Looks like they might have got Sinwar......Graphic

[Sherlock Holmes]

He wants to pretend that his anti Semitism isn’t noticed when he claims it is only anti Zionism.

Why is it that I know more than you about Zionism, Israeli history, antisemitism, the UN, the history of Zionism, British colonialism, Middle East Arab history - than you do, yet you keep attacking me?

Try shutting your deafening and cavernous oral cavity and learn from me.

 

[Shusha]

So how would you discuss an ideology? is there such a thing as an evil ideology?

Primarily I challenge claims that I see in this forum that I regard as untrue or immoral, that's really what I do here.

So, you don't want to discuss conduct, you want to discuss ideology. And further you want to apply that ideology to a collective group of people. And further you believe you can do that accurately.

 

[Sherlock Holmes]

So, you don't want to discuss conduct, you want to discuss ideology. And further you want to apply that ideology to a collective group of people. And further you believe you can do that accurately.

Where did I say that I "don't want to discuss conduct"? I asked you a question but you don't seem to want to answer it.

There are behaviors that are inherent within ideologies, characteristics of ideologies, things most adherents of an ideology accept, and do not fight against.

One can discuss aggregates when that level of abstraction helps. We could discuss the history of the Nazi party in Germany purely by only discussing individuals and their actions and make no reference to shared ideas and shared beliefs. But if you want to do that then you're basically saying that ideas and beliefs don't exist, can't be discussed.

Abstractions are part of human reasoning, we create and speak at an abstract level all the time in the sciences and the arts and in politics.

If told Himmler and Heydrich were both senior Nazis, would that convey anything? would knowing the beliefs of Himmler but not Heydrich allow us to draw any reasonable inferences about the beliefs Heydrich?

 

[Shusha]

Where did I say that I "don't want to discuss conduct"? I asked you a question but you don't seem to want to answer it.

This question?

is there such a thing as an evil ideology?

Yes. I believe there is such a thing as an evil ideology.

 

[Sherlock Holmes]

This question?

Yes. I believe there is such a thing as an evil ideology.

Is this an example of an evil ideology?

 

[Shusha]

Is this an example of an evil ideology?

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What do you think the ideology is and who holds it?

 

[Sherlock Holmes]

What do you think the ideology is and who holds it?

Do you need that information in order to answer my question?

 

[Shusha]

Do you need that information in order to answer my question?

I do. Because I believe you and I will take the (mis)information presented in your post and claim that it represents different ideologies. I need to know which one you are working with.

 

[Sherlock Holmes]

I do. Because I believe you and I will take the (mis)information presented in your post and claim that it represents different ideologies.

Why does the name of the ideology matter? if you saw a group of men beating Jews in the street in Germany in 1937 would you need to know whether the men were or were not Nazis in order to decide if you were witnessing evil?

If you have to think about this, then yes, you and I do indeed very much differ.

 

[Shusha]

Why does the name of the ideology matter? if you saw a man beating Jews in the street in Germany in 1937 would you need to know whether the men were or were not Nazis in order to decide if you were witnessing evil?

I don't need a name. I just what ideology you think is operating in the example you gave and who holds that ideology.

Example: Jews believe all Arabs in Gaza must be killed because Arabs are inherently and irredeemably evil.
Example: The current government of Israel believes that Israel is under existential threat from multiple terrorist organizations and is justly defending its sovereign territory and citizens within the confines of international law.

 

[Sherlock Holmes]

I don't need a name. I just what ideology you think is operating in the example you gave and who holds that ideology.

Example: Jews believe all Arabs in Gaza must be killed because Arabs are inherently and irredeemably evil.
Example: The current government of Israel believes that Israel is under existential threat from multiple terrorist organizations and is justly defending its sovereign territory and citizens within the confines of international law.

Well that means then that the killing taking place in Gaza would be deemed as evil by you IF the government of Israel were misleading people or were simply wrong, about the veracity of there being and existential threat to the people of Israel as the justification for what's taking place as I write, in Northern Gaza?

Do you agree?

 

[Sherlock Holmes]

People care, many people care, I care. To be expected to care about Jews being exterminated by Germans yet not care when Jews appear to be exterminating Palestinians is not something an honest decent principled human being can do, some people can do it, I'm not one of them.

I privately studied the history of the Third Reich in my late teens, I spent a lot of hours reading and learning about that. Part of that education was to learn how an entire people lent their support to the German authorities, what they were told in order for them to become not only accepting but supportive of their governments actions.

Once you've studied that and come to understand the hold that governments have over people and how they carefully manage that in order to maintain that control then it's not very hard to recognize that when you see it happening.

I see it with many here (not you) but many Americans. They have a firm unearned trust in the words of the Israeli government, they believe what the Israelis say and once they have adopted that belief they then believe ANYTHING the Israelis say.

You have no excuse here, you surely understand what many Israelis are saying and that is Netanyahu WANTS THE WAR for reasons that are nothing to do with the reasons he claims to want the war - this is all over the news in Israel and has been for months.

Therefore it's pretty clear lies are being told...

 

[Shusha]

People care, many people care, I care. To be expected to care about Jews being exterminated by Germans yet not care when Jews appear to be exterminating Palestinians is not something an honest decent principled human being can do, some people can do it, I'm not one of them.

See, I think we (you and I) have a fundamental disagreement about facts, and not necessarily about a moral ideology. Obviously, we agree that extermination of a peoples is an evil ideology. Where we disagree is whether or not an extermination is occurring.

 

[Shusha]

You have no excuse here, you surely understand what many Israelis are saying and that is Netanyahu WANTS THE WAR for reasons that are nothing to do with the reasons he claims to want the war - this is all over the news in Israel and has been for months.

The Israelis I am speaking with believe that Netanyahu wants the war for the same reason they all want the war -- never again will there be an attack against Jews in Israel on the scale of October 7. If Netanyahu wants something else as well, it is a secondary and minor point.

 

[BackAgain]

All those words and nasty vitriol yet nothing really said, so typical of you, just effete foot stamping and tantrums.

Still can’t manage to discuss the actual topic without your perpetual spin and total dishonesty.

That’s fully expected. We all see you for what you are, Shitbag Homeless.

 

[BackAgain]

Why is it that I know more than you about Zionism, Israeli history, antisemitism, the UN, the history of Zionism, British colonialism, Middle East Arab history - than you do,

You don’t. But you’re a scumbag anti Semite.

yet you keep attacking me?

You’re also a lightweight fairy.

Need more Mido!?

Try shutting your deafening and cavernous oral cavity and learn from me.

Nobody could learn from an ignorant dishonest bigot piece of shit like you.

So eat shit, stfu and practice dying.

 

[Sherlock Holmes]

Still can’t manage to discuss the actual topic without your perpetual spin and total dishonesty.

Care to support that accusation with evidence? give us all an example of one of my "lies"?

That’s fully expected. We all see you for what you are, Shitbag Homeless.

You can always ignore me.

 

[Sherlock Holmes]

You don’t. But you’re a scumbag anti Semite.


You’re also a lightweight fairy.

Need more Mido!?


Nobody could learn from an ignorant dishonest bigot piece of shit like you.

So eat shit, stfu and practice dying.

Odd, you write "still can’t manage to discuss the actual topic" yet you never discuss the actual topic, all you do is complain about and insult people who don't share your views, that's called intolerance by the way something I see regularly in MAGA cultists.

 

[Roudy]

Any open minded seeker after truth (of which you are not an example) can find the evidence for themselves if they truly want to see it. Something as simple as this is a way to get that moving, they don't need me or you as the source of truth they just need to grasp that you are a liar and a bigot and that will soon become clear once they do start searching and form their own opinion.

Understand you deranged neo-Nazi, I am not here to seek your approval or agreement, your own words and your own "arguments" prove my case, YOU are the evidence, so think about that you stone age throwback, you are no match for Sherlock Holmes. I am better than you, I am nicer than you, I am more honest than you and I am more intelligent than you - get over it and move on.

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Oh wow! It is literate enough to know how to use a search engine! Who woulda thunk it?!

Now who’s going to tell it that search engine results don’t mean jack shit?!

 

[Roudy]

toomuchtime_ Shusha

This is a product of Israel's "liberal democracy" the fact that people at the TV studio worked to produce and air such filth cannot be blamed on others. This was a premeditated planned act, this is the true face of Zionism, this is what the society is like and has been like since as far back as WW1 - Jews expressing hatred toward non-Jews, an attitude and ideology alien to the Levant until the British and their extremist Zionist colonizers brought it over from Christian Europe.

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I wonder what happened to all the occupants of Gaza that were celebrating and cheering for the savagery and barbarism of Oct. 7 by Hamas? Many of the animals even joined in on the savagery, and spat in the hostages and dead bodies as they were being brought in.

…hard to feel sorry for such depraved deranged people.