Last Days

[Dan]

I thought this film was really moving and beautifully shot, but I'm assuming that most of the people on this board won't care about it, really, which is cool.

The film basically shows the last two or three days of Kurt Cobain's life. The main character in this film is named Blake, but take a look at "Blake"...

....and tell me who you think he's supposed to be. The film actually ends saying that though the film was based on Kurt Cobain's life, much of the characters and facts have been changed. But, I don't think that's so true, I think this is a pretty accurate portrayal.

The thing that some of us love about this movie is the same thing that will make others hate it: there is basically no plot whatsoever, and not a whole lot happens. Rather than sensationalizing Cobain's final days, Gus Van Sant shows what a real heroin addict would likely go through as he reaches the end: wandering around aimlessly, faking conversations, randomly passing out. It's not an exciting film, and I admit, it gets a little hard to watch at times, but once you get used to it, you really get wrapped up in it.

Has anyone else even heard of this, let alone seen it, other than me?

 

[insein]

heard of it. Didnt see it. I was a big nirvana fan back in the mid to late 90's. After he killed himself, too many posers came out of the woodwork claiming to be "Kurt Cobain" fans and that turned me off to the whole thing. MTV basically glorified a heroin addicts suicide and turned the biggest waste of talent into this age's john lennon.

His death was a sad illustration of whats fucked up in our culture. We glorify a drug addicts suicide but don't even know who a president is when he passes such as Ronald Reagan.

 

[Dan]

Well, from what I know about you and your movie tastes, which I think I know a little bit about by now, I don't really think you'd like this movie. It's a little too artsy-fartsy for you, I think.

But...

MTV basically glorified a heroin addicts suicide and turned the biggest waste of talent into this age's john lennon.

To a degree, this is what the movie tries to show. Kurt Cobain wasn't some grunge martyr, changing the world forever, then dying so the rest of his followers could live on. He was just a guy who wrote some really great songs, then got too heavy into heroin and ended his life as absolutely nothing. Just a mumbling weirdo who doesn't like to leave his garden.

 

[Dan]

And, please just indulge me for a second, because I know this is kinda messed up to say, but I really think the best thing for his legacy was to end it when, and how, he did. His musical style would not age well, and the thought of a bald, fat 50-year-old Kurt Cobain playing "Come as You Are" to a bunch of equally sad 50-year-old grunge leftovers is just about as tragic as what really happened to him.

I wonder if he thought about that sort of thing. Probably not, towards the end, I don't think. But, I guess back when Nevermind really hit big, he must have considered it at least a few times. This reminds me of one of the best lines of this movie, spoken by Kim Gordon of Sonic Youth, no less, when she's got "Blake" off on his own, she's trying to get him to go into rehab. She asks him "Do you talk to your daughter? Do you tell her 'I'm sorry for being a rock and roll cliche?'" Probably the saddest line in the movie.

I'd like to think that maybe in some alternate universe, Kurt kicked heroin, and left the music business to raise his daughter or something like that, but we all know that probably could've never happened.

 

[insein]

I dont mind an artsy thinky flick now and then but i hate the ones that lead you no where or have a topic i have no interest in. So i do have an interest in the topic and i probably would watch it if it came on a movie network late night. thats when ill watch pretty much anything. Ive caught some cool movies and some really crappy ones that way.

Anyway, its good to hear that they dont glorify him as MTV did in Real life. The man was a talent. While yes i think it would have been a shame to see him try to cling to the spotlight like Neil Young or the like, i like to think that their (Nirvana) greatest work was yet to come. Look at foofighters. Dave groehl is a talented motherfucker. Combine him with Kurt for another 5 to 10 years and you'd have had a legenedary band not just a band of the genre. Nirvana would have been echoed with the Beatles or Led Zeppelin had they had more time. As it stands now, they are no more then a memory of a musical fad.

Who knows though. Maybe your right and he ran out of stuff to write and decided this was the best way to finish is legacy.

 

[Dan]

Who knows though. Maybe your right and he ran out of stuff to write and decided this was the best way to finish is legacy.

Well, that's not what I meant to say, even though I see that's kind of what it sounds like.

I sort of do think that they may have had many great years ahead of them. But, in truth they only had three proper albums, and were only "around" for about four years, at least that's how long they were really a complete band.

I do think Dave Grohl is talented as hell, a rock album doesn't get much better than There is Nothing Left to Lose. However, I heard that there was a whole lot of tension between Grohl and Cobain back in the day, and I don't really think I could see Kurt letting him take over any songwriting duties (although, I will admit that his drumming was as integral as anything else to most of their music).

But, that said, my favorite album by them is by far Unplugged, and I do think it showed them all to be great, talented musicians. I still get goosebumps listening to "Where Did You Sleep Last Night".

Nirvana would have been echoed with the Beatles or Led Zeppelin had they had more time. As it stands now, they are no more then a memory of a musical fad.

I think you may be shortchanging them a bit. Time will tell, of course, but I think their name has been cemented alongside the Beatles or Led Zeppelin. There's no denying that they were the most popular band of the early to mid nineties (not that I'm judging just on popularity or anything).

But, regardless, I don't think it would've lasted for them. You look at the really great, really groundbreaking "artists" of rock and roll, your John Lennon, your Elvis, whoever, they all seem to burn out or, even worse, fade away.

 

[The ClayTaurus]

The cultural significance of Nirvana is hard to dispute. Any time you can take over a music scene that was so heavily decadent and materialistic with dirty jeans, old flannel shirts, and songs like "Rape Me"...

 

[JOKER96BRAVO]

I thought this film was really moving and beautifully shot, but I'm assuming that most of the people on this board won't care about it, really, which is cool.

The film basically shows the last two or three days of Kurt Cobain's life. The main character in this film is named Blake, but take a look at "Blake"...

....and tell me who you think he's supposed to be. The film actually ends saying that though the film was based on Kurt Cobain's life, much of the characters and facts have been changed. But, I don't think that's so true, I think this is a pretty accurate portrayal.

The thing that some of us love about this movie is the same thing that will make others hate it: there is basically no plot whatsoever, and not a whole lot happens. Rather than sensationalizing Cobain's final days, Gus Van Sant shows what a real heroin addict would likely go through as he reaches the end: wandering around aimlessly, faking conversations, randomly passing out. It's not an exciting film, and I admit, it gets a little hard to watch at times, but once you get used to it, you really get wrapped up in it.

Has anyone else even heard of this, let alone seen it, other than me?

I almost rented this, but there wasn't anything else I wanted to rent, and
I always rent at least 2 movies. I was tempted to rent Lords of dogtown
again, maybe this week.

 

[insein]

The cultural significance of Nirvana is hard to dispute. Any time you can take over a music scene that was so heavily decadent and materialistic with dirty jeans, old flannel shirts, and songs like "Rape Me"...

Yes but when we look back in 30 years, are we going to say "that was a band that transcended time," or will we say "that was the band that that guy killed himself in."

 

[The ClayTaurus]

Yes but when we look back in 30 years, are we going to say "that was a band that transcended time," or will we say "that was the band that that guy killed himself in."

I would say the former. Many would say his suicide is proof that his music was as authentic, his angst as true and accurate, as possible. Many sing about perpetual inner torment, he embodied it. I don't know if glorification is something that should be encouraged, but the simple point remains, few musicians lived their music more than Cobain did.

I really do think that people will look back and see Nirvana as having transcended.

 

[JOKER96BRAVO]

Yes but when we look back in 30 years, are we going to say "that was a band that transcended time," or will we say "that was the band that that guy killed himself in."

It all depends....
As a musician, I hated Nirvana.
As a music trendy teenager, I loved them.

 

[Dan]

As a musician, I hated Nirvana.

Really? As a musician, I think Nirvana married the pop song with the 3-chord punk song about as perfectly as anyone can.

 

[JOKER96BRAVO]

Really? As a musician, I think Nirvana married the pop song with the 3-chord punk song about as perfectly as anyone can.

They might have, but it was in fact the repeditive 3 chord progressions
that did me in. I loved their older stuff, but it seemed to get worse in time.

 

[Dan]

They might have, but it was in fact the repeditive 3 chord progressions
that did me in. I loved their older stuff, but it seemed to get worse in time.

That's cool, but I wonder, if you weren't into the whole 3-chord/punk thing, why get into them at all? I'd say their stuff got less punk as they went on. In Utero was definitely "sloppy" sounding, and it definitely had a punk sound to it, but I think it was more musically advanced than anything else they ever did, especially compared to something like Bleach.

 

[JOKER96BRAVO]

I never really saw it as real punk either.
It's hard to explain unless I say that I respect music in two forms.

1. As art which doesn't always require talent or musical know-how.
2. As music and the talent represented therein.

Seems most of the trendy stuff qualifies as art most of the time.
On a side note, I think Bleach was the best album.

 

[Dan]

That's cool, I kind of have that duality with music, too. Most of the music I like is pretty simple, and I sometimes feel like "man, I could've written this stuff..."

It's weird because I grew up with Sir Evil and Jimnyc in the house always listening to Iron Maiden, Michael Schenker, etc., stuff that's pretty technically advanced. Then, I went right from that to listening to grunge and punk, stuff that's about as simple as it gets, and I guess that's where I get that conflict from.

On a side note, I think Bleach was the best album.

Woah, you were old-school!
I haven't listened to Bleach in years, maybe I need to give it another chance. As it is, really all I remember from it is About A Girl.

Since we're on the topic of grunge, one band that's always irritated me is Pearl Jam. Ten was a great album and all, but to read an interview with Eddie Vedder or Stone Gossard or somebody, you'd think they were the second coming or something. Just soooooooooo full of themselves, which basically goes against what grunge was all about. I think if Kurt Cobain had acted like that, he would never have the status that he has now.

And while we're on THAT topic, I think Dave Grohl seems like one of the coolest, most laid-back rock stars out there.

 

[JOKER96BRAVO]

That's cool, I kind of have that duality with music, too. Most of the music I like is pretty simple, and I sometimes feel like "man, I could've written this stuff..."

I know how that feels. I think the same about alot of guitar players out there.

It's weird because I grew up with Sir Evil and Jimnyc in the house always listening to Iron Maiden, Michael Schenker, etc., stuff that's pretty technically advanced. Then, I went right from that to listening to grunge and punk, stuff that's about as simple as it gets, and I guess that's where I get that conflict from.

I grew up the same, and it was tough to get into the simple stuff because I “knew better”.
It’s rounded me off pretty well though.

Woah, you were old-school!
I haven't listened to Bleach in years, maybe I need to give it another chance. As it is, really all I remember from it is About A Girl.

Floyd the barber
Love Buzz
School

Ohh it’s a great album.
I have a few songs I wish were on there just because it never got that popular.
That was the problem with the other albums for me (except Insecticide) they were
played WAY too much on the radio, just got tired of hearing it.
I hate it when that happens. I used to LOVE lithium, nut they played it to much.
I enjoyed the unplugged session.

Since we're on the topic of grunge, one band that's always irritated me is Pearl Jam. Ten was a great album and all, but to read an interview with Eddie Vedder or Stone Gossard or somebody, you'd think they were the second coming or something. Just soooooooooo full of themselves, which basically goes against what grunge was all about. I think if Kurt Cobain had acted like that, he would never have the status that he has now.

One thing I will say about PJ is that they were true to their music.
They never wanted to “sell out”. That says a lot to me, but I stopped listening after Yeild

And while we're on THAT topic, I think Dave Grohl seems like one of the coolest, most laid-back rock stars out there.

He does, wouldn’t mind drinking a brew with him.

 

[insein]

Dave Groehl is the shit. I love Groehl. Uber talented and probably will never get the credit that he deserves as far as his greatness is concerned.