Judge Blocks Oklahoma’s Ban on Using Shariah Law in Court

[ScreamingEagle]

...like i asked truthmatters before.....should we allow muslims to murder just because their religion condones it....?
...or rape their women...? ....or beat their women....?

Incorrect.

Islam does Not condone murder, rape, or the beating of women.

I tend to agree, however this is a multi-layered issue since this issue is a cultural interpretation, and which many Muslim countries interpret the rights of a husband as sacrosanct and a few are marginally more moderate than the more cultural extreme interpretations.

But how many Governments support this interpretation to the extreme Sunni Man?

Let's take Afghanistan under the Islamic 'control' of the Taliban. With their interpretation of Islam and Sharia, you can not say what you just said.

So, I put forwards that you attempt to hide the reality with a softer moderate posting, but which is against the reality we see in the Islamic world.

Since you demand the extraction and 'cure' of homosexuality, I put forward you have little concern for the lives of people if they do not fit into 'your' personal views. Again, if you wish, I can post the links of your words regarding Islam and the homosexuals within the Muslim world. Muslims are all over the world.

That's rather backward looking.

Pretty much why i answered "says you" to Sunni Man....but much better said...

...and since muslim immigrants tend to bring along old practices...who is to say many of the more negative practices would NOT be included in their sharia laws if allowed to exist here....? hell....we'd have to do the women rights movement all over again....

 

[Ropey]

Pretty much why i answered "says you" to Sunni Man....but much better said...

...and since muslim immigrants tend to bring along old practices...who is to say many of the more negative practices would NOT be included in their sharia laws if allowed to exist here....? hell....we'd have to do the women rights movement all over again....

Better? More long winded at any rate

Iran shows what is happening. Saudi Arabia shows what is happening.

Effect of globalization of political Islam on Women’s Rights, in question with Polygamy, Neqab and Honor Killing

The United Nations High Commissioner of Human Rights,

Its senior management group

And

The 47 nation members of the UN Human Rights Council!

Dear Sirs/Madams

The International Campaign to close down Iranian Embassies would like to emphasize that the violation of human rights in Iran predates the election last June of Ahmadinejad. The report presented by the Britain, France, and the United States on February 15, 2010 is misleading by stressing the abuses only occurred after the election. Right from the beginning of this regime, people in Iran have experienced various abuses and their rights have been violated as the government set out to establish Sharia Law as the laws of the state. These laws and regulations are the most anti-human, anti-women and anti-modernist. Such barbaric laws truly belong to the era of 1400 years ago. All concerned citizens globally must wonder whether we are talking about Iran as a state in 21st century.

Discrimination against women and the oppression of women have taken the most grotesque and outrageous forms against the rights of women. These rights have been increasingly under attack through Iran’s enforcement of Sharia Law. Women are being subjected to abuse for disobeying Islamic standards. Daily degradation of women, prohibition from many forms of employment, field of study and sports, sexual segregation in buses, schools and public places, stoning to death of women or murdering them for sexual relations outside marriage, acid-throwing in the faces of women and flogging in public for putting on makeup, arresting and gang raping women are routine practices of this regime. Private cars are often stopped and the women and young girls are forcefully separated and insulted in front of other family members. And then, after being dragged away, other members of their family are assaulted too. Actions like these put the Iranian regime on par with the cruelty of the Taliban.

Mass arrests include young mothers who have been tortured before their children to obtain confessions. Then with their child/children, some under a year old, they were left in solitary confinement, sometimes for days, bleeding and with broken bones. Often their children were also tortured before their mother’s eyes. Such inhuman behavior can be compared to the Nazi regime during the second war.

There is no need to send a team of investigators from the United Nations to do an “inquiry mechanism to shed light on these violation” as was proposed by the French, Britain and American governments. There is already a system in place. Access to all the reports of the three million refugees who went through UNHCR and have already been questioned about the abuse, torture and loss of beloved ones by execution is already at your disposal through the UNHCR offices. After, these reports were submitted to various countries; the United Nation has access to the number of executions with names, gender, date of birth and pictures of dead bodies, sometimes through the victim’s family or victim’s organizations . There is no doubt that United Nations receives news, pictures, reports, letters, weblogs on YouTube, on daily bases, either from survivors or other members of victims with respect to the facts mentioned above. Reports of Amnesty International on violation of human rights in Iran is open to the public too.

Soon people in Iran along with concerned citizens globally will put all the leaders of Islamic regime of Iran on trial for all the heinous state crimes they have committed in Iran. But until then the International Campaign to close down Iranian Embassies has very rightfully demanded that Secretary-General of the United Nations, BAN KI-MOON, the United Nations High Commissioner of Human Rights and its senior management group, adopt a resolution for closing down all Iranian Embassies around the world. This is the least global citizens expect the United Nation do.

If the above mentioned crimes are not enough for such a resolution, then let us study the crimes this regime has committed against children.

There cannot be found any law or regulation that benefits children in general, in the Islamic state of Iran. The Convention on the Rights of the Child was never adopted by the Islamic Regime of Iran. Children are segregated at very young age. The hijab has been imposed on girls as young as 5 years old. In schools, the Sharia law is paramount and is teaching young girls to become submissive and young boys cruelty towards women and brutality towards girls. Furthermore, Sharia law has taken over the childhood children by preventing young girls and boys participating in social and leisure activities. Forced marriage and child brides are permitted and the husband can be as old as her grandfather. The Regime also has been involved in sexual trafficking of girls and children are sold as sex slaves. States with laws of Sharia have permitted short term marriages or sigheh. Young girls are sold into prostitution as short term marriages, in which these marriages can last from one hour to several years. In 21st century language a “Child Bride” is another name for abduction and rape and it is considered a serious crime. Children are being arrested, tortured, forced to witness torture of their beloved ones and raped by the officials in prisons. A virgin girl is raped first before execution.

Child labor is permitted and children are working in the most unbearable environment. Many have lost their health due to their jobs. According to Islamic Regime Authorities, over 5 million children have been prevented from attending school and are practically living in streets.

Highlights of above mentioned crimes against children and misery that this regime has caused these children living in Iran gives us the right to request the urgent matter before Secretary-General of the United Nations, BAN KI-MOON, the United Nations High Commissioner of Human Rights and its senior management group by the international Campaign to close down Iranian embassies, and that is to adopt a resolution to freeze all the bank accounts of the Islamic regime’s leaders. Much evidence and documentation have come to light showing embezzlement of money belonging to the people of Iran by these leaders. These leaders who have committed state crimes and human rights violations, have pocketed huge amounts of funds into their personal bank accounts in Europe, Canada and other Western countries.

The campaign has only briefly touched upon violations and crimes against women and children. There is much to say about the violation against workers, horrendous crimes against Kurdish people, and oppression against other religions.

To prevent further crimes by Islamic Regime of Iran and to save the lives of the people in Iran, we believe the Secretary-General of the United Nations, BAN

KI-MOON, the United Nations High Commissioner of Human Rights and its senior management group need to act fast. We therefore expect a resolution be adopted by the United Nation to close down all Iranian Embassies for:

* Crimes against the people in Iran
* Executing more than 100,000 of political prisoners and assassination of oppositions outside of Iran
* Executing gays and lesbians in Iran
* Stoning women and men for consensual sex
* Imposing gender apartheid
* Systematic oppression of women
* Imposing extreme poverty and destitution on the society
* Imposing compulsory veil
* Involving in Child Trafficking
* Participating in Sexual trafficking
* Legalizing child labor
* Legalizing Child brides
* Legalizing temporary marriage (sigheh) and polygamy
* Committing horrendous crimes against Kurdish people
* Oppressing other regions in Iran in particular Jews, Christianity and Bahai

Sincerely,

Homa Arjomand

Coordinator of the International Campaign to Close down Iranian Embassies

[email protected]

International Campaign Against Shari'a Court in Canada

416-737-9500

 

[High_Gravity]

Incorrect.

Islam does Not condone murder, rape, or the beating of women.

I tend to agree, however this is a multi-layered issue since this issue is a cultural interpretation, and which many Muslim countries interpret the rights of a husband as sacrosanct and a few are marginally more moderate than the more cultural extreme interpretations.

But how many Governments support this interpretation to the extreme Sunni Man?

Let's take Afghanistan under the Islamic 'control' of the Taliban. With their interpretation of Islam and Sharia, you can not say what you just said.

So, I put forwards that you attempt to hide the reality with a softer moderate posting, but which is against the reality we see in the Islamic world.

Since you demand the extraction and 'cure' of homosexuality, I put forward you have little concern for the lives of people if they do not fit into 'your' personal views. Again, if you wish, I can post the links of your words regarding Islam and the homosexuals within the Muslim world. Muslims are all over the world.

That's rather backward looking.

Pretty much why i answered "says you" to Sunni Man....but much better said...

...and since muslim immigrants tend to bring along old practices...who is to say many of the more negative practices would NOT be included in their sharia laws if allowed to exist here....? hell....we'd have to do the women rights movement all over again....

Madeline mentioned that the US courts can pick through Shariah and choose what laws we can have and what laws we can't but I told her that Muslims will not allow a US judge to tell them what parts of Shariah they can and cannot adhere to. According to Muslims Shariah words are str8 from God and that is it, point blank period. They want all of it.

 

[ScreamingEagle]

I tend to agree, however this is a multi-layered issue since this issue is a cultural interpretation, and which many Muslim countries interpret the rights of a husband as sacrosanct and a few are marginally more moderate than the more cultural extreme interpretations.

But how many Governments support this interpretation to the extreme Sunni Man?

Let's take Afghanistan under the Islamic 'control' of the Taliban. With their interpretation of Islam and Sharia, you can not say what you just said.

So, I put forwards that you attempt to hide the reality with a softer moderate posting, but which is against the reality we see in the Islamic world.

Since you demand the extraction and 'cure' of homosexuality, I put forward you have little concern for the lives of people if they do not fit into 'your' personal views. Again, if you wish, I can post the links of your words regarding Islam and the homosexuals within the Muslim world. Muslims are all over the world.

That's rather backward looking.

Pretty much why i answered "says you" to Sunni Man....but much better said...

...and since muslim immigrants tend to bring along old practices...who is to say many of the more negative practices would NOT be included in their sharia laws if allowed to exist here....? hell....we'd have to do the women rights movement all over again....

Madeline mentioned that the US courts can pick through Shariah and choose what laws we can have and what laws we can't but I told her that Muslims will not allow a US judge to tell them what parts of Shariah they can and cannot adhere to. According to Muslims Shariah words are str8 from God and that is it, point blank period. They want all of it.

Which is exactly why Shariah cannot become law in the United States...we do not allow theocracy...

 

[High_Gravity]

Pretty much why i answered "says you" to Sunni Man....but much better said...

...and since muslim immigrants tend to bring along old practices...who is to say many of the more negative practices would NOT be included in their sharia laws if allowed to exist here....? hell....we'd have to do the women rights movement all over again....

Madeline mentioned that the US courts can pick through Shariah and choose what laws we can have and what laws we can't but I told her that Muslims will not allow a US judge to tell them what parts of Shariah they can and cannot adhere to. According to Muslims Shariah words are str8 from God and that is it, point blank period. They want all of it.

Which is exactly why Shariah cannot become law in the United States...we do not allow theocracy...

I agree but I don't want any religious courts in the US regardless of religion.

 

[Sunni Man]

...like i asked truthmatters before.....should we allow muslims to murder just because their religion condones it....?
...or rape their women...? ....or beat their women....?

Incorrect.

Islam does Not condone murder, rape, or the beating of women.

I tend to agree, however this is a multi-layered issue since this issue is a cultural interpretation, and which many Muslim countries interpret the rights of a husband as sacrosanct and a few are marginally more moderate than the more cultural extreme interpretations.

But how many Governments support this interpretation to the extreme Sunni Man?

Let's take Afghanistan under the Islamic 'control' of the Taliban. With their interpretation of Islam and Sharia, you can not say what you just said.

So, I put forwards that you attempt to hide the reality with a softer moderate posting, but which is against the reality we see in the Islamic world.

Why should I care what they do in Afghanistan, Iran, Saudi Arabia, or any other muslim country.

It doesn't affect me in the least.

I am only concerned with America and U.S. law.

 

[Intense]

Incorrect.

Islam does Not condone murder, rape, or the beating of women.

I tend to agree, however this is a multi-layered issue since this issue is a cultural interpretation, and which many Muslim countries interpret the rights of a husband as sacrosanct and a few are marginally more moderate than the more cultural extreme interpretations.

But how many Governments support this interpretation to the extreme Sunni Man?

Let's take Afghanistan under the Islamic 'control' of the Taliban. With their interpretation of Islam and Sharia, you can not say what you just said.

So, I put forwards that you attempt to hide the reality with a softer moderate posting, but which is against the reality we see in the Islamic world.

Why should I care what they do in Afghanistan, Iran, Saudi Arabia, or any other muslim country.

It doesn't affect me in the least.

I am only concerned with America and U.S. law.

So you have come to your senses and are abandoning Sharia Law? Wonderful! May God Bless you for your Wisdom.

 

[jillian]

I agree but I don't want any religious courts in the US regardless of religion.

To be fair, we already have religious courts in the US. The Catholic Church grants religious divorces and there are jewish courts called Beit Din which resolve disputes between jews based on Jewish law.

Obviously, that's a purely voluntary thing for people of the same culture, but it does exist.

 

[ScreamingEagle]

Incorrect.

Islam does Not condone murder, rape, or the beating of women.

I tend to agree, however this is a multi-layered issue since this issue is a cultural interpretation, and which many Muslim countries interpret the rights of a husband as sacrosanct and a few are marginally more moderate than the more cultural extreme interpretations.

But how many Governments support this interpretation to the extreme Sunni Man?

Let's take Afghanistan under the Islamic 'control' of the Taliban. With their interpretation of Islam and Sharia, you can not say what you just said.

So, I put forwards that you attempt to hide the reality with a softer moderate posting, but which is against the reality we see in the Islamic world.

Why should I care what they do in Afghanistan, Iran, Saudi Arabia, or any other muslim country.

It doesn't affect me in the least.

I am only concerned with America and U.S. law.

Then you should have no problem with the OK law....

 

[ScreamingEagle]

I agree but I don't want any religious courts in the US regardless of religion.

To be fair, we already have religious courts in the US. The Catholic Church grants religious divorces and there are jewish courts called Beit Din which resolve disputes between jews based on Jewish law.

Obviously, that's a purely voluntary thing for people of the same culture, but it does exist.

To be fair....do any of those run counter to U.S. law....?

 

[High_Gravity]

I agree but I don't want any religious courts in the US regardless of religion.

To be fair, we already have religious courts in the US. The Catholic Church grants religious divorces and there are jewish courts called Beit Din which resolve disputes between jews based on Jewish law.

Obviously, that's a purely voluntary thing for people of the same culture, but it does exist.

Does the Jewish courts and Catholic courts follow rules like this?

1. Islam commands that drinkers and gamblers should be whipped. Sura 5:90-91.

2. Islam allows husbands to beat their wives. Qur’an, 4:34

3. Islam allows an injured plaintiff to exact legal revenge, physical eye for physical eye. Qur’an, 5:45

4. Islam commands that a male and female thief must have a hand cut off. Qur’an, 5:38

5. Islam commands that highway robbers should be crucified or mutilated. Qur’an, 5:33. As an alternative, the convicted may have a hand and the opposite foot cut off while being banished from the land instead of crucifixion.

6. Islam commands that Homosexuals be executed. Abdu Dawud no. 447. Burning to death, stoned while against a wall, or stoned and thrown over a cliff.

7. Islam orders unmarried fornicators to be whipped and adulterers to be stoned to death. Qur’an, 24-6

8. Islam orders death for Muslim and possible death for non—Muslim critics of Muhammad and the Quran and even sharia itself.

9. Islam orders apostates to be killed. Sura 9:11-12

10. Islam commands offensive and aggressive and unjust jihad

Has a Jew or Catholic murdered or raped his wife, and tried to hide behind their court system? because Muslims in the US have tried that.

 

[Intense]

I agree but I don't want any religious courts in the US regardless of religion.

To be fair, we already have religious courts in the US. The Catholic Church grants religious divorces and there are jewish courts called Beit Din which resolve disputes between jews based on Jewish law.

Obviously, that's a purely voluntary thing for people of the same culture, but it does exist.

I agree and Totally support it's right to be with the understanding that it does not Trump State or Constitutional Law. It is not within reason to commit a violent crime and hide behind Religious Protection. You are free to use it in your defense, but it should not effect a Judges Ruling, when in conflict with our law.

 

[Sunni Man]

So you have come to your senses and are abandoning Sharia Law? Wonderful! May God Bless you for your Wisdom.

Not a chance.


Seems like no matter what the subject is concerning muslims or Islam.

Be it marriage, divorce, sharia law, children, courts, women, etc.

The first thing I hear people say to me; well in Iran or Pakistan or Egypt, they do this or did that.

Look, I live in America and am only concerned with laws and situations that affect American muslims.

What happens in other nations is their business, their culture, and their laws.

 

[High_Gravity]

So you have come to your senses and are abandoning Sharia Law? Wonderful! May God Bless you for your Wisdom.

Not a chance.


Seems like no matter what the subject is concerning muslims or Islam.

Be it marriage, divorce, sharia law, children, courts, women, etc.

The first thing I hear people say to me; well in Iran or Pakistan or Egypt, they do this or did that.

Look, I live in America and am only concerned with laws and situations that affect American muslims.

What happens in other nations is their business, their culture, and their laws.

So if Muslims got to have Shariah here in the States, how would it be applied?

 

[Sunni Man]

So if Muslims got to have Shariah here in the States, how would it be applied?

Much like the jew's Beth din courts.

Or the native american's Tribal courts.

They deal with civil matters and not criminal cases.


People don't understand that the overwhelming bulk of Sharia Laws deals with civil court matters.

Like divorce, finance, law suits, banking matters, orphans, child custody, property rights, etc.


But most people in the West think that Sharia Law is just about punishment for criminals and criminal acts.

 

[High_Gravity]

So if Muslims got to have Shariah here in the States, how would it be applied?

Much like the jew's Beth din courts.

Or the native american's Tribal courts.

They deal with civil matters and not criminal cases.


People don't understand that the overwhelming bulk of Sharia Laws deals with civil court matters.

Like divorce, finance, law suits, banking matters, orphans, child custody, property rights, etc.


But most people in the West think that Sharia Law is just about punishment for criminals and criminal acts.

Well if you look at the list I posted above where they talk about death penalties for people who commit adultry, steal, homosexuality etc. its very scary stuff. When people hear you say you want Shariah, they assume you want the whole package, with beheadings, floggings and all.

 

[Varth Dader]

You don't understand the difference...

If a hotel owner is offering his rooms to the general public he cannot discriminate by race...because he is offering his product to all.....but it is HIS product (rooms) he is selling...

An African-American can't demand that the hotel owner provide a room decorated with African decor...just because he wants it...take what is offered for sale or don't buy...

Why would you force anyone to rent a privately owned room to someone based on the color of his skin?

The point is that your can force someone to do something.

Can you force a pharmacy to carry all sorts of medicine, including contraceptive pills?

Think about it. To open a pharmacy you need a license.

The license, issued by a State, says you have to carry a certain set of products including contraceptive pills. If you are not happy, do not open a pharmacy.

Is everything OK with you so far? Are you going to challenge the right of a State to decide how to license a pharmacy?

So what do you do when a pharmacist says it is against his religion to sell the pill?

 

[jillian]

I agree but I don't want any religious courts in the US regardless of religion.

To be fair, we already have religious courts in the US. The Catholic Church grants religious divorces and there are jewish courts called Beit Din which resolve disputes between jews based on Jewish law.

Obviously, that's a purely voluntary thing for people of the same culture, but it does exist.

I agree and Totally support it's right to be with the understanding that it does not Trump State or Constitutional Law. It is not within reason to commit a violent crime and hide behind Religious Protection. You are free to use it in your defense, but it should not effect a Judges Ruling, when in conflict with our law.

Oh.. I'm 100% in agreement with you. But that's already the law and it isn't changing any time soon.

 

[High_Gravity]

You don't understand the difference...

If a hotel owner is offering his rooms to the general public he cannot discriminate by race...because he is offering his product to all.....but it is HIS product (rooms) he is selling...

An African-American can't demand that the hotel owner provide a room decorated with African decor...just because he wants it...take what is offered for sale or don't buy...

Why would you force anyone to rent a privately owned room to someone based on the color of his skin?

The point is that your can force someone to do something.

Can you force a pharmacy to carry all sorts of medicine, including contraceptive pills?

Think about it. To open a pharmacy you need a license.

The license, issued by a State, says you have to carry a certain set of products including contraceptive pills. If you are not happy, do not open a pharmacy.

Is everything OK with you so far? Are you going to challenge the right of a State to decide how to license a pharmacy?

So what do you do when a pharmacist says it is against his religion to sell the pill?

Isn't that the kind of stuff that will start happening if we start letting people only be accountable to their own religious beliefs?

 

[Sunni Man]

Well if you look at the list I posted above where they talk about death penalties for people who commit adultry, steal, homosexuality etc. its very scary stuff. When people hear you say you want Shariah, they assume you want the whole package, with beheadings, floggings and all.

Personally, I believe some people NEED to be flogged.

People who physically hurt children and infants, torture animals, molest children, beat women, etc.


As for beheadings; here in the U.S. the death penalty can be carried out by lethal injection, hanging, firing squad, depending on the state.

So beheading is just another method that we could easily include into the penalty phase of our justice system.