Let's unpack some of the right wing's delusion and dishonesty. Is universal healthcare socialism?

[Concerned American]

Well, my 100% Swedish wife of 44 years and those Canadian nurses that are rushing to our US hospitals tend to prove your assumption wrong.

That's not my assessment; it's the assessment of those nations. They don't think they're socialist nations. They think they're capitalist nations with social safety nets.

Geez, you ought to take that mind reading thing on the road. You might not feel the need to be a parasite anymore. How do YOU know what THEY think. SMH

 

[Meister]

Underneath all the noise is the simple fact that Trump lied and the GOP lied when they said they had a replacement for Obamacare.

All the bitching in the world about "socialism" will not obscure that very real fact.

And that is why we are going to have UHC in our lifetimes.

Thanks a lot, assholes.

Waaah waah waah Obammycare got healthcare welfare for a few at increased cost to the rest of us....just like every other liberal program ever created. It doesnt need a replacement it needs an elimination.

You, along with most people in this thread, are missing g5000's point. He's not a fan of Obamacare, he's not in favor of UHC. He's just (rightfully, my view) blaming Republicans for allowing it to happen. They've done an incredibly bad job of standing up for limited government.

The President had only 4 years not 8, and all of it spent fighting off the wacko attacks on his presidency so not sure what you expected. With another term I am sure he could have rid the country of yet another anti American program like Obammycare.

ACA was passed in 2010. That was ten years ago. Republicans have had all that time to come up with a better way to fix the broken health care market. And frankly, they should have come up with something before it was even passed. They failed. Miserably.

Failed what? If you are talking about the high cost of medicines and hospital service then Obammycare only made that worse. As for anything else people can either choose healthcare for their family or get Iphones and Ipads instead, theeir choice.

Failed to address the fact that health care prices are artificially inflated - inflated beyond the means of the average health care consumer. Something is wrong with this picture.

Markets don’t work in healthcare...

Yes. You mentioned that, once or twice.

That’s what’s wrong with the picture.

Yeah. Thing is, that kind of claim doesn't even make any sense to me. I think that's because I don't look at a free market an institution with specific goals, or an other means to evaluate whether it "works" or not. A free market is just people, freely collaborating, trading goods and services as they see fit. Saying free markets don't work is like saying "freedom doesn't work".

And a sick person is not capable of making good buying decisions. Free markets do work, but not for healthcare.

Again, I don't know what you mean by "work". Are you presuming that the purpose of a free market is to provide people with their needs? And if someone can't get what they need the market has failed?

You don’t understand markets?

PIss off.

Markets don’t work for healthcare. Once you figure that out you will see universal is only real option.

From what I've seen in other countries, government doesn't work for healthcare either, now what?

 

[dblack]

Again, I don't know what you mean by "work". Are you presuming that the purpose of a free market is to provide people with their needs? And if someone can't get what they need the market has failed?

You don’t understand markets?

PIss off.

Markets don’t work for healthcare. Once you figure that out you will see universal is only real option.

Listen, asswipe, I ask you above for clarification on what you mean by "work for healthcare" and you declined to answer, choosing instead to insult me. If want to continue the conversation, start with answering those questions. Until you do, the statement you keep chanting, "Markets don't work for healthcare", has no meaning.

Again:

Healthcare costs just go up, markets have no downward pressure on healthcare. The guy in an ambulance can’t shop a cheaper price so they just charge more and more...

Again, I don't know what you mean by "work". Are you presuming that the purpose of a free market is to provide people with their needs? And if someone can't get what they need the market has failed?

You are really slow. If there is no downward pressure on pricing, then markets aren’t working. It’s more of a monopoly situation and prices just increase. Competition is important in markets. Again the guy in an ambulance isn’t shopping around. What don’t you get?

There's no downward pressure because no one is paying for their own health care. They've been herded, by government, into employer-provided, group health insurance that obliterates all normal market dynamics - actually turns them upside down so that health care consumers have incentive to choose the more expensive option at every opportunity.

But you're still ignoring my question. Is it that you don't understand it? Or that you just don't want to talk about it? What are you so afraid of? If you're going to claim that markets don't "work" for health care, you need to say what that means. What would it mean for a market to "work"? You seem to be assuming that the purpose of a market is provide everyone with their needs. You don't seem to want to admit that though. Why are you such a chickenshit about it? Can't you just have an honest conversation without all the evasion?

 

[Norman]

Universal health care is mostly stupidity. It's a massive income transfer from the working people, to mostly women and single mothers. It is pure parasitism, which is why the OP is of course all over it.

It's seriously destructive to give the proceeds of a working man to a woman without proper payment, devaluing the work and also making it very difficult to honestly succeed. Meanwhile the women who are getting everything for free embrace stupidity and above all - will never have families or get a man - there is no need - government is daddy!

 

[Concerned American]

Underneath all the noise is the simple fact that Trump lied and the GOP lied when they said they had a replacement for Obamacare.

All the bitching in the world about "socialism" will not obscure that very real fact.

And that is why we are going to have UHC in our lifetimes.

Thanks a lot, assholes.

Waaah waah waah Obammycare got healthcare welfare for a few at increased cost to the rest of us....just like every other liberal program ever created. It doesnt need a replacement it needs an elimination.

You, along with most people in this thread, are missing g5000's point. He's not a fan of Obamacare, he's not in favor of UHC. He's just (rightfully, my view) blaming Republicans for allowing it to happen. They've done an incredibly bad job of standing up for limited government.

The President had only 4 years not 8, and all of it spent fighting off the wacko attacks on his presidency so not sure what you expected. With another term I am sure he could have rid the country of yet another anti American program like Obammycare.

ACA was passed in 2010. That was ten years ago. Republicans have had all that time to come up with a better way to fix the broken health care market. And frankly, they should have come up with something before it was even passed. They failed. Miserably.

Failed what? If you are talking about the high cost of medicines and hospital service then Obammycare only made that worse. As for anything else people can either choose healthcare for their family or get Iphones and Ipads instead, theeir choice.

Failed to address the fact that health care prices are artificially inflated - inflated beyond the means of the average health care consumer. Something is wrong with this picture.

Markets don’t work in healthcare...

Yes. You mentioned that, once or twice.

That’s what’s wrong with the picture.

Yeah. Thing is, that kind of claim doesn't even make any sense to me. I think that's because I don't look at a free market an institution with specific goals, or an other means to evaluate whether it "works" or not. A free market is just people, freely collaborating, trading goods and services as they see fit. Saying free markets don't work is like saying "freedom doesn't work".

And a sick person is not capable of making good buying decisions. Free markets do work, but not for healthcare.

Again, I don't know what you mean by "work". Are you presuming that the purpose of a free market is to provide people with their needs? And if someone can't get what they need the market has failed?

You don’t understand markets?

PIss off.

Markets don’t work for healthcare. Once you figure that out you will see universal is only real option.

From what I've seen in other countries, government doesn't work for healthcare either, now what?

I haven't seen a great deal of people breaking down the doors of those socialist countries to get their healthcare either. Wish that was the case here. None of those socialist SJW mental midgets seem eager to go to their utopias either.

 

[Brain357]

Again, I don't know what you mean by "work". Are you presuming that the purpose of a free market is to provide people with their needs? And if someone can't get what they need the market has failed?

You don’t understand markets?

PIss off.

Markets don’t work for healthcare. Once you figure that out you will see universal is only real option.

Listen, asswipe, I ask you above for clarification on what you mean by "work for healthcare" and you declined to answer, choosing instead to insult me. If want to continue the conversation, start with answering those questions. Until you do, the statement you keep chanting, "Markets don't work for healthcare", has no meaning.

Again:

Healthcare costs just go up, markets have no downward pressure on healthcare. The guy in an ambulance can’t shop a cheaper price so they just charge more and more...

Again, I don't know what you mean by "work". Are you presuming that the purpose of a free market is to provide people with their needs? And if someone can't get what they need the market has failed?

You are really slow. If there is no downward pressure on pricing, then markets aren’t working. It’s more of a monopoly situation and prices just increase. Competition is important in markets. Again the guy in an ambulance isn’t shopping around. What don’t you get?

There's no downward pressure because no one is paying for their own health care. They've been herded, by government, into employer-provided, group health insurance that obliterates all normal market dynamics - actually turns them upside down so that health care consumers have incentive to choose the more expensive option at every opportunity.

But you're still ignoring my question. Is it that you don't understand it? Or that you just don't want to talk about it? What are you so afraid of? If you're going to claim that markets don't "work" for health care, you need to say what that means. What would it mean for a market to "work"? You seem to be assuming that the purpose of a market is provide everyone with their needs. You don't seem to want to admit that though. Why are you such a chickenshit about it? Can't you just have an honest conversation without all the evasion?

I’ve explained it several times. The number of emergency room patients in a day is dependent on the number of sudden illnesses and accidents. What they charge has no effect. So the price goes up and up. Markets don’t work for healthcare.

 

[Brain357]

Underneath all the noise is the simple fact that Trump lied and the GOP lied when they said they had a replacement for Obamacare.

All the bitching in the world about "socialism" will not obscure that very real fact.

And that is why we are going to have UHC in our lifetimes.

Thanks a lot, assholes.

Waaah waah waah Obammycare got healthcare welfare for a few at increased cost to the rest of us....just like every other liberal program ever created. It doesnt need a replacement it needs an elimination.

You, along with most people in this thread, are missing g5000's point. He's not a fan of Obamacare, he's not in favor of UHC. He's just (rightfully, my view) blaming Republicans for allowing it to happen. They've done an incredibly bad job of standing up for limited government.

The President had only 4 years not 8, and all of it spent fighting off the wacko attacks on his presidency so not sure what you expected. With another term I am sure he could have rid the country of yet another anti American program like Obammycare.

ACA was passed in 2010. That was ten years ago. Republicans have had all that time to come up with a better way to fix the broken health care market. And frankly, they should have come up with something before it was even passed. They failed. Miserably.

Failed what? If you are talking about the high cost of medicines and hospital service then Obammycare only made that worse. As for anything else people can either choose healthcare for their family or get Iphones and Ipads instead, theeir choice.

Failed to address the fact that health care prices are artificially inflated - inflated beyond the means of the average health care consumer. Something is wrong with this picture.

Markets don’t work in healthcare...

Yes. You mentioned that, once or twice.

That’s what’s wrong with the picture.

Yeah. Thing is, that kind of claim doesn't even make any sense to me. I think that's because I don't look at a free market an institution with specific goals, or an other means to evaluate whether it "works" or not. A free market is just people, freely collaborating, trading goods and services as they see fit. Saying free markets don't work is like saying "freedom doesn't work".

And a sick person is not capable of making good buying decisions. Free markets do work, but not for healthcare.

Again, I don't know what you mean by "work". Are you presuming that the purpose of a free market is to provide people with their needs? And if someone can't get what they need the market has failed?

You don’t understand markets?

PIss off.

Markets don’t work for healthcare. Once you figure that out you will see universal is only real option.

From what I've seen in other countries, government doesn't work for healthcare either, now what?

I haven't seen a great deal of people breaking down the doors of those socialist countries to get their healthcare either. Wish that was the case here. None of those socialist SJW mental midgets seem eager to go to their utopias either.

Rand Paul Goes to Canada for Surgery

A U.S. senator is going to Canada for surgery, and it may be far cheaper than the cost for surgery in the United States. Many Americans are opting to go abroad for healthcare in the hopes of paying less.

www.healthline.com

 

[Anomalism]

Geez, you ought to take that mind reading thing on the road. You might not feel the need to be a parasite anymore. How do YOU know what THEY think. SMH

It's really not hard to find information like that if you know how to look for it.

 

[Concerned American]

Geez, you ought to take that mind reading thing on the road. You might not feel the need to be a parasite anymore. How do YOU know what THEY think. SMH

It's really not hard to find information like that if you know how to look for it.

Yeah, I know your mind readers, Pew, Gallup, Reuter's--the ones that hang out outside of the welfare offices to get conservative viewpoints. LOL. You're ridiculous.

 

[dblack]

Again, I don't know what you mean by "work". Are you presuming that the purpose of a free market is to provide people with their needs? And if someone can't get what they need the market has failed?

You don’t understand markets?

PIss off.

Markets don’t work for healthcare. Once you figure that out you will see universal is only real option.

Listen, asswipe, I ask you above for clarification on what you mean by "work for healthcare" and you declined to answer, choosing instead to insult me. If want to continue the conversation, start with answering those questions. Until you do, the statement you keep chanting, "Markets don't work for healthcare", has no meaning.

Again:

Healthcare costs just go up, markets have no downward pressure on healthcare. The guy in an ambulance can’t shop a cheaper price so they just charge more and more...

Again, I don't know what you mean by "work". Are you presuming that the purpose of a free market is to provide people with their needs? And if someone can't get what they need the market has failed?

You are really slow. If there is no downward pressure on pricing, then markets aren’t working. It’s more of a monopoly situation and prices just increase. Competition is important in markets. Again the guy in an ambulance isn’t shopping around. What don’t you get?

There's no downward pressure because no one is paying for their own health care. They've been herded, by government, into employer-provided, group health insurance that obliterates all normal market dynamics - actually turns them upside down so that health care consumers have incentive to choose the more expensive option at every opportunity.

But you're still ignoring my question. Is it that you don't understand it? Or that you just don't want to talk about it? What are you so afraid of? If you're going to claim that markets don't "work" for health care, you need to say what that means. What would it mean for a market to "work"? You seem to be assuming that the purpose of a market is provide everyone with their needs. You don't seem to want to admit that though. Why are you such a chickenshit about it? Can't you just have an honest conversation without all the evasion?

I’ve explained it several times. The number of emergency room patients in a day is dependent on the number of sudden illnesses and accidents. What they charge has no effect. So the price goes up and up. Markets don’t work for healthcare.

There's no downward pressure because no one is paying for their own health care. They've been herded, by government, into employer-provided, group health insurance that obliterates all normal market dynamics - actually turns them upside down so that health care consumers have incentive to choose the more expensive option at every opportunity. But just ignore this and keep chanting. You're getting good at it.

Anyway, since you won't answer my question, I'll assume that you think the purpose of a market is to provide everyone with what they need, and that's where we disagree. A free market doesn't have a purpose, other than freedom. It allows people to pursue their own goals by trading and collaborating with others. It's really freedom that you're railing against. You want things to be controlled by the government. Why?

 

[Norman]

Here is what free health care and other free shit has accomplished in Europe, the promised continent of free shit.

No one is having children as women loot up on free shit from working men's pockets:

(The rate goes down again after 2006 as more free shit is looted)

The economy is not growing as there is no reason to work just so that people can loot your shit. Japan's lost decade was not even half as bad as where free shit gets you:

Government health care has nothing to do with health care. It's simply the looters and riggers looting more of your money. Have you ever heard these people propose a government run system where payment is proportional to use? Oh, they don't get to loot working people's pockets? Forget it then...

Also do recall, it will be free for them, not for you. First of all, you have a job and don't have months to wait to get to a treatment. Second, as someone who contributed you are a Nazi and therefore excluded from health care.

 

[Brain357]

Again, I don't know what you mean by "work". Are you presuming that the purpose of a free market is to provide people with their needs? And if someone can't get what they need the market has failed?

You don’t understand markets?

PIss off.

Markets don’t work for healthcare. Once you figure that out you will see universal is only real option.

Listen, asswipe, I ask you above for clarification on what you mean by "work for healthcare" and you declined to answer, choosing instead to insult me. If want to continue the conversation, start with answering those questions. Until you do, the statement you keep chanting, "Markets don't work for healthcare", has no meaning.

Again:

Healthcare costs just go up, markets have no downward pressure on healthcare. The guy in an ambulance can’t shop a cheaper price so they just charge more and more...

Again, I don't know what you mean by "work". Are you presuming that the purpose of a free market is to provide people with their needs? And if someone can't get what they need the market has failed?

You are really slow. If there is no downward pressure on pricing, then markets aren’t working. It’s more of a monopoly situation and prices just increase. Competition is important in markets. Again the guy in an ambulance isn’t shopping around. What don’t you get?

There's no downward pressure because no one is paying for their own health care. They've been herded, by government, into employer-provided, group health insurance that obliterates all normal market dynamics - actually turns them upside down so that health care consumers have incentive to choose the more expensive option at every opportunity.

But you're still ignoring my question. Is it that you don't understand it? Or that you just don't want to talk about it? What are you so afraid of? If you're going to claim that markets don't "work" for health care, you need to say what that means. What would it mean for a market to "work"? You seem to be assuming that the purpose of a market is provide everyone with their needs. You don't seem to want to admit that though. Why are you such a chickenshit about it? Can't you just have an honest conversation without all the evasion?

I’ve explained it several times. The number of emergency room patients in a day is dependent on the number of sudden illnesses and accidents. What they charge has no effect. So the price goes up and up. Markets don’t work for healthcare.

There's no downward pressure because no one is paying for their own health care. They've been herded, by government, into employer-provided, group health insurance that obliterates all normal market dynamics - actually turns them upside down so that health care consumers have incentive to choose the more expensive option at every opportunity. But just ignore this and keep chanting. You're getting good at it.

Anyway, since you won't answer my question, I'll assume that you think the purpose of a market is to provide everyone with what they need, and that's where we disagree. A free market doesn't have a purpose, other than freedom. It allows people to pursue their own goals by trading and collaborating with others. It's really freedom that you're railing against. You want things to be controlled by the government. Why?

Being sick destroys all market dynamics. You need to figure that out.

 

[Meister]

Underneath all the noise is the simple fact that Trump lied and the GOP lied when they said they had a replacement for Obamacare.

All the bitching in the world about "socialism" will not obscure that very real fact.

And that is why we are going to have UHC in our lifetimes.

Thanks a lot, assholes.

Waaah waah waah Obammycare got healthcare welfare for a few at increased cost to the rest of us....just like every other liberal program ever created. It doesnt need a replacement it needs an elimination.

You, along with most people in this thread, are missing g5000's point. He's not a fan of Obamacare, he's not in favor of UHC. He's just (rightfully, my view) blaming Republicans for allowing it to happen. They've done an incredibly bad job of standing up for limited government.

The President had only 4 years not 8, and all of it spent fighting off the wacko attacks on his presidency so not sure what you expected. With another term I am sure he could have rid the country of yet another anti American program like Obammycare.

ACA was passed in 2010. That was ten years ago. Republicans have had all that time to come up with a better way to fix the broken health care market. And frankly, they should have come up with something before it was even passed. They failed. Miserably.

Failed what? If you are talking about the high cost of medicines and hospital service then Obammycare only made that worse. As for anything else people can either choose healthcare for their family or get Iphones and Ipads instead, theeir choice.

Failed to address the fact that health care prices are artificially inflated - inflated beyond the means of the average health care consumer. Something is wrong with this picture.

Markets don’t work in healthcare...

Yes. You mentioned that, once or twice.

That’s what’s wrong with the picture.

Yeah. Thing is, that kind of claim doesn't even make any sense to me. I think that's because I don't look at a free market an institution with specific goals, or an other means to evaluate whether it "works" or not. A free market is just people, freely collaborating, trading goods and services as they see fit. Saying free markets don't work is like saying "freedom doesn't work".

And a sick person is not capable of making good buying decisions. Free markets do work, but not for healthcare.

Again, I don't know what you mean by "work". Are you presuming that the purpose of a free market is to provide people with their needs? And if someone can't get what they need the market has failed?

You don’t understand markets?

PIss off.

Markets don’t work for healthcare. Once you figure that out you will see universal is only real option.

From what I've seen in other countries, government doesn't work for healthcare either, now what?

I haven't seen a great deal of people breaking down the doors of those socialist countries to get their healthcare either. Wish that was the case here. None of those socialist SJW mental midgets seem eager to go to their utopias either.

Rand Paul Goes to Canada for Surgery

A U.S. senator is going to Canada for surgery, and it may be far cheaper than the cost for surgery in the United States. Many Americans are opting to go abroad for healthcare in the hopes of paying less.

www.healthline.com

And?

Are you sure you want to play the "Post a Link" game?

Waiting Your Turn: Wait Times for Health Care in Canada, 2016 Report

www.fraserinstitute.org

.

 

[Brain357]

Underneath all the noise is the simple fact that Trump lied and the GOP lied when they said they had a replacement for Obamacare.

All the bitching in the world about "socialism" will not obscure that very real fact.

And that is why we are going to have UHC in our lifetimes.

Thanks a lot, assholes.

Waaah waah waah Obammycare got healthcare welfare for a few at increased cost to the rest of us....just like every other liberal program ever created. It doesnt need a replacement it needs an elimination.

You, along with most people in this thread, are missing g5000's point. He's not a fan of Obamacare, he's not in favor of UHC. He's just (rightfully, my view) blaming Republicans for allowing it to happen. They've done an incredibly bad job of standing up for limited government.

The President had only 4 years not 8, and all of it spent fighting off the wacko attacks on his presidency so not sure what you expected. With another term I am sure he could have rid the country of yet another anti American program like Obammycare.

ACA was passed in 2010. That was ten years ago. Republicans have had all that time to come up with a better way to fix the broken health care market. And frankly, they should have come up with something before it was even passed. They failed. Miserably.

Failed what? If you are talking about the high cost of medicines and hospital service then Obammycare only made that worse. As for anything else people can either choose healthcare for their family or get Iphones and Ipads instead, theeir choice.

Failed to address the fact that health care prices are artificially inflated - inflated beyond the means of the average health care consumer. Something is wrong with this picture.

Markets don’t work in healthcare...

Yes. You mentioned that, once or twice.

That’s what’s wrong with the picture.

Yeah. Thing is, that kind of claim doesn't even make any sense to me. I think that's because I don't look at a free market an institution with specific goals, or an other means to evaluate whether it "works" or not. A free market is just people, freely collaborating, trading goods and services as they see fit. Saying free markets don't work is like saying "freedom doesn't work".

And a sick person is not capable of making good buying decisions. Free markets do work, but not for healthcare.

Again, I don't know what you mean by "work". Are you presuming that the purpose of a free market is to provide people with their needs? And if someone can't get what they need the market has failed?

You don’t understand markets?

PIss off.

Markets don’t work for healthcare. Once you figure that out you will see universal is only real option.

From what I've seen in other countries, government doesn't work for healthcare either, now what?

I haven't seen a great deal of people breaking down the doors of those socialist countries to get their healthcare either. Wish that was the case here. None of those socialist SJW mental midgets seem eager to go to their utopias either.

Rand Paul Goes to Canada for Surgery

A U.S. senator is going to Canada for surgery, and it may be far cheaper than the cost for surgery in the United States. Many Americans are opting to go abroad for healthcare in the hopes of paying less.

www.healthline.com

And?

Are you sure you want to play the "Post a Link" game?

Waiting Your Turn: Wait Times for Health Care in Canada, 2016 Report

www.fraserinstitute.org

.

This one says it all.

https://www.jhsph.edu/news/news-releases/2019/us-health-care-spending-highest-among-developed-countries.html

AMERICANS ON AVERAGE CONTINUE TO SPEND MUCH MORE FOR HEALTH CARE—WHILE GETTING LESS CARE—THAN PEOPLE IN OTHER DEVELOPED COUNTRIES

 

[dblack]

Again, I don't know what you mean by "work". Are you presuming that the purpose of a free market is to provide people with their needs? And if someone can't get what they need the market has failed?

You don’t understand markets?

PIss off.

Markets don’t work for healthcare. Once you figure that out you will see universal is only real option.

Listen, asswipe, I ask you above for clarification on what you mean by "work for healthcare" and you declined to answer, choosing instead to insult me. If want to continue the conversation, start with answering those questions. Until you do, the statement you keep chanting, "Markets don't work for healthcare", has no meaning.

Again:

Healthcare costs just go up, markets have no downward pressure on healthcare. The guy in an ambulance can’t shop a cheaper price so they just charge more and more...

Again, I don't know what you mean by "work". Are you presuming that the purpose of a free market is to provide people with their needs? And if someone can't get what they need the market has failed?

You are really slow. If there is no downward pressure on pricing, then markets aren’t working. It’s more of a monopoly situation and prices just increase. Competition is important in markets. Again the guy in an ambulance isn’t shopping around. What don’t you get?

There's no downward pressure because no one is paying for their own health care. They've been herded, by government, into employer-provided, group health insurance that obliterates all normal market dynamics - actually turns them upside down so that health care consumers have incentive to choose the more expensive option at every opportunity.

But you're still ignoring my question. Is it that you don't understand it? Or that you just don't want to talk about it? What are you so afraid of? If you're going to claim that markets don't "work" for health care, you need to say what that means. What would it mean for a market to "work"? You seem to be assuming that the purpose of a market is provide everyone with their needs. You don't seem to want to admit that though. Why are you such a chickenshit about it? Can't you just have an honest conversation without all the evasion?

I’ve explained it several times. The number of emergency room patients in a day is dependent on the number of sudden illnesses and accidents. What they charge has no effect. So the price goes up and up. Markets don’t work for healthcare.

There's no downward pressure because no one is paying for their own health care. They've been herded, by government, into employer-provided, group health insurance that obliterates all normal market dynamics - actually turns them upside down so that health care consumers have incentive to choose the more expensive option at every opportunity. But just ignore this and keep chanting. You're getting good at it.

Anyway, since you won't answer my question, I'll assume that you think the purpose of a market is to provide everyone with what they need, and that's where we disagree. A free market doesn't have a purpose, other than freedom. It allows people to pursue their own goals by trading and collaborating with others. It's really freedom that you're railing against. You want things to be controlled by the government. Why?

Being sick destroys all market dynamics. You need to figure that out.

I've already figured that out. I've been sick, without insurance. And I looked for medical service that I could afford. I avoided expensive ambulance service when I could. I negotiated for lower rates and asked about cheaper alternatives. Later, when I had insurance, I didn't give a shit about any of that. I went to the doctor that was close by and had the nicest office. I never asked about prices.

Anyway, none of your whinging about that has anything to do with whether markets "work" or not. Since you haven't specified what it means for a market to "work" there's no way to tell what the **** you mean. But evasion seems to be your go to - so maybe that's intentional.

 

[Norman]

Again, I don't know what you mean by "work". Are you presuming that the purpose of a free market is to provide people with their needs? And if someone can't get what they need the market has failed?

You don’t understand markets?

PIss off.

Markets don’t work for healthcare. Once you figure that out you will see universal is only real option.

Listen, asswipe, I ask you above for clarification on what you mean by "work for healthcare" and you declined to answer, choosing instead to insult me. If want to continue the conversation, start with answering those questions. Until you do, the statement you keep chanting, "Markets don't work for healthcare", has no meaning.

Again:

Healthcare costs just go up, markets have no downward pressure on healthcare. The guy in an ambulance can’t shop a cheaper price so they just charge more and more...

Again, I don't know what you mean by "work". Are you presuming that the purpose of a free market is to provide people with their needs? And if someone can't get what they need the market has failed?

You are really slow. If there is no downward pressure on pricing, then markets aren’t working. It’s more of a monopoly situation and prices just increase. Competition is important in markets. Again the guy in an ambulance isn’t shopping around. What don’t you get?

There's no downward pressure because no one is paying for their own health care. They've been herded, by government, into employer-provided, group health insurance that obliterates all normal market dynamics - actually turns them upside down so that health care consumers have incentive to choose the more expensive option at every opportunity.

But you're still ignoring my question. Is it that you don't understand it? Or that you just don't want to talk about it? What are you so afraid of? If you're going to claim that markets don't "work" for health care, you need to say what that means. What would it mean for a market to "work"? You seem to be assuming that the purpose of a market is provide everyone with their needs. You don't seem to want to admit that though. Why are you such a chickenshit about it? Can't you just have an honest conversation without all the evasion?

I’ve explained it several times. The number of emergency room patients in a day is dependent on the number of sudden illnesses and accidents. What they charge has no effect. So the price goes up and up. Markets don’t work for healthcare.

There's no downward pressure because no one is paying for their own health care. They've been herded, by government, into employer-provided, group health insurance that obliterates all normal market dynamics - actually turns them upside down so that health care consumers have incentive to choose the more expensive option at every opportunity. But just ignore this and keep chanting. You're getting good at it.

Anyway, since you won't answer my question, I'll assume that you think the purpose of a market is to provide everyone with what they need, and that's where we disagree. A free market doesn't have a purpose, other than freedom. It allows people to pursue their own goals by trading and collaborating with others. It's really freedom that you're railing against. You want things to be controlled by the government. Why?

Being sick destroys all market dynamics. You need to figure that out.

I've already figured that out. I've been sick, without insurance. And I looked for doctors that I could afford. I avoided expensive ambulance service when I could. I negotiated for lower rates and asked about cheaper alternatives. Later, when I had insurance, I didn't give a shit about any of this.

Anyway, none of your whinging about that has anything to do with whether markets "work" or not. Since you haven't specified what it means for a market to "work" there's no way to tell what the **** you mean. But evasion seems to be your go to - so maybe that's intentional.

Only the markets where you get to loot other people's earnings "work".

But working does not work.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Geez, you ought to take that mind reading thing on the road. You might not feel the need to be a parasite anymore. How do YOU know what THEY think. SMH

It's really not hard to find information like that if you know how to look for it.

By which I can only assume you mean reading leftist blogs and opinion pieces telling you all about what you should believe about those nasty right-wingers you've never spoken to.

 

[366h34d]

Universal healthcare will not work in USA unless USA can fundamentally change the healthcare system in USA which USA needs to change their own fundamental principals first. it is because universal healthcare, the dems' pov, is a single insurance provider only. In fact, you need a single healthcare provider for the healthcare system to be sustain.
Trust me, I am a canadian and BC'er.

 

[danielpalos]

Geez, you ought to take that mind reading thing on the road. You might not feel the need to be a parasite anymore. How do YOU know what THEY think. SMH

It's really not hard to find information like that if you know how to look for it.

By which I can only assume you mean reading leftist blogs and opinion pieces telling you all about what you should believe about those nasty right-wingers you've never spoken to.

Equal protection of the law for unemployment compensation in our at-will employment States is a market friendly backup plan.

 

[Cecilie1200]

I can only assume

I noticed.

Hey, Chuckles, you started it with the assume game.

I, at least, am making my assumptions based on your actual words, rather than on what someone told me your words were.

I take it you still haven't strapped on a pair. Scamper away again, little coward.