Map of Ottoman Empire @ 1900's clearly shows, land NOT OWNED BY ARABS:
- Thread starter Roudy
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Shusha
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Yes. Every five year old knows that. Don't confuse that with my POINT. Which is that the Jewish people's existence is unrelated to Xianity and Xianity should not be brought into a discussion about the Jewish people. The Jewish people exist independent of Xtianity.
Shusha
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Sure. Sit your privileged Xian ass down. We are discussing the Jewish people and we CAN discuss the Jewish people without bringing up Xianity, you know. As I said, its a form of erasure.
Shusha
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Cool. Then you should be able to support the Jewish people without mentioning Xianity.
I’m putting you on “ignore.”
Shusha
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Historical facts fly in the face of those who claim: "The Jews stole the land".
The "land" was Ottoman Empire territory for 600 years, and then under the control of the British after WWI once the Ottoman Empire collapsed.
Get it right, the Arabs had no say or control over what happened to the land for 800 years. In fact, the Ottomans who CONQUERED the Arabs were enemies:
Great!
Let's give it back to the Turks then!
Why not the Crusaders, or the Romans even the Jews. The arab muslims did not hold it for long enough to matter.
Yeah for sure.... Why not....
But isn't it rather idiotic of all pro-israelis to try and choose just where to draw a timeline that is convenient for, well, jews, and actually forget the rest of historical fact, simply because it doesn't really suit you cause....
Oh, before I get tagged an islamonazi, or whatever ridiculous tag you want to throw at me, exactly the same can be said of pro-palestinians...
Both sides should actually draw a "line in the sand" from where to start a mutual history and 'argue' from there....
Trying to argue 1800's with 1920's or 1947's is just a farce...
If you want to go back to the earliest remains in the region then you are looking at 1.5 million years ago and they came from Africa!
Free “palestine“? Um, it was a fictional Roman name imposed on Jews. Roman Empire is defunct. Israel is free.
In your parallel universe, Christians and Muslims inhabiting Jews’ homeland, which existed long before Christians and Muslims, transformed it into Christian and Muslim land? Um, no.
The Romans called Israel “Palestine” after they conquered it.
Yes, the map is labeled "Palestine". but you have cut off the label at the top.
Here is what a typical Ottoman Empire map of Palestine looks like.
Note the label "Palestine" at the top.
You’re not very good at this: Nowhere in the map is there an administrative unit named “palestine.” No such place existed.
That is the whole point.
It is the REGION that was always called Palestine, and it was not until 1920 that it was made into an independent country, as a federation of the little tribal areas inside of it.
That is the way countries are always formed.
German was 16 separate states until confederation.
{... Prussia and the other states in Northern and Central Germany united as a federal state, the North German Federation, on July 1, 1867 ...}
There was no Germany before that, just the name of the region.
If you don’t know this from a simple Google search then you are an idiot.
Totally wrong.
Israel had been defeated and destroyed many times, such as by the Assyrians and Babylonians.
{...
cca. 720 BCE – Kingdom of Israel conquered by Neo-Assyrian Empire. Local population deported, becoming the ten lost tribes, and the region is repopulated from other provinces of the Assyrian Empire.
...}
{...
...
- 609 BCE – After the Battle of Megiddo (609 BC ) the region becomes part of the Empire of the Twenty-sixth dynasty of Egypt.[citation needed]
- 605 BCE – The region of the Kingdom of Judah returns to Babylonian control after the Battle of Carchemish in which Crown Prince Nebuchadnezzar II of Babylon defeated the army of Necho II of Egypt
- ...
- 6th century BCE
- 16 March 597 BCE – Babylonians capture Jerusalem following a siege, replace Jehoiachin with Zedekiah as king.[citation needed]
- 597 BCE – Exile of prominent Jews (including Ezekiel) to Babylonia.[citation needed]
- 587 BCE – Jerusalem falls to the Babylonians, ending the Kingdom of Judah. The conquerors destroy the Jewish Temple of Jerusalem and exile some of the land's inhabitants.[citation needed]
- 538 BCE – After Cyrus the Great conquered the Babylonian Empire a year earlier, he declared that the Israelites are allowed to return to Jerusalem and rebuild the Temple.
4th century BCE
3rd century BCE
- 332 BCE – Alexander the Great conquered the region from the Persian Empire.[citation needed]
- 301 BCE – Ptolemy I Soter conquered the region from the heirs of Alexander the Great.[citation needed]
2nd century BCE
- 22 June 217 BCE – Egyptian native hoplites under Ptolemy IV crushes the Seleucid army under Antiochus III at Raphia near Gaza. The realization of their military importance leads to demands by native Egyptians for greater privileges and so to the development of racial difficulties which will weaken the Ptolemy dynasty in the future.[citation needed]
- 200 BCE – Antiochus III the Great from the Seleucid dynasty conquered the region from the Ptolemaic dynasty.
...
- 198 BCE – The Battle of Panium is fought between Seleucid forces led by Antiochus III and Ptolemaic forces led by Scopas of Aetolia. The Seleucids win the battle which allows Antiochus III to obtain entire possession of the region of Syria Palaestina and Coele-Syria from King Ptolemy V of Egypt.[citation needed]
- 167–160 BCE – Maccabean Revolt: Jewish revolt against the Seleucid Empire.[citation needed]
- 160–63 BCE – The semi-autonomous rule of the Hasmoneans
...}
- 63 BCE – Rome sends Pompey the Great and his forces to Judea to intervene in the civil war between the two religious sects who were fighting each other for control over the whole kingdom.[citation needed]
- 63 BCE – Pompey the Great conquers Jerusalem during Yom Kippur after another Siege of Jerusalem and as a result brings about the end of the Hasmonean Kingdom and incorporates Judea into the Roman Republic. During the battle over Jerusalem the Roman troops kill about 12,000 Jews including many priests at the temple compound.
- 63 BCE – King Judah Aristobulus II is removed from power, while his brother John Hyrcanus II is reappointed king (ethnarch) under Roman suzerainty and high priest.[citation needed]
- ...
- 40 BCE – the Parthians invade Judea, seize Jerusalem and appoint Antigonus II Mattathias King of Judea.
- 37 BCE – Herod the Great seizes back power in Judea with the help of the Romans and executes Antigonus II Mattathias.
- ...
- 66–73 – The First Jewish–Roman War occurs, the first uprising of Jews of the Iudaea province against the rule of the Roman Empire. The upraising fails and leads to destruction of the Jewish Temple and the conquest of Masada.
- 70 – First Jewish–Roman War: The Roman Empire conquer Jerusalem and destroy the Second Jewish Temple. Jews are banned from their city by the Roman conqueror.
- ...
- 132–135 AD – The Bar Kokhba revolt takes place, the third major rebellion by the Jews of Iudaea Province against the rule of the Roman Empire. After the rebellion failed emperor Hadrian changed the name of the province from Iudaea to "Syria Palaestina" in order to complete the dissociation between the Jewish rebels to the region.
The Romans invaded Palestine when the Jews were no longer in power at all, and restored them to power as puppets. For example, Herod was crowned king of the Jews, but was actually a Roman who simply converted so that he could rule.
And after the Bar Kokhba revolt , the Jews were totally eliminated from Palestine.
They went to what is now Saudi Arabia, and later helped Mohammad rise to power there.
If you are claiming there was a long standing Jewish kingdom on history, you would be wrong.
There was only a very fleeting dynasty that the Romans took advantage of to temporarily restore.
Jewish history is fairly insignificant really.
Jews did much better when they were not in charge, and instead concentrated on technological advancements instead of just killing people.
Romans invaded ancient Israel and called it Judea, signifying land of the Jews. No place “palestine” existed. Jesus is called King Of Israel in the NT, born in Judea.
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