Kudlow's Law and Our Poor Economy

[The Rabbi]

When you tax capital you depress the ability of businesses to form and grow. We have had 2 capital gains tax increases over the last 6 years, with Obama pushing for more.

Jesus H. Christ, you are conflating two entirely different terms. The capital used to create a business is not capital gains!

I realize you are both arrogant and stupid, a bad combination.
Technically you are right: capital gains is not strictly speaking capital.
But capital gains supplies capital for the next investment so there is a relationship between the two.
Sorry I had to spell it out in simple, easy to understand terms. I forgot who I was dealing with.

Man, this just gets funnier and funnier.

Capital gains is the profit made when an asset is SOLD.

Thank you, Capt Obvious.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Capital gains aren't capital, they are the income from capital. People put their earned income into investment as well.

Capital gains are the profit on income that is ALREADY invested.

true that.....however his point is that capital is needed for business startups......if capital gains are taxed heavily like BO wants to do that means there is less money available for those startups which means less jobs which means less customers to buy things....

So we should raise taxes on regular income to cover the cost of lowering capital gains taxes?

That makes no sense.

How about lowering spending and cut taxes across the board

First of all, we already have a gap between revenue and spending so we have to close that. Let the Republicans propose spending cuts that include a proportionate amount of their constituencies' skin in the game and then we can talk.

OK. DOnt you always say "Red states get the most government handouts"? So let's start with cutting government hadnouts like welfare, SSI, food stamps and the like.

No let's cut spending that lobbyists hire Republicans to advocate for.

 

[g5000]

When you tax capital you depress the ability of businesses to form and grow. We have had 2 capital gains tax increases over the last 6 years, with Obama pushing for more.

Jesus H. Christ, you are conflating two entirely different terms. The capital used to create a business is not capital gains!

I realize you are both arrogant and stupid, a bad combination.
Technically you are right: capital gains is not strictly speaking capital.
But capital gains supplies capital for the next investment so there is a relationship between the two.
Sorry I had to spell it out in simple, easy to understand terms. I forgot who I was dealing with.

Man, this just gets funnier and funnier.

Capital gains is the profit made when an asset is SOLD.

Thank you, Capt Obvious.

It wasn't obvious to you. Capital gains taxes have nothing to do with corporate earnings that are re-invested.

Capital gains are things like dividends paid on stocks owned by investors, or the profit realized from selling a stock or bond.

Corporate earnings are a different animal, and earnings that are re-invested in the company are entitled to a tax deduction.

Man, you are way, way, way out of your depth.

 

[g5000]

Rabbi, you have confused corporate income taxes with capitals gains taxes.

Idiocy.

 

[g5000]

Two minutes of talk radio. BWA-HA-HA-HA!

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Kudlow apparently forgot tax write off's that offset capital gains taxes.

unfortunately for RW's nobody can forget they're idiots.

Kudlow apparently forgot tax write off's that offset capital gains taxes.

You have a list of those?

I posted one, pay attention and quit asking dumbass questions.

No you didn't. Dumbass.

 

[Siete]

did Larry bother to say your capital gain tax depends on your tax bracket .. and some people pay 0 % ???

No?

figures. Larry is a RW economist. Facts that cut the grain of his STORY are left out because the idiots that watch him would miss out on his drama bs ...

 

[The Rabbi]

When you tax capital you depress the ability of businesses to form and grow. We have had 2 capital gains tax increases over the last 6 years, with Obama pushing for more.

Jesus H. Christ, you are conflating two entirely different terms. The capital used to create a business is not capital gains!

I realize you are both arrogant and stupid, a bad combination.
Technically you are right: capital gains is not strictly speaking capital.
But capital gains supplies capital for the next investment so there is a relationship between the two.
Sorry I had to spell it out in simple, easy to understand terms. I forgot who I was dealing with.

Man, this just gets funnier and funnier.

Capital gains is the profit made when an asset is SOLD.

Thank you, Capt Obvious.

It wasn't obvious to you. Capital gains taxes have nothing to do with corporate earnings that are re-invested.

Capital gains are things like dividends paid on stocks owned by investors, or the profit realized from selling a stock or bond.

Corporate earnings are a different animal, and earnings that are re-invested in the company are entitled to a tax deduction.

Man, you are way, way, way out of your depth.

Geezus. Befoire you go calling people ignorant, just shut up.
Dividends are earnings from a company paid out as income. They are not capital gains.
Corporate earnings are not capital gains, they are ordinary profit from operations, typically.

Capital gains are indeed the difference between the cost of an asset and its sale price. The proceeds are usually used to produce further investments. Thus Kudlow's view that if you tax capital gains you depress new business formation. Which is what we've seen.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

I caught about 2 minutes of Lawrence Kudlow on the radio the other day. He talked about "Kudlow's Law" which runs like this:
No business starts without capital. In order to do anything they must have capital first. So first they have capital, then they buy supplies/equipment, then they hire people and pay wages and then the workers spend those wages as consumers.
So consumer spending is the last link in the chain not the first.
Without capital none of that can happen.
When you tax capital you depress the ability of businesses to form and grow. We have had 2 capital gains tax increases over the last 6 years, with Obama pushing for more.
With the hit to capital it is no wonder business formation, and thus employment, is depressed, with wages stagnant.

Hard to argue with any of this, but I am sure the economic gurus on the left here will explain why that's wrong and why greedy capitalists can just reach into their mattresses for unlimited funds.

Borrowing costs are at record low rates.

Consumers are the first link in the chain because without a demand for your goods and services there's no point in starting or expanding a business.

It's irrelevant.
All business starts with capital. If you tax capital you get less of it.
We have the lowest start up rate in a very long time. There are more businesses closing than opening. It is no wonder our economy is stagnant.

Capital gains aren't capital, they are the income from capital. People put their earned income into investment as well.

Capital gains are the profit on income that is ALREADY invested.

true that.....however his point is that capital is needed for business startups......if capital gains are taxed heavily like BO wants to do that means there is less money available for those startups which means less jobs which means less customers to buy things....

So we should raise taxes on regular income to cover the cost of lowering capital gains taxes?

That makes no sense.

So we should raise taxes on regular income to cover the cost of lowering capital gains taxes?
Obama thinks we should raise taxes on regular income to cover the cost of raising capital gains taxes.

 

[The Rabbi]

Rabbi, you have confused corporate income taxes with capitals gains taxes.

Idiocy.

No, I realluy havebt. I didnt mention corporate income taxes. You did.
If you cant keep track of what you've posted you need to quit.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

I caught about 2 minutes of Lawrence Kudlow on the radio the other day. He talked about "Kudlow's Law" which runs like this:
No business starts without capital. In order to do anything they must have capital first. So first they have capital, then they buy supplies/equipment, then they hire people and pay wages and then the workers spend those wages as consumers.
So consumer spending is the last link in the chain not the first.
Without capital none of that can happen.
When you tax capital you depress the ability of businesses to form and grow. We have had 2 capital gains tax increases over the last 6 years, with Obama pushing for more.
With the hit to capital it is no wonder business formation, and thus employment, is depressed, with wages stagnant.

Hard to argue with any of this, but I am sure the economic gurus on the left here will explain why that's wrong and why greedy capitalists can just reach into their mattresses for unlimited funds.

Borrowing costs are at record low rates.

Consumers are the first link in the chain because without a demand for your goods and services there's no point in starting or expanding a business.

It's irrelevant.
All business starts with capital. If you tax capital you get less of it.
We have the lowest start up rate in a very long time. There are more businesses closing than opening. It is no wonder our economy is stagnant.

Capital gains aren't capital, they are the income from capital. People put their earned income into investment as well.

Capital gains are the profit on income that is ALREADY invested.

Capital gains are the profit on income that is ALREADY invested.

It's true, if you make capital investment less profitable, you'll get less capital investment.

If you shift the tax burden to regular income, you get less consumption, therefore less capital gain.

If you shift the tax burden to regular income,

Shift the burden?
If you raise capital gains tax rate, you'll collect less capital gains tax, less corporate tax and less income tax.

 

[The Rabbi]

High cap gains taxes tend to "lock in" gains in investments.
Im in that situation now. I've owned a duplex for 20 years. It has about doubled in value. But if I sell it I will pay out virtually half the proceeds in cap gains taxes. So I hold on to it rather than pay. That gives me less money to go buy other property. It is very inefficient.

 

[The Rabbi]

Borrowing costs are at record low rates.

Consumers are the first link in the chain because without a demand for your goods and services there's no point in starting or expanding a business.

It's irrelevant.
All business starts with capital. If you tax capital you get less of it.
We have the lowest start up rate in a very long time. There are more businesses closing than opening. It is no wonder our economy is stagnant.

Capital gains aren't capital, they are the income from capital. People put their earned income into investment as well.

Capital gains are the profit on income that is ALREADY invested.

Capital gains are the profit on income that is ALREADY invested.

It's true, if you make capital investment less profitable, you'll get less capital investment.

If you shift the tax burden to regular income, you get less consumption, therefore less capital gain.

If you shift the tax burden to regular income,

Shift the burden?
If you raise capital gains tax rate, you'll collect less capital gains tax, less corporate tax and less income tax.

Even Obama understands that raising cap gains taxes produces LESS revenue to the Treasury. But he doesnt care about that.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Borrowing costs are at record low rates.

Consumers are the first link in the chain because without a demand for your goods and services there's no point in starting or expanding a business.

It's irrelevant.
All business starts with capital. If you tax capital you get less of it.
We have the lowest start up rate in a very long time. There are more businesses closing than opening. It is no wonder our economy is stagnant.

Capital gains aren't capital, they are the income from capital. People put their earned income into investment as well.

Capital gains are the profit on income that is ALREADY invested.

Capital gains are the profit on income that is ALREADY invested.

It's true, if you make capital investment less profitable, you'll get less capital investment.

If you shift the tax burden to regular income, you get less consumption, therefore less capital gain.

If you shift the tax burden to regular income,

Shift the burden?
If you raise capital gains tax rate, you'll collect less capital gains tax, less corporate tax and less income tax.

Fantasy.

 

[NYcarbineer]

It's irrelevant.
All business starts with capital. If you tax capital you get less of it.
We have the lowest start up rate in a very long time. There are more businesses closing than opening. It is no wonder our economy is stagnant.

Capital gains aren't capital, they are the income from capital. People put their earned income into investment as well.

Capital gains are the profit on income that is ALREADY invested.

Capital gains are the profit on income that is ALREADY invested.

It's true, if you make capital investment less profitable, you'll get less capital investment.

If you shift the tax burden to regular income, you get less consumption, therefore less capital gain.

If you shift the tax burden to regular income,

Shift the burden?
If you raise capital gains tax rate, you'll collect less capital gains tax, less corporate tax and less income tax.

Even Obama understands that raising cap gains taxes produces LESS revenue to the Treasury. But he doesnt care about that.

No cause and effect EVER proven, but go ahead and try.

How about we lower the cap gains tax to ZERO? Then show us how much MORE cap gains revenue you would collect.

lol

 

[The Rabbi]

It's irrelevant.
All business starts with capital. If you tax capital you get less of it.
We have the lowest start up rate in a very long time. There are more businesses closing than opening. It is no wonder our economy is stagnant.

Capital gains aren't capital, they are the income from capital. People put their earned income into investment as well.

Capital gains are the profit on income that is ALREADY invested.

Capital gains are the profit on income that is ALREADY invested.

It's true, if you make capital investment less profitable, you'll get less capital investment.

If you shift the tax burden to regular income, you get less consumption, therefore less capital gain.

If you shift the tax burden to regular income,

Shift the burden?
If you raise capital gains tax rate, you'll collect less capital gains tax, less corporate tax and less income tax.

Fantasy.

Even Obama understands that's the case.

 

[NYcarbineer]

High cap gains taxes tend to "lock in" gains in investments.
Im in that situation now. I've owned a duplex for 20 years. It has about doubled in value. But if I sell it I will pay out virtually half the proceeds in cap gains taxes. So I hold on to it rather than pay. That gives me less money to go buy other property. It is very inefficient.

You can borrow against your equity at rock bottom interest rates.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Capital gains aren't capital, they are the income from capital. People put their earned income into investment as well.

Capital gains are the profit on income that is ALREADY invested.

Capital gains are the profit on income that is ALREADY invested.

It's true, if you make capital investment less profitable, you'll get less capital investment.

If you shift the tax burden to regular income, you get less consumption, therefore less capital gain.

If you shift the tax burden to regular income,

Shift the burden?
If you raise capital gains tax rate, you'll collect less capital gains tax, less corporate tax and less income tax.

Fantasy.

Even Obama understands that's the case.

Prove it. With full attention to cause and effect, eliminating all other outside influences.

 

[The Rabbi]

Capital gains aren't capital, they are the income from capital. People put their earned income into investment as well.

Capital gains are the profit on income that is ALREADY invested.

Capital gains are the profit on income that is ALREADY invested.

It's true, if you make capital investment less profitable, you'll get less capital investment.

If you shift the tax burden to regular income, you get less consumption, therefore less capital gain.

If you shift the tax burden to regular income,

Shift the burden?
If you raise capital gains tax rate, you'll collect less capital gains tax, less corporate tax and less income tax.

Even Obama understands that raising cap gains taxes produces LESS revenue to the Treasury. But he doesnt care about that.

No cause and effect EVER proven, but go ahead and try.

How about we lower the cap gains tax to ZERO? Then show us how much MORE cap gains revenue you would collect.

lol

Every time the rate has been lowered, it has produced more revenue. Every time it has been raised it produces less revenue. Are you disagreeing withObama?
A zero rate would produce the most benefit to the economy.

 

[The Rabbi]

High cap gains taxes tend to "lock in" gains in investments.
Im in that situation now. I've owned a duplex for 20 years. It has about doubled in value. But if I sell it I will pay out virtually half the proceeds in cap gains taxes. So I hold on to it rather than pay. That gives me less money to go buy other property. It is very inefficient.

You can borrow against your equity at rock bottom interest rates.

I can borrow some of the equity and have to pay interest on it. No thanks.

I could also do a 1031 exchange but that is cumbersome and restrictive.