Mexican President: We're not paying for the wall.

[Vandalshandle]

Meantime, Trump has quietly stopped talking about deportation squads illegally rounding up illegal aliens without probable cause, and has switched to talking only about deporting those that commit further crimes, which is, of course, exactly what we are presently doing.

 

[Correll]

There's no incentive for Mexico to upfront pay for the wall. The only way to "Make Mexico Pay" is to use some of the legal tools that came out of the Patriot Act to seize money being wire-transferred south. That isn't likely to work though as I can guarantee that gets tied up in the courts as soon as even one legitimate wire transfer from a native citizen to a person south of the border gets seized. On top of that, as soon as the order is signed you'll see that money get funneled through the black market.

You could cut off aid to Mexico, but that just lets Russia step in and cozy up to the Mexican government. Foreign aid buys the US influence and allows us to curb the growing influence of China and Russia.

End of the day, a wall comes out of the US Budget somewhere. Maintenance of the wall will have to come out somewhere. And it won't be cheap. The US-Mexican boarder is long, winding, and has some really harsh terrain.

You can do it better and cheaper via electronic and satellite observation with an active interception force. You could pay for it by pulling the military out of a lot of the forward projection bases we have staged all over the world and redeploying them at the border. If this is a priority, it can be done. Trump is just choosing the stupidest, most expensive, and least likely to work way.

For decades we've been talking about doing something about the border.

No more talk. BUILD. If you want to ADD ADDITIONAL STUFF, fine. But while we've been talking millions and millions of illegals have walked across the border.


SEAL THE ******* BORDER.

 

[Correll]

I never said we had them. I asked a simple question to you if that was what you suggested. You gave a simple minded response.

Sounds as if your mathematically and factually sound grounds means whatever you support. I suggested how to handle it and it's way cheaper.

Way cheaper? To place guards with guns along the entire south border?

Lets do some dirty math:

1,989 miles of south border.

How much do you think it would cost to keep daily 3 shifts (about 5 FTE at $200k inc equipment, facilities administration and etc.) of guards for every 1 mile of it?

About 2 billion/ year - is that really cheaper?

I'm not against spending money, if it is worth it for Americans, but given ALREADY leveling off or even some decline among illigals is it really a major problem to spend time and resources on? Seems like this is more a case of scapegoating illegals for all our problems.

Leveling off is not acceptable.

Rapid and irreversible decline is the only scenario that is acceptable.


Deport the illegals, bring back the manufacturing jobs, and what the Law of Supply and Demand improve the lives of our Working CLass and Middle Class workers and their families.

 

[Correll]

Meantime, Trump has quietly stopped talking about deportation squads illegally rounding up illegal aliens without probable cause, and has switched to talking only about deporting those that commit further crimes, which is, of course, exactly what we are presently doing.

Wrong on two counts.

1. He talked of going after those illegals FIRST, not instead.

2. And we are NOT doing that now, not to a significant extent.

 

[Vandalshandle]

Meantime, Trump has quietly stopped talking about deportation squads illegally rounding up illegal aliens without probable cause, and has switched to talking only about deporting those that commit further crimes, which is, of course, exactly what we are presently doing.

Wrong on two counts.

1. He talked of going after those illegals FIRST, not instead.

2. And we are NOT doing that now, not to a significant extent.

And how many ways has Trump lied about illegal immigration? Let us count the ways:

What Trump got wrong in last night's immigration speech:

 

[Dr.Traveler]

I never said we had them. I asked a simple question to you if that was what you suggested. You gave a simple minded response.

Sounds as if your mathematically and factually sound grounds means whatever you support. I suggested how to handle it and it's way cheaper.

Way cheaper? To place guards with guns along the entire south border?

Lets do some dirty math:

1,989 miles of south border.

How much do you think it would cost to keep daily 3 shifts (about 5 FTE at $200k inc equipment, facilities administration and etc.) of guards for every 1 mile of it?

About 2 billion/ year - is that really cheaper?

I'm not against spending money, if it is worth it for Americans, but given ALREADY leveling off or even some decline among illigals is it really a major problem to spend time and resources on? Seems like this is more a case of scapegoating illegals for all our problems.

Leveling off is not acceptable.

Rapid and irreversible decline is the only scenario that is acceptable.


Deport the illegals, bring back the manufacturing jobs, and what the Law of Supply and Demand improve the lives of our Working CLass and Middle Class workers and their families.

The manufacturing jobs are gone and not coming back. The only reason people are doing those jobs at all is because the cost of labor overseas is cheap and the safety requirements are low, meaning cheap. If you raise tariffs enough to make it not affordable to make stuff overseas it will come back to the USA as a highly automated process with a small fraction of the jobs the factory once had.

The only real future in jobs all over the world is in the high tech realm or in the trade jobs. Factory jobs and midlevel white collar jobs are dying.

 

[Vandalshandle]

I never said we had them. I asked a simple question to you if that was what you suggested. You gave a simple minded response.

Sounds as if your mathematically and factually sound grounds means whatever you support. I suggested how to handle it and it's way cheaper.

Way cheaper? To place guards with guns along the entire south border?

Lets do some dirty math:

1,989 miles of south border.

How much do you think it would cost to keep daily 3 shifts (about 5 FTE at $200k inc equipment, facilities administration and etc.) of guards for every 1 mile of it?

About 2 billion/ year - is that really cheaper?

I'm not against spending money, if it is worth it for Americans, but given ALREADY leveling off or even some decline among illigals is it really a major problem to spend time and resources on? Seems like this is more a case of scapegoating illegals for all our problems.

Leveling off is not acceptable.

Rapid and irreversible decline is the only scenario that is acceptable.


Deport the illegals, bring back the manufacturing jobs, and what the Law of Supply and Demand improve the lives of our Working CLass and Middle Class workers and their families.

The manufacturing jobs are gone and not coming back. The only reason people are doing those jobs at all is because the cost of labor overseas is cheap and the safety requirements are low, meaning cheap. If you raise tariffs enough to make it not affordable to make stuff overseas it will come back to the USA as a highly automated process with a small fraction of the jobs the factory once had.

The only real future in jobs all over the world is in the high tech realm or in the trade jobs. Factory jobs and midlevel white collar jobs are dying.

Nonsense. Trump is going to see that every town blacksmith job and every locomotive fireman job will come back just as soon as he is elected.

 

[Correll]

Meantime, Trump has quietly stopped talking about deportation squads illegally rounding up illegal aliens without probable cause, and has switched to talking only about deporting those that commit further crimes, which is, of course, exactly what we are presently doing.

Wrong on two counts.

1. He talked of going after those illegals FIRST, not instead.

2. And we are NOT doing that now, not to a significant extent.

And how many ways has Trump lied about illegal immigration? Let us count the ways:

What Trump got wrong in last night's immigration speech:

NOthing in your post addressed anything in my post.

My points stand.

 

[Correll]

I never said we had them. I asked a simple question to you if that was what you suggested. You gave a simple minded response.

Sounds as if your mathematically and factually sound grounds means whatever you support. I suggested how to handle it and it's way cheaper.

Way cheaper? To place guards with guns along the entire south border?

Lets do some dirty math:

1,989 miles of south border.

How much do you think it would cost to keep daily 3 shifts (about 5 FTE at $200k inc equipment, facilities administration and etc.) of guards for every 1 mile of it?

About 2 billion/ year - is that really cheaper?

I'm not against spending money, if it is worth it for Americans, but given ALREADY leveling off or even some decline among illigals is it really a major problem to spend time and resources on? Seems like this is more a case of scapegoating illegals for all our problems.

Leveling off is not acceptable.

Rapid and irreversible decline is the only scenario that is acceptable.


Deport the illegals, bring back the manufacturing jobs, and what the Law of Supply and Demand improve the lives of our Working CLass and Middle Class workers and their families.

The manufacturing jobs are gone and not coming back. The only reason people are doing those jobs at all is because the cost of labor overseas is cheap and the safety requirements are low, meaning cheap. If you raise tariffs enough to make it not affordable to make stuff overseas it will come back to the USA as a highly automated process with a small fraction of the jobs the factory once had.

The only real future in jobs all over the world is in the high tech realm or in the trade jobs. Factory jobs and midlevel white collar jobs are dying.

1. Germany has twice the rate of manufacturing jobs that we do. They do not have low wages or low safety requirements.

2. Future? High Tech jobs are being filled with Work Visa cheap Third World Labor TOO, which is addressed on Trump's web site.

 

[Vandalshandle]

Meantime, Trump has quietly stopped talking about deportation squads illegally rounding up illegal aliens without probable cause, and has switched to talking only about deporting those that commit further crimes, which is, of course, exactly what we are presently doing.

Wrong on two counts.

1. He talked of going after those illegals FIRST, not instead.

2. And we are NOT doing that now, not to a significant extent.

And how many ways has Trump lied about illegal immigration? Let us count the ways:

What Trump got wrong in last night's immigration speech:

NOthing in your post addressed anything in my post.

My points stand.

I sort of figured that you would not let the facts get in the way of Trump's populist xenophobic rant.

 

[Correll]

I never said we had them. I asked a simple question to you if that was what you suggested. You gave a simple minded response.

Sounds as if your mathematically and factually sound grounds means whatever you support. I suggested how to handle it and it's way cheaper.

Way cheaper? To place guards with guns along the entire south border?

Lets do some dirty math:

1,989 miles of south border.

How much do you think it would cost to keep daily 3 shifts (about 5 FTE at $200k inc equipment, facilities administration and etc.) of guards for every 1 mile of it?

About 2 billion/ year - is that really cheaper?

I'm not against spending money, if it is worth it for Americans, but given ALREADY leveling off or even some decline among illigals is it really a major problem to spend time and resources on? Seems like this is more a case of scapegoating illegals for all our problems.

Leveling off is not acceptable.

Rapid and irreversible decline is the only scenario that is acceptable.


Deport the illegals, bring back the manufacturing jobs, and what the Law of Supply and Demand improve the lives of our Working CLass and Middle Class workers and their families.

The manufacturing jobs are gone and not coming back. The only reason people are doing those jobs at all is because the cost of labor overseas is cheap and the safety requirements are low, meaning cheap. If you raise tariffs enough to make it not affordable to make stuff overseas it will come back to the USA as a highly automated process with a small fraction of the jobs the factory once had.

The only real future in jobs all over the world is in the high tech realm or in the trade jobs. Factory jobs and midlevel white collar jobs are dying.

Nonsense. Trump is going to see that every town blacksmith job and every locomotive fireman job will come back just as soon as he is elected.

Your hyperbole is noted.

Germany has TWICE the level of manufacturing employment we do. Many of those jobs are still there and can come back if we just stop being the world's ***** when it comes to trade.

And Trade jobs are effected by the Law of Supply and Demand too.

Deport the illegals. Limit legal immigration and reduce work visas.

 

[Correll]

Meantime, Trump has quietly stopped talking about deportation squads illegally rounding up illegal aliens without probable cause, and has switched to talking only about deporting those that commit further crimes, which is, of course, exactly what we are presently doing.

Wrong on two counts.

1. He talked of going after those illegals FIRST, not instead.

2. And we are NOT doing that now, not to a significant extent.

And how many ways has Trump lied about illegal immigration? Let us count the ways:

What Trump got wrong in last night's immigration speech:

NOthing in your post addressed anything in my post.

My points stand.

I sort of figured that you would not let the facts get in the way of Trump's populist xenophobic rant.

Save your buzz words for someone who cares.


1. He talked of going after those illegals FIRST, not instead.

2. And we are NOT doing that now, not to a significant extent.

 

[Indeependent]

I never said we had them. I asked a simple question to you if that was what you suggested. You gave a simple minded response.

Sounds as if your mathematically and factually sound grounds means whatever you support. I suggested how to handle it and it's way cheaper.

Way cheaper? To place guards with guns along the entire south border?

Lets do some dirty math:

1,989 miles of south border.

How much do you think it would cost to keep daily 3 shifts (about 5 FTE at $200k inc equipment, facilities administration and etc.) of guards for every 1 mile of it?

About 2 billion/ year - is that really cheaper?

I'm not against spending money, if it is worth it for Americans, but given ALREADY leveling off or even some decline among illigals is it really a major problem to spend time and resources on? Seems like this is more a case of scapegoating illegals for all our problems.

Leveling off is not acceptable.

Rapid and irreversible decline is the only scenario that is acceptable.


Deport the illegals, bring back the manufacturing jobs, and what the Law of Supply and Demand improve the lives of our Working CLass and Middle Class workers and their families.

The manufacturing jobs are gone and not coming back. The only reason people are doing those jobs at all is because the cost of labor overseas is cheap and the safety requirements are low, meaning cheap. If you raise tariffs enough to make it not affordable to make stuff overseas it will come back to the USA as a highly automated process with a small fraction of the jobs the factory once had.

The only real future in jobs all over the world is in the high tech realm or in the trade jobs. Factory jobs and midlevel white collar jobs are dying.

Wouldn't it be a DISASTER to have State of the Art manufacturing in the US!?
Of course, truckers would be thrilled.

 

[Vandalshandle]

Arguing about what Trump is going to do, or not do, about illegal aliens, is sort of like arguing about what Reagan would do, should he suddenly be resurrected and reelected.

It ain't going to happen, anyway.

The folks in AZ know that, and the state is no longer a guaranteed GOP state.Going blue is very possible this year. Even McCain is keeping his distance from him.

Trump has already lost the election, and an epic landslide to rival LBJ over Goldwater is starting to look possible. The truth is that there simply are not enough undereducated, white, angry, high school male graduates to get Trump elected.

 

[Indeependent]

Arguing about what Trump is going to do, or not do, about illegal aliens, is sort of like arguing about what Reagan would do, should he suddenly be resurrected and reelected.

It ain't going to happen, anyway.

The folks in AZ know that, and the state is no longer a guaranteed GOP state.Going blue is very possible this year. Even McCain is keeping his distance from him.

Trump has already lost the election, and an epic landslide to rival LBJ over Goldwater is starting to look possible. The truth is that there simply are not enough undereducated, white, angry, high school male graduates to get Trump elected.

There are and that's why you're shitting in your pants.

 

[Vandalshandle]

Arguing about what Trump is going to do, or not do, about illegal aliens, is sort of like arguing about what Reagan would do, should he suddenly be resurrected and reelected.

It ain't going to happen, anyway.

The folks in AZ know that, and the state is no longer a guaranteed GOP state.Going blue is very possible this year. Even McCain is keeping his distance from him.

Trump has already lost the election, and an epic landslide to rival LBJ over Goldwater is starting to look possible. The truth is that there simply are not enough undereducated, white, angry, high school male graduates to get Trump elected.

There are and that's why you're shitting in your pants.

Hell, I was more worried about Romney than I am about Trump, and we whipped Romney's ass.

 

[Indeependent]

Arguing about what Trump is going to do, or not do, about illegal aliens, is sort of like arguing about what Reagan would do, should he suddenly be resurrected and reelected.

It ain't going to happen, anyway.

The folks in AZ know that, and the state is no longer a guaranteed GOP state.Going blue is very possible this year. Even McCain is keeping his distance from him.

Trump has already lost the election, and an epic landslide to rival LBJ over Goldwater is starting to look possible. The truth is that there simply are not enough undereducated, white, angry, high school male graduates to get Trump elected.

There are and that's why you're shitting in your pants.

Hell, I was more worried about Romney than I am about Trump, and we whipped Romney's ass.

Yes, we did whip Romney's ass.
And now we're gonna whip Hillary's ass.
Oh yeah, I voted for Obama.

 

[Correll]

Arguing about what Trump is going to do, or not do, about illegal aliens, is sort of like arguing about what Reagan would do, should he suddenly be resurrected and reelected.

It ain't going to happen, anyway.

The folks in AZ know that, and the state is no longer a guaranteed GOP state.Going blue is very possible this year. Even McCain is keeping his distance from him.

Trump has already lost the election, and an epic landslide to rival LBJ over Goldwater is starting to look possible. The truth is that there simply are not enough undereducated, white, angry, high school male graduates to get Trump elected.

Odd, a moment ago you were happy to discuss whether Trump's policies could work and whether he would do them.

Now you want to drop those discussions, cause they are "pointless".


Kind of admitting that you got your ass handed to you.

 

[candycorn]

I never said we had them. I asked a simple question to you if that was what you suggested. You gave a simple minded response.

Sounds as if your mathematically and factually sound grounds means whatever you support. I suggested how to handle it and it's way cheaper.

Way cheaper? To place guards with guns along the entire south border?

Lets do some dirty math:

1,989 miles of south border.

How much do you think it would cost to keep daily 3 shifts (about 5 FTE at $200k inc equipment, facilities administration and etc.) of guards for every 1 mile of it?

About 2 billion/ year - is that really cheaper?

I'm not against spending money, if it is worth it for Americans, but given ALREADY leveling off or even some decline among illigals is it really a major problem to spend time and resources on? Seems like this is more a case of scapegoating illegals for all our problems.

Leveling off is not acceptable.

Rapid and irreversible decline is the only scenario that is acceptable.


Deport the illegals, bring back the manufacturing jobs, and what the Law of Supply and Demand improve the lives of our Working CLass and Middle Class workers and their families.

The manufacturing jobs are gone and not coming back. The only reason people are doing those jobs at all is because the cost of labor overseas is cheap and the safety requirements are low, meaning cheap. If you raise tariffs enough to make it not affordable to make stuff overseas it will come back to the USA as a highly automated process with a small fraction of the jobs the factory once had.

The only real future in jobs all over the world is in the high tech realm or in the trade jobs. Factory jobs and midlevel white collar jobs are dying.

You're correct (mostly). The jobs won't come back in a highly automated or any other environment.

 

[Vandalshandle]

Arguing about what Trump is going to do, or not do, about illegal aliens, is sort of like arguing about what Reagan would do, should he suddenly be resurrected and reelected.

It ain't going to happen, anyway.

The folks in AZ know that, and the state is no longer a guaranteed GOP state.Going blue is very possible this year. Even McCain is keeping his distance from him.

Trump has already lost the election, and an epic landslide to rival LBJ over Goldwater is starting to look possible. The truth is that there simply are not enough undereducated, white, angry, high school male graduates to get Trump elected.

There are and that's why you're shitting in your pants.

Hell, I was more worried about Romney than I am about Trump, and we whipped Romney's ass.

Yes, we did whip Romney's ass.
And now we're gonna whip Hillary's ass.
Oh yeah, I voted for Obama.

The sad part is that the GOP could have beat Hillary so easy, if they would just quit nominating nuts. Gerald Ford, Reagan, Bush I, could have all beat Hillary. But the GOP is on some sort of masochistic death spiral.