yes. In fact went to see my doctor just yesterday. They have somebody standing at the entrances and asking those same stupid questions they always ask. You can't get into the place vaccinated or not. Everybody must wear a mask. The nurse that seen me had a mask on, and so did my doctor. I know they must be fully vaccinated.

My sister works at the main campus downtown. Although she's been doing a lot of work from home, she still has to go to her officer for various duties she needs to take care of. She's been fully vaccinated for a few months now, and still has to wear a mask when at work.

Does the Cleveland clinic have a mask policy and do the doctors support the vaccine? Just curious

Yes. In fact went to see my doctor just yesterday. They have somebody standing at the entrances and asking those same stupid questions they always ask. You can't get into the place vaccinated or not. Everybody must wear a mask. The nurse that seen me had a mask on, and so did my doctor. I know they must be fully vaccinated.

My sister works at the main campus downtown. Although she's been doing a lot of work from home, she still has to go to her officer for various duties she needs to take care of. She's been fully vaccinated for a few months now, and still has to wear a mask when at work.

And despite all that from a place it sounds like you trust are you still a skeptic about masks and the vaccine?

Why have the all causes death numbers not moved either nationally or globally?

Why has the national level of intelligence and education dropped to the point that so many can't even understand basic science? How far we've fallen from the days of JFK... thanks to the anti-intellectual anti-democratic anti-freedom GOP.

So ya got nuthin'.....figures. Why is that? That is because I am dealing with real statistics and you are dealing with your " widdo feewins "....... you may answer the question whenever you feel up to it or continue to hide behind the wall of ridicule that insulates you from reality.'

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

I’d totally vax a 12-16 y/o that was living with me & back in school this fall.
Gotta play the odds!

The odds of a 12 to 16 year old getting this thing is very slim. Pumping them up with experimental vaccines when they likely will never get it is not responsible in my opinion. If this vaccine went under the same scrutiny most every other medication does, I would otherwise agree with you.

I'm taking it, but I'm 61 years old. Anything happens to me, I've lived my life. Unlike children, if I get this virus, it could kill me. If a kid does get it, they will recover just fine like any other medical problem everybody experiences in life.

 

[Chillicothe]

".......like putting up a chain link fence to stop the water from your garden hose spraying on your neighbors property."

Well, that settles it.
All those doctors, nurses, staffers in hospitals have been wasting time, money, resources by masking up since, well, since when? 1901?
How foolish.
Some might say.
Not me, though.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"Even the CDC is looking into those heart issue numbers in the US."

"Even"?
"Even"?
That sounds like a concession, or an admission.

Instead, I would suggest "Of course, the CDC is looking into those heart issues."

 

[krichton]

I’m not quite ready to infer big pharma corruption in cahoots with politcos Ray. So far they’ve been pretty cool on gouging, but it’s something to keep an eye on.

But hey, as to lasting forever? Your lips to God’s ear, but I’m a sceptic at this point due to variants & such.

Get that first shot yet? Hell, most places it’s easy now & no appointment required!

Well if it was so readily available, most pharmacies would offer it. At least over here, very few do. My local hospital had the vaccine program for two weeks. I got my first shot on the last day. They will restart vaccinations for the second shot, but I really don't know if they will be offering the first shot to other people. My second vaccination is scheduled for June 23rd.

I do think politics is behind this already. In Israel, they are finding that giving these vaccines to people between the ages of 16 and 24 have created this surge of serious heart problems; something not normal in young healthy kids and young adults. Of course Democrats are aware of that here, but are ignoring the data and even pushing this vaccine to children in their single digit years, even though they are the least likely to catch Covid, and even less likely to spread it or die from it.

The idea is to keep the hysteria going. In fact it's starting earlier than I thought.

Vaccinated patient tests positive for delta variant

HONOLULU, Hawaii (AP) — Hawaii says a vaccinated Oahu resident who traveled to Nevada last month has tested positive for the delta variant of COVID-19. The delta variant was first detected in…

fox8.com

There is no surge, except in the minds of hysterical anti vaxxers. 275 ppl had mild heart inflammation among 5 million vaccinated in Israel and all recovered quickly. That's .000055% of ppl who were affected. You ppl crack me up

The heart issue should be investigated thoroughly, but let's not make this into something it's not. Stop the fear mongering.

 

[Slade3200]

And despite all that from a place it sounds like you trust are you still a skeptic about masks and the vaccine?

Of course I am. I've watched interviews with virologists that stated wearing a mask to stop this virus is like putting up a chain link fence to stop the water from your garden hose spraying on your neighbors property. Even at the onset of this thing, the CDC and Fauci recommended people not wear a mask. As I just pointed out in my last post, I do have reservations about the vaccines as well.

Why do you think your trusted hospital is requiring masks if they are totally useless? Why are you believing people you see on the TV and internet over what the pros do at the institution you trust with your medical needs?

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Why do you think your trusted hospital is requiring masks if they are totally useless? Why are you believing people you see on the TV and internet over what the pros do at the institution you trust with your medical needs?

Because the mask was the only defense before vaccines came out and people started to get vaccinated. Some said it would help while others didn't. To be honest, I don't know if they help or not. So I just do as my providers recommend.

Other factors are that the vaccines we use are only 95% effective. Some people can be fully vaccinated and still catch and spread Covid. There are plenty of cases where fully vaccinated people did catch it. If 100,000 people are fully vaccinated, then that means on average, 5000 people can still get it. However from what I read, the vaccines are out performing their expectations.

Another factor is we have an open borders President and federal government. These untested people are pouring into our country at a rate that some estimate will give us over 2 million more illegals by the end of the year, and Dementia is putting these untested vagrants on buses and shipping them all over the country coast to coast. The people who are tested and show positive for Covid can't be stopped. If they want to enter the country anyway, they can.

Dozens of newly released migrants test positive for virus; ‘Hundreds’ of border agents are South Texas-bound

McALLEN, Texas (Border Report) — A confluence of immigration-related events are creating a surge of asylum-seekers in South Texas during this dangerous COVID-19 pandemic, and a South Texas la…

www.borderreport.com

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

There is no surge, except in the minds of hysterical anti vaxxers. 275 ppl had mild heart inflammation among 5 million vaccinated in Israel and all recovered quickly. That's .000055% of ppl who were affected. You ppl crack me up

The heart issue should be investigated thoroughly, but let's not make this into something it's not. Stop the fear mongering.

No fear mongering at all. Only pointing to the fact that these vaccines are not totally tested on everybody in every situation. We still don't know what effect it may have on newborns after the mother takes it. We don't have any studies on long-term effects since they've only been out a year since the research to manufacture them began. We simply don't know. The heart problem could be one of many problems we experience down the road.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Well, that settles it.
All those doctors, nurses, staffers in hospitals have been wasting time, money, resources by masking up since, well, since when? 1901?
How foolish.
Some might say.
Not me, though.

Doctors and nurses mask up to protect the patient from any germs they may have. They don't mask up to protect themselves from the patient.

 

[Slade3200]

Why do you think your trusted hospital is requiring masks if they are totally useless? Why are you believing people you see on the TV and internet over what the pros do at the institution you trust with your medical needs?

Because the mask was the only defense before vaccines came out and people started to get vaccinated. Some said it would help while others didn't. To be honest, I don't know if they help or not. So I just do as my providers recommend.

Other factors are that the vaccines we use are only 95% effective. Some people can be fully vaccinated and still catch and spread Covid. There are plenty of cases where fully vaccinated people did catch it. If 100,000 people are fully vaccinated, then that means on average, 5000 people can still get it. However from what I read, the vaccines are out performing their expectations.

Another factor is we have an open borders President and federal government. These untested people are pouring into our country at a rate that some estimate will give us over 2 million more illegals by the end of the year, and Dementia is putting these untested vagrants on buses and shipping them all over the country coast to coast. The people who are tested and show positive for Covid can't be stopped. If they want to enter the country anyway, they can.

Dozens of newly released migrants test positive for virus; ‘Hundreds’ of border agents are South Texas-bound

McALLEN, Texas (Border Report) — A confluence of immigration-related events are creating a surge of asylum-seekers in South Texas during this dangerous COVID-19 pandemic, and a South Texas la…

www.borderreport.com

It sounds like you’ve got conflicting political and medical arguments. You say you go with what your medical advisors recommend which is masks and vaccines. You say that before the vaccine the only protection was masks meaning they were a form of defense…. Then you present analogies comparing a mask to a chain link Fence and a garden hose. You see how those don’t line up right?

Sounds like you think the vaccines are effective and useful. Is that right or are you buying into all the anti-vax talk?

the immigration point you made has nothing to do with the effectiveness of masks and vaccines. That was a purely political argument.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

It sounds like you’ve got conflicting political and medical arguments. You say you go with what your medical advisors recommend which is masks and vaccines. You say that before the vaccine the only protection was masks meaning they were a form of defense…. Then you present analogies comparing a mask to a chain link Fence and a garden hose. You see how those don’t line up right?

Sounds like you think the vaccines are effective and useful. Is that right or are you buying into all the anti-vax talk?

the immigration point you made has nothing to do with the effectiveness of masks and vaccines. That was a purely political argument.

Everything in our country is political, or haven't you figured that out yet? The mask and fence analogy was not mine. I was reiterating a point several expert virologists made.

I believe the vaccines are useful for most people, but not all. The point about the immigration disaster that Dementia created is that vaccinated people who can still catch this have a much better chance of doing so now that this mental patient is allowing all these untested people into our country and busing them from coast to coast by the tens of thousands every month. It's like being in a boat that's sinking, and while you instruct some riders to bail out the water, you are drilling another hole in the boat.

As usual with the left, you are asking all Americans to make sacrifices to eradicate this problem while your President is doing everything he can to make it continue by rolling out the red carpet to people who are breaking our laws by coming here and extending the problem. Screw our American people, it's power the left craves which is why they are so gun-ho about those people coming here in the first place. If a few thousand Americans die, so what?

 

[woodwork201]

What is this "Human Liberty In The West" of which you speak? Nothing but a myth. I refer you to the North Korean Defector thread as evidence that liberty in the US is long past and is nothing more than a memory or a myth.

North Korean defector realizes that American leftists are "nuts"

Now the left will have to cancel her. North Korean defector says 'even North Korea was not this nuts' after attending Ivy League school https://www.foxnews.com/us/north-korean-defector-ivy-league-nuts

www.usmessageboard.com

The only difference is that, mostly, we aren't yet killing enemies of the state and the food is still better here - for now.

 

[woodwork201]

There you have it, some political science major will determine what kind of papers you have to have to travel and congregate freely in this country.

More like a race theory major. I’m sure they will calculate race into it somehow, since of course they claim “minorities” are more affected by the WuFlu. Plus blacks are refusing to get the shot at a much higher rate than whites:

The Reason Black Americans Are Getting Vaccinated At A Much Slower Rate Is Not Because They’re Reluctant

The early data we have on vaccination rates is incomplete, but one fact is particularly alarming: Black Americans are getting vaccinated at a much slower rate t…

fivethirtyeight.com

So the will no doubt factor that in. Blacks will be exempt from needing the shot, but everyone else will be required. Kind of like voter ID.

ID is required to get the shot and we all know that black people are not capable of getting ID.

 

[woodwork201]

"Even the CDC is looking into those heart issue numbers in the US."

"Even"?
"Even"?
That sounds like a concession, or an admission.

Instead, I would suggest "Of course, the CDC is looking into those heart issues."

The CDC has a pre-determined, pre-planned outcome that the heart issues are not a problem. If it were otherwise, if they thought it might be a problem they'd stop trying to convince healthy young men to take the virus until more tests had been done.

They may find that they can't avoid the science and have to concede that it's too dangerous for young men, considering the very low risk/danger from Covid, and may have to retract their recommendation but that they're going down the road of killing young men proves that they're planning on finding nothing at all. Going into a study with a plan to find nothing at all is not a study at all.

 

[Slade3200]

It sounds like you’ve got conflicting political and medical arguments. You say you go with what your medical advisors recommend which is masks and vaccines. You say that before the vaccine the only protection was masks meaning they were a form of defense…. Then you present analogies comparing a mask to a chain link Fence and a garden hose. You see how those don’t line up right?

Sounds like you think the vaccines are effective and useful. Is that right or are you buying into all the anti-vax talk?

the immigration point you made has nothing to do with the effectiveness of masks and vaccines. That was a purely political argument.

Everything in our country is political, or haven't you figured that out yet? The mask and fence analogy was not mine. I was reiterating a point several expert virologists made.

I believe the vaccines are useful for most people, but not all. The point about the immigration disaster that Dementia created is that vaccinated people who can still catch this have a much better chance of doing so now that this mental patient is allowing all these untested people into our country and busing them from coast to coast by the tens of thousands every month. It's like being in a boat that's sinking, and while you instruct some riders to bail out the water, you are drilling another hole in the boat.

As usual with the left, you are asking all Americans to make sacrifices to eradicate this problem while your President is doing everything he can to make it continue by rolling out the red carpet to people who are breaking our laws by coming here and extending the problem. Screw our American people, it's power the left craves which is why they are so gun-ho about those people coming here in the first place. If a few thousand Americans die, so what?

Again you are playing politics. And your politics lead you to conflicting arguments. I think you see that

 

[Chillicothe]

"they're going down the road of killing young men proves that they're planning on finding nothing at all."

OK, gotcha. We understand your point.

Though, to be honest, your point ain't very traction-ful. IMHO

The CDC doing a test with the intention to dismiss their findings from it, all with the cost of killing young American men?

I wanna be a pinch snarky on that, however, it is early on a beautiful June morning and I've got soybeans to spray. And am in a smiley generous mood.

So, let's just agree ---if we can ---- that dangerous variants to Covid lurk. E.g., 'Delta' ..ala' India.

What we think we know about these kinds of SARS-type infections is that they mutate relatively rapidly......as this one has. Meaning, the disease has 'learned' how to be better at it's 'work'....since we first officially experienced in America in early 2020.

There is an army of medical professionals researching, testing, re-testing, observing this event. To dismiss their testing as intentionally futile or intentionally obfuscating is......well, it is in error.

IMHO

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Again you are playing politics. And your politics lead you to conflicting arguments. I think you see that

Nothing conflicting about it.

How can we stop Covid in the US? People taking precautions and getting vaccinated if they never had Covid before.

When will this crisis end? When we have very low new Covid cases reported.

How do we reduce the number of vaccinated people from getting Covid anyway? By having less people in our population that have Covid in which to give it to them.

So if Americans are being vaccinated, taking precautions, what could go wrong? Allowing people to come here by the millions with Covid retarding our chance at herd immunity.