MSNBC Panel: Little Hope’ Zimmerman Will Be Convi

[Truthseeker420]

How so? The medical examiner said the injuries were minor and no where near life threatening.

Because Zimmerman was able to stop the beating before the injuries became life threatening. If Zimmerman had not fired his weapon, who knows how bad those injuries would have been.

There is no evidence he was being beat. He is not allowed to shoot someone because he thinks he might be injured.

 

[bripat9643]

Conservatives had themselves a freakin war because they thought that the government getting rid of what they perceived as their "right" to own slaves as wrong.

You really are ignorant of history.

Lincoln invaded the Confederate states. He started the war. He did it so he could enforce punitive tariffs and loot the Southern states.

It was started when the rebel traitors attacked an American base.

That base was on South Carolina territory, and Lincoln sent ships to resupply it - a blatant act of war.

 

[The Rabbi]

This will be the enduring falsehood of this case. It is the equivalent of "Gore won Florida" and "Iraq was all about WMDs".
You cannot charge involuntary manslaughter in a case where the action was deliberate. Zimmerman admitted to shooting Trayvon. He intentionally pulled the gun and shot him. That is not in dispute. And it does not add up to involuntary manslaughter. Which is why he wasn't charged that way.

Yes, he intentionally shot him in a struggle during a fight where he felt his life was being threatened. It can be argued that he created that situation by stalking, tracking down, and finally confronting Martin, and instigating an argument that led to the fight that led to him killing Martin. That actually fits well within the guidelines of involuntary manslaughter.

No, that can't be argued. That's just lynch mob blather. Nothing Zimmerman did is a justification for assault.

The basic problem here is people's ignorance.
Self defense is an ancient common law principle. It is very thoroughly articulated by both statute and case law as to what constitutes lawful self defense. If people were familiar with that these threads would be about 3 posts long.
But they aren't. They think that anything "wrong" the defendent did is evidence of his guilt. They think he cannot defend himself unless he has already sustained life threatening injuries. They think if he is facing someone unarmed he cannot use a gun to defend himself.
It is all based on ignorance of the law. We live with the most powerful tool mankind has ever invented to spread knowledge, the Internet. And instead it spreads ignorance and stupidity.

 

[bripat9643]

How so? The medical examiner said the injuries were minor and no where near life threatening.

Because Zimmerman was able to stop the beating before the injuries became life threatening. If Zimmerman had not fired his weapon, who knows how bad those injuries would have been.

There is no evidence he was being beat. He is not allowed to shoot someone because he thinks he might be injured.

You really are incredibly dense. And, yes, you are allowed to shoot someone who is trying to injure you.

 

[The Rabbi]

How so? The medical examiner said the injuries were minor and no where near life threatening.

Because Zimmerman was able to stop the beating before the injuries became life threatening. If Zimmerman had not fired his weapon, who knows how bad those injuries would have been.

There is no evidence he was being beat. He is not allowed to shoot someone because he thinks he might be injured.

Wrong on both counts.
There is ample evidence he suffered physical injury consistent with his story.
He has every right to use deadly force to counter the *threat* of death or severe bodily injury.

 

[Truthseeker420]

Because Zimmerman was able to stop the beating before the injuries became life threatening. If Zimmerman had not fired his weapon, who knows how bad those injuries would have been.

There is no evidence he was being beat. He is not allowed to shoot someone because he thinks he might be injured.

You really are incredibly dense. And, yes, you are allowed to shoot someone who is trying to injure you.

Show me any evidence Zimmerman was being beat. And you have to have a reasonable fear of death or great bodily injury,which Zimmerman did not....

 

[Truthseeker420]

Because Zimmerman was able to stop the beating before the injuries became life threatening. If Zimmerman had not fired his weapon, who knows how bad those injuries would have been.

There is no evidence he was being beat. He is not allowed to shoot someone because he thinks he might be injured.

Wrong on both counts.
There is ample evidence he suffered physical injury consistent with his story.
He has every right to use deadly force to counter the *threat* of death or severe bodily injury.

Again that is a mischaracterization of the law.

 

[The Rabbi]

There is no evidence he was being beat. He is not allowed to shoot someone because he thinks he might be injured.

You really are incredibly dense. And, yes, you are allowed to shoot someone who is trying to injure you.

Show me any evidence Zimmerman was being beat. And you have to have a reasonable fear of death or great bodily injury,which Zimmerman did not....

I guess the bruises and cuts were self inflicted?
Zimmerman clearly had such a reasonable fear. Anyone would in that situation.

 

[hjmick]

There is no evidence he was being beat. He is not allowed to shoot someone because he thinks he might be injured.

You really are incredibly dense. And, yes, you are allowed to shoot someone who is trying to injure you.

Show me any evidence Zimmerman was being beat. And you have to have a reasonable fear of death or great bodily injury,which Zimmerman did not....

How do you know what Zimmerman felt at that moment?

 

[The Rabbi]

There is no evidence he was being beat. He is not allowed to shoot someone because he thinks he might be injured.

Wrong on both counts.
There is ample evidence he suffered physical injury consistent with his story.
He has every right to use deadly force to counter the *threat* of death or severe bodily injury.

Again that is a mischaracterization of the law.

Please go ahead an explain how I mischaracterized it.

 

[R.D.]

There is no evidence he was being beat. He is not allowed to shoot someone because he thinks he might be injured.

You really are incredibly dense. And, yes, you are allowed to shoot someone who is trying to injure you.

Show me any evidence Zimmerman was being beat. And you have to have a reasonable fear of death or great bodily injury,which Zimmerman did not....

Earth to TS, Earth to TS. Just about every prosecution witness so far gave such evidence.

 

[Truthseeker420]

You really are incredibly dense. And, yes, you are allowed to shoot someone who is trying to injure you.

Show me any evidence Zimmerman was being beat. And you have to have a reasonable fear of death or great bodily injury,which Zimmerman did not....

How do you know what Zimmerman felt at that moment?

I think Zimmerman's actions shows his rage but what Zimmerman felt is not the only element of self defense law.

 

[Truthseeker420]

You really are incredibly dense. And, yes, you are allowed to shoot someone who is trying to injure you.

Show me any evidence Zimmerman was being beat. And you have to have a reasonable fear of death or great bodily injury,which Zimmerman did not....

Earth to TS, Earth to TS. Just about every prosecution witness so far gave such evidence.

Name one.

 

[The Rabbi]

Show me any evidence Zimmerman was being beat. And you have to have a reasonable fear of death or great bodily injury,which Zimmerman did not....

How do you know what Zimmerman felt at that moment?

I think Zimmerman's actions shows his rage but what Zimmerman felt is not the only element of self defense law.

What Zimmerman felt is irrelevant to self defense law. Get it right.

 

[Erand7899]

See this guy?

He was beat up. This is what getting beat up looks like. This guy is, as you all can see, in a hospital bed.

Zimmerman barely received a band-aid much less hospitalization. And the altercation he claims was life threatening was less than 3 minutes and Martin was unarmed.

Put some perspective into this and less speculation.

The law in Florida is what we rely on to determine whether Zimmerman committed a crime, or did not commit a crime. Self defense is a legal defense for an assualt, and is based on what a reasonable person could believe to be true. If an assualt victime could reasonably believe that he was in immediate danger of death or serious bodily harm, then self defense allows him to use deadly force to protect himself.

Zimmerman has raised self defense as a legal defense in the killing of Martin, and it is the duty of the state to prove, beyond any reasonable doubt, that Zimmerman could not have reasonably believed that he was in imminent threat of death or serious bodily harm.

So far, the state has failed to produce any evidence that would demonstrate that Zimmerman could not have reasonably believed that he was facing death or serious bodily harm. This case should have never been brought to trial.

 

[Truthseeker420]

How do you know what Zimmerman felt at that moment?

I think Zimmerman's actions shows his rage but what Zimmerman felt is not the only element of self defense law.

What Zimmerman felt is irrelevant to self defense law. Get it right.

He had to feel fear for his life or great bodily injury...

 

[mudwhistle]

There is no evidence he was being beat. He is not allowed to shoot someone because he thinks he might be injured.

You really are incredibly dense. And, yes, you are allowed to shoot someone who is trying to injure you.

Show me any evidence Zimmerman was being beat. And you have to have a reasonable fear of death or great bodily injury,which Zimmerman did not....

You don't have to be near death to feel your life is threatened.

 

[Truthseeker420]

See this guy?

He was beat up. This is what getting beat up looks like. This guy is, as you all can see, in a hospital bed.

Zimmerman barely received a band-aid much less hospitalization. And the altercation he claims was life threatening was less than 3 minutes and Martin was unarmed.

Put some perspective into this and less speculation.

I believe there is a mountain of evidence to show Zimmerman's use of force was unreasonable.

 

[Truthseeker420]

That is just your opinion, I believe there is a mountain of evidence to show Zimmerman's use of force was unreasonable.

 

[Truthseeker420]

See this guy?

He was beat up. This is what getting beat up looks like. This guy is, as you all can see, in a hospital bed.

Zimmerman barely received a band-aid much less hospitalization. And the altercation he claims was life threatening was less than 3 minutes and Martin was unarmed.

Put some perspective into this and less speculation.

The law in Florida is what we rely on to determine whether Zimmerman committed a crime, or did not commit a crime. Self defense is a legal defense for an assualt, and is based on what a reasonable person could believe to be true. If an assualt victime could reasonably believe that he was in immediate danger of death or serious bodily harm, then self defense allows him to use deadly force to protect himself.

Zimmerman has raised self defense as a legal defense in the killing of Martin, and it is the duty of the state to prove, beyond any reasonable doubt, that Zimmerman could not have reasonably believed that he was in imminent threat of death or serious bodily harm.

So far, the state has failed to produce any evidence that would demonstrate that Zimmerman could not have reasonably believed that he was facing death or serious bodily harm. This case should have never been brought to trial.

That's your opinion, there is a lot of evidence to show Zimmerman was unreasonable.