John 3:16 means you have to be Christian to get into heaven

[irosie91]

........... Studying Tanach more closely led to the fact that the NT is a total lie. .........

If Tanach is true, then NT must be true .....
OR ....
The God of Israel let the Temple be destroyed and ancient Israel be dispersed while letting faith in an impostor (or total imaginary character) to spread "like wildfire" and endure for 2000 years.

oh gee------billy graham "logic"

 

[Meriweather]

Why would you "be a robot"? I've never understood the idea that having god reveal itself to humanity in a clear way would somehow keep people from having a choice.

One hypothesis uses the analogy of light and dark. Darkness cannot exist in the presence of light. Some propose the same is true of Good and Evil, Love and Hate, Justice and Injustice. God's traits are said to be pure goodness and pure love. Evil and hatred cannot exist in the presence of pure love and goodness (God)--therefore, no choice.

 

[irosie91]

I would either become a Noachide or a Jew as both paths lead to an attachment to God.

Never heard of a Noachide before but I like the bar being so low (depending on the meaning of sexual immorality and eating 'flesh torn from a living animal'/blood?) that I and most people can join. I feel I've done my part, now it is God's turn.

You don't know if you've done your part until you do something other than simply reading my posts...but that's up you.

I've also read Wikipedia and feel I've qualified to be a Noachide:

The seven Noahide laws as traditionally enumerated are the following:[7]

1. Not to worship idols. (Don't)
2. Not to curse God. (Don't)
3. To establish courts of justice. (Like ours)
4. Not to commit murder. (Not so far)
5. Not to commit adultery or sexual immorality. (Don't but the later is a bit subjective)
6. Not to steal. (Don't except for one incident when I was very young and have regretted since that day)
7. Not to eat flesh torn from a living animal. (Don't, but did have Dancing Shrimp in a Thai restaurant once)

So where is God? If I have to do it all, what is his part?

try to be patient-----the UN is about to destroy the planet

 

[Indeependent]

I would either become a Noachide or a Jew as both paths lead to an attachment to God.

Never heard of a Noachide before but I like the bar being so low (depending on the meaning of sexual immorality and eating 'flesh torn from a living animal'/blood?) that I and most people can join. I feel I've done my part, now it is God's turn.

You don't know if you've done your part until you do something other than simply reading my posts...but that's up you.

I've also read Wikipedia and feel I've qualified to be a Noachide:

The seven Noahide laws as traditionally enumerated are the following:[7]

1. Not to worship idols. (Don't)
2. Not to curse God. (Don't)
3. To establish courts of justice. (Like ours)
4. Not to commit murder. (Not so far)
5. Not to commit adultery or sexual immorality. (Don't but the later is a bit subjective)
6. Not to steal. (Don't except for one incident when I was very young and have regretted since that day)
7. Not to eat flesh torn from a living animal. (Don't, but did have Dancing Shrimp in a Thai restaurant once)

So where is God? If I have to do it all, what is his part?

If God was in your face, you'd be a robot.
The average prophet in Scripture is at least 80 years old, well established in the community and needs to be an expert in every subject.
For instance, if God showed you the cure for a disease and you didn't know anything about medicine, you would forget what God showed you the moment the prophecy ended.

Why would you "be a robot"? I've never understood the idea that having god reveal itself to humanity in a clear way would somehow keep people from having a choice.

God revealed himself once and we all know what happened.
It was called the Golden Calf.
And it wasn't a sin of transgression, it was a sin of omission.

It's rather interesting that the mixed multitude, who experienced the revelation at Sinai, in the absence of a stern leader, Moshe, had the overwhelming desire to have an intermediary.
What's even more interesting is that God was severely upset that the Children of Israel stood by and allowed it to happen.

The reaction to God usually takes one of 2 distinct paths...
Complete obedience to the desire of God.
Complete rejection.

It's way too complicated for a post.

 

[deanrd]

He made a mistake. He gave His son and look at the world today.

He doesn't make mistakes.

God ISN'T calling the world today. It is under SATAN'S rule until the Return of Christ.

At this time, God only rules the Church (the TRUE church -- not anyone who calls themselves "Christian").

Most Christians in the GOP follow Satan. Their policies prove it beyond a doubt.

 

[Indeependent]

He made a mistake. He gave His son and look at the world today.

He doesn't make mistakes.

God ISN'T calling the world today. It is under SATAN'S rule until the Return of Christ.

At this time, God only rules the Church (the TRUE church -- not anyone who calls themselves "Christian").

Most Christians in the GOP follow Satan. Their policies prove it beyond a doubt.

Christian neo-Cons are a living, breathing oxymoron.
Jewish neo-Cons are a living, breathing oxymoron.

 

[Likkmee]

He made a mistake. He gave His son and look at the world today. Nasty, awful, filled with horrors for man and beast. God's experiment failed. I wish He would just throw His hands up and destroy the whole place. Only creation He made that did NOT fail were animals and nature. There are many good people on this planet...but the bad outweigh the good too much now. Time to clean house and drain the swamp.

It shall be as it was in the days of Noah......woe unto the inhabitants of earth in that day.

 

[Likkmee]

He made a mistake. He gave His son and look at the world today.

He doesn't make mistakes.

God ISN'T calling the world today. It is under SATAN'S rule until the Return of Christ.

At this time, God only rules the Church (the TRUE church -- not anyone who calls themselves "Christian").

Yup. And guess what "god" one nation under god refers to ? The Great Satan Inc (nlc---no liability as we say not as we do)

 

[Meriweather]

Most Christians in the GOP follow Satan. Their policies prove it beyond a doubt.

I wouldn't be too sure of that. The Republican Party and its followers are of the mind that the greater majority of people can take care of themselves if government steps aside. Christians believe they may rely on God to have a fulfilling life in this world. The individual focus is on God.

On the other hand, many Liberals seem to be of the mind that it does not work for the individual focus to be on God--it needs to be on government, because government will look after people better than God will. I would not call the government Satan, but it certainly isn't God. Some Liberals, sometimes, seem more concerned about the power of government than they do about the power of God.

I choose to call on God, not the government.

 

[Natural Citizen]

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Is there any support in the Bible for the opposite position, that a man or woman can obtain salvation without belief in Christ?

Because this is a pretty common belief, even among Christians, and I think it is wrong.

Well, what if God made Earth to be Man's home? What if the hope for heaven is just a backdoor means of saying that God is too weak to bring his original intention to fruition?

I read that question some place. Your thread reminded me of it.

 

[BreezeWood]

God revealed himself once and we all know what happened.
It was called the Golden Calf.

God told Moses what the Israelites were up to back in camp, that they had turned aside quickly out of the way which God commanded them and he was going to destroy them and start a new people from Moses. Moses besought and pleaded that they should be spared (Exodus 32:11-14), and God "repented of the evil which He said He would do unto His people." Moses went down from the mountain, but upon seeing the calf, he became angry and threw down the two Tablets of Stone, breaking them.


God told Moses what the Israelites were up to back in camp ... Moses went down from the mountain, but upon seeing the calf, he became angry and threw down the two Tablets of Stone, breaking them.


that really makes little sense, if moses were told beforehand why would he become angry when he saw what was described ... and why would that be a reason to destroy the tablets - supposedly etched by the Almighty.

those tablets would have been the proof for all ages, moses by destroying them would have committed a greater crime than the crime he destroyed them for, the jews to this day are misled.

Indeependent is wrong about the revelation, that was only the words from an aspiring lunatic ...



* God "repented of the evil which He said He would do unto His people ...

sure, the Almighty's action would have been "evil" - that moses knew quite well how to keep his flock from ever turning on him - is the real story behind the "scripture".

 

[Indeependent]

God revealed himself once and we all know what happened.
It was called the Golden Calf.

God told Moses what the Israelites were up to back in camp, that they had turned aside quickly out of the way which God commanded them and he was going to destroy them and start a new people from Moses. Moses besought and pleaded that they should be spared (Exodus 32:11-14), and God "repented of the evil which He said He would do unto His people." Moses went down from the mountain, but upon seeing the calf, he became angry and threw down the two Tablets of Stone, breaking them.


God told Moses what the Israelites were up to back in camp ... Moses went down from the mountain, but upon seeing the calf, he became angry and threw down the two Tablets of Stone, breaking them.


that really makes little sense, if moses were told beforehand why would he become angry when he saw what was described ... and why would that be a reason to destroy the tablets - supposedly etched by the Almighty.

those tablets would have been the proof for all ages, moses by destroying them would have committed a greater crime than the crime he destroyed them for, the jews to this day are misled.

Indeependent is wrong about the revelation, that was only the words from an aspiring lunatic ...



* God "repented of the evil which He said He would do unto His people ...

sure, the Almighty's action would have been "evil" - that moses knew quite well how to keep his flock from ever turning on him - is the real story behind the "scripture".

Moshe saw them dancing.
They saw Moshe and didn't stop dancing.
If they stopped and apologized, Moshe would not have been so upset.
Moshe goes up to the mountain 2x for 40 days each to beg God for a do over.

What's your point?

 

[alang1216]

try to be patient-----the UN is about to destroy the planet

With their black helicopters? You might want to re-evaluate your belief systems.

 

[alang1216]

I don't have to prove anything.
My duty as a Jew is to inform, not impose.

Maybe you'd be more successful if you gave some evidence to support that information. You basically tell us we can't understand because we don't read the original Hebrew of the Bible so we should just accept your Biblical interpretations. Sorry but that informs no one.

 

[Indeependent]

I don't have to prove anything.
My duty as a Jew is to inform, not impose.

Maybe you'd be more successful if you gave some evidence to support that information. You basically tell us we can't understand because we don't read the original Hebrew of the Bible so we should just accept your Biblical interpretations. Sorry but that informs no one.

What you need is the Aish Hatorah Discovery Weekend.
Aish HaTorah's Discovery Seminar
But that would require you leaving your house.

The Torah is a life long pursuit, not a magic pill.
I also know you're not truly interested.

But I ask you to allow me to get amused when someone says, "The Bible is a bunch of fairy tales" and I respond, "OK, start from Genesis 1:1." and all I get is a bunch of verses, out of context, thrown at the wall.

 

[BreezeWood]

God revealed himself once and we all know what happened.
It was called the Golden Calf.

God told Moses what the Israelites were up to back in camp, that they had turned aside quickly out of the way which God commanded them and he was going to destroy them and start a new people from Moses. Moses besought and pleaded that they should be spared (Exodus 32:11-14), and God "repented of the evil which He said He would do unto His people." Moses went down from the mountain, but upon seeing the calf, he became angry and threw down the two Tablets of Stone, breaking them.


God told Moses what the Israelites were up to back in camp ... Moses went down from the mountain, but upon seeing the calf, he became angry and threw down the two Tablets of Stone, breaking them.


that really makes little sense, if moses were told beforehand why would he become angry when he saw what was described ... and why would that be a reason to destroy the tablets - supposedly etched by the Almighty.

those tablets would have been the proof for all ages, moses by destroying them would have committed a greater crime than the crime he destroyed them for, the jews to this day are misled.

Indeependent is wrong about the revelation, that was only the words from an aspiring lunatic ...



* God "repented of the evil which He said He would do unto His people ...

sure, the Almighty's action would have been "evil" - that moses knew quite well how to keep his flock from ever turning on him - is the real story behind the "scripture".

Moshe saw them dancing.
They saw Moshe and didn't stop dancing.
If they stopped and apologized, Moshe would not have been so upset.
Moshe goes up to the mountain 2x for 40 days each to beg God for a do over.

What's your point?

.

Moshe saw them dancing.
They saw Moshe and didn't stop dancing.
If they stopped and apologized, Moshe would not have been so upset.
Moshe goes up to the mountain 2x for 40 days each to beg God for a do over.

What's your point?

What's your point?


"moshe" destroys tables etched by the Almighty and you ask "what's your point" ... did moshe have permission to do that - and you criticize "them" for dancing. why weren't some of them with moses up in the mountain ... who's fault was it they failed to apologies.

* there seems little difference between moses and mohamed, flip a coin for which religion is less trustworthy than the other.

 

[Indeependent]

God revealed himself once and we all know what happened.
It was called the Golden Calf.

God told Moses what the Israelites were up to back in camp, that they had turned aside quickly out of the way which God commanded them and he was going to destroy them and start a new people from Moses. Moses besought and pleaded that they should be spared (Exodus 32:11-14), and God "repented of the evil which He said He would do unto His people." Moses went down from the mountain, but upon seeing the calf, he became angry and threw down the two Tablets of Stone, breaking them.


God told Moses what the Israelites were up to back in camp ... Moses went down from the mountain, but upon seeing the calf, he became angry and threw down the two Tablets of Stone, breaking them.


that really makes little sense, if moses were told beforehand why would he become angry when he saw what was described ... and why would that be a reason to destroy the tablets - supposedly etched by the Almighty.

those tablets would have been the proof for all ages, moses by destroying them would have committed a greater crime than the crime he destroyed them for, the jews to this day are misled.

Indeependent is wrong about the revelation, that was only the words from an aspiring lunatic ...



* God "repented of the evil which He said He would do unto His people ...

sure, the Almighty's action would have been "evil" - that moses knew quite well how to keep his flock from ever turning on him - is the real story behind the "scripture".

Moshe saw them dancing.
They saw Moshe and didn't stop dancing.
If they stopped and apologized, Moshe would not have been so upset.
Moshe goes up to the mountain 2x for 40 days each to beg God for a do over.

What's your point?

.

Moshe saw them dancing.
They saw Moshe and didn't stop dancing.
If they stopped and apologized, Moshe would not have been so upset.
Moshe goes up to the mountain 2x for 40 days each to beg God for a do over.

What's your point?

What's your point?


"moshe" destroys tables etched by the Almighty and you ask "what's your point" ... did moshe have permission to do that - and you criticize "them" for dancing. why weren't some of them with moses up in the mountain ... who's fault was it they failed to apologies.

* there seems little difference between moses and mohamed, flip a coin for which religion is less trustworthy than the other.

You omitted the verse in Deuteronomy where God approves of Moshe breaking the Tablets.
Please let me know how many times God said no to Moshe other than entering the land?
I bet you didn't think of that, did you.
God NEVER says to Moshe because Moshe lives and breathes for God.

 

[Indeependent]

God revealed himself once and we all know what happened.
It was called the Golden Calf.

God told Moses what the Israelites were up to back in camp, that they had turned aside quickly out of the way which God commanded them and he was going to destroy them and start a new people from Moses. Moses besought and pleaded that they should be spared (Exodus 32:11-14), and God "repented of the evil which He said He would do unto His people." Moses went down from the mountain, but upon seeing the calf, he became angry and threw down the two Tablets of Stone, breaking them.


God told Moses what the Israelites were up to back in camp ... Moses went down from the mountain, but upon seeing the calf, he became angry and threw down the two Tablets of Stone, breaking them.


that really makes little sense, if moses were told beforehand why would he become angry when he saw what was described ... and why would that be a reason to destroy the tablets - supposedly etched by the Almighty.

those tablets would have been the proof for all ages, moses by destroying them would have committed a greater crime than the crime he destroyed them for, the jews to this day are misled.

Indeependent is wrong about the revelation, that was only the words from an aspiring lunatic ...



* God "repented of the evil which He said He would do unto His people ...

sure, the Almighty's action would have been "evil" - that moses knew quite well how to keep his flock from ever turning on him - is the real story behind the "scripture".

Moshe saw them dancing.
They saw Moshe and didn't stop dancing.
If they stopped and apologized, Moshe would not have been so upset.
Moshe goes up to the mountain 2x for 40 days each to beg God for a do over.

What's your point?

.

Moshe saw them dancing.
They saw Moshe and didn't stop dancing.
If they stopped and apologized, Moshe would not have been so upset.
Moshe goes up to the mountain 2x for 40 days each to beg God for a do over.

What's your point?

What's your point?


"moshe" destroys tables etched by the Almighty and you ask "what's your point" ... did moshe have permission to do that - and you criticize "them" for dancing. why weren't some of them with moses up in the mountain ... who's fault was it they failed to apologies.

* there seems little difference between moses and mohamed, flip a coin for which religion is less trustworthy than the other.

The Rebbe On Why Moses Broke the Tablets
Of course you can't read Hebrew but the word God uses to remind Moshe that he broke the tablets means, "The Tablets that you fortunately broke."

 

[BreezeWood]

God revealed himself once and we all know what happened.
It was called the Golden Calf.

God told Moses what the Israelites were up to back in camp, that they had turned aside quickly out of the way which God commanded them and he was going to destroy them and start a new people from Moses. Moses besought and pleaded that they should be spared (Exodus 32:11-14), and God "repented of the evil which He said He would do unto His people." Moses went down from the mountain, but upon seeing the calf, he became angry and threw down the two Tablets of Stone, breaking them.


God told Moses what the Israelites were up to back in camp ... Moses went down from the mountain, but upon seeing the calf, he became angry and threw down the two Tablets of Stone, breaking them.


that really makes little sense, if moses were told beforehand why would he become angry when he saw what was described ... and why would that be a reason to destroy the tablets - supposedly etched by the Almighty.

those tablets would have been the proof for all ages, moses by destroying them would have committed a greater crime than the crime he destroyed them for, the jews to this day are misled.

Indeependent is wrong about the revelation, that was only the words from an aspiring lunatic ...



* God "repented of the evil which He said He would do unto His people ...

sure, the Almighty's action would have been "evil" - that moses knew quite well how to keep his flock from ever turning on him - is the real story behind the "scripture".

Moshe saw them dancing.
They saw Moshe and didn't stop dancing.
If they stopped and apologized, Moshe would not have been so upset.
Moshe goes up to the mountain 2x for 40 days each to beg God for a do over.

What's your point?

.

Moshe saw them dancing.
They saw Moshe and didn't stop dancing.
If they stopped and apologized, Moshe would not have been so upset.
Moshe goes up to the mountain 2x for 40 days each to beg God for a do over.

What's your point?

What's your point?


"moshe" destroys tables etched by the Almighty and you ask "what's your point" ... did moshe have permission to do that - and you criticize "them" for dancing. why weren't some of them with moses up in the mountain ... who's fault was it they failed to apologies.

* there seems little difference between moses and mohamed, flip a coin for which religion is less trustworthy than the other.

The Rebbe On Why Moses Broke the Tablets
Of course you can't read Hebrew but the word God uses to remind Moshe that he broke the tablets means, "The Tablets that you fortunately broke."

.

"The Tablets that you fortunately broke."

Enigmatic Climax ...

it is not possible to know what was written when they were destroyed, you can not have both by the answer given. how is it they claim to know their content.

 

[Indeependent]

God revealed himself once and we all know what happened.
It was called the Golden Calf.

God told Moses what the Israelites were up to back in camp, that they had turned aside quickly out of the way which God commanded them and he was going to destroy them and start a new people from Moses. Moses besought and pleaded that they should be spared (Exodus 32:11-14), and God "repented of the evil which He said He would do unto His people." Moses went down from the mountain, but upon seeing the calf, he became angry and threw down the two Tablets of Stone, breaking them.


God told Moses what the Israelites were up to back in camp ... Moses went down from the mountain, but upon seeing the calf, he became angry and threw down the two Tablets of Stone, breaking them.


that really makes little sense, if moses were told beforehand why would he become angry when he saw what was described ... and why would that be a reason to destroy the tablets - supposedly etched by the Almighty.

those tablets would have been the proof for all ages, moses by destroying them would have committed a greater crime than the crime he destroyed them for, the jews to this day are misled.

Indeependent is wrong about the revelation, that was only the words from an aspiring lunatic ...



* God "repented of the evil which He said He would do unto His people ...

sure, the Almighty's action would have been "evil" - that moses knew quite well how to keep his flock from ever turning on him - is the real story behind the "scripture".

Moshe saw them dancing.
They saw Moshe and didn't stop dancing.
If they stopped and apologized, Moshe would not have been so upset.
Moshe goes up to the mountain 2x for 40 days each to beg God for a do over.

What's your point?

.

Moshe saw them dancing.
They saw Moshe and didn't stop dancing.
If they stopped and apologized, Moshe would not have been so upset.
Moshe goes up to the mountain 2x for 40 days each to beg God for a do over.

What's your point?

What's your point?


"moshe" destroys tables etched by the Almighty and you ask "what's your point" ... did moshe have permission to do that - and you criticize "them" for dancing. why weren't some of them with moses up in the mountain ... who's fault was it they failed to apologies.

* there seems little difference between moses and mohamed, flip a coin for which religion is less trustworthy than the other.

The Rebbe On Why Moses Broke the Tablets
Of course you can't read Hebrew but the word God uses to remind Moshe that he broke the tablets means, "The Tablets that you fortunately broke."

.

"The Tablets that you fortunately broke."

Enigmatic Climax ...

it is not possible to know what was written when they were destroyed, you can not have both by the answer given. how is it they claim to know their content.

I study the entire Torah in depth every year.
You're way out of your league.