Keeping guns from criminals - liberals, what is your plan?

[Arizona Willie]

We only need ONE law regulating guns.

If you commit a crime while in possession of a firearm it is an automatic LIFE SENTENCE.
No appeal ... no parole ... no time off for good behavior.

Soon all the idiot criminals would be locked up and the population would be much safer.

life time in prison for armed robbery means they have no reason not to kill the victim. Get rid of a witness.

So people would use a gun in a crime but kill everyone they can find so they can't Identify them? I hope that was tongue in cheek...

If they get maximum sentence for simply having a gun, nothing will stop them from using the gun to silence witnesses. If armed robbery gets you life who gives a **** if you commit murder while you are at it.

6 years have a gun during a criminal act, life/death if fire a gun during that same act would be more appropriate.

========
I agree that is probably better.

I could go for that.

 

[Fishlore]

I've saved myself from two bad guys. I have no fantasies I know I am unlikely to be able to react quickly enough in the Kalamazoo scenario, but I did in the Foley scenario. I am not childish, I am prepared. Molon labe.[/QUOTE]
Well, that makes a lot of sense and I congratulate you on your successful self-defense. If we could somehow ensure that semi-automatic weapons were only in hands like yours, this wild debate would be moot. The problem is that guns are fungible and don't give a damn who pulls their triggers.

Now, I realize that guys like you keep gun safes, use trigger locks etc. and are very rarely, if ever, involved in a legal gun turning into an illegal gun. It is also true that the big majority of guns used in crimes have been traced back to a very small percentage of licensed gun dealers.

But, nonetheless, we have some 300,000,000 guns floating around in this country with effective control resting largely on responsible gun owners like you. Alas, you guys don't control all or even most of those 300,000,000 guns and, as we see every week, it takes only one whacko or one criminal with one gun to create horrible carnage of innocent people.

I admit I don't see an easy answer to the gun problem and I agree that the responsible gun owners is the wrong place to start. Although the number of guns keep increasing, the number of families without any gun has been growing steadily for forty years. This means that we are heading to a wild eyed, one-size-fits-all gun control program that will do little to effect the real problem. The responsible gun owners do not help their cause by stonewalling the issue.

When I first joined the NRA as a teen ager, the association was big on responsibility and necessary restriction. Gun ownership was a right, but it was a right that required demonstrated capability. Since then, the NRA has turned into a highly politicized lobby of the firearms industry, worse than useless. If the responsible gun owners don't take the wheel and get something accomplished, the hysterical Moms and Dads who have never fired a weapong will take over.

 

[Fishlore]

When you say things like this:

You are a ******* idiot. No one thinks that except apparently you. You're being a pompous ass and characterizing our position so you can look down your snooty nose at people. If you want to have a real discussion, cut the crap

Of course, every liberal in gun discussions is a gun owner. And you just proved with your asinine characterization of gun owners that you're a L-I-A-R. Any actual gun owner would know that.

And like you,no, I have never shot anyone. And unlike you I'm very happy about that. I've never shot a gun in anger at all and hope not to. But I don't have sick Rambo fantasies like you do

Well, amigo, you need to read a bit more carefully. I didn't say I was a gun owner, (although I am) I said I had shot somewone deliberately and had been paid for it. In fact, I shot several people and had quite a few more probables. Judging from your infantile world view, this all probably happened before you were born. I'll give you another clue and see if you can figure out what I am speaking about. The guy who paid me to shoot is named Uncle Sam.

Think about it because shooting someone under any circumstances is an experience one does not soon forget. You feel unrestrained to mouth off about the wonder-working powers of people trap

When you say things like this:

You are a ******* idiot. No one thinks that except apparently you. You're being a pompous ass and characterizing our position so you can look down your snooty nose at people. If you want to have a real discussion, cut the crap

Of course, every liberal in gun discussions is a gun owner. And you just proved with your asinine characterization of gun owners that you're a L-I-A-R. Any actual gun owner would know that.

And like you,no, I have never shot anyone. And unlike you I'm very happy about that. I've never shot a gun in anger at all and hope not to. But I don't have sick Rambo fantasies like you do

You need to read a bit more closely and think a bit harder. I didn't say I was a gun owner (although I am) I said I had shot someone deliberately and been paid for it. I guess from your inability to catch the reference that you are too young to grasp my what I am alluding to. Here's a hint: the guy who paid me is called Uncle Sam.

You have never shot anyone by your own admission, yet you feel qualified to discuss the beneficial effect of arming everyone at the mall in order to prevent crime. Shooting someone not by accident is something you seldom forget. Being in a group of people all of whom are shooting at people in another group also sticks in the memory. The idea of untrained gun virgins like you, not to mention your little sister and her grandmother, strapping on semi-automatic handguns in order to make their trip to Arby's safer is the stupidest, funniest post on this thread. Congratulations!

You were a soldier. We get it. People wanted to shoot you, so you shot them first. Congratulations. We're not talking about war here. We're talking about assholes with knives that want to cut your heart out and take your property. I carry a gun, thank you, so I still have my heart and my property. Thankfully once the gentlemen saw that they were.... let's say, out gunned, they both decided to abandon their plan and became quite compliant. No. I've never taken a life, but on 2 occasions, I was under a second from being forced to.

People wanted to shoot us but we wanted to shoot them even more. That's how Marines win. The will to kill isn't all I learned from Uncle Sam. I learned about collateral casualties downrange in the battle space, and I learned how difficult it is to respond effectively when stumbling into a premeditated ambush.

In the Kalamazoo scenario, three retired ladies in their 60s and 70s were emerging from and backlit a Cracker Barrel Restaurant when they were gunned down from within a darkened automobile. You could arm those ladies with assault weapons, RPGs and M67 frags and it wouldn't have saved them. There is a fair chance, however, that if those good old girls managed to get off a few rounds, they might have taken a pedestrians or two from across the street with them.

Face it: gun nuts have heroic fantasies about using their weapons collections to save America but it is just childish. You want to save America from the bad guys? Enlist.

I've saved myself from two bad guys. I have no fantasies I know I am unlikely to be able to react quickly enough in the Kalamazoo scenario, but I did in the Foley scenario. I am not childish, I am prepared. Molon labe.

Now that's the response of an actual, responsible gun owner.

Fishlore's response is the response of someone you know is lying about ever having touched a gun, and as certain as you are, even more you hope to God he hasn't

I'm curious to know by what line of reasoning your reached your conclusion about my history of gun ownership. Do you really think you can determine gun ownership from a few words posted on a bbs site?

If I agree to PM you my real identity and a copy of my pistol permit will you agree to do the same and swear to never post on usmessageboard.com again?

 

[kaz]

Since then, the NRA has turned into a highly politicized lobby of the firearms industry

Again, you belie your claims by parroting the bigoted caricatures of the leftist media. Anyone who actually knows the NRA knows they are all about gun safety, that hasn't changed at all. The DC lobbying effort isn't what you see when you deal with the local NRA groups

 

[kaz]

Fishlore's response is the response of someone you know is lying about ever having touched a gun, and as certain as you are, even more you hope to God he hasn't

I'm curious to know by what line of reasoning your reached your conclusion about my history of gun ownership. Do you really think you can determine gun ownership from a few words posted on a bbs site?

If I agree to PM you my real identity and a copy of my pistol permit will you agree to do the same and swear to never post on usmessageboard.com again?

My claim you are lying is based on your claim that you are a gun owner, so you know that gun owner fantasies are getting in a shooting and rolling on the ground like Rambo. I've been around gun owners all my life, family, friends, community, myself, and I have never known anyone like that. We take guns seriously. No paper you can fabricate can ever convince me that your ridiculous caricature of gun owners is true. It isn't. And anyone serious about guns would know that.

Also, I only make bets for fun with people I respect. The endless stream of liberals who claim like you they are gun owners and that's how they know we are a bunch of cartoon Yosemite Sams I do not respect. You've never touched a gun.

BTW, I'm not military, but I've known lots of people who were, including my brother and cousin in Gulf War I. They didn't kill anyone, but other people I knew did and they while talking about it are never flip about it like you are saying you've killed people for money.

...Mod Edit...​

 

[Wry Catcher]

Well, another few bite the dust, yawn ...

County sheriff: Multiple deaths, injuries Kansas attacks

To bad a few dozen by-standers didn't have AR 15's, it could have really been interesting. As it stands, it's just a run-of-the-mill standard murder of a bunch of people who went to work and will never go home. As I wrote, yawn.

BTW, I wonder if the shooter was a criminal before he went hunting today?

 

[Rustic]

I've saved myself from two bad guys. I have no fantasies I know I am unlikely to be able to react quickly enough in the Kalamazoo scenario, but I did in the Foley scenario. I am not childish, I am prepared. Molon labe.

Well, that makes a lot of sense and I congratulate you on your successful self-defense. If we could somehow ensure that semi-automatic weapons were only in hands like yours, this wild debate would be moot. The problem is that guns are fungible and don't give a damn who pulls their triggers.

Now, I realize that guys like you keep gun safes, use trigger locks etc. and are very rarely, if ever, involved in a legal gun turning into an illegal gun. It is also true that the big majority of guns used in crimes have been traced back to a very small percentage of licensed gun dealers.

But, nonetheless, we have some 300,000,000 guns floating around in this country with effective control resting largely on responsible gun owners like you. Alas, you guys don't control all or even most of those 300,000,000 guns and, as we see every week, it takes only one whacko or one criminal with one gun to create horrible carnage of innocent people.

I admit I don't see an easy answer to the gun problem and I agree that the responsible gun owners is the wrong place to start. Although the number of guns keep increasing, the number of families without any gun has been growing steadily for forty years. This means that we are heading to a wild eyed, one-size-fits-all gun control program that will do little to effect the real problem. The responsible gun owners do not help their cause by stonewalling the issue.

When I first joined the NRA as a teen ager, the association was big on responsibility and necessary restriction. Gun ownership was a right, but it was a right that required demonstrated capability. Since then, the NRA has turned into a highly politicized lobby of the firearms industry, worse than useless. If the responsible gun owners don't take the wheel and get something accomplished, the hysterical Moms and Dads who have never fired a weapong will take over.[/QUOTE]


Quit making shit up...

 

[kaz]

auditor0007

So, you keep repeating the canard that if we make guns illegal then:

1) Criminals won't be able to get guns
2) Everyone will be safe because no gun and the criminals won't commit the crimes and we're all safe without guns.

So what's your plan? There are 310 million guns in the US and hundreds millions more in the world. Yet you're going to keep all those out of the hands of criminals? Seriously? What's your plan to accomplish that? 6387 posts so far, and no actual plan from any of the liberals? So what's your plan?

 

[Fishlore]

auditor0007

So, you keep repeating the canard that if we make guns illegal then:

1) Criminals won't be able to get guns
2) Everyone will be safe because no gun and the criminals won't commit the crimes and we're all safe without guns.

So what's your plan? There are 310 million guns in the US and hundreds millions more in the world. Yet you're going to keep all those out of the hands of criminals? Seriously? What's your plan to accomplish that? 6387 posts so far, and no actual plan from any of the liberals? So what's your plan?

1. Ban possession of all firearms and ammunition Illegal possession carries a $1,000 fine and mandatory 1 year in jail. The fine and jail terms double every year. Five years later it is a $16,000 fine and 16 years in jail.

2. Information leading to the arrest and conviction of anyone in illegal possession of a firearm receives a reward equal to the fine on the year of arrest. Rat out someone who has a gun seven years after passage of the law and collect a $64,000 reward. Folks will be lined up around the block of every police station waiting to turn in friends, family and neighbors for that reward money.

3. All persons entering the US are subject to search for guns and ammunition. Conviction carries a mandatory life sentence without parole.

What a glorious and happy land America will be only ten years after this ground-breaking law comes into effect!

 

[auditor0007]

auditor0007

So, you keep repeating the canard that if we make guns illegal then:

1) Criminals won't be able to get guns
2) Everyone will be safe because no gun and the criminals won't commit the crimes and we're all safe without guns.

So what's your plan? There are 310 million guns in the US and hundreds millions more in the world. Yet you're going to keep all those out of the hands of criminals? Seriously? What's your plan to accomplish that? 6387 posts so far, and no actual plan from any of the liberals? So what's your plan?

I'm not making an argument to take everyone's guns away, because I understand it will never happen. I'm just stating a fact that no guns equals a much lower homicide rate than we currently have, and that cannot be denied.

 

[westwall]

auditor0007

So, you keep repeating the canard that if we make guns illegal then:

1) Criminals won't be able to get guns
2) Everyone will be safe because no gun and the criminals won't commit the crimes and we're all safe without guns.

So what's your plan? There are 310 million guns in the US and hundreds millions more in the world. Yet you're going to keep all those out of the hands of criminals? Seriously? What's your plan to accomplish that? 6387 posts so far, and no actual plan from any of the liberals? So what's your plan?

1. Ban possession of all firearms and ammunition Illegal possession carries a $1,000 fine and mandatory 1 year in jail. The fine and jail terms double every year. Five years later it is a $16,000 fine and 16 years in jail.

2. Information leading to the arrest and conviction of anyone in illegal possession of a firearm receives a reward equal to the fine on the year of arrest. Rat out someone who has a gun seven years after passage of the law and collect a $64,000 reward. Folks will be lined up around the block of every police station waiting to turn in friends, family and neighbors for that reward money.

3. All persons entering the US are subject to search for guns and ammunition. Conviction carries a mandatory life sentence without parole.

What a glorious and happy land America will be only ten years after this ground-breaking law comes into effect!

Japan has basically the same laws, their harbors are heavily patrolled and even with all of that the Yakuza has more guns than members.

 

[kaz]

auditor0007

So, you keep repeating the canard that if we make guns illegal then:

1) Criminals won't be able to get guns
2) Everyone will be safe because no gun and the criminals won't commit the crimes and we're all safe without guns.

So what's your plan? There are 310 million guns in the US and hundreds millions more in the world. Yet you're going to keep all those out of the hands of criminals? Seriously? What's your plan to accomplish that? 6387 posts so far, and no actual plan from any of the liberals? So what's your plan?

1. Ban possession of all firearms and ammunition Illegal possession carries a $1,000 fine and mandatory 1 year in jail. The fine and jail terms double every year. Five years later it is a $16,000 fine and 16 years in jail.

2. Information leading to the arrest and conviction of anyone in illegal possession of a firearm receives a reward equal to the fine on the year of arrest. Rat out someone who has a gun seven years after passage of the law and collect a $64,000 reward. Folks will be lined up around the block of every police station waiting to turn in friends, family and neighbors for that reward money.

3. All persons entering the US are subject to search for guns and ammunition. Conviction carries a mandatory life sentence without parole.

What a glorious and happy land America will be only ten years after this ground-breaking law comes into effect!

So 1 and 2 are going to scare criminals into not getting a gun when they are planning to commit murder? That's ridiculous

As for 3, so since you people demand we keep the borders open, why are they going to go through legal entry anyway?

 

[kaz]

auditor0007

So, you keep repeating the canard that if we make guns illegal then:

1) Criminals won't be able to get guns
2) Everyone will be safe because no gun and the criminals won't commit the crimes and we're all safe without guns.

So what's your plan? There are 310 million guns in the US and hundreds millions more in the world. Yet you're going to keep all those out of the hands of criminals? Seriously? What's your plan to accomplish that? 6387 posts so far, and no actual plan from any of the liberals? So what's your plan?

I'm not making an argument to take everyone's guns away, because I understand it will never happen. I'm just stating a fact that no guns equals a much lower homicide rate than we currently have, and that cannot be denied.

You can argue a general correlation, but you can't conclude cause and effect from that. Again, Europle had lower murder rates as they were more homogonous and those murder rates are skyrocketing as they increase immigration of different cultures. We are very diverse, how does that observation help us? Want to start exporting people so we're more midwestern white again?

What do we get from that? What we do know is in Sandy Hook, Virginia Tech, Columbine, the Washington Navy yard, Aurora and other mass shootings, the commonality was no one was shooting back and that helped the shooter maximize the carnage. That's what gun laws accomplish

 

[TooTall]

auditor0007

So, you keep repeating the canard that if we make guns illegal then:

1) Criminals won't be able to get guns
2) Everyone will be safe because no gun and the criminals won't commit the crimes and we're all safe without guns.

So what's your plan? There are 310 million guns in the US and hundreds millions more in the world. Yet you're going to keep all those out of the hands of criminals? Seriously? What's your plan to accomplish that? 6387 posts so far, and no actual plan from any of the liberals? So what's your plan?

1. Ban possession of all firearms and ammunition Illegal possession carries a $1,000 fine and mandatory 1 year in jail. The fine and jail terms double every year. Five years later it is a $16,000 fine and 16 years in jail.

2. Information leading to the arrest and conviction of anyone in illegal possession of a firearm receives a reward equal to the fine on the year of arrest. Rat out someone who has a gun seven years after passage of the law and collect a $64,000 reward. Folks will be lined up around the block of every police station waiting to turn in friends, family and neighbors for that reward money.

3. All persons entering the US are subject to search for guns and ammunition. Conviction carries a mandatory life sentence without parole.

What a glorious and happy land America will be only ten years after this ground-breaking law comes into effect!

The next thing you will have to do is have a confiscatory program to take away all of the knives people have. Then you can start on baseball bats. LMAO

 

[Fishlore]

auditor0007

So, you keep repeating the canard that if we make guns illegal then:

1) Criminals won't be able to get guns
2) Everyone will be safe because no gun and the criminals won't commit the crimes and we're all safe without guns.

So what's your plan? There are 310 million guns in the US and hundreds millions more in the world. Yet you're going to keep all those out of the hands of criminals? Seriously? What's your plan to accomplish that? 6387 posts so far, and no actual plan from any of the liberals? So what's your plan?

1. Ban possession of all firearms and ammunition Illegal possession carries a $1,000 fine and mandatory 1 year in jail. The fine and jail terms double every year. Five years later it is a $16,000 fine and 16 years in jail.

2. Information leading to the arrest and conviction of anyone in illegal possession of a firearm receives a reward equal to the fine on the year of arrest. Rat out someone who has a gun seven years after passage of the law and collect a $64,000 reward. Folks will be lined up around the block of every police station waiting to turn in friends, family and neighbors for that reward money.

3. All persons entering the US are subject to search for guns and ammunition. Conviction carries a mandatory life sentence without parole.

What a glorious and happy land America will be only ten years after this ground-breaking law comes into effect!

So 1 and 2 are going to scare criminals into not getting a gun when they are planning to commit murder? That's ridiculous

As for 3, so since you people demand we keep the borders open, why are they going to go through legal entry anyway?

The law may not scare criminals, it's intent is to dry up the supply. Of all the tragedies due to guns, premeditated murder is perhaps the least likely to be significantly reduced by eliminating guns. There are lots of ways to kill with time and planning. Impulsive crimes, accidental shootings and suicides will be more effectively reduced. Gang and criminal killings can continue but multiple deaths and collateral injuries will go way down.

I don't know who "you people" you are talking about gun control and border control are not necessarily linked.

There are many countries in which guns were once widely prevalent, ususally as the result of war, in which civiliang guns have been successfully rounded up. It not only can be done, it has been done from China to Greece.

 

[The Rabbi]

auditor0007

So, you keep repeating the canard that if we make guns illegal then:

1) Criminals won't be able to get guns
2) Everyone will be safe because no gun and the criminals won't commit the crimes and we're all safe without guns.

So what's your plan? There are 310 million guns in the US and hundreds millions more in the world. Yet you're going to keep all those out of the hands of criminals? Seriously? What's your plan to accomplish that? 6387 posts so far, and no actual plan from any of the liberals? So what's your plan?

I'm not making an argument to take everyone's guns away, because I understand it will never happen. I'm just stating a fact that no guns equals a much lower homicide rate than we currently have, and that cannot be denied.

No cars would equal a zero auto fatality rate too. Just saying.

 

[The Rabbi]

auditor0007

So, you keep repeating the canard that if we make guns illegal then:

1) Criminals won't be able to get guns
2) Everyone will be safe because no gun and the criminals won't commit the crimes and we're all safe without guns.

So what's your plan? There are 310 million guns in the US and hundreds millions more in the world. Yet you're going to keep all those out of the hands of criminals? Seriously? What's your plan to accomplish that? 6387 posts so far, and no actual plan from any of the liberals? So what's your plan?

1. Ban possession of all firearms and ammunition Illegal possession carries a $1,000 fine and mandatory 1 year in jail. The fine and jail terms double every year. Five years later it is a $16,000 fine and 16 years in jail.

2. Information leading to the arrest and conviction of anyone in illegal possession of a firearm receives a reward equal to the fine on the year of arrest. Rat out someone who has a gun seven years after passage of the law and collect a $64,000 reward. Folks will be lined up around the block of every police station waiting to turn in friends, family and neighbors for that reward money.

3. All persons entering the US are subject to search for guns and ammunition. Conviction carries a mandatory life sentence without parole.

What a glorious and happy land America will be only ten years after this ground-breaking law comes into effect!

So are all persons entering the US subject to search for cocaine? Is there any place here you cannot buy cocaine?
There is no way to get rid of guns without turning the US into a polcie state, which is what liberals want.

 

[auditor0007]

auditor0007

So, you keep repeating the canard that if we make guns illegal then:

1) Criminals won't be able to get guns
2) Everyone will be safe because no gun and the criminals won't commit the crimes and we're all safe without guns.

So what's your plan? There are 310 million guns in the US and hundreds millions more in the world. Yet you're going to keep all those out of the hands of criminals? Seriously? What's your plan to accomplish that? 6387 posts so far, and no actual plan from any of the liberals? So what's your plan?

I'm not making an argument to take everyone's guns away, because I understand it will never happen. I'm just stating a fact that no guns equals a much lower homicide rate than we currently have, and that cannot be denied.

No cars would equal a zero auto fatality rate too. Just saying.

There is a much better argument for the need of cars in our lives than there is for guns. Just saying.

 

[kaz]

auditor0007

So, you keep repeating the canard that if we make guns illegal then:

1) Criminals won't be able to get guns
2) Everyone will be safe because no gun and the criminals won't commit the crimes and we're all safe without guns.

So what's your plan? There are 310 million guns in the US and hundreds millions more in the world. Yet you're going to keep all those out of the hands of criminals? Seriously? What's your plan to accomplish that? 6387 posts so far, and no actual plan from any of the liberals? So what's your plan?

1. Ban possession of all firearms and ammunition Illegal possession carries a $1,000 fine and mandatory 1 year in jail. The fine and jail terms double every year. Five years later it is a $16,000 fine and 16 years in jail.

2. Information leading to the arrest and conviction of anyone in illegal possession of a firearm receives a reward equal to the fine on the year of arrest. Rat out someone who has a gun seven years after passage of the law and collect a $64,000 reward. Folks will be lined up around the block of every police station waiting to turn in friends, family and neighbors for that reward money.

3. All persons entering the US are subject to search for guns and ammunition. Conviction carries a mandatory life sentence without parole.

What a glorious and happy land America will be only ten years after this ground-breaking law comes into effect!

So 1 and 2 are going to scare criminals into not getting a gun when they are planning to commit murder? That's ridiculous

As for 3, so since you people demand we keep the borders open, why are they going to go through legal entry anyway?

The law may not scare criminals, it's intent is to dry up the supply. Of all the tragedies due to guns, premeditated murder is perhaps the least likely to be significantly reduced by eliminating guns. There are lots of ways to kill with time and planning. Impulsive crimes, accidental shootings and suicides will be more effectively reduced. Gang and criminal killings can continue but multiple deaths and collateral injuries will go way down.

I don't know who "you people" you are talking about gun control and border control are not necessarily linked.

There are many countries in which guns were once widely prevalent, ususally as the result of war, in which civiliang guns have been successfully rounded up. It not only can be done, it has been done from China to Greece.

So you're banking on:

We can "dry up" or keep away the 310 million guns from criminals

They can't import them even though drugs are rampant

And they can't think of any other way to kill people

And if any of those fail, we're dead. Oh well. OK, I'm in, that sounds like a reasonable plan ...

 

[kaz]

auditor0007

So, you keep repeating the canard that if we make guns illegal then:

1) Criminals won't be able to get guns
2) Everyone will be safe because no gun and the criminals won't commit the crimes and we're all safe without guns.

So what's your plan? There are 310 million guns in the US and hundreds millions more in the world. Yet you're going to keep all those out of the hands of criminals? Seriously? What's your plan to accomplish that? 6387 posts so far, and no actual plan from any of the liberals? So what's your plan?

I'm not making an argument to take everyone's guns away, because I understand it will never happen. I'm just stating a fact that no guns equals a much lower homicide rate than we currently have, and that cannot be denied.

No cars would equal a zero auto fatality rate too. Just saying.

There is a much better argument for the need of cars in our lives than there is for guns. Just saying.

Yes, a car can take you places. A gun can protect you from someone who wants to kill you. No need for that. How'd that plan work out for you in Paris? Or Aurora, Sandy Hook, the Washington Navy Yard, Columbine, the community college in Oregon, San Bernardino, Virginia Tech, Sandy Hook ...