CDZ Let’s take a time out for some truth.

[PredFan]

i am setting aside partisan politics.

I do not believe that the majority of the women coming out against powerful men these days are totally innocent.

I have been in healthcare for 35 years now. It is a profession that is dominated by women. I have seen women flirt openly with doctors, married or not, they flirt. I have seen dozens of women end up marrying doctors they first worked with. In several cases they broke up the doctors marriage or their own or both. Undeniably, women are attracted to wealth and power.

These powerful men both in politics and the private sector get flirted with on a daily basis. It doesn’t take long before it begins to affect them. One slip up at a moment of weakness is all it takes. A hand on a bare back, a pat on the butt, or a dirty joke and you can be taken down many years into the future.

I’m not saying they are totally innocent victims here. Especially the married men who should know better. I’m not as powerful or rich as a doctor but I have more power and money than most. I am and have been happily married and the flirting is nothing more to me than flattering. If I can do it then certainly anyone can.

It’s easy for me with all I’ve observed in 35 years to imagine exactly how so many otherwise intelligent men get caught up in this. It’s easy for me to see their accusers in a much different, and I believe much more accurate light than they are being portrayed.

 

[JoeMoma]

Years ago when I was a college student, I worked at a Westinghouse transformer plant through the cooperative education office at my college. There was a beautiful lady, probably in her mid 30s to 40s that had one of the management corner offices that worked at that facility. I never knew exactly what type of "manager" she was, but she would usually come into work looking like she was ready for a night out on the town rather than what I would think of as professional attire for a lady in a management position. I guess I will never know exactly what that lady did to have that nice corner office................

 

[OldLady]

i am setting aside partisan politics.

I do not believe that the majority of the women coming out against powerful men these days are totally innocent.

I have been in healthcare for 35 years now. It is a profession that is dominated by women. I have seen women flirt openly with doctors, married or not, they flirt. I have seen dozens of women end up marrying doctors they first worked with. In several cases they broke up the doctors marriage or their own or both. Undeniably, women are attracted to wealth and power.

These powerful men both in politics and the private sector get flirted with on a daily basis. It doesn’t take long before it begins to affect them. One slip up at a moment of weakness is all it takes. A hand on a bare back, a pat on the butt, or a dirty joke and you can be taken down many years into the future.

I’m not saying they are totally innocent victims here. Especially the married men who should know better. I’m not as powerful or rich as a doctor but I have more power and money than most. I am and have been happily married and the flirting is nothing more to me than flattering. If I can do it then certainly anyone can.

It’s easy for me with all I’ve observed in 35 years to imagine exactly how so many otherwise intelligent men get caught up in this. It’s easy for me to see their accusers in a much different, and I believe much more accurate light than they are being portrayed.

You're right about women being attracted to men in power and that flirting/affairs/romances take place all the time.
That is not what is being complained about, though. Your argument makes it sound as if men are poor helpless victims of a woman's overpowering wiles. The vast majority of cases I've been hearing about weren't a simple "slip" or accident. A moment of weakness? Is it always a yearning harbored in men's hearts to compel unwilling women to have sex with them? THAT's what a sexual harassment claim SHOULD be about. The use of power to compel sexual relations.

 

[aaronleland]

When I was younger I worked as a supervisor at a call center, and this married woman I was friends with would raise her hand as if she had a question, then grab my crotch when I walked over to her. To make matters worse her husband was a really nice guy who used to give me a ride to work all the time. I still fucked his wife, but still...

 

[Pop23]

When I was younger..........

Oh who the hell am I trying to fool, I can't remember that damn far back

 

[OldLady]

When I was younger I worked as a supervisor at a call center, and this married woman I was friends with would raise her hand as if she had a question, then grab my crotch when I walked over to her. To make matters worse her husband was a really nice guy who used to give me a ride to work all the time. I still fucked his wife, but still...

Sounds consensual to me. You must be cute.

 

[PredFan]

i am setting aside partisan politics.

I do not believe that the majority of the women coming out against powerful men these days are totally innocent.

I have been in healthcare for 35 years now. It is a profession that is dominated by women. I have seen women flirt openly with doctors, married or not, they flirt. I have seen dozens of women end up marrying doctors they first worked with. In several cases they broke up the doctors marriage or their own or both. Undeniably, women are attracted to wealth and power.

These powerful men both in politics and the private sector get flirted with on a daily basis. It doesn’t take long before it begins to affect them. One slip up at a moment of weakness is all it takes. A hand on a bare back, a pat on the butt, or a dirty joke and you can be taken down many years into the future.

I’m not saying they are totally innocent victims here. Especially the married men who should know better. I’m not as powerful or rich as a doctor but I have more power and money than most. I am and have been happily married and the flirting is nothing more to me than flattering. If I can do it then certainly anyone can.

It’s easy for me with all I’ve observed in 35 years to imagine exactly how so many otherwise intelligent men get caught up in this. It’s easy for me to see their accusers in a much different, and I believe much more accurate light than they are being portrayed.

You're right about women being attracted to men in power and that flirting/affairs/romances take place all the time.
That is not what is being complained about, though.

I know that that is not what is being complained about. Of course it isn’t. They aren’t going to admit that they flirted.

Your argument makes it sound as if men are poor helpless victims of a woman's overpowering wiles.

No, I specifically stated that the men aren’t innocent, especially the married ones who should know better. My point is that I don’t believe the women are totally innocent either.

The vast majority of cases I've been hearing about weren't a simple "slip" or accident. A moment of weakness?

Not a slip maybe a moment of weakness but what I’m saying is that how much flirting is a man supposed to take before he gets the idea that some kind of response is permitted or encouraged by the woman. It is also a fact of life that there are women who actually do want something more. Unless you are married, how do you know that you have crossed a line?

Is it always a yearning harbored in men's hearts to compel unwilling women to have sex with them? THAT's what a sexual harassment claim SHOULD be about. The use of power to compel sexual relations.

You are assuming that in all cases the woman was unwilling. I’m saying experience leads me to doubt that strongly.

 

[PredFan]

As a side note, I have 5 daughters aged 19 to 33. My two youngest have received unwanted (they claim) “dick pics) from boys.

I have heard that this is a thing now.

Wonder if we will be hearing about those coming back to haunt men years from now.

 

[task0778]

I think there are or were a helluva lot of women 40-50 years ago on up to right now that had to face a choice between allowing themselves to be sexually harassed and even assaulted without saying anything cuz they needed their job. Your word against his, who wins that fight most of the time unless you got some kind of proof? Which didn't exist until we got into the email/sexting era when idiots would send compromising suggestions and photos of themselves to women, some of which were underage. I don't care how attractive those women are, you don't have a license to put your hands where they don't belong on a woman just cuz she looks hot.

Is it that way all the time? Probably not, some women might've been trying to sleep their way up but didn't get the payoff they wanted. IOW, it could've been consensual quite often, who knows? BUT - my guess is that more often than not it wasn't consensual but the woman kept her mouth shut and put up with whatever she had to do. And that's really sad and ought to be stopped.

 

[oldsoul]

i am setting aside partisan politics.

I do not believe that the majority of the women coming out against powerful men these days are totally innocent.

I have been in healthcare for 35 years now. It is a profession that is dominated by women. I have seen women flirt openly with doctors, married or not, they flirt. I have seen dozens of women end up marrying doctors they first worked with. In several cases they broke up the doctors marriage or their own or both. Undeniably, women are attracted to wealth and power.

These powerful men both in politics and the private sector get flirted with on a daily basis. It doesn’t take long before it begins to affect them. One slip up at a moment of weakness is all it takes. A hand on a bare back, a pat on the butt, or a dirty joke and you can be taken down many years into the future.

I’m not saying they are totally innocent victims here. Especially the married men who should know better. I’m not as powerful or rich as a doctor but I have more power and money than most. I am and have been happily married and the flirting is nothing more to me than flattering. If I can do it then certainly anyone can.

It’s easy for me with all I’ve observed in 35 years to imagine exactly how so many otherwise intelligent men get caught up in this. It’s easy for me to see their accusers in a much different, and I believe much more accurate light than they are being portrayed.

An interesting take on things. One which I, myself, have pondered. However, the larger, and more dangerous, part of all of this, IMHO, is the "guilty until proven innocent" mentality of the court of public opinion. I have to wonder, how would it be seen if a man were to claim sexual harassment against a wealthy/powerful female "celebrity", or politician? Would the matter be seen the same? I have reason to believe it would not.

That said, for those who have been shown to be guilty (Mr. Franken comes to mind) how is it that some are still in their position, while others have been forced to resign, if not outright fired? Where does the double standard come from? How is it that the guy from Alabama ( I forget his name as it is unimportant) is "unfit" for office before anything illegal has been proven (let alone anything immoral, a very subjective standard), while an "investigation" into others, such as Franken, must be undertaken before any statements as to their "fitness" for office are made? The only commonality I see is the letter behind the name. (D) vs. (R) Seems like hypocrisy from the party that claims they are for women...

 

[miketx]

i am setting aside partisan politics.

I do not believe that the majority of the women coming out against powerful men these days are totally innocent.

I have been in healthcare for 35 years now. It is a profession that is dominated by women. I have seen women flirt openly with doctors, married or not, they flirt. I have seen dozens of women end up marrying doctors they first worked with. In several cases they broke up the doctors marriage or their own or both. Undeniably, women are attracted to wealth and power.

These powerful men both in politics and the private sector get flirted with on a daily basis. It doesn’t take long before it begins to affect them. One slip up at a moment of weakness is all it takes. A hand on a bare back, a pat on the butt, or a dirty joke and you can be taken down many years into the future.

I’m not saying they are totally innocent victims here. Especially the married men who should know better. I’m not as powerful or rich as a doctor but I have more power and money than most. I am and have been happily married and the flirting is nothing more to me than flattering. If I can do it then certainly anyone can.

It’s easy for me with all I’ve observed in 35 years to imagine exactly how so many otherwise intelligent men get caught up in this. It’s easy for me to see their accusers in a much different, and I believe much more accurate light than they are being portrayed.

You're right about women being attracted to men in power and that flirting/affairs/romances take place all the time.
That is not what is being complained about, though. Your argument makes it sound as if men are poor helpless victims of a woman's overpowering wiles. The vast majority of cases I've been hearing about weren't a simple "slip" or accident. A moment of weakness? Is it always a yearning harbored in men's hearts to compel unwilling women to have sex with them? THAT's what a sexual harassment claim SHOULD be about. The use of power to compel sexual relations.

Your remark is nowhere near what he said

 

[JoeMoma]

Anyone know the story (bible) of Joseph and Potiphar's wife?

 

[MarathonMike]

Another place this happens frequently is in academia. I wonder if we will start seeing high ranking professors and school Presidents etc. taken down for relationships with female college students?

 

[Circe]

I think the claims against Franken and Keillor are the weakest. There doesn't seem to be a pattern of abuse, the "offenses" were in both cases minor, and everyone knows comedians have to be given some leeway: comedy is dangerous. It's supposed to be dangerous.

The real problem is a pattern of abuse, especially with unsuspecting young job applicants and other innocents. Mark Halperin, Bill O'Reilly.

Another problem is corruption: when the men pay women off with taxpayers' money as a number of congressmen have done past and present, or when they have special contracts with "harassment insurance" like O'Reilly had.

Everyone does realize this isn't about men and women, right? This is a mass hysteria, a witch hunt, and it can't last. It is based on politics, left fighting right first, but then the right came roaring back and seems to have lowered the boom on the left, which has more publicized offenders as of now.

This is also about purging the aged from power. It's nearly all old men: old reporters, old movie stars, especially old politicians. They are 86, 87, 88 in the case of Conyers and they Just Won't Quit. So this "social movement" is actually a purge of superannuated people making room for the next generation. Where are all the scandals about 40-year-olds? There was one 37-year-old Hispanic congressman the other day who went out, but I think he's the first under 70.

 

[Circe]

Another place this happens frequently is in academia. I wonder if we will start seeing high ranking professors and school Presidents etc. taken down for relationships with female college students?

Dartmouth College got hit last month --- THREE psych profs. Out, suspended, can't come on campus and though the administration and everyone up to the governor has admitted there was something sexual going on, nobody will specify. Very frustrating.

 

[Dogmaphobe]

When I was younger I worked as a supervisor at a call center, and this married woman I was friends with would raise her hand as if she had a question, then grab my crotch when I walked over to her. To make matters worse her husband was a really nice guy who used to give me a ride to work all the time. I still fucked his wife, but still...

Sounds consensual to me. You must be cute.

She didn't grab him in his cute.

Try again.

 

[Circe]

Sounds consensual to me. You must be cute.

She didn't grab him in his cute.

Try again.[/QUOTE]


Well said. No, women don't like to be grabbed in our "cute" either. I remember an older man who was constantly petting, hugging, patting a young woman because she was so "soft," as he said. She didn't know what to do or say; she left to work with a competitor, never confronting him.