Mandatory mental health screening for kids

[eots]

In 1936, the Portuguese neurologist Egas Moniz introduced a surgical operation, prefrontal leukotomy, which after an initial period came to be used particularly in the treatment of schizophrenia. The operation, later called lobotomy, consisted in incisions that destroyed connections between the prefrontal region and other parts of the brain.

At that time there did not exist any effective treatment whatsoever for schizophrenia, and the leukotomy managed at least to make life more endurable for the patients and their surroundings. The treatment became rather popular in many countries all over the world and Moniz received the Nobel Prize in 1949.


Controversial Psychosurgery Resulted in a Nobel Prize

 

[eots]

Peter R. Breggin, MD, has been called "the conscience of psychiatry" for his efforts to reform the mental health field, including his promotion of caring psychotherapeutic approaches and his opposition to the escalating overuse of psychiatric medications, the oppressive diagnosing and drugging of children, electroshock, lobotomy, involuntary treatment, and false biological theories.
Peter R. Breggin, MD, has been called "the conscience of psychiatry" for his efforts to reform the mental health field, including his promotion of caring psychotherapeutic approaches and his opposition to the escalating overuse of psychiatric medications, the oppressive diagnosing and drugging of children, electroshock, lobotomy, involuntary treatment, and false biological theories.

A Harvard-trained psychiatrist and former full-time consultant at NIMH, Dr. Breggin's private practice is in Ithaca, New York, where he treats adults, couples, and families with children. He also offers consultations in clinical psychopharmacology and often acts as a medical expert in criminal, malpractice and product liability suits. He is the author of many scientific articles and books including Medication Madness: A psychiatrist exposes the dangers of mood-altering medications (2008).

Psychiatric Drug Facts with Dr. Peter Breggin - HOME


A Harvard-trained psychiatrist and former full-time consultant at NIMH, Dr. Breggin's private practice is in Ithaca, New York, where he treats adults, couples, and families with children. He also offers consultations in clinical psychopharmacology and often acts as a medical expert in criminal, malpractice and product liability suits. He is the author of many scientific articles and books including Medication Madness: A psychiatrist exposes the dangers of mood-altering medications (2008).

 

[RetiredGySgt]

And yet you know nothing. I agree our society jumps to the me first approach. But drugs are absolutely effective.

Do I need to remind you that with out my medication I would probably be dead or living a life of hell? Once I started on these meds I went from a basket case with daily over powering urges to commit suicide to now not even having suicidal thoughts. For 9 years I struggled to get through each and every day as it got worse. Now as long as I take my medication I am nearly normal again.

I take an anti depressant, an anti psycotic and a mood enhancer. With out them I would be unable to function. I WAS unable to function. There are people with brain chemical imbalances that no amount of talking is gonna help. No amount of deep breathing, no amount of thinking happy thoughts. Medication is the ONLY relief they can look forward to.

You would deny them that because you do not like them. Even with medication there are about 20 percent of people with mental problems that NOTHING helps.

The people that should not be taking medication are the housewifes that feel down for a couple days and so get anti depressants or Valium. And because a segment of society abuses needed medication you would deny it to all. The word for you is heartless and stupid.

I am living proof that medications are needed and effective. I will never willingly go back to how it was with out them. On some days curled into a ball in bed cause if I moved I would kill myself.

On this issue you are a fool and an idiot.

 

[eots]

I fully support a individuals right with real informed consent..to seek the treatment of there choice..

 

[RetiredGySgt]

I fully support a individuals right with real informed consent..to seek the treatment of there choice..

And yet the last time we went round this you were demanding all meds be banned.

 

[eots]

the thread question was... should neroleptic drugs be banned ?

it was a question and the and the links posted with it addressed this question from several different angles...and questioned the morality of administering these drugs by force and without informed consent

 

[Silence]

Except kids are not sane in the same way adults are. You can not judge their mental state like you would an adult. They progress in stages. And they can and do act nuts when that is just NORMAL behavior.

It is to easy if you have the money to send your kid to the nut house for a time out so mommy and daddy can get some time off.

Well RGS, I fought the doctor's putting my daughter on medication from the time she was 9 until just this past August (she just turned 14) because I believed, like you do, that she was just doing "what kids do" with her mood swings, angry outbursts and out of control crying at inappropriate times.

It's easy to say that parents dope up their kids just so they don't have to deal with them but the truth is a lot of children suffer from chemical imbalances, just like adults do and denying them medication is cruel. I have terrible guilt over the almost 5 years that my daughter suffered because of my own unwillingness to accept that she needed medication. It wasn't that I was ashamed of her possibly needing it. No, like you, I believed that too many parents medicate their kids so they can opt out of actually parenting their children and I was willing to put in the work to get through this "stage." I put her in therapy, I spent time talking to her, doing things with her and she was still angry, moody and just a sad little girl.

She's been on Prozac for a little over 3 months and I have my daughter back. She's happy (for the most part...she's still 14 LOL). She's able to hang out with her friends and do things without feeling pissed off all the time. She laughs spontaneously instead of cries. and that's because of the medication.


Now there are parents and doctors who will just stick a pill down a kids throat and be done with it but I'm gonna guess that 90% of kids who are on medication went a period of time without it due to their parents resistance to it.

 

[eots]

a little over 3 months ?..not really enough time to tell anything..and there is also placebo effects that can create the same reaction in a realtivly large number of people with depesision and even phycosis..with no more than a sugar pill

In clinical studies, antidepressants increased the risk of suicidal thinking and behavior in children, adolescents, and young adults with depression and other psychiatric disorders. Anyone considering the use of PROZAC or any other antidepressant in a child, adolescent, or young adult must balance this risk with the clinical need. Short-term studies did not show an increase in the risk of suicidality with antidepressants compared to placebo in adults beyond age 24; there was a reduction in risk with antidepressants compared to placebo in adults aged 65 and older. Depression and certain other psychiatric disorders are themselves associated with increases in the risk of suicide. Patients of all ages who are started on antidepressant therapy should be monitored appropriately and observed closely. Families and caregivers should discuss with the doctor any observation of worsening of depression symptoms, suicidal thinking and behavior, or unusual changes in behavior. PROZAC is approved for use in pediatric patients (children and adolescents) with MDD or obsessive compulsive disorder (OCD).

Prozac.com - Safety Information

Prozac Vs. Placebos
By DAVID NOONAN AND GEOFFREY COWLEY | NEWSWEEK
From the magazine issue dated Jul 15, 2002
University of Connecticut, pooled data from 38 studies on six drugs approved by the Food and Drug Administration between 1987 and 1999 (the three above, and Serzone, Celexa and Effexor). The studies were placebo-controlled clinical trials in which some depressed patients were given actual drugs while others got pills with no active ingredients. The studies didn't show any lack of effect. In fact, the patients improved markedly. The problem is that people who got placebos fared almost as well as those getting real drugs. On average, people on placebos enjoyed an eight-point improvement on the 50-point Hamilton Depression Scale, while those on medication managed a 10-point improvement. It's no secret that placebos can ease depression in short-term studies, but Kirsch and his colleagues raise an unsettling possibility. In a paper appearing next week in Prevention & Treatment, an online journal published by the American Psychological Association (apa.org), they argue that the SSRIs' active ingredients may account only for the two-point difference between drug and placebo, not the whole 10-point benefit that users enjoy. If so, says Kirsch, the benefits are "clinically negligible."

http://www.newsweek.com/id/100911

 

[GigiBowman]

And yet you know nothing. I agree our society jumps to the me first approach. But drugs are absolutely effective.

Do I need to remind you that with out my medication I would probably be dead or living a life of hell? Once I started on these meds I went from a basket case with daily over powering urges to commit suicide to now not even having suicidal thoughts. For 9 years I struggled to get through each and every day as it got worse. Now as long as I take my medication I am nearly normal again.

I take an anti depressant, an anti psycotic and a mood enhancer. With out them I would be unable to function. I WAS unable to function. There are people with brain chemical imbalances that no amount of talking is gonna help. No amount of deep breathing, no amount of thinking happy thoughts. Medication is the ONLY relief they can look forward to.

You would deny them that because you do not like them. Even with medication there are about 20 percent of people with mental problems that NOTHING helps.

The people that should not be taking medication are the housewifes that feel down for a couple days and so get anti depressants or Valium. And because a segment of society abuses needed medication you would deny it to all. The word for you is heartless and stupid.

I am living proof that medications are needed and effective. I will never willingly go back to how it was with out them. On some days curled into a ball in bed cause if I moved I would kill myself.

On this issue you are a fool and an idiot.

I understand where you are coming from Sarge BUT....in 2003 when my daughter was taking zoloft it DID NOT SAY on the tv commercial "May cause feelings of suicide in children under 18". It does now, loud and clear. Why? because SO MANY CHILDREN have committed suicide BECAUSE OF THIS DRUG.
Yet they hand it out like candy.

One of my daughter's friends got very drunk one night when she was attending college (two years ago). She got so drunk she passed out and ended up in the hospital. They prescribed zoloft to her. ZOLOFT???? For going out and getting drunk???? This child was never depressed a day in her life! Why the hell would they prescribe this anti-depressant to her? Well luckily my daughter had already gone though this nightmare with her own sister and sat the parents of her friend down and had a talk with them. They were going to take the advice of the hospital and get the prescription for their daughter but they decided not to. OMG.....what the hell???

When my daughter died, my youngest daughter had to go to the school psychologist. They called me in and told me that they feel that my youngest is very hyper and might have ADHD. What???? My youngest daughter has always been very active! She started walking at 6 months, which is unheard of. Hyper? From a few conversations they conclude this? Her sister had just died and I'm sure going to talk to the school psychologist was a scary thing --she was in the 6th grade at the time. They called me in and I looked at them with such disdain. I had just lost a child because of prescription medicine....and they want to put a label and a drug into my baby? I refused.
My daughter Theresa is the last child on earth who should have been diagnosed by anyone with ADHD. She has a school average in the 90's she is the President of Habitat for Humanity in her high school. She has a great job in our community and she is a lovely lovely girl with no sign of being hyper. She is active, yes! But Hyper?????

I trust none of these doctors now.

Here are the faces of dead children who killed themselves while on SSRI medication. Not adults but CHILDREN!Faces of Suicide

When I was growing up in the 70's not one of my friends was on medication and we all made it out alive. These days I can't believe the amount of kids with labels who are prescribed a daily drug.

 

[Silence]

a little over 3 months ?..not really enough time to tell anything..and there is also placibo effects that can create the same reaction in a realtivly large number of people with depesision and even phycosis

In clinical studies, antidepressants increased the risk of suicidal thinking and behavior in children, adolescents, and young adults with depression and other psychiatric disorders. Anyone considering the use of PROZAC or any other antidepressant in a child, adolescent, or young adult must balance this risk with the clinical need. Short-term studies did not show an increase in the risk of suicidality with antidepressants compared to placebo in adults beyond age 24; there was a reduction in risk with antidepressants compared to placebo in adults aged 65 and older. Depression and certain other psychiatric disorders are themselves associated with increases in the risk of suicide. Patients of all ages who are started on antidepressant therapy should be monitored appropriately and observed closely. Families and caregivers should discuss with the doctor any observation of worsening of depression symptoms, suicidal thinking and behavior, or unusual changes in behavior. PROZAC is approved for use in pediatric patients (children and adolescents) with MDD or obsessive compulsive disorder (OCD).

Prozac.com - Safety Information

it's not a placibo effect. There was no marked improvement until she had been on the medication for 2 months. The dose was slowly increased and she's not even on the highest dose available because she doesn't need it.

trust me eots, I discussed the side effects, such as suicidal thoughts and am vigilant in observing her behavior for even the slightest change.

There are two anti-depressants that are approved for children under the age of 18, Zoloft and Prozac, according to my daughter's psychiatrist. (yes, she goes to a psychiatrist and not her pediatrician to monitor these medications) and she tried Zoloft first and had headaches so they switched her to Prozac. She's had no side effects and even she said she feels better.

I do laugh at people who assume that parents don't understand or bother to look into the possible side effects of medication. Like I said I resisted for 5 years and if I thought she could go off and be fine I'd do it in a heartbeat. unfortunately, she happens to be someone who needs medication to balance out the chemicals in her brain. That's life.

 

[eots]

if you can read..even from the manufactures own web site..marked improvement is only 10 points higher than placebo..and independent studies say only 2 pointS..I never said you had not seen a improvment.

JUST THE FACTS MAM..


[Ads for SSRI antidepressants are misleading, say researchers

----


Margaret Shear, Public Library of Science


depression is due to a chemical imbalance in the brain, and that SSRIs correct this imbalance, but these claims are not supported by scientific evidence, say researchers in PLoS Medicine.

Although scientists in the 1960s suggested that depression may be linked to low brain levels of the chemical serotonin (the so-called "serotonin hypothesis"), contemporary research has failed to confirm the hypothesis, they say.

The researchers--Jeffrey Lacasse, a doctoral candidate at Florida State University and Dr. Jonathan Leo, a neuroanatomy professor at Lake Erie College of Osteopathic Medicine--studied US consumer advertisements for SSRIs from print, television, and the Internet. They found widespread claims that SSRIs restore the serotonin balance of the brain. "Yet there is no such thing as a scientifically established correct 'balance' of serotonin," the authors say.

According to Lacasse and Leo, in the scientific literature it is openly admitted that the serotonin hypothesis remains unconfirmed and that there is "a growing body of medical literature casting doubt on the serotonin hypothesis," which is not reflected in the consumer ads.

For instance, the widely televised animated Zoloft (setraline) commercials have dramatized a serotonin imbalance and stated, "Prescription Zoloft works to correct this imbalance." Advertisements for other SSRIs, such as Prozac (fluoxetine), Paxil (paroxetine), and Lexapro (escitalopram), have made similar claims.

In the US, the FDA is responsible for regulating consumer advertisements, and requires that they be based on scientific evidence. Yet, according to Lacasse and Leo, the mismatch between the scientific literature and the SSRI advertisements is "remarkable, and possibly unparalleled

http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2005-11/plos-afs103105.php

 

[editec]

Look folks this argument is sort of goofy.

Good medicine, medicine which is appropriate to the disease is invaluable.

Bad medicine, for example the over prescription of meds to kids who are merely unruly is obviously not.

Some of you seem want to throw the baby out with the bath.

When I was serverely depressed psychotropics probably saved somebody's life.

But I was serverely depressed, not a merely unhappy or unruly child seeking relief from ennui, or something minor.

There is a place for pyschotrpic medication, believe me.

This question is much like the question of guns, really.

In the proper place at the proper time, they're life savers.

In the wrong hands, they're a menace to society.

The trick (the science and the art of medicine) is knowing which is which.

 

[Luissa]

I understand where you are coming from Sarge BUT....in 2003 when my daughter was taking zoloft it DID NOT SAY on the tv commercial "May cause feelings of suicide in children under 18". It does now, loud and clear. Why? because SO MANY CHILDREN have committed suicide BECAUSE OF THIS DRUG.
Yet they hand it out like candy.

One of my daughter's friends got very drunk one night when she was attending college (two years ago). She got so drunk she passed out and ended up in the hospital. They prescribed zoloft to her. ZOLOFT???? For going out and getting drunk???? This child was never depressed a day in her life! Why the hell would they prescribe this anti-depressant to her? Well luckily my daughter had already gone though this nightmare with her own sister and sat the parents of her friend down and had a talk with them. They were going to take the advice of the hospital and get the prescription for their daughter but they decided not to. OMG.....what the hell???

When my daughter died, my youngest daughter had to go to the school psychologist. They called me in and told me that they feel that my youngest is very hyper and might have ADHD. What???? My youngest daughter has always been very active! She started walking at 6 months, which is unheard of. Hyper? From a few conversations they conclude this? Her sister had just died and I'm sure going to talk to the school psychologist was a scary thing --she was in the 6th grade at the time. They called me in and I looked at them with such disdain. I had just lost a child because of prescription medicine....and they want to put a label and a drug into my baby? I refused.
My daughter Theresa is the last child on earth who should have been diagnosed by anyone with ADHD. She has a school average in the 90's she is the President of Habitat for Humanity in her high school. She has a great job in our community and she is a lovely lovely girl with no sign of being hyper. She is active, yes! But Hyper?????

I trust none of these doctors now.

Here are the faces of dead children who killed themselves while on SSRI medication. Not adults but CHILDREN!Faces of Suicide

When I was growing up in the 70's not one of my friends was on medication and we all made it out alive. These days I can't believe the amount of kids with labels who are prescribed a daily drug.

I agree with you completly on this one. MY friend was on Zoloft in high school and I think prozac before that and she tried to commit suicide more times when she was on this medicine then any other time. And once you are on them there is really no going off of them.
Also if you are going to take anti depressants or such drugs you should also be like Retired and be on at least two because they have proven this to be more effective. Having passed meds to people with demensia who also have mental illnesses the ones who were on at least two seemed to do better. Some also can have the opposite effect on people, they put this one guy on ativan and it was like crack to him.
I also think some adults need to be on this medicine, for one many who need some sort of medication and have mental illness self medicate with other things. This is also why you see people with ADHD taking meth because it has the opposite effect on them from other people who take it. To many people are self medicating with drugs and alcohol when they should be on something controlled by their doctor.

 

[chloe]

No, I am against "mandatory" screening.

 

[Skeptik]

Why is it that medication to counter depression or any other mental condition brings out an emotional reaction in people, while medication to counter physical problems does not?

I haven't heard anyone saying that insulin, for example, shouldn't be prescribed when needed, but psychotropic drugs are somehow an admission that we can't cope with the rigors of life, or, if it is our children taking them, it makes us bad parents.

All medications have contraindications. Many are given to people who really don't need them, and that applies to meds given for physical aliments as well as psychological ones.

What really needs to be stopped is the constant hawking of prescription medications on TV. Shouldn't you ask your doctor? No, my doctor should know which medication, if any, is indicated.

 

[Caligirl]

Why is it that medication to counter depression or any other mental condition brings out an emotional reaction in people, while medication to counter physical problems does not?

I can think of a few reasons from not wanting to drug up a person (especially a kid) if you aren't sure they need it, to addiction, to how long the medication would need to be taken, to a few others.

What I see is not parents putting their kids on meds to keep them from being severely depressed - I see parents putting their kids on meds so that their kids have an easier time being "nice."

I am not trying to sound judgmental, but it does sound very mind-controlly, hell it *is* very mind-controlly.

 

[dilloduck]

I can think of a few reasons from not wanting to drug up a person (especially a kid) if you aren't sure they need it, to addiction, to how long the medication would need to be taken, to a few others.

What I see is not parents putting their kids on meds to keep them from being severely depressed - I see parents putting their kids on meds so that their kids have an easier time being "nice."

I am not trying to sound judgmental, but it does sound very mind-controlly, hell it *is* very mind-controlly.

and un-mavericky too.

 

[Valerie]

All medications have contraindications. Many are given to people who really don't need them, and that applies to meds given for physical aliments as well as psychological ones.

What really needs to be stopped is the constant hawking of prescription medications on TV. Shouldn't you ask your doctor? No, my doctor should know which medication, if any, is indicated.

You're right. These pharma companies are ridiculous. There's a pill for everything! And there is so much waste in the system, I don't know where to begin. This screening of children is a redundancy. Children are already screened...by their doctors and parents. These decisions are private and should not be brought into the realm of government.

 

[eots]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v2P9CklV3dc&feature=related]YouTube - Attention Deficit Disorder Not a Disease[/ame]