My thoughts on transgenderism, gender fluidity. See what you think.

[scruffy]

Science:

Neural Systems for Own-body Processing Align with Gender Identity Rather Than Birth-assigned Sex

Gender identity is a core aspect of self-identity and is usually congruent with birth-assigned sex and own body sex-perception. The neuronal circuits underlying gender identity are unknown, but greater awareness of transgenderism has sparked interest ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Brain network interactions in transgender individuals with gender incongruence

Functional brain organization in transgender persons remains unclear. Our aims were to investigate global and regional connectivity differences within…

www.sciencedirect.com

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/ejn.14420

==>

https://www.jneurosci.org/content/jneuro/21/12/RC150.full.pdf

----

Effective connectivity of the amygdala during the consumption of erotic, sexual humor, and monetary rewards with a DCM-PEB approach

While a large body of research exists on the processing of monetary rewards, less is known about sexual reward processing. This study aimed to identify effective connectivity for the consumption of sexual (erotic and sexual humor) and non-sexual (monetary) rewards, using dynamic causal modeling...

journals.plos.org

https://www.eneuro.org/content/eneuro/8/6/ENEURO.0226-21.2021.full.pdf

 

[westwall]

For the TLDR crowd, not asking you to read the entire thing, just take a point, or two, if that's all you want. No problem.

I realize modern psychology has shifted its view to accept that if someone believes one is of the opposite gender, then that person is that gender, and now the term 'gender' and 'sex', are not necessarily the same thing. However, I disagree, and for millenia this was not the case. In terms of history, this is a recent development. Now, many recent developments are now fact. but psychology is a soft science, it's not like physics when results are either there, or they are not, and physicists an reproduce the results you claim on a published paper. There is considerable more subjectivity in psychology, than the hard sciences.

Psychology is sometimes considered a soft science, but this can be a matter of debate and interpretation.

The term "soft science" is often used to refer to fields of study that rely heavily on subjective interpretation and do not typically involve precise quantitative measurement. Fields like sociology, anthropology, and psychology are sometimes considered soft sciences because they rely on observations, case studies, and interviews to gather data and often deal with complex, difficult-to-measure variables such as emotions, beliefs, and attitudes.

However, it's important to note that psychology is a broad field that encompasses many different subfields, some of which involve more precise, quantitative measurements. For example, cognitive psychology and neuropsychology use neuroimaging techniques to measure brain activity, and experimental psychology uses carefully controlled experiments to test hypotheses and measure outcomes.

In addition, psychology has made significant contributions to other fields, such as medicine, education, and business, which suggests that it is a rigorous and valuable scientific discipline.

Overall, while some aspects of psychology may involve subjective interpretation, the field as a whole is a complex and multifaceted science that incorporates both qualitative and quantitative methods. So, my point is, psychology is a kind of hybrid science, part subjective, part objective. It is on the subject of gender fluidity, in my personal opinion, there is considerable subjectivity going on. I personally don't like the word 'woke' it's a weasel word, so it won't be used here.

I am critical with my liberal brethren in some key respects on this subject, and in agreement on others.

Now then, on 'pronouns' let's get that out of the way, first.

If I use a pronoun referring to an effeminate male, and I happen to be aware that that person transfemale who dresses as a female, wears make up, etc, I would assume that that persons prefers the feminine pronoun and I have no issue obliging them on that point. I do it because it's not that big of a deal with me, and I don't want to fight, if I can avoid it. But, that I would do that is out of courtesy, not obligation.

However, if that same effeminate male approached me as asked me my opinion as to that person's sex, I would answer as follows:

I am one who believes gender and sex are the same thing, as this was the norm for millenia and I see no reason to believe otherwise. Does that answer your question? My point is, if you don't want an honest answer to the question, don't ask it. Some might agree with your point of view, some might not, be prepared for it and respect their sensitivities, and we will respect yours, where we can. On that point, my position is as follows:

1. I do understand there is a real phenomenon called 'transgender/gender fluidity' and it shouldn't be trivialized or ridiculed or shamed.

2. On the matter of children, It is my view that adults, given that children have vivid imaginations, tend to be influenced by adults and what is on television, subject to peer pressure, get ideas with which they easily change their mind, or lose interest, as time passes, that they often pursue fads and things trendy, that we, as adults, should try and convince a child, who might be gender confused, given that it might be merely an outside influence, a temporal thing, we should try first to have the child acknowledge their biological sex is their true sex, and if they (boys) exhibit effeminate characteristics, explain to the child that it is perfectly okay for a boy to be effeminate, perfectly okay for a girl to be masculine (as in a 'tomboy'), that these conditions often fade as they grow up, and that I believe, sincerely, it is actually better for one's mental and spiritual health to be honest and acknowledge what one truly is, and that, for children, over time, their truer selves emerge from the fog of life's barrage of confusing influences.

After the age of 18, if they still are determined to be transgender, that is their right and we should respect it. If I were to counsel a young man, or young woman, I would still act in accordance to the above, given the chance they are still young, and still might change. I tell a young man or woman, it's perfectly okay to be gay, and watch out for the tendency some gay boys and girls to envy being straight, the solution of which would be to change one sex. In my view, envy would be the wrong reason to change one's sex. But doing that, is a radical change for one's biology, and can lead to serious health consequences. Proceed with the utmost caution.

But, for children, I adamantly don't believe in sex change surgery, puberty blockers, for children, no matter how apparently 'urgent a child may make it seem . As I understand it, there is no surgery going on? (is there? I hope not), but some kids are given puberty blockers, and I think this is wrong (but I'm not an expert, or a Doctor, so it comes with a caveat).

Children are children, they have powerful and fanciful imaginations (I remember vividly my own childhood--I remember in the 6th grade, I envied left handed kids. I thought being left-handed was 'cool', and since I was practically ambidextrous, it was easy for me to pretend being left handed. After awhile, the fad faded and I returned to being my normal self, predominantly right handed) and much is urgent in the life of a child. To make such an assumption for a child, leading to life altering drugs and surgery, in my view, is a mistake, and could be a tragic one, if harm comes to the child, that the child changes his/her mind, later on.

3. I believe transgenders, gays, lesbians, etc., should be treated with respect and they should not be discriminated against and have all the rights that all citizens possess and that anti discrimination laws pertain to them, as they do to race, creed, etc.

4. I am more than happy to treat a transgender with their preferred pronouns, and treat them as their gender to which they identify. However, there are limits, and those are commented on, herein.

5. I simply do not accept the concept of 'non binary'. To me, these persons are androgenous/A-sexual. Unless you are born in with a rare case of being intersex, you are either or female. This idea of not indicating sex on birth certificates is insane. This was the conventional wisdom for such persons, when I grew up and over decades. I will use he or she or him or her as they prefer, but NOT 'they'. No one has the right to change what centuries have decided meanings of words mean.True, meanings of words evolve, but it happens always organically, NEVER by 'decree'. However, if anyone obliges on that point, it is out of courtesy, not obligation. I choose not to, on the subject of A-sexual persons. Why? Because 'they/their/them' normally means plural. I understand that 'they' has been used, though rarely, when describing singular when the sex of the person being spoken of is not known, that is the only grammatical exception, i.e, 'Someone-they left their jacket on the park bench').

However, that being said.

1. I believe that heterosexuals have the right to date only other heterosexuals. If they date transgender, that is their willful choice, but for a heterosexual who claims he or is only willing to date, marry, fall in love with, only other heterosexuals that this does NOT constitute discrimination against transgendered persons. One cannot help who one is attracted to. I warn transfemales who might be considering surgery but only in order that they perceive they might be able to attract straight males. I say, hold on! While there might be some straight males who see you as a woman, myself, being a straight male, I must say, no, they will probably see you as a gay man, and you will have a tough time finding a straight man. In fact, transfemales would be much better off not getting surgery, and I strongly suspect there are far more gay men (for some I've talked to about it, anyway) that prefer well endowed transfemales, than there will be straight males who are so liberated they will accept you as they would any woman, and I advise them strongly not to go through it it. It would be an irreversible decision and I don't see how it could improve one's libido, it seems logical that it would kill it, but I just don't know. That's my position, anyway. If there is research on this, then point me to it.

2. I believe that heterosexuals (or anyone, for that matter) have the right to use whatever pronouns they prefer with regard to transexuals, non binary persons, and any heterosexual who uses a transgendered or non binary person's prefered pronoun is an act of courtesy but such cannot be forced or legislated.

3. Sports, this is a problem. I understand that women are complaining, and they have a valid point. I'm not a sports enthusiast so I will let the professionals duke it out on this subject. I'm with the ladies, though, that's my leaning, unless someone can convince me of otherwise.

4. Restrooms. No one with a penis should be allowed to use a woman's facility, and vice versa. End of argument. Post op, I haven't figured that one out. Help me out.

I invite challenges, comments, discussions, affirmations, etc., as long as it is civil. If it is otherwise, such comments will be ignored.

I'm not asking anyone to read this post in it's entirety, feel free to discuss portions, those which you care to address, or add to the discussion.

Well thought out. I agree with most of it.

I despise the concept of pronouns. If you present as a woman I will refer to you as a woman. If you present as a man, likewise.

I will never use they, them, or whatever ridiculous terminology they wish. That is a mental illness and I won't humor them on that level.

 

[westwall]

We're Americans that should be treated like anyone else in our society and treated like we're human beings. We shouldn't have any less then anyone else.

No kidding. You don't. You ARE treated like everyone else.

 

[scruffy]

No kidding. You don't. You ARE treated like everyone else.

lol - trannies wouldn't be the first people where an oddly shaped body part made a difference in a relationship. 'Course it's hard to lift your head up out of the swamp when you're swimming in it.

 

[Rumpole]

Science:

Neural Systems for Own-body Processing Align with Gender Identity Rather Than Birth-assigned Sex

Gender identity is a core aspect of self-identity and is usually congruent with birth-assigned sex and own body sex-perception. The neuronal circuits underlying gender identity are unknown, but greater awareness of transgenderism has sparked interest ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Brain network interactions in transgender individuals with gender incongruence

Functional brain organization in transgender persons remains unclear. Our aims were to investigate global and regional connectivity differences within…

www.sciencedirect.com

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/ejn.14420

==>

https://www.jneurosci.org/content/jneuro/21/12/RC150.full.pdf

----

Effective connectivity of the amygdala during the consumption of erotic, sexual humor, and monetary rewards with a DCM-PEB approach

While a large body of research exists on the processing of monetary rewards, less is known about sexual reward processing. This study aimed to identify effective connectivity for the consumption of sexual (erotic and sexual humor) and non-sexual (monetary) rewards, using dynamic causal modeling...

journals.plos.org

https://www.eneuro.org/content/eneuro/8/6/ENEURO.0226-21.2021.full.pdf

There is a logical fallacy happening here. Neurological "Proof" that individuals have gender identity mistmaches just confirms empirical observation, it doesn't prove that 'gender doesn't equal sex', because they merely show an association between physiology and mental state. If 50 million people who were clearly Caucasian declared they 'identified as Chinese' and science found a neurological association, are we the to say these folks are really chinese? No, and to declare it as fact is to introduce chaos in society. And I therefore assert that this is more true with sex, than delusions of race. See anomalies in mentality can easily have an anomalous physical association, and are even likely to, just as depression can easily can indicate a chemical disturbance in the body, but that doesn't prove any claim that 'those identify as female who are born male are actually female' no more than to assert that 'those who identify as Chinese but who were born African are actually Chinese".

IN short, it is a logical fallacy promulgated by hard left cultural bias in the professional community which, naturally, has been adopted by the political left. As a liberal/libertarian (conservative on some issues) I reject this view on chaos grounds. Does this mean I am going to treat transgenders with disrespect, and discrimate against them? Hell no. That's not what I'm saying at all. I'm challenging a point of view, and that is all it is, a point of view.

The view that "gender doesn't equal sex" emerged in the mid-20th century as part of the development of modern psychology and it gained more widespread recognition and acceptance in the mid-to-late 20th century [though, from my personal vantage point, it has only become widely known in the social realm in the last 20 or so years), particularly in the fields of psychology and sociology. This view posits that while sex refers to biological differences between males and females, gender refers to the social and cultural roles, behaviors, and expectations associated with being male or female.

In the field of psychology, this view was championed by social learning theorists, who argued that gender roles were learned through socialization processes rather than being biologically determined. The concept of gender identity, which refers to an individual's internal sense of their gender, also emerged during this time and further contributed to the idea that gender was more complex than simply being determined by biology.

One of the key figures in the development of this view was psychologist and gender theorist, Sandra Bem. In the 1970s, Bem developed the Gender Schema Theory, which proposed that individuals develop gender schemas (i.e., cognitive frameworks) that guide their understanding of gender and gender roles. According to Bem, these schemas are learned through socialization processes and can influence behavior, thoughts, and emotions.

Another important contributor to the view that "gender doesn't equal sex" was the social constructionist perspective, which emerged in the 1980s. This perspective argued that gender is not an inherent or fixed trait, but rather a socially constructed concept that is shaped by cultural, historical, and political factors.

Neurological studies have found differences in brain structure and activity between males and females, as well as between individuals who identify as transgender or non-binary and those who identify as cisgender. However, these studies do not prove that gender doesn't equal sex. Instead, they suggest that biological factors may play a role in shaping gender identity and expression but are not the sole determinant.

It is important to note that while scientific research can provide insights into the biological and psychological factors that shape gender, cultural and social influences also play a significant role. Gender norms and expectations vary across cultures and change over time, and it is important to consider the cultural context in which gender is understood and experienced.

Most of the above is the politically correct centrist's view. Now for the not-so-politically correct view. If it's political, and it is political, then it is not NECESSARILY correct. To quote a famous song, 'It Ain't Necessarily So'.

 

[ReinyDays]

Are you claiming you are actually transsexual? Or are you just speaking metaphorically? Whichever is the case, that is fine, either way, I respect your choice.

However, if there are any specific points I raise in the OP with which you take issue, feel free to offer them.

Cheers,
Rumpole.

What do you mean by transsexual? ... I do make a size 12 dress look hot, I was prohibited from wearing my wife's clothes on that account ... women can't stand men who carry that feminine look better than they do ... keep in mind, I have long beautiful full-bodied silky-smooth hair down to my oh so pinchable butt ...

But no ... alas ... each and every one of my trillions upon trillions of cells have only 45 X-Chromosomes ...

I am a man,
but I can change,
if I want to,
I guess ...

 

[marvin martian]

For the TLDR crowd, not asking you to read the entire thing, just take a point, or two, if that's all you want. No problem.

I realize modern psychology has shifted its view to accept that if someone believes one is of the opposite gender, then that person is that gender, and now the term 'gender' and 'sex', are not necessarily the same thing. However, I disagree, and for millenia this was not the case. In terms of history, this is a recent development. Now, many recent developments are now fact. but psychology is a soft science, it's not like physics when results are either there, or they are not, and physicists an reproduce the results you claim on a published paper. There is considerable more subjectivity in psychology, than the hard sciences.

Psychology is sometimes considered a soft science, but this can be a matter of debate and interpretation.

The term "soft science" is often used to refer to fields of study that rely heavily on subjective interpretation and do not typically involve precise quantitative measurement. Fields like sociology, anthropology, and psychology are sometimes considered soft sciences because they rely on observations, case studies, and interviews to gather data and often deal with complex, difficult-to-measure variables such as emotions, beliefs, and attitudes.

However, it's important to note that psychology is a broad field that encompasses many different subfields, some of which involve more precise, quantitative measurements. For example, cognitive psychology and neuropsychology use neuroimaging techniques to measure brain activity, and experimental psychology uses carefully controlled experiments to test hypotheses and measure outcomes.

In addition, psychology has made significant contributions to other fields, such as medicine, education, and business, which suggests that it is a rigorous and valuable scientific discipline.

Overall, while some aspects of psychology may involve subjective interpretation, the field as a whole is a complex and multifaceted science that incorporates both qualitative and quantitative methods. So, my point is, psychology is a kind of hybrid science, part subjective, part objective. It is on the subject of gender fluidity, in my personal opinion, there is considerable subjectivity going on. I personally don't like the word 'woke' it's a weasel word, so it won't be used here.

I am critical with my liberal brethren in some key respects on this subject, and in agreement on others.

Now then, on 'pronouns' let's get that out of the way, first.

If I use a pronoun referring to an effeminate male, and I happen to be aware that that person transfemale who dresses as a female, wears make up, etc, I would assume that that persons prefers the feminine pronoun and I have no issue obliging them on that point. I do it because it's not that big of a deal with me, and I don't want to fight, if I can avoid it. But, that I would do that is out of courtesy, not obligation.

However, if that same effeminate male approached me as asked me my opinion as to that person's sex, I would answer as follows:

I am one who believes gender and sex are the same thing, as this was the norm for millenia and I see no reason to believe otherwise. Does that answer your question? My point is, if you don't want an honest answer to the question, don't ask it. Some might agree with your point of view, some might not, be prepared for it and respect their sensitivities, and we will respect yours, where we can. On that point, my position is as follows:

1. I do understand there is a real phenomenon called 'transgender/gender fluidity' and it shouldn't be trivialized or ridiculed or shamed.

2. On the matter of children, It is my view that adults, given that children have vivid imaginations, tend to be influenced by adults and what is on television, subject to peer pressure, get ideas with which they easily change their mind, or lose interest, as time passes, that they often pursue fads and things trendy, that we, as adults, should try and convince a child, who might be gender confused, given that it might be merely an outside influence, a temporal thing, we should try first to have the child acknowledge their biological sex is their true sex, and if they (boys) exhibit effeminate characteristics, explain to the child that it is perfectly okay for a boy to be effeminate, perfectly okay for a girl to be masculine (as in a 'tomboy'), that these conditions often fade as they grow up, and that I believe, sincerely, it is actually better for one's mental and spiritual health to be honest and acknowledge what one truly is, and that, for children, over time, their truer selves emerge from the fog of life's barrage of confusing influences.

After the age of 18, if they still are determined to be transgender, that is their right and we should respect it. If I were to counsel a young man, or young woman, I would still act in accordance to the above, given the chance they are still young, and still might change. I tell a young man or woman, it's perfectly okay to be gay, and watch out for the tendency some gay boys and girls to envy being straight, the solution of which would be to change one sex. In my view, envy would be the wrong reason to change one's sex. But doing that, is a radical change for one's biology, and can lead to serious health consequences. Proceed with the utmost caution.

But, for children, I adamantly don't believe in sex change surgery, puberty blockers, for children, no matter how apparently 'urgent a child may make it seem . As I understand it, there is no surgery going on? (is there? I hope not), but some kids are given puberty blockers, and I think this is wrong (but I'm not an expert, or a Doctor, so it comes with a caveat).

Children are children, they have powerful and fanciful imaginations (I remember vividly my own childhood--I remember in the 6th grade, I envied left handed kids. I thought being left-handed was 'cool', and since I was practically ambidextrous, it was easy for me to pretend being left handed. After awhile, the fad faded and I returned to being my normal self, predominantly right handed) and much is urgent in the life of a child. To make such an assumption for a child, leading to life altering drugs and surgery, in my view, is a mistake, and could be a tragic one, if harm comes to the child, that the child changes his/her mind, later on.

3. I believe transgenders, gays, lesbians, etc., should be treated with respect and they should not be discriminated against and have all the rights that all citizens possess and that anti discrimination laws pertain to them, as they do to race, creed, etc.

4. I am more than happy to treat a transgender with their preferred pronouns, and treat them as their gender to which they identify. However, there are limits, and those are commented on, herein.

5. I simply do not accept the concept of 'non binary'. To me, these persons are androgenous/A-sexual. Unless you are born in with a rare case of being intersex, you are either or female. This idea of not indicating sex on birth certificates is insane. This was the conventional wisdom for such persons, when I grew up and over decades. I will use he or she or him or her as they prefer, but NOT 'they'. No one has the right to change what centuries have decided meanings of words mean.True, meanings of words evolve, but it happens always organically, NEVER by 'decree'. However, if anyone obliges on that point, it is out of courtesy, not obligation. I choose not to, on the subject of A-sexual persons. Why? Because 'they/their/them' normally means plural. I understand that 'they' has been used, though rarely, when describing singular when the sex of the person being spoken of is not known, that is the only grammatical exception, i.e, 'Someone-they left their jacket on the park bench').

However, that being said.

1. I believe that heterosexuals have the right to date only other heterosexuals. If they date transgender, that is their willful choice, but for a heterosexual who claims he or is only willing to date, marry, fall in love with, only other heterosexuals that this does NOT constitute discrimination against transgendered persons. One cannot help who one is attracted to. I warn transfemales who might be considering surgery but only in order that they perceive they might be able to attract straight males. I say, hold on! While there might be some straight males who see you as a woman, myself, being a straight male, I must say, no, they will probably see you as a gay man, and you will have a tough time finding a straight man. In fact, transfemales would be much better off not getting surgery, and I strongly suspect there are far more gay men (for some I've talked to about it, anyway) that prefer well endowed transfemales, than there will be straight males who are so liberated they will accept you as they would any woman, and I advise them strongly not to go through it it. It would be an irreversible decision and I don't see how it could improve one's libido, it seems logical that it would kill it, but I just don't know. That's my position, anyway. If there is research on this, then point me to it.

2. I believe that heterosexuals (or anyone, for that matter) have the right to use whatever pronouns they prefer with regard to transexuals, non binary persons, and any heterosexual who uses a transgendered or non binary person's prefered pronoun is an act of courtesy but such cannot be forced or legislated.

3. Sports, this is a problem. I understand that women are complaining, and they have a valid point. I'm not a sports enthusiast so I will let the professionals duke it out on this subject. I'm with the ladies, though, that's my leaning, unless someone can convince me of otherwise.

4. Restrooms. No one with a penis should be allowed to use a woman's facility, and vice versa. End of argument. Post op, I haven't figured that one out. Help me out.

I invite challenges, comments, discussions, affirmations, etc., as long as it is civil. If it is otherwise, such comments will be ignored.

I'm not asking anyone to read this post in it's entirety, feel free to discuss portions, those which you care to address, or add to the discussion.

According to the DemoKKKrat party, you're a Nazi.

 

[Rumpole]

What do you mean by transsexual? ..

As I understand it, a transexual is an indvidual born of one sex, identifies with the opposite sex, and is taking physical and psychological measures to transition to the opposite sex, and eventually undergoing surgery to complete the transformation.

In my view, until the transformation is complete, I view such individuals as either 1. effeminate males (for transitioning males to female, but not fully realized ) and 2. masculine females (for transitioning females to male but not yet fully realized).

Now, for those who have no intention of surgical measures to complete the transition, those individuals I view as cross dressers or transvestites or masculine females who possess, (in my experience observing them), varying degrees of qualities, characteristics and mannerisms of the opposite sex.

. I do make a size 12 dress look hot, I was prohibited from wearing my wife's clothes on that account ... women can't stand men who carry that feminine look better than they do ... keep in mind, I have long beautiful full-bodied silky-smooth hair down to my oh so pinchable butt ...

If you have a penis and do not intend on a full and complete post op transformation, in my view, you are
perhaps a cross dresser/transvestite/effeminate male.

But no ... alas ... each and every one of my trillions upon trillions of cells have only 45 X-Chromosomes ...

I think, for classification sakes, the determinant factor is genitalia.
Do you have:
1. Male genitalia?
2. Female genitalia?
3. Both ( and male testicles could be internal).

I am a man,
but I can change,
if I want to,
I guess ...

I await your reply.

Caveat: the above is my sole opinion as a layperson, I am not a psychologist, psychiatrist, social counselor, or mental health or medical professional.

 

[Dadoalex]

I don't recall seeing any of that in his post.

look behind the excuses.

look for intent

 

[Bob Blaylock]

For the TLDR crowd, not asking you to read the entire thing, just take a point, or two, if that's all you want. No problem.

I realize modern psychology has shifted its view to accept that if someone believes one is of the opposite gender, then that person is that gender, and now the term 'gender' and 'sex', are not necessarily the same thing. However, I disagree, and for millenia this was not the case. In terms of history, this is a recent development. Now, many recent developments are now fact. but psychology is a soft science, it's not like physics when results are either there, or they are not, and physicists an reproduce the results you claim on a published paper. There is considerable more subjectivity in psychology, than the hard sciences.

Psychology is sometimes considered a soft science, but this can be a matter of debate and interpretation.

The term "soft science" is often used to refer to fields of study that rely heavily on subjective interpretation and do not typically involve precise quantitative measurement. Fields like sociology, anthropology, and psychology are sometimes considered soft sciences because they rely on observations, case studies, and interviews to gather data and often deal with complex, difficult-to-measure variables such as emotions, beliefs, and attitudes.

However, it's important to note that psychology is a broad field that encompasses many different subfields, some of which involve more precise, quantitative measurements. For example, cognitive psychology and neuropsychology use neuroimaging techniques to measure brain activity, and experimental psychology uses carefully controlled experiments to test hypotheses and measure outcomes.

In addition, psychology has made significant contributions to other fields, such as medicine, education, and business, which suggests that it is a rigorous and valuable scientific discipline.

Overall, while some aspects of psychology may involve subjective interpretation, the field as a whole is a complex and multifaceted science that incorporates both qualitative and quantitative methods. So, my point is, psychology is a kind of hybrid science, part subjective, part objective. It is on the subject of gender fluidity, in my personal opinion, there is considerable subjectivity going on. I personally don't like the word 'woke' it's a weasel word, so it won't be used here.

I am critical with my liberal brethren in some key respects on this subject, and in agreement on others.

Now then, on 'pronouns' let's get that out of the way, first.

If I use a pronoun referring to an effeminate male, and I happen to be aware that that person transfemale who dresses as a female, wears make up, etc, I would assume that that persons prefers the feminine pronoun and I have no issue obliging them on that point. I do it because it's not that big of a deal with me, and I don't want to fight, if I can avoid it. But, that I would do that is out of courtesy, not obligation.

However, if that same effeminate male approached me as asked me my opinion as to that person's sex, I would answer as follows:

I am one who believes gender and sex are the same thing, as this was the norm for millenia and I see no reason to believe otherwise. Does that answer your question? My point is, if you don't want an honest answer to the question, don't ask it. Some might agree with your point of view, some might not, be prepared for it and respect their sensitivities, and we will respect yours, where we can. On that point, my position is as follows:

1. I do understand there is a real phenomenon called 'transgender/gender fluidity' and it shouldn't be trivialized or ridiculed or shamed.

2. On the matter of children, It is my view that adults, given that children have vivid imaginations, tend to be influenced by adults and what is on television, subject to peer pressure, get ideas with which they easily change their mind, or lose interest, as time passes, that they often pursue fads and things trendy, that we, as adults, should try and convince a child, who might be gender confused, given that it might be merely an outside influence, a temporal thing, we should try first to have the child acknowledge their biological sex is their true sex, and if they (boys) exhibit effeminate characteristics, explain to the child that it is perfectly okay for a boy to be effeminate, perfectly okay for a girl to be masculine (as in a 'tomboy'), that these conditions often fade as they grow up, and that I believe, sincerely, it is actually better for one's mental and spiritual health to be honest and acknowledge what one truly is, and that, for children, over time, their truer selves emerge from the fog of life's barrage of confusing influences.

After the age of 18, if they still are determined to be transgender, that is their right and we should respect it. If I were to counsel a young man, or young woman, I would still act in accordance to the above, given the chance they are still young, and still might change. I tell a young man or woman, it's perfectly okay to be gay, and watch out for the tendency some gay boys and girls to envy being straight, the solution of which would be to change one sex. In my view, envy would be the wrong reason to change one's sex. But doing that, is a radical change for one's biology, and can lead to serious health consequences. Proceed with the utmost caution.

But, for children, I adamantly don't believe in sex change surgery, puberty blockers, for children, no matter how apparently 'urgent a child may make it seem . As I understand it, there is no surgery going on? (is there? I hope not), but some kids are given puberty blockers, and I think this is wrong (but I'm not an expert, or a Doctor, so it comes with a caveat).

Children are children, they have powerful and fanciful imaginations (I remember vividly my own childhood--I remember in the 6th grade, I envied left handed kids. I thought being left-handed was 'cool', and since I was practically ambidextrous, it was easy for me to pretend being left handed. After awhile, the fad faded and I returned to being my normal self, predominantly right handed) and much is urgent in the life of a child. To make such an assumption for a child, leading to life altering drugs and surgery, in my view, is a mistake, and could be a tragic one, if harm comes to the child, that the child changes his/her mind, later on.

3. I believe transgenders, gays, lesbians, etc., should be treated with respect and they should not be discriminated against and have all the rights that all citizens possess and that anti discrimination laws pertain to them, as they do to race, creed, etc.

4. I am more than happy to treat a transgender with their preferred pronouns, and treat them as their gender to which they identify. However, there are limits, and those are commented on, herein.

5. I simply do not accept the concept of 'non binary'. To me, these persons are androgenous/A-sexual. Unless you are born in with a rare case of being intersex, you are either or female. This idea of not indicating sex on birth certificates is insane. This was the conventional wisdom for such persons, when I grew up and over decades. I will use he or she or him or her as they prefer, but NOT 'they'. No one has the right to change what centuries have decided meanings of words mean.True, meanings of words evolve, but it happens always organically, NEVER by 'decree'. However, if anyone obliges on that point, it is out of courtesy, not obligation. I choose not to, on the subject of A-sexual persons. Why? Because 'they/their/them' normally means plural. I understand that 'they' has been used, though rarely, when describing singular when the sex of the person being spoken of is not known, that is the only grammatical exception, i.e, 'Someone-they left their jacket on the park bench').

However, that being said.

1. I believe that heterosexuals have the right to date only other heterosexuals. If they date transgender, that is their willful choice, but for a heterosexual who claims he or is only willing to date, marry, fall in love with, only other heterosexuals that this does NOT constitute discrimination against transgendered persons. One cannot help who one is attracted to. I warn transfemales who might be considering surgery but only in order that they perceive they might be able to attract straight males. I say, hold on! While there might be some straight males who see you as a woman, myself, being a straight male, I must say, no, they will probably see you as a gay man, and you will have a tough time finding a straight man. In fact, transfemales would be much better off not getting surgery, and I strongly suspect there are far more gay men (for some I've talked to about it, anyway) that prefer well endowed transfemales, than there will be straight males who are so liberated they will accept you as they would any woman, and I advise them strongly not to go through it it. It would be an irreversible decision and I don't see how it could improve one's libido, it seems logical that it would kill it, but I just don't know. That's my position, anyway. If there is research on this, then point me to it.

2. I believe that heterosexuals (or anyone, for that matter) have the right to use whatever pronouns they prefer with regard to transexuals [sic], non binary persons, and any heterosexual who uses a transgendered or non binary person's prefered [sic] pronoun is an act of courtesy but such cannot be forced or legislated.

3. Sports, this is a problem. I understand that women are complaining, and they have a valid point. I'm not a sports enthusiast so I will let the professionals duke it out on this subject. I'm with the ladies, though, that's my leaning, unless someone can convince me of otherwise.

4. Restrooms. No one with a penis should be allowed to use a woman's facility, and vice versa. End of argument. Post op, I haven't figured that one out. Help me out.

I invite challenges, comments, discussions, affirmations, etc., as long as it is civil. If it is otherwise, such comments will be ignored.

I'm not asking anyone to read this post in it's entirety, feel free to discuss portions, those which you care to address, or add to the discussion.

You're way overthinking, perhaps poisoned by too much insane left wrong-wing bullshit.

The hard, scientific realty is that we—all of us—are either male or female, and that this is based on objective, observable biological traits.

That's all there is to it.

Those who are confused about this, who deny it who think themselves to be anything other than the gender sex that their biology dictates, are in some way mentally ill, or severely deceived—most likely under some form of Satanic influence. Sane people should never feel obligated to pander to the insane delusions of such creatures.

 

[ReinyDays]

As I understand it, a transexual is an indvidual born of one sex, identifies with the opposite sex, and is taking physical and psychological measures to transition to the opposite sex, and eventually undergoing surgery to complete the transformation.

So this includes all single parents? ... maybe sexual people are the minority these days what with rampant divorce ruining marriage ...

I've always been referred to in the masculine ... "he, him, his" ... and that matches my DNA ... 45 X- and 1 Y-Chromosome ... but I definitely act the Mother-in-Law-from-Hell, I'll always find fault with my DILs' homemaking skills ... "You're not cleaning under your washing machine because you're a whore, stealing my son's affections from me" ... if the girl stays after such an attack, then we know her feelings are true ...

I am a man,
but I can change,
if I want to,
I guess

 

[Godboy]

I think anyone who worries that much about other people's genitals has severe gender insecurity problems.

Democrats worry about it constantly. They never fucking shut up about it.

 

[Dadoalex]

Where do I clearly identify myself as a sadist? Please provide the quote where I do this.

Until you can answer the above question, your point is moot.


Vacuous drivel. Move along.

If you insist

"Are you a heterosexual male? Let me ask you a question, would you date a transfemale?

Are you heterosexual female? Let me ask you a question, would you date a transmale?

If you would, then you have more bisexuality in you than most males or females I know."

Here you clearly identify your opposite number as having value only as a sexual target. People who view others in the manner as you share that trait with sadists. That is, a person's value to you lay only in their ability to provide you pleasure.


Telling a woman she's ugly is not an objective fact. it is subjective, and to call her ugly, a subjective reality, mine, perhap no one else's, serves no useful purpose. Same goes for 'moron' or 'salad bar', these are subjective, and harping on the subjective serves no useful purpose.

Whether a person is clearly ugly or clearly Trans only matters if you choose to make the effort when none is needed.

Do you think a Trans person needs you to tell them they're Trans? Of course not. Just as an ugly person doesn't need you to tell them.

So why tell them? Because you draw satisfaction by causing pain. Just like a sadist.





I do NOt buy the 'gender and sex are not the same thing' claim. That, to me, is delusion.

How are you harmed by what you claim is a delusion?
And if there's no harm, why bring it up?
Unless, it is to cause pain. Like a sadist.


I'm not saying you're a bad person. I used to be like you but I've learned to be a better person.
If you're bothered by your words identifying you as sadist I'd suggest why you feel the need to harm others.
You may find you dislike yourself a little less.

 

[jotathought]

As I understand it, a transexual is an indvidual born of one sex, identifies with the opposite sex, and is taking physical and psychological measures to transition to the opposite sex, and eventually undergoing surgery to complete the transformation.

You do realize that an individual, lets say a male, can not and never will be able to transition into the opposite sex .. or some other delusional identity? A male getting his genitals mutilated to look like female genitalia doesn't make him a female, and this reality often reasserts itself and most likely fueling the high rate of transgender suicides.

 

[ralfy]

It's part of gender identity and comes from John Money.

 

[Rumpole]

You do realize that an individual, lets say a male, can not and never will be able to transition into the opposite sex .. or some other delusional identity? A male getting his genitals mutilated to look like female genitalia doesn't make him a female, and this reality often reasserts itself and most likely fueling the high rate of transgender suicides.

I agree with you, biologically speaking. I just go my what my senses tell me. When I see Caitlyn Jenner, I see, hear, a man in drag.
But, I didn't know Fran Blance (Youtuber) was trans until a year into watching her videos she admitted it. And she's no lipstick wearin' tranny, she just looks and acts like a female, wearing little make up, naturally. The transition is astounding. Not only that, she's into electronic gizmos, not very feminine, (I was an ET in the navy) but SHE is very feminine acting, though not ultrafeminine looking.

the point is, I'd have no trouble treating her as I would any woman (though I would draw the line at dating). However, if she asked me did i believe she was a 'real woman', I'd answer no, but it's okay to be an effeminate male.

 

[jotathought]

I agree with you, biologically speaking. I just go my what my senses tell me. When I see Caitlyn Jenner, I see, hear, a man in drag.
But, I didn't know Fran Blance (Youtuber) was trans until a year into watching her videos she admitted it. And she's no lipstick wearin' tranny, she just looks and acts like a female, wearing little make up, naturally. The transition is astounding. Not only that, she's into electronic gizmos, not very feminine, (I was an ET in the navy) but SHE is very feminine acting, though not ultrafeminine looking.

the point is, I'd have no trouble treating her as I would any woman (though I would draw the line at dating). However, if she asked me did i believe she was a 'real woman', I'd answer no, but it's okay to be an effeminate male.

Sounds squishy to me .. you're either male or female .. and giving in to the absurd idea that a facade makes you the opposite sex only fuels the fire. No wonder trans people have such a high suicide rate -- reality reasserts itself when they realize their fantasy isn't congruent with the facade they created.

 

[Rumpole]

Sounds squishy to me .. you're either male or female .. and giving in to the absurd idea that a facade makes you the opposite sex only fuels the fire. No wonder trans people have such a high suicide rate -- reality reasserts itself when they realize their fantasy isn't congruent with the facade they created.

It's kinda like this, if I saw a woman whom i felt, inwardly, was extremely unattractive, outwardly I wouldn't make no mention of that fact, because it would serve no useful or constructive purpose. My point is about how I approach Transgenders, with respect, etc, not my inward personal opinions about the subject, in general.

 

[jotathought]

It's kinda like this, if I saw a woman whom i felt, inwardly, was extremely unattractive, outwardly I wouldn't make no mention of that fact, because it would serve no useful or constructive purpose. My point is about how I approach Transgenders, with respect, etc, not my inward personal opinions about the subject, in general.

I respect people .. and not their ideology. Many identifying as trans expect others to accept their identity .. sometimes forcibly .. and playing nice and not unleashing the inner monologue at the appropriate time implicitly makes one submissive to the idea.

 

[Dogmaphobe]

My thoughts on Transgenderism are consistent with my thoughts on just about everything else.

I pay little attention on what a person SAYS they are, but what they actually are, instead.