Looks like Tea Party was right about Obamacare. America owes them an apology

[TyroneSlothrop]

Hey stupid. Obozo doesn't count all the trillions of $ he's borrowed from the federal reserve and given to the banks!!! He says we borrowed it from ouselves so it shouldn't count, ignoring the fact that the federal reserve is a cartel of PRIVATE banks. And the PPP lets himi get away with it.

You Mad bro...

 

[TooTall]

Anyone who is still going to college when they are 23 is either in grad school, milking it or too stupid to be there. And you bet your ass it costs extra to have kids and young adults on your policy.

I'll bet it's more expensive for a 23 year old to get individual coverage than it is to stay on a family plan, if the coverages are equal.

my son at 23 was able to get his own policy 2 years ago for the amount of $60 a month, free preventative, low co-pays, and deductible of $500. And it reduced our policy by $200 a month.

Sounds good. Now, please let us know what happens when Obamacare becomes effective next year.

 

[TooTall]

You're paying for 100% of the people who show up at the County and City clinics and emergency rooms. Preventative healthcare will reduce those numbers. Keep in mind that in many cases it's not 20 y/o adults who show up after not going to the doctor for several years even though they could; it's 10 y/o girls who have high fever whose parents wanted to but couldn't afford insurance. Now instead of that ER visit, they'll have the ability to go to scheduled doctor visits to catch problems before they result in acute care having to be delivered.

I never was able to schedule a high fever in my girls or boys.

Did the telephone stump you there, stupid?

They usually woke us up in the middle of the night. How many doctors do you know that are able to take an unscheduled visit in the middle of the night, let alone during normal office hours? Since there will be many more patients waiting for appointments, and fewer doctors, a visit to the clinic or emergency room would be where I would and have taken my kids.

Yeah, more people going to the doctor is a bad thing. In the other post you said that nobody will be able to get health insurance because companies are bailing out...which is it today?

And somehow Kindred Hospital, Humana, Concentra, etc... are able to take walk-ins all the time.
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Kindred Healthcare - Facility Locator
Welcome to Kelsey-Seybold Clinic | Kelsey-Seybold Clinic

There is this thing called a hospital now. Will emergencies still happen? Sure. Except now instead of having to drive your kid to the County seat, you can go to your neighborhood hospital because you're covered.

Fewer doctors? Sure..whatever.

On edit: Since city and county clinics are paid for out of local taxes, I am sure my property tax will go down. Just thought I would insert a bit of humor in this post, because you know that ain't gonna happen.

No but the next County emergency room may not be built as soon or ever now with more people able to go to the private health system instead of county emergency rooms.

You lost the argument already.

You are the one that started the name calling fuckface. Now you resort to misquoting me.

I tried to call and schedule a fever in my kids, but the line was busy. Oh, you meant call the doctor at 3 AM. She told me to meet her at the emergency room dumbass!

So the next county emergency may not be built. LMFAO

You keep on with your faith in the government until the country is bankrupt if it makes you happy. I don't travel that road.

 

[TyroneSlothrop]

I never was able to schedule a high fever in my girls or boys.

Did the telephone stump you there, stupid?


Yeah, more people going to the doctor is a bad thing. In the other post you said that nobody will be able to get health insurance because companies are bailing out...which is it today?

And somehow Kindred Hospital, Humana, Concentra, etc... are able to take walk-ins all the time.
Concentra Location Finder - Map Search
Kindred Healthcare - Facility Locator
Welcome to Kelsey-Seybold Clinic | Kelsey-Seybold Clinic

There is this thing called a hospital now. Will emergencies still happen? Sure. Except now instead of having to drive your kid to the County seat, you can go to your neighborhood hospital because you're covered.

Fewer doctors? Sure..whatever.

On edit: Since city and county clinics are paid for out of local taxes, I am sure my property tax will go down. Just thought I would insert a bit of humor in this post, because you know that ain't gonna happen.

No but the next County emergency room may not be built as soon or ever now with more people able to go to the private health system instead of county emergency rooms.

You lost the argument already.

You are the one that started the name calling fuckface. Now you resort to misquoting me.

I tried to call and schedule a fever in my kids, but the line was busy. Oh, you meant call the doctor at 3 AM. She told me to meet her at the emergency room dumbass!

So the next county emergency may not be built. LMFAO

You keep on with your faith in the government until the country is bankrupt if it makes you happy. I don't travel that road.

 

[candycorn]

I never was able to schedule a high fever in my girls or boys.

Did the telephone stump you there, stupid?


Yeah, more people going to the doctor is a bad thing. In the other post you said that nobody will be able to get health insurance because companies are bailing out...which is it today?

And somehow Kindred Hospital, Humana, Concentra, etc... are able to take walk-ins all the time.
Concentra Location Finder - Map Search
Kindred Healthcare - Facility Locator
Welcome to Kelsey-Seybold Clinic | Kelsey-Seybold Clinic

There is this thing called a hospital now. Will emergencies still happen? Sure. Except now instead of having to drive your kid to the County seat, you can go to your neighborhood hospital because you're covered.

Fewer doctors? Sure..whatever.

On edit: Since city and county clinics are paid for out of local taxes, I am sure my property tax will go down. Just thought I would insert a bit of humor in this post, because you know that ain't gonna happen.

No but the next County emergency room may not be built as soon or ever now with more people able to go to the private health system instead of county emergency rooms.

You lost the argument already.

You are the one that started the name calling fuckface. Now you resort to misquoting me.

I tried to call and schedule a fever in my kids, but the line was busy. Oh, you meant call the doctor at 3 AM. She told me to meet her at the emergency room dumbass!

So the next county emergency may not be built. LMFAO

You keep on with your faith in the government until the country is bankrupt if it makes you happy. I don't travel that road.

So for what now, 40 years we've been supposedly on the verge of going bankrupt. Having faith in government has nothing to do with it; Having zero faith in the chronic "sky is falling" pussies like yourself is much more fun (and accurate).

Ya know...if you go to the emergency room there is probably already a doctor there. Just a note for future reference there, stupid.

 

[candycorn]

So lets stack up the qualifications:

Your opinion vs. the insurance companies.
Your opinion vs. their accountants, lawyers, advisors, board members, etc...
Your opinion vs. the millions of new policy holders they will get

Yeah...I'm pretty sure you're full of shit. Pick a position at some point and try to make a cognitive argument.

It is not my opinion that a number of insurance companies are backing out after learning about the hazards of believing a government scam. It is a fact!

It is not my opinion that the insurance companies are listening to their accountants, lawyers, board members, etc. and that is the reason they are limiting their participation in the government exchanges. It is a fact.

It is not my opinion that MOST of those NEW policy holders premiums will be paid by the federal government and they will get the money by increasing the taxes and premiums from those who already have policies. It is a fact.

Look in the mirror if you want to see a pile of shit.

I think you're twisting the facts a bit. Insurers are not backing out of the exchanges. They either didn't apply or were not certified. Aetna and Unitedhealth have issued statements as to why they're not participating in some of the state run exchanges and their reasons have nothing to do with their faith in the US government. The primary reason why these insurers are not registering in all states is they have little or no presence in the individual healthcare market in those states. There is considerable cost for a health insurance company to induce a new product in a state, building networks, opening offices, and meeting state insurance regulations.

In my state over a dozen companies applied but only 5 were accepted by the state insurance commission. However those companies offer 34 different plans. In some states, there are as many as 36 different companies on the their exchange.

​

It always cracks me up how you let these blowhards rant and rave then calmly retort with facts and figures.

 

[TyroneSlothrop]

How could a President/Congress double the national debt and this chart be an honest appraisal?

The same way as if you divorce and your ex spouse has left you bills that are now coming in and that spouse has subtracted from income by a tax cut so you have a double whammy to deal with...that is how that happens.. It is not that you are spending heavily and irresponsibly..

Hate to burst your bubble since you've really grown attached to your nice colored graph, but let's start things off with just ONE concrete fact that should help bring things into their proper perspective.

After the eight year term of President George W. Bush was up, the Iraq War cost taxpayers $820 BILLION dollars.
SOURCE - http://www.dpc.senate.gov/docs/fs-112-1-36.pdf

Now we look to the Obama stimulus bill which has the CBO estimate of $821 BILLION dollars.
SOURCE - CBO raises its stimulus cost estimate, again - Washington Times

Then to that you include the Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac blank checks, the Chevy Volt incentives, the prolonged unemployment extensions which brings in no federal revenue ( had this president use some intelligence to look to the pipeline construction from Canada for jobs instead of insisting on more unemployment checks ), oh we must not forget all those tax dollars wasted on green corporations that fell towards bankruptcy - Solyndra, US Geothermal, etc. You know ....... it's not really looking good for President Barrack Obama at this point, I think you should take the time to find a better graph.

The Iraq war is still going up in cost due to the medical care costs for vets, disability payments to veterans , the borrowing costs of the war which was not funded....the greatest deficit of all times was in Bush's last budget a $1.85 trillion deficit , the last JOKER left behind by huge failure 43...there had to be stimulus spending because Failure 43 left a steaming smoky pile of crap on the economy..then there were his tax cuts adding to the deficit...IT SIMPLY HAS NOT BEEN OBAMA INITIATIVES OR SPENDING DRIVING DEFICITS

 

[TyroneSlothrop]

I agree with Edgethro that it looks good on paper until the time comes with how it's to be implemented. To introduce a mandate where everyone is required to carry insurance becomes difficult to attain as there will always be those who fall through the cracks. Our nation can't even control our own boarders, yet we are asking the government to track all immigrants (illegal, or those with a green card), as well as those that are homeless, who become ill or injured and require care in our hospitals.

The issue of cost is another factor. Obamacare was sold under the promise of providing affordable health care. Yet there will still be many Americans that are too poor, or the countless unemployed effected by a huge loss in income with bills and obligations that don't change simply because they can't find work. Who covers their costs to provide coverage? What the government does is provide system that is nothing more than a shell game of hidden costs, diverted under the umbrella of another type of program. When someone provides a service and the bill is simply left at the table, as the grateful party simply turns and walks, someone ALWAYS has to be left to pick up the tab. Changing the system doesn't negate the problems in confronting cost. Rather we've traded uninsured patients who require treatment that raises the costs on the rest who HAVE coverage, to low income patients who now obtain their coverage divided amongst taxpayers who must acquire it FOR them among their taxable provisions. It's the government shell game, under the false premise that it will not add a cent to our debt or raise its costs onto the majority of Americans.

The only way to achieve 100% coverage is through a single payer system. The ACA will increase the number covered significantly but certainly not a 100%. Half the states, mostly red states who opted out of the expanded medicaid will create a coverage gap of over 5 million.

Although many of these states are considering offering the medicaid expansion or an alternative program, it will still create a large gap. The reason for states rejecting the expansion is political not funding. The federal government pays 100% of the expansion for the first few years and will gradually reduce federal funding to 90%.

Other coverage gaps will be unavoidable. As is the case now, employees changing jobs will have gaps in coverage. Also some employees will not be able to afford their employer offered coverage but will not meet the 8% income rule for use of the exchanges.

Since most of the costs of the ACA goes to subsidies and the Medicaid expansion, the less coverage the less financial impact on federal spending. The CBO cost estimate of $120 billion/yr for the ACA is based on 24 million enrollments on the healthcare exchanges and all states expanding medicaid. If these numbers are significantly lower, then so will be the impact on federal spending.

Counterpoint on ACA Medicaid Coverage Gap - NPQ - Nonprofit Quarterly

CBO | CBO?s Estimate of the Net Budgetary Impact of the Affordable Care Act?s Health Insurance Coverage Provisions Has Not Changed Much Over Time

Only a fool would believe any projected costs published by the government.

In 1965, the House Ways and Means Committee estimated that the hospital insurance program of Medicare - the federal health care program for the elderly and disabled - would cost $9 billion by 1990. The actual cost that year was $67 billion.

In 1967, the House Ways and Means Committee said the entire Medicare program would cost $12 billion in 1990. The actual cost in 1990 was $98 billion.

In 1987, Congress projected that Medicaid - the joint federal-state health care program for the poor - would make special relief payments to hospitals of less than $1 billion in 1992. Actual cost: $17 billion.

The list goes on. The 1993 cost of Medicare’s home care benefit was projected in 1988 to be $4 billion, but ended up at $10 billion. The State Children’s Health Insurance Program (SCHIP), which was created in 1997 and projected to cost $5 billion per year, has had to be supplemented with hundreds of millions of dollars annually by Congress.

Barely two weeks in office, Mr. Obama signed a $33 billion bill that will add 4 million mostly low-income children to the SCHIP program over the next 4 1/2 years.

 

[Flopper]

It is not my opinion that a number of insurance companies are backing out after learning about the hazards of believing a government scam. It is a fact!

It is not my opinion that the insurance companies are listening to their accountants, lawyers, board members, etc. and that is the reason they are limiting their participation in the government exchanges. It is a fact.

It is not my opinion that MOST of those NEW policy holders premiums will be paid by the federal government and they will get the money by increasing the taxes and premiums from those who already have policies. It is a fact.

Look in the mirror if you want to see a pile of shit.

I think you're twisting the facts a bit. Insurers are not backing out of the exchanges. They either didn't apply or were not certified. Aetna and Unitedhealth have issued statements as to why they're not participating in some of the state run exchanges and their reasons have nothing to do with their faith in the US government. The primary reason why these insurers are not registering in all states is they have little or no presence in the individual healthcare market in those states. There is considerable cost for a health insurance company to induce a new product in a state, building networks, opening offices, and meeting state insurance regulations.

In my state over a dozen companies applied but only 5 were accepted by the state insurance commission. However those companies offer 34 different plans. In some states, there are as many as 36 different companies on the their exchange.

​

It always cracks me up how you let these blowhards rant and rave then calmly retort with facts and figures.

It always amazes me to see how flexible facts become on the Internet.
A statement that some large healthcare insurers will not be registering on some state exchanges morphs into:
Large healthcare insurers abandoning state insurance exchanges
Large healthcare insurers backing off from Obamacare exchanges
Large healthcare insurers are no longer offering plans on exchanges because of their lack of faith in the administration.

When it comes to politics, most of what you read on the Internet is mostly wrong.

 

[depotoo]

I'll bet it's more expensive for a 23 year old to get individual coverage than it is to stay on a family plan, if the coverages are equal.

my son at 23 was able to get his own policy 2 years ago for the amount of $60 a month, free preventative, low co-pays, and deductible of $500. And it reduced our policy by $200 a month.

Prove that and you'll have made a point, of sorts.

You'll have to take my word for it, dear. It's been nice having that extra income each month.

And this is the sad fact of the matter, many young adults do not realize, because they never cared to inquire, that insurance used to be reasonable for them. Ours did, as we drove home the point you should carry insurance for yourself, if you do contract work and we taught them to take care of such matters for themselves.

 

[depotoo]

So lets stack up the qualifications:

Your opinion vs. the insurance companies.
Your opinion vs. their accountants, lawyers, advisors, board members, etc...
Your opinion vs. the millions of new policy holders they will get

Yeah...I'm pretty sure you're full of shit. Pick a position at some point and try to make a cognitive argument.

It is not my opinion that a number of insurance companies are backing out after learning about the hazards of believing a government scam. It is a fact!

It is not my opinion that the insurance companies are listening to their accountants, lawyers, board members, etc. and that is the reason they are limiting their participation in the government exchanges. It is a fact.

It is not my opinion that MOST of those NEW policy holders premiums will be paid by the federal government and they will get the money by increasing the taxes and premiums from those who already have policies. It is a fact.

Look in the mirror if you want to see a pile of shit.

I think you're twisting the facts a bit. Insurers are not backing out of the exchanges. They either didn't apply or were not certified. Aetna and Unitedhealth have issued statements as to why they're not participating in some of the state run exchanges and their reasons have nothing to do with their faith in the US government. The primary reason why these insurers are not registering in all states is they have little or no presence in the individual healthcare market in those states. There is considerable cost for a health insurance company to induce a new product in a state, building networks, opening offices, and meeting state insurance regulations.

In my state over a dozen companies applied but only 5 were accepted by the state insurance commission. However those companies offer 34 different plans. In some states, there are as many as 36 different companies on the their exchange.

Obamacare Exchange Down To Two Insurance Providers
Major Health Insurance Companies Leave Obamacare Exchanges | Western Free Press

 

[depotoo]

I'll bet it's more expensive for a 23 year old to get individual coverage than it is to stay on a family plan, if the coverages are equal.

my son at 23 was able to get his own policy 2 years ago for the amount of $60 a month, free preventative, low co-pays, and deductible of $500. And it reduced our policy by $200 a month.

Sounds good. Now, please let us know what happens when Obamacare becomes effective next year.

He is now working for a company that provides insurance and has a family, thus is on the family plan there. He was a contractor before, thus why he got his own policy.

 

[Neotrotsky]

Millions of Americans Are Losing Their Health Plans Because of Obamacare

But the president's promise is turning out to be false for millions of Americans who have had their health insurance policies canceled because they don't meet the requirements of the Affordable Care Act.
​

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KoV0NeHNklk][FLASHBACK] Obama: If you like your health care plan you can keep your health care plan - YouTube[/ame]

 

[depotoo]

Did the telephone stump you there, stupid?


Yeah, more people going to the doctor is a bad thing. In the other post you said that nobody will be able to get health insurance because companies are bailing out...which is it today?

And somehow Kindred Hospital, Humana, Concentra, etc... are able to take walk-ins all the time.
Concentra Location Finder - Map Search
Kindred Healthcare - Facility Locator
Welcome to Kelsey-Seybold Clinic | Kelsey-Seybold Clinic

There is this thing called a hospital now. Will emergencies still happen? Sure. Except now instead of having to drive your kid to the County seat, you can go to your neighborhood hospital because you're covered.

Fewer doctors? Sure..whatever.



No but the next County emergency room may not be built as soon or ever now with more people able to go to the private health system instead of county emergency rooms.

You lost the argument already.

You are the one that started the name calling fuckface. Now you resort to misquoting me.

I tried to call and schedule a fever in my kids, but the line was busy. Oh, you meant call the doctor at 3 AM. She told me to meet her at the emergency room dumbass!

So the next county emergency may not be built. LMFAO

You keep on with your faith in the government until the country is bankrupt if it makes you happy. I don't travel that road.

Obamacare Polls: Faith in Health Care Exchanges Eroding | TIME.com
Poll: Majority believe health-care Web site problems indicate broader issue with law

 

[ShaklesOfBigGov]

The same way as if you divorce and your ex spouse has left you bills that are now coming in and that spouse has subtracted from income by a tax cut so you have a double whammy to deal with...that is how that happens.. It is not that you are spending heavily and irresponsibily

Hate to burst your bubble since you've really grown attached to your nice colored graph, but let's start things off with just ONE concrete fact that should help bring things into their proper perspective.

After the eight year term of President George W. Bush was up, the Iraq War cost taxpayers $820 BILLION dollars.
SOURCE - http://www.dpc.senate.gov/docs/fs-112-1-36.pdf

Now we look to the Obama stimulus bill which has the CBO estimate of $821 BILLION dollars.
SOURCE - CBO raises its stimulus cost estimate, again - Washington Times

Then to that you include the Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac blank checks, the Chevy Volt incentives, the prolonged unemployment extensions which brings in no federal revenue ( had this president use some intelligence to look to the pipeline construction from Canada for jobs instead of insisting on more unemployment checks ), oh we must not forget all those tax dollars wasted on green corporations that fell towards bankruptcy - Solyndra, US Geothermal, etc. You know ....... it's not really looking good for President Barrack Obama at this point, I think you should take the time to find a better graph.

So the 800 billion you're saying that the stimulus cost, that the stimulus added to the defict?

Yes, I'm sure the stimulus was all about job creation to help boost the economy. There is no way this President would even THINK of wasting our taxpayer dollars like he did with Solyndra, right?


• $2 billion earmark to restart FutureGen, a near-zero emissions coal power plant in Illinois that the Dept. of Energy defunded last year because the project was inefficient

• $246 million tax break for Hollywood movie producers to buy motion picture film.

• $650 million for the digital television converter box coupon program.

• $88 million for the Coast Guard to design a new polar icebreaker (arctic ship).

• $600 million to buy hybrid vehicles for federal employees.

• $75 million for “smoking cessation activities.”

• $25 million for tribal alcohol and substance abuse reduction.

• $500 million for flood reduction projects on the Mississippi River.

• $10 million to inspect canals in urban areas.

• $650 million for wildland fire management on forest service lands.

• $1.2 billion for “youth activities,” including youth summer job programs.

• $160 million for “paid volunteers” at the Corporation for National and Community Service.If they are paid they are not volunteers, they are called employees.

• $5.5 million for “energy efficiency initiatives” at the Department of Veterans Affairs National Cemetery Administration. Electric hearses?? .. or are we talking about electric lawn mowers here?

• $100 million for reducing the hazard of lead-based paint. Are you serious? This is what we need to be spending our money on to improve our economy?

• $75M to construct a new "security training" facility for State Dept Security officers when they can be trained at existing facilities of other agencies.


• $110 million to the Farm Service Agency to upgrade computer systems.

• $88 Million - for renovating the headquarters of the Public Health Services. I wouldn't think of renovating my OWN house until I knew I could afford it

• $200 million in funding for the lease of alternative energy vehicles for use on military installations. They are soldiers who march from building to building, and Michelle Obama has also been promoting the need for MORE people to be physically fit.

• Unspecified assistance for "nonambulatory cattle"

SOURCES:
GOP Reveals Obama Stimulus Plan Waste: Stimulus Plan Is Full Of Pork Projects » Right Pundits

Newsweek's Hirsh on Stimulus: Don't Worry About Pork, This is an 'Emergency' | NewsBusters

What GOP Leaders deem wasteful in Senate stimulus bill - CNN.com


Then there is the repeated attempts to pour more money into Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac

June 23, 2010

The cost of fixing Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, the mortgage companies that last year bought or guaranteed three-quarters of all U.S. home loans, will be at least $160 billion and could grow to as much as $1 trillion after the biggest bailout in American history.

So you want to blame the 2009 and 2010 deficits on the Democratic House,

but 2011, 2012, and 2013, those deficits you want to blame on Obama because the Republicans took the House in 2010?

lol, do you consider yourself one of the smarter inmates around here?

Obama may pout and cry all he wants, over what he wants to see in HIS idea of another stimulus plan. However, any plans of what this President wants to see has to meet the approval of the House. I thought you understood the basics of how our Governmet works? Do you honestly believe the Republicans are going to allow ANOTHER stimulus bill like that one above to pass the House? Come on NYCarbineer, I thought you would have more common sense than this? You don't appear to be the most intelligent liberal in the bunch.

The Iraq war is still going up in cost due to the medical care costs for vets, disability payments to veterans , the borrowing costs of the war which was not funded....the greatest deficit of all times was in Bush's last budget a $1.85 trillion deficit , the last JOKER left behind by huge failure 43...there had to be stimulus spending because Failure 43 left a steaming smoky pile of crap on the economy..then there were his tax cuts adding to the deficit...IT SIMPLY HAS NOT BEEN OBAMA INITIATIVES OR SPENDING DRIVING DEFICITS

When are you going to start providing me with some concrete figures you can actually back up, instead of simply pulling your own figures right out of your ass?

 

[Neotrotsky]

No comrade

facts from Daily Kos and Maddow
are the truth

 

[TooTall]

So lets stack up the qualifications:

Your opinion vs. the insurance companies.
Your opinion vs. their accountants, lawyers, advisors, board members, etc...
Your opinion vs. the millions of new policy holders they will get

Yeah...I'm pretty sure you're full of shit. Pick a position at some point and try to make a cognitive argument.

It is not my opinion that a number of insurance companies are backing out after learning about the hazards of believing a government scam. It is a fact!

It is not my opinion that the insurance companies are listening to their accountants,lawyers, board members, etc. and that is the reason they are limiting their participation in the government exchanges. It is a fact.

It is not my opinion that MOST of those NEW policy holders premiums will be paid by the federal government and they will get the money by increasing the taxes and premiums from those who already have policies. It is a fact.

Look in the mirror if you want to see a pile of shit.

I think you're twisting the facts a bit. Insurers are not backing out of the exchanges. They either didn't apply or were not certified. Aetna and Unitedhealth have issued statements as to why they're not participating in some of the state run exchanges and their reasons have nothing to do with their faith in the US government. The primary reason why these insurers are not registering in all states is they have little or no presence in the individual healthcare market in those states. There is considerable cost for a health insurance company to induce a new product in a state, building networks, opening offices, and meeting state insurance regulations.

In my state over a dozen companies applied but only 5 were accepted by the state insurance commission. However those companies offer 34 different plans. In some states, there are as many as 36 different companies on the their exchange.

Point taken. I may have overstated my case on the reasons some insurance companies are not participating in some markets.

If I ran a health insurance company I would most certainly not publicly blame government policy since one does not bite the hand that feeds it.

Some other excuse would be given

 

[TooTall]

So lets stack up the qualifications:

Your opinion vs. the insurance companies.
Your opinion vs. their accountants, lawyers, advisors, board members, etc...
Your opinion vs. the millions of new policy holders they will get

Yeah...I'm pretty sure you're full of shit. Pick a position at some point and try to make a cognitive argument.

It is not my opinion that a number of insurance companies are backing out after learning about the hazards of believing a government scam. It is a fact!

It is not my opinion that the insurance companies are listening to their accountants, lawyers, board members, etc. and that is the reason they are limiting their participation in the government exchanges. It is a fact.

It is not my opinion that MOST of those NEW policy holders premiums will be paid by the federal government and they will get the money by increasing the taxes and premiums from those who already have policies. It is a fact.

Yet if you were to log on to healthcare.gov, you'd see plan after plan listed...Amazing that they're there if what you are saying were true.

Like most conservatives, you have a very casual relationship to the truth. Again, you should buy a mirror so you can debate yourself. You seem really confused.

It looks like 6 Democrat Senators who voted for Obamacare are bailing out. Does that 'delay for a year' ring a bell in your hollow head? Hint, Republican House bill sent to the Senate and returned without the delay.

--"Red state Democrats propose changes to Obamacare," by Burgess Everett and Seung Min: "Sen. Joe Manchin (D-W.Va.) is taking the strongest tack among Senate Democrats, writing legislation with Sen. Johnny Isakson (R-Ga.) to delay for a year the individual mandate's enforcement mechanism - a $95 fine for anyone who doesn't enroll in health insurance by March 31. Manchin is even taking the full rollout and explanation of his legislation to an unusual venue for a Democrat: Bill O'Reilly's show [tonight] ... Democrats facing difficult reelection campaigns in 2014 - Sens. Mark Pryor of Arkansas, Mary Landrieu of Louisiana, Kay Hagan of North Carolina and Mark Begich of Alaska - came out on Wednesday evening in support of extending the open enrollment period of the law, as first proposed by Sen. Jeanne Shaheen of New Hampshire, who is also up for reelection in 2014."

Red state Democrats propose changes to Obamacare - Burgess Everett and Seung Min Kim - POLITICO.com

 

[candycorn]

It is not my opinion that a number of insurance companies are backing out after learning about the hazards of believing a government scam. It is a fact!

It is not my opinion that the insurance companies are listening to their accountants, lawyers, board members, etc. and that is the reason they are limiting their participation in the government exchanges. It is a fact.

It is not my opinion that MOST of those NEW policy holders premiums will be paid by the federal government and they will get the money by increasing the taxes and premiums from those who already have policies. It is a fact.

Yet if you were to log on to healthcare.gov, you'd see plan after plan listed...Amazing that they're there if what you are saying were true.

Like most conservatives, you have a very casual relationship to the truth. Again, you should buy a mirror so you can debate yourself. You seem really confused.

It looks like 6 Democrat Senators who voted for Obamacare are bailing out. Does that 'delay for a year' ring a bell in your hollow head? Hint, Republican House bill sent to the Senate and returned without the delay.

--"Red state Democrats propose changes to Obamacare," by Burgess Everett and Seung Min: "Sen. Joe Manchin (D-W.Va.) is taking the strongest tack among Senate Democrats, writing legislation with Sen. Johnny Isakson (R-Ga.) to delay for a year the individual mandate's enforcement mechanism - a $95 fine for anyone who doesn't enroll in health insurance by March 31. Manchin is even taking the full rollout and explanation of his legislation to an unusual venue for a Democrat: Bill O'Reilly's show [tonight] ... Democrats facing difficult reelection campaigns in 2014 - Sens. Mark Pryor of Arkansas, Mary Landrieu of Louisiana, Kay Hagan of North Carolina and Mark Begich of Alaska - came out on Wednesday evening in support of extending the open enrollment period of the law, as first proposed by Sen. Jeanne Shaheen of New Hampshire, who is also up for reelection in 2014."

Red state Democrats propose changes to Obamacare - Burgess Everett and Seung Min Kim - POLITICO.com

Closing your business for remodeling is one thing.
Closing your business because you refuse to pay extortion is another.

 

[candycorn]

It is not my opinion that a number of insurance companies are backing out after learning about the hazards of believing a government scam. It is a fact!

It is not my opinion that the insurance companies are listening to their accountants,lawyers, board members, etc. and that is the reason they are limiting their participation in the government exchanges. It is a fact.

It is not my opinion that MOST of those NEW policy holders premiums will be paid by the federal government and they will get the money by increasing the taxes and premiums from those who already have policies. It is a fact.

Look in the mirror if you want to see a pile of shit.

I think you're twisting the facts a bit. Insurers are not backing out of the exchanges. They either didn't apply or were not certified. Aetna and Unitedhealth have issued statements as to why they're not participating in some of the state run exchanges and their reasons have nothing to do with their faith in the US government. The primary reason why these insurers are not registering in all states is they have little or no presence in the individual healthcare market in those states. There is considerable cost for a health insurance company to induce a new product in a state, building networks, opening offices, and meeting state insurance regulations.

In my state over a dozen companies applied but only 5 were accepted by the state insurance commission. However those companies offer 34 different plans. In some states, there are as many as 36 different companies on the their exchange.

Point taken. I may have overstated my case on the reasons some insurance companies are not participating in some markets.

If I ran a health insurance company I would most certainly not publicly blame government policy since one does not bite the hand that feeds it.

Some other excuse would be given

Earlier you said that they were bailing out. Then (in the next post I think) you said that emergency rooms would be flooded with new policy holders.

What is your stance today?